Jackie: All right. Hey Lisa, welcome to the Women's Race Podcast. I'm excited to have you here. I want to start ⁓ by remembering, if you remember this, I'm not sure. The very first time that I met you, which was in I looked this up by the way. This is how it's top of mind. It was in Los Cabos 70.3 in 2023 at the very, very start of your Lisa: Yeah. Jackie: kind of entry into long distance. I don't know if you remember it, but it was a deathly hot race. And you absolutely kicked my butt. And I only knew because Paula had alerted me that you were going to be very, very good at ⁓ 70.3. So I wasn't surprised to be getting my butt kicked by you. You probably didn't know I was back there behind you dying somewhere, but you were good at 70.3s, straight out of the gates and You've been to three Olympics, you're just like an absolute star and you've lasted forever in triathlon. And I can't wait to hear all about it. So thanks for joining me here today. Lisa: Hi, thanks for having me here. So I listened to some podcasts and I'm proud that I can be a part of your podcast. Jackie: Yeah, you're the first ⁓ athlete we've had from Austria. Also probably first three time Olympian. So do you wanna say hello? ⁓ speak do you wanna speak to your Austrian fans? Say a quick hello. Lisa: In German or? Yeah, we speak German. Hello, I'm Lisa Berterer, 3 times Olympian. I'm here with Jackie Herring in a podcast and I'm looking forward to the next minutes. ⁓ Jackie: I don't know. What are the what I don't even know what they speak. Yes, sure. love it. I have no clue what you said, but it sounded awesome. ⁓ I love, I love a little German. ⁓ yeah, so we could cover so many different things. I feel like we could start out with ⁓ just kind of talking about, I guess, your life as a short course athlete, unless it you're so sick of that and it causes you PTSD, we don't have to talk about it. ⁓ Lisa: Nah, it's fine. Jackie: But you must have enjoyed it to be have done it that long, right? So let's just talk about, I guess, maybe some of your favorite memories for short course or how you even got involved in short course racing. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah, like that's true. I really enjoyed short cut racing for like 15 years and yeah, I always knew the end gonna come very soon. ⁓ But I didn't know when because they're okay, let's do next Olympics, next Olympics. And when I see I have a chance to make the Olympics, of course I was motivated to keep going. And... how I got into triathlon. I watched always the Ironman in Klangford. It's very close to my hometown, just 20 minutes away. And yeah, I said I want to do this once and I joined the Iron Kids. yeah, and I remember once when I watched the Olympics in 2004 when an Austrian Olympic champion, Kadelln, and I was playing tennis and I was like, I didn't like to play tennis anymore. I wanted to watch the race and... Jackie: Mm. Lisa: I was thinking one day I really want to do this as well. And somehow I got into triathlon. I was a swimmer before, had a big accident from the horse riding. So I fell from the horse and I broke everything I could in my left arm. So swimming was just therapy anymore. yeah, and somehow I was, loved running. I was just a natural runner always. So I never joined any running club or no one teach me how to run. just loved it. Jackie: ⁓ wow. Wow. Lisa: So the transition into aqua-trodlon first was very easy for me, because running, yeah, I was natural and I used to be a swimmer and I really, really liked it. And in 2015, I did my first triathlon. It was just a local triathlon and I rented a bike and I was so slow, especially on the bike. I was very, very slow, but I loved it. People were passing me. Jackie: Mm. Yeah. Lisa: pushing me from behind. But it was fine. I finished this straddle and it was a 330k bike and an 8k run. So swimming was the shortest discipline, was my best at this time. But I did it and I had fun. So I just keep going and I'm still doing it 19 years later. ⁓ Jackie: ⁓ wow. Yeah, and and back then, did they have pretty good like national programs? Is that how you kind of got identified and got like into the Olympic type of pipeline that quickly? Lisa: Yeah, like when I finished, like I did my first national championships in like sprint distance and I got like, yeah, in the national team and we got a little support and then I was visiting a school which like gave me good support so I could train already like in the last five years in school two times per day which like allows me like, yeah, to train more and then with 19 I did my first like World Cup. Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: and I finished on the podium in Edmonton and that time a coach said yeah you can do this Lisa and I'm yeah and I say what what I can do yeah you can do the Olympics in next year and I say I don't know that if I can do that and yeah so I was cool traveling a lot did a lot of races to did my Olympic qualification finishing school but very stressful time actually and Jackie: Wow. Lisa: Yeah, but I made it like last minute that I was one of the last like who made it to the like qualifying and yeah, I was the youngest racing there. So in London 2012. yeah, it's a long, time ago. Very long time ago and yeah, it was allowed me to keep going. have like the army which support me like from day one being a professional then. Jackie: Wow. Wow, that's a long time ago. Lisa: So, and I was joining the army for 10 years. And after these 10 years, it was hard to keep going the short course because yeah, the support wasn't that great that I could like survive just from doing short course. So that's why I was thinking a little bit, yeah, to change. Jackie: Mm. Yeah, there's yeah. Yeah, not as much money in short course, but in the beginning, I mean, what a gift to have a coach like that that can give you that confidence and that encouragement to just be like, you can do this and set you on that path. That's really it might not have you might not have made it to that Olympic so quick if that coach hadn't kind of pushed you along on that. This so that's gotta be, although stressful, like a really cool experience to make it so early. Lisa: Mm-mm. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. He was really, really confident always in me. So it was for sure a big help, especially as a young, teen girl and have no idea what I wanted to do. And Olympics were really not in my head at this race. ⁓ And I remember it was in Edmonton and Paula was like the... She was always a big role model for me. She was racing that too. So I was... very excited to race against her, but she ended up didn't racing that race. yeah. Yeah, wasn't. Yeah. No, she was very good. And then I think she was insured or something. So yeah. Jackie: In Edmonton, that's like her home race, isn't it? Yeah, she had quite a streak there in short course. It's pretty amazing to to look back. I mean, it's pretty cool to me. You get a lot of different, you know, many people in long course had some sort of stint in short course. And some were really good and had a lot of success, which I think you had some enough success, obviously, that you were able to do it that long. And people like Paula that were on these mega winning streaks. But then there's so many people that came from short course that were just like Lisa: Yeah. Jackie: mediocre, like not that great at short course, and then they're like exceptional at long course. And it's just like must be how your body works. And do you kind of feel that long course is more suited to how your body how your body works? I mean, you're doing so good. Lisa: Yeah, I think so. People told me way before I started in long course, you should really switch to long course. But I really didn't want it. I really wanted to get faster and I really wanted to have won good Olympics because ⁓ it wasn't really my race or three. And ⁓ actually I qualified four times, but ⁓ in Rio I was injured. So one week before I had to give my slot to another woman. So yeah, so the Olympics wasn't so my thing. And then I don't know, for me, the swim was always a big problem in short course. So if I had a good swim, I had a good race. So if I had a bad swim, it was a bad race. So it was kind of this game all the time. And I always had to ride very, very hard in short course. Jackie: ⁓ Lisa: to like not get left or anything. Some races yes and some not. But I think that's why. And I was a lot of injured so I was a lot of riding in my whole short course career. Like more or less the same than I do now. And maybe that's, it's my profit right now that biking is like wasn't a big problem for me to go to like the 180K in long course. Jackie: Yeah. Wow. Lisa: because I was just used to just ride a lot and always to ride hard. I was never hanging out in a group in short course. Like when I started triathlon, it was a scene like people just stayed in group and it was such the running race. But I never was in this position that I could hang out on the bike. yeah. Jackie: That's crazy because in long course you're actually a really good swimmer. So is that really strange for you to like come into to 70.3 in Iron Man and now you're like, wow, I'm already at the front of the race. You're at the front of every race. Lisa: Okay. Yeah, I mean my whole short course career I just heard from everyone like Lisa you are so weak on the swim, work more on the swim, you are so weak. ⁓ and now it funny we just talked before Hamburg and we were watching something and they called me a strong swimmer and I was like ⁓ wow it took a long time that someone said I can actually swim and probably this gives me some confidence as well in racing like in the long course now that I mean Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: I can't swim and I just, yeah, I never had this confidence in me. So, and someone say it right now, it's mentally makes it much easier for me. Jackie: Yeah. Well, I can attest that you are a strong swimmer, stronger than me for sure. Cause in Kona, I jumped in the lane with you and Elliot that one day, the end of your workout. And I don't even know what you were doing, but I think we finished up maybe some hundreds or something together and you're fast. You're definitely fast. So it's good. Lisa: It's the discipline with the most ups and downs for me. In training I have days where I'm so so weak in swimming and then one day I don't know where it's getting from. Like I'm just swimming five seconds faster per hundred and I don't even like go harder. So it's I don't know why it's a big rollercoaster on the swim for me. ⁓ Jackie: Yeah. actually I'm actually like that too and I've been for the last I swear fifteen years I've been trying to figure out is it related to like the day after a hard run or after a hard bike like but no it's so random. I can feel sometimes so tired and warm up and then we'll start the main set and magically I'm fast. And then a couple days later I'll be terrible and I have no clue. I it's Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. Jackie: An absolute mystery. So you just hope that like you feel magical during the race and like you have your good swimming yeah. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah on race day. Yeah. Not because I know if I'm resting for biking or running I know I can be strong or I know how I feel but that's what you say on the swimming. I still didn't find the recipe like what actually makes me feel good. I have no idea like before Hamburg the week and Ironman Hamburg I felt so strong in the pool it was a 50 meter pool never seen 50 meter even my mom because she's a swim coach she was there and said what happened to you this I don't know. And then I was so confident for the race, you know, I'm going to be there and this. And then I had one of my worst swims. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah, who was I talking to? ⁓ Indy. She also didn't have a great swim. So I love that pool in Hamburg, by the way. If you can dodge all like the German breaststrokers, then ⁓ it's all good, right? That's a really nice pool. So in the race in Hamburg, like what went on? You just didn't find your stroke, you just didn't feel good. And then did you just get stuck in a weird group or what? Lisa: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know, maybe because I mean, I'm known, I don't like the cord. So probably I went too early in the water. I don't know, because I just, usually I'm one of the last going in the water and start, because I never do swim warm up or anything. And I think it just, I was thinking it's time to start. And I went in and we were still six, seven minutes in the water. And then I was starting, I was like, ⁓ no, where are my arms? I couldn't feel them at all. Jackie: Mm. wow. Lisa: And I could see how the group that everyone, I was standing next to Fanella and I was thinking, okay, I can hold the leg, but no, I couldn't hold the legs all. And it took 300 meters until I felt good. But you know, the group were gone and I need a group, know, like to swim is the first group. I need good, I need the legs. I can't like lead this group. And I know that. So I was like, okay, I take it relaxed. Maybe I lose another minute. But, and then I was leading the whole group, like the chasing bag. Jackie: Yeah. yeah. Lisa: for 3.8k but it was fine. ⁓ Jackie: Yeah, it's so tough. Some of those girls just they start so fast. And you would be more used to that from short course, but I'm just like a true Iron Man athlete. Like my takeout speed doesn't exist. So it's so hard, those first few hundred. And I think that's why I can't swim with who I wanna swim with, is if you lose them in the start, there's just like no hope to catch them. You're you just like probably Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. No, no, no, save ya. Jackie: You probably settle at the same pace, but it's that beginning part that is still fast. So ⁓ that's tough. Lisa: Yeah, yeah, I still have to figure it out. Like where I have to start. Sometimes I think like I can start next to fast swimmer, catch the legs, but if it's too fast, I'm still having my head. I have to do a nine hour race or eight and a half hour race. And then you sprint the first 25 meters. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, you don't really want to like actually get out of breath in an Iron Man, right? Like, yeah, so okay, so you now you're you're I mean, you did like four Ironmans last year. You're like full blown Ironman athlete now. ⁓ what have been the biggest, I guess, things you've learned or things that you've been, I don't know, I guess like changes moving from short to long and kind of what are you focused and what are you working on? Lisa: I mean, the biggest change was for sure nutrition because for me, never like, I grew up like eating, doing training or drinking. We didn't do anything. So, and then to long course, actually have to eat also doing training, not just racing. And this was a big change for me. And also before the first Ironman's, I never practiced any race nutrition because Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: I don't know in training, it's very hard for me to get like all the chairs or the cups down, like what I use in training. And I always prefer my petrol stops, you know, with like some Coke or Fanta or some mass or like normal food. And people say, Lisa, you can't do that. And I say, I know, but I don't know. I can't, you know, like, I think if I eat this every day, I can't eat it during racing anymore. And they were very like, Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: Not confident into me, I can make it on race, state and nutrition. But then I had my first Ironman and had zero issues. as I, maybe I'm very lucky with that. And I'm still very lucky, I think with race nutrition, think. Yeah. So I can get like a lot of caps down doing racing, compare what I'm used in training, I think. Yeah. So this was a big change. And what was also a big change is, ⁓ Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: Actually, like the swimming, yeah, okay, it's still, we just talked about fast in the beginning, but what was going on in short course there in the beginning, like, I don't know, I had the door, my suit and I had blue eyes and I don't know, like areas of something. And this is so much more relaxed right now, I have to say. and that I just. Jackie: ⁓ Lisa: keep it more relaxed that I know not every second counts, you know, like I have so long day and this keeps me also more relaxed before the start and keep my nerves away because I was always very nervous right now before long course, actually I'm not very nervous anymore. yeah, mean, Kona I was actually, was the only race last year where I was nervous, but I don't know why actually, but yeah. Jackie: Yeah. That's so nice. Well, it's probably because you I feel like there's some races where you feel like, okay, for me at least, it's when I know I'm really fit and I know I could have a really good day. I feel like that makes the nerves kind of compound because you're like, all right, I've prepared really, really well and I just want to execute a day. And you get nervous because you just want it to work out so badly. And Lisa: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Jackie: It did work for you and Kona. You had a absolute awesome day. I would love to hear about your Kona race last year. Like can you kind of walk us through Kona? What did you get fourth? Fifth? That is so good. It was your first Kona, right? Lisa: Yeah. Fifth, fifth, yeah. Yeah, it was first phone I had. Jackie: First Kona. Okay, let's hear all about it. Fifth place. So good. Lisa: Yeah, actually, this was exactly my goal. I was thinking on a perfect day. If I can finish fifth, this is all I wanted. ⁓ But I wasn't focusing. I really needed it. I just wanted to enjoy a day there because it's my first World Champs. And ⁓ that was happening so much around. I arrived in Kona two and a half weeks before the race. I remember when I did the course one time and I had a terrible day out there. I was thinking how you can, I really do this in the race. Like it was hot, no shade. There was two petrol stations to stop for drinks and ⁓ yeah, it was a very, very hard day. And so my confidence on the bike, like wasn't very strong anymore after this ride. Yeah. And then the race week came and I wasn't expecting like I have so much like media things and Jackie: that's tough. Lisa: that people talk about me, so I wasn't expecting that. So that actually was more stressful than I thought the whole week. So now I know if this would happen again, I would take it more relaxed and not see it as a stress. And I think because of all the stress, because I took it as a stress, I got sick three days before the race, like throat pain and... Yeah, it's one lymph nodes and I was like, no, why now? You know, and yeah. So my mom was there. She tried everything she could do for me. Massage and yeah, she was very nice and she was cooking for me. And yeah, but on race day, actually, I wasn't thinking on this anymore and I just wanted to go out there and have a good day. And yeah, and the day didn't start it how I wanted again, like. ⁓ Hamburg was a bad swim, I think Kona, I don't know, like the swim, again, the start was, I had not a good start again. And I was in a group where it was very, very easy to swim in, but I said, okay, take it relaxed, take it easy. so I went out from the water and I saw... Actually, I was with everyone around that I wanted to be. So then I was happy again, but then you doing swimming, I just saw how far everyone was swimming away, you know, in the swim, it looks sometimes more fat than it is actually in the end. And yeah, I know the bike. I just tried to ride very hard in the beginning. I think that's just how I like it. Yeah, so I just tried to. Jackie: It was very hard in the beginning. Yeah. Cause you came out you came out with like the big huge group of like pretty much everybody. Right. Yeah. Lisa: Yeah, yeah, almost everybody was in the group. Yeah, I mean you were in the group too. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah, I was there and I tried to go towards the front at the start of the bike because I was so worried about getting a penalty. But then of course, like you and Kat, I think a lot of you guys like were up ahead, went up ahead, obviously. ⁓ So were you able to stay with them or like did you ride who'd you ride with? Lisa: ⁓ Yeah. Yeah, I think... ⁓ I think with Laura, like I was leading the group actually until Laura, she caught up. So I think this is still from short course. I'm very good in it, like coming out from the water and ride very hard. I think it's just, I can still do this. yeah, and then Laura came and I was riding with Laura and then Kat and... ⁓ Jackie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Lisa: Solveig came after five or ten, no, after the first loop before you go on the Queen K. Then they came and I think Solveig, had a very bad transition and Kat too. think Mr. Helmet or something was going wrong. ⁓ yeah, Kat. And I Solveig put on her calf sleeves so they had not a good transition. So that was good for me. So I had a little time before the train came. Jackie: Solvig. Yeah, Kat was screwing around with her helmet. I left. Yeah, she was Yeah. That's perfect. Yeah, right. You can like settle in and get ready. Lisa: Yeah. Exactly. So I knew when they're coming, it's going to be hard. But then we rode all together until like, yeah, so she made like the move. I mean, she didn't want, she said she didn't want it to make the move, but it was very hard to follow after like, I think it was around 30 K. And yeah, so actually I felt very good when I just tried, but I also ran out of gear. So I completely had wrong gear. I'm not sure I had the 54. Jackie: ⁓ wow. Wow. Lisa: on 54 Dubai from Shimano and I was just like 130 cadence on the downhill and I was like ⁓ no I can't do this anymore yeah so Jackie: Mm. What And and up to that point, like, is your power like your normal Ironman power or is your power higher than it would normally be for an Ironman? Lisa: It's much higher. In the beginning, first 30-40km I always ride more than I want to ride. Yeah. And yeah, but I think I need it for my concrete. I don't know why. Sometimes I listen to take it easy more in the beginning and maybe you can get stronger in the race. But I get a little slower in the race, not faster. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah. Just happens. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well it's there's something about like being in race mode. And I find races where I just try to like do my power. I feel like I'm letting the race go and then I'm like it's almost like I'm giving up right away. Rather than, you know, push a little extra, be in the race and yeah, kind of push it. Especially if you know, you know, you're a runner. If you know your run's gonna be there, it's gonna be fine, then Lisa: Is it? Jackie: It's kinda worth a shot sometimes. Lisa: Yeah, so I'm not really the runner anymore in own course. But that's why I know I have to ride hard. ⁓ Yeah, I some minutes on the run, but we tried to work on it. yeah, I mean, the run is a little thing for me because I don't know if you know that I had a surgery in December and the Iliac atherofibrosis surgery and Jackie: So Lisa: Yeah, that's why I my run, like I couldn't do it. And this was also because probably I changed to long course. My decision was easy because of that, because I couldn't push on the nimid anymore on the bike and not on the run. So, and on the run, it gets so bad in training. Like I had to stop a lot of times. So last year I couldn't do any like tempo training anymore. Like very like fast training. I couldn't go faster than. 345 because my leg was just getting numb or like cramped and I had to stop. And it took a long time to find out what I have. And on the bike I could compensate. I was riding 60-40, 60 % on the left, right and 40 on the right. But it was fine. Like I found like a technique how to ride fast with this. But I didn't like it anymore mentally. It was very hard for me. Jackie: Wow. Yeah. Lisa: because I know I can run fast, but something not allow me. And finally in November, we found the solution for that. And I had surgery very fast there for it. Jackie: That's pretty crazy. So that's just something that develops over time. Just you have no control. It just it just kinda developed and then all of a sudden was it just you were getting a whole bunch of pain in one leg or you said the leg would go numb? Like when you're running. Lisa: Mm. Yeah. Yeah, it's like, it was in 2024, it started, you know, it was the Olympic year. And I already told everyone I have some weird pain in my leg when I go fast. And they'll say, ⁓ yeah, Lisa, you you over train and this and that. Okay. And so then it was the Olympics. And again, during the Olympics, just wonder, I was far behind, but I still wanted to go as fast I want. Even I was like running for. Jackie: Yep. Lisa: 50th position or something, but I couldn't, no, I could not like use my right leg properly anymore. And because I knew from the training, if I go to a certain heart rate, because the more heart rate I had, the more blood have to pump through and my artery was like so blocked for like 15 centimeters. We found out finally that, yeah. So it was getting, it's weird feeling like. Jackie: Yeah. Wow. Lisa: it get a cramp and then it got very weak and I can't use it anymore. It's not really numb. I just can't use it anymore. Then I stopped for like 10 seconds. Heart rate is going down and then I can just normal run again. And so yeah, and it's good. Of course I couldn't do fast training anymore. So it's always happening, um, faster and faster because my heart rate was then higher when I ran three 40 and then three 45 and whatever. Jackie: Wow, that's crazy. Yeah. Lisa: And last year I had some runs off the bike when sometimes it was 4.20 and this happened. I was like, oh no, if this happened in race day, luckily never happened in race day. And on 70.3 it happened. So that's why almost my Ironman time and 70.3 time is more or less the same. I couldn't like run much faster. So, and I just love running. Yeah, so, but the problem is I have it on both sides. They found out. Jackie: Well Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So you decided to have the surgery. Yeah. Lisa: But on right side it's stronger. So that's how the right side is fixed. But now I can go fast on the right side and I feel my left side sometimes. So yeah, it's bad, but luckily I do long course and I don't have to go to 170 or 180 hard rate. I mean, 70 I see a lot of times, but 180 probably not. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah. So do you think you'll eventually do the surgery or do they suggest it for the other side? Lisa: ⁓ I mean, they wouldn't suggest it because it's my decision. It's a very like, it's not like an easy surgery. And I just let the year go and then I will see. Yeah. So I just right now I have different problem because I had this year was like crazy so far. It wasn't like a good start to the season, like sick. And then I came home from Texas. Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: And I had a bike crash. didn't take it serious, but actually two weeks after the bike crash, I got the pain in my right leg and I'm still struggling with this pain in my leg. So I've always on off with my running and I have some muscle edema in my leg where I had the bike crash. So in Hamburg, like I didn't run at all the whole week before because I just wanted to run on race day. So actually it's nothing serious, but Jackie: ⁓ geeish. Wow. Я. Lisa: It's just hurting and I don't want to hurt anymore. That sounds weird because I have so much injuries my whole career and I just, it's not, ⁓ it's hard for me to just run with pain anymore. Yeah. So, so I'm focusing on biking and swimming right now. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah, I'm not into that either. Yeah, I mean, biking and swimming is important. That'll get you pretty far. You ⁓ I mean, good job getting the the Kona slot and getting it done in Hamburg with all that going on. Like you honestly have had a pretty rough start to the year. You I did it you were all over the place in Texas, and it sounds like you were really like back and forth. Were you really like having a hard time deciding if you were gonna race or not? Or like what was going on there? Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. How did Dexels? Yeah, I couldn't wait to race and then I could already feel Wednesday, I got a very bad coughing and then, you know, after interviews, I didn't want, I'm not someone who wants to cry to everyone, I feel bad or this, you know, like I just don't like it. And I mean, just my boyfriend knew like how bad it was because he also couldn't sleep all night because my coughing was so bad. And yeah, then on Friday night, I got actually already the temperature. Jackie: ⁓ yeah. ⁓ Lisa: but I still didn't take it serious. I prepared all my bottles and this and that. said, no, it's not true. I can't race. And the night was very bad and in the morning, I still wanted to go. my boyfriend said, no, no. And the coach and everyone say, no, you should not. You damage your body. And you did so much to your body a year before. You don't race to race, race, see can Ironman. Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: And yeah, it was a good decision. And then I went out, of course, for me, you I love the sport and I can't even if I'm sick, can't just lay in the hotel. And like, I don't know, I just also like to support and others. And I was thinking, okay, I'm sick now. Maybe then another day more sick because I'm running around and not resting. But yeah, so, but it took a long time to recover from that mentally actually. Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, that's hard. I mean, we dump a lot of effort into training and preparing and and it is kind of funny. Like you coach people and and your boyfriend Elliot is a coach as well. And it's really funny because if you think about it with a coaching hat on, if you were advising that person, you would say, Don't race, don't do it. But when it's yourself, it's like, I think I'll be okay. I'll be fine. Like Lisa: Mm. Mm-hmm. Yeah... No. Yeah, that's so weird. You know what is the best, but you don't want to accept it. You still need advice from someone else or tells you. Because to make such a decision on my own is hard because for me, just want to feel like she's the weak one. She's not racing because she's not feeling well or something. Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: ⁓ I don't want to be dead, but no, it was bad. I was like for another 10 days, I couldn't train at all. yeah, was some serious thing actually. Jackie: Yeah, well then for sure it's the right choice. And yeah, those are really hard choices. But ⁓ talking about the coaching, ⁓ how long have you always been coaching or are you just coaching now that that you're together with Elliot with your with your team? Like tell us about your coaching status. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah, actually before I met Elliot, ⁓ I created my own club, the LP Sport Club. And it was my idea to slowly start with it for the future. And I made some coaching educations, I'm starting. And then I met Elliot and yeah, he's full into coaching. He loves it. And he inspired me to do more of it. right now it's crazy. Yeah, sometimes I... forget about myself and I just I'm so nervous about them and the racing and I really really really like the process from them too and yeah I mean I can't coach that much in Elliot because I have not so much routine yet so for me like 10 I'm right now like 10 athletes and I think next to the professional sport it's more or less enough for me right now yeah Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, ten can take up a lot of time, but I feel like if you're in it together as a team effort and I don't know, if you have some in person and some remote, are they all just remote athletes? Lisa: Yeah. Yeah, they're like remote, but I want to like have as much community, communication with them as possible because that's important for me. And this also takes some time, but yeah, I think that's a very important part of coaching to just be in contact with the athletes. Jackie: Yeah, yeah, that is a big deal. And they'll be able to learn a lot from you because you have so much experience. That's awesome. And with the coaching, like I don't know what type of people are listening to this podcast. I have no data on any of that, but I'm sure it's mostly triathletes. I want to hear your top three mistakes that you see age groupers making, ⁓ maybe more than pros, like Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. Jackie: What are these aid what are the main mistakes that people are making that you see? Lisa: ⁓ I mean one thing is for sure that before race day is coming they think they just need to train more and more but they don't really realize that they're working done in race week and they can relax before racing. Yeah that's one big thing and then it's another thing is I just saw that you talk with them about everything nutrition and this and that and then what they Jackie: Yes. Lisa: have to eat before racing and then you see them the day before the race and they just eat a big pizza with lot of cheese and this and that. was like okay why we talked about this you know. Yeah so. Jackie: Wait a minute. I am on Team Pizza. Do you know this? I eat pizza the day before. I eat pizza the day before every race. Yes, there's people that are on Team Pizza. And there's people that are on Team Rice. And maybe you're on Team Rice. Lisa: out okay and salami ⁓ really? Okay. Yeah. I'm on team pasta, even if I don't like pasta so much, but I try to eat rice in the morning. So I'm on team pasta the night before. Yeah. Jackie: Team pasta. Okay, we got three teams then, but pizza is a a strategy because it's delicious and it's it's carbs. Yes. And if if like like me, I consume a lot of dairy. I live in the dairy state in Wisconsin. So a lot of cheese does yeah. Lisa: Yeah, it stays there. It's true. It stays there. It's good. Yeah. I mean, if you can adjust it, it's just because of the cheese. It's not about the bread or something. It's more about the cheese or the toppings which is on, know, like I think, yeah. But if someone can handle it, that's true, yeah. And another thing is, hmm, that's hard. Jackie: Yeah. Well that's funny. What about like the intensity of sessions? Like, do you find what I see for a lot of people is that there's not a lot of difference in intensity in a lot of age groupers? Like everything is just kind of like medium and they don't have the ability to go much faster and they are not really willing to go much slower because they don't want their Strava time to look bad or something. Yes? I think you're still there. You went out for a second, but you're back. Lisa: Okay, okay, okay, that's Ah, good, okay. Yeah, that's true. If you have to tell them, I have to learn them, you can go slow, you know? It's very hard for them in the beginning, especially when they're beginners, that's true, to go slow. some of them have to be very slow to build up their endurance. And some of them, have to walk and it's... Jackie: Mm-hmm. Lisa: They don't believe it until they see the result like a half a year later that it's very, very important to have different speeds in training. That's true. That's a big mistake. Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, I'm trying to help my my sister get back into running right now. And it's actually painful to watch how slow she has to go, but it she does have to go slow because that's how you get in shape. You can't just run at heart rate 170 every single run and every day. Your body won't Lisa: Yeah. No. All the time. Because you have no energy for going faster then and that's what they don't realize. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah, yeah. So that's what I see a lot of and that's part of it. Gotta go slow to go fast for sure. has coaching ⁓ changed how you think about your training or how you deal with going to races or anything like that? Lisa: Yeah. It keeps me actually more relaxed before racing because I have so much other things to do or think about. Not just about me, you it's not just always about me, me, me. I mean, you have kids, you know, you know this, it's not always about you. I mean, I'm at a race on my own and ⁓ this is very good for me that I have a different focus and it helps me. ⁓ Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, that's that's so true. I feel like any pro I know, well not anyone, but many pros that don't have something else going on before racing, I feel like they're filled with anxiety. They're so obsessed with how their race is gonna go. It's like there's so many more important things besides each and every single race. Like it's not that big of a deal. So that's good. Yeah. Lisa: ⁓ yes. Yeah. No. Jackie: ⁓ I wanna do just like a slight transition and just talk about I guess longevity in the sport and the mindset and how that's changed for you over the years. I feel like you've been doing this quite a long time and you rolled into long course and everyone's like, Who is this? And it's like you've already been in the sport for a very long time. So I guess how has your mindset evolved? Over the years and what do you think about now that lets you like get up, stay motivated and stay excited about training and racing? Lisa: What changed for me a lot in long course now that I love racing. Before that, I always loved training and I wasn't really looking forward for the races. But right now, it motivates me to train because I can't wait to race again. It's funny to hear, but I'm like, even that is to my boyfriend. It's crazy. I love training so much, but right now I just can't wait to have the next race. ⁓ Maybe that's why I maybe race so much last year because I didn't have to train so much because, because always after Ironman I really take a whole week of training. ⁓ I don't think about training at all. And, yeah, this changed a lot and this keeps me motivated. And in Ironman racing, like, I don't know so much can happen there and during the race and mentally it's. Jackie: Yes. Lisa: Very exhausting, actually, Ironman. I think it's not just the body which is exhausted, and my head as well. Yeah, but this is the thing what I like on it. That is the big part of Ironman racing. It's not just the body. The head is a very, very big part of it, Jackie: Yeah. I I mean that's what I love about it is it's people can be maybe ⁓ in much better shape or much more fit, but if something's going wrong in their mind or they're having yeah, they get in like a mental slump that they can't get through, it kind of like their race goes down down and goes bad. So the mental part I think is is what makes racing a lot of fun for Iron Man and Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. Jackie: Every Iron Man you have like so many different things to just overcome throughout the day. And I was talking go ahead. Lisa: Yeah, mean, yeah. Now you go. Jackie: I mean every every Iron Man athlete I've talked to, but I remember Holly specifically, like you can just go from having a really bad time and then two hours later you're feeling amazing and you're having an awesome day. It's just like the really cool part about it. Lisa: Yeah, that's true. I ⁓ mean, like people always say, Lisa, you make it look so easy from outside. But no, like I'm hurting, you know, like even people think like I look, it looks easy, but no, I'm actually hurting on the bike a lot. yeah, so, but I never, can't, I need to say like I'm very lucky, like so far the six Ironmans I did. I was never in a low, low, point, like where I say, okay. Probably Kona was one of the hardest races for me mentally, where I reached the lowest point when I ran out on the Queen K and I just could see the asphalt, you know, and no one else in front of me. And yeah, that was the first time I started to cry. Like my mom was standing out there and I was like, oh, it's so hard, you know, it's so hard. And I was like... You know, no one wants to know that, at I know, but it was the first time I wanted to tell people like it's hard, you know. Yeah. Yeah, ⁓ true. ⁓ Jackie: That's awesome. Yeah, we never got to the end of your Kona race, but the Queen K is so lonely. Like, I so I raced this last fall and I hadn't been there since, let's see, 2014 was my last Kona before last year. So it been a while and I completely forgot what it was like. And I also wanted to cry out there because it was Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ Jackie: It's terrible. It's so lonely. Like they need to let people go out there because we're out there like in no man's land. And all I had was whoever, I can't remember the person I was running by, some other German. I don't know, but her boyfriend didn't speak any English. He was just saying German to me. And I'm like, I think he's saying something nice. I'm not sure. ⁓ but there's nobody out there, and we need Lisa: you Yeah. You No. Jackie: I think that's what makes the race so hard, honestly, is Lisa: Yeah. Jackie: Just being out there alone with your thoughts. Lisa: I mean, everyone was talking about this energy lift and this and I was like, did it in training. I was like, okay, yeah, it's hard, but what would they talk about? And I remember running up back there and the aid station. I can't remember, I remember when I was walking, but it was the aid station. really took my time was walking and just reset. And I was like, ⁓ yeah, that's actually very hard. Yeah. So. Jackie: Yeah, it's very v sad out there at that point. But once you get like Lisa: Yeah, it will change probably next year with men and women together. gonna be a little bit more people outside on the run course. Jackie: Yes. Yeah, I think that is the difference. Having the age group, because we'll have a lot of age group men probably around us by that point. And that does help. Just more people, it makes it much more fun. I mean, it was just lonely, just having the women. I was not a fan of that. Yeah. Lisa: Yeah. No, me neither. Jackie: Yeah. Well, let's kind of look ahead for I wanna hear about kind of what you have planned for the rest of the year, what your goals are. I'm sure well, I'm not sure, but I'm guessing you're probably going for the pro series again since were you third? You were third last year. Yeah. So let's hear. What do you got? Lisa: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, right now, like I'm preparing for Lake Blessed, yeah, Ironman. I mean, I love this race last year, so I really wanted to go back. ⁓ I don't know, like I had just that perfect day and for me, I didn't, it was one of the days I could just keep going all day and all the feeling. It was weird. Even the rain, nothing bothers me that day, yeah. Jackie: Did you really love it? It was raining all day. Lisa: So I was thinking I want to go back without the rain actually. I want to enjoy it more. Jackie: Yeah, I mean it is a beautiful race. Yeah and you were so strong that day. And you even got a penalty and you still you were second, right? Amazing. Lisa: ⁓ it's beautiful, yeah. Yeah, exactly. And not even that bothered me. When I rewatched the race, was like, wow, I'm so relaxed. Is this me or what? Yeah. So yeah, I want to do the pro series, but for the beginning of the year, I didn't know how it goes after surgery. So I was not really focusing it. I say Kona was my main focus for the year. Jackie: That's amazing. That's cool. Lisa: And it still is because now I mean, I'm not running much and, but I'm still, it can be strong. think they blessed it and I still want to give it a try to proceed. So I'm to go there and my boyfriend is racing and then we go to Porta to training camp for some weeks and then back to Austria. mean, it's wild because I'm already in the U S I go back for a telem see it's my home race. It's my home race. Yeah. So. Jackie: ⁓ wow, yeah. Yeah. And that one is beautiful. Lisa: Yeah, I like it a lot. Yeah, it's very hard. It's very, very hard. Every time I think, it's a very hard course, but I love it. So then I go back and then yeah, and then to Kona and then I will see if I do another Ironman. Jackie: Nice. And then Kona. Yeah. So Zell ⁓ C and then are you doing you don't do seventy point three worlds, no? Lisa: I'm not sure about that yet, so we will see how Zalem Z is going. Yeah, it's still in the 50-50 if I'm gonna do it. It's so close to Kona. Jackie: Yeah. Yeah. It I know. The timing is rough 'cause then the travel like messes up like where you would be doing some like big Kona training. It's really tough. Lisa: Hmm. Yeah, I mean, I'm already in Europe and for you, for example, to travel from the US to Europe, a race and then back. That's more wild. Jackie: Yeah. Yeah, that's not it's not happening for me. ⁓ also, like, I used to be in a better place, like where I could be in top ten at seventy point three worlds. And I think nowadays that's just a really unlikely scenario. So for me, it would just be a very expensive trip where I'm gonna get my butt kicked by Taylor Nib or something and ⁓ y get bad points anyways. So yeah, if you're already over there. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And all the short course athletes, know, like maybe they are already season's over, they are rested. And I mean, there so many short course who can race faster, 70.3. And on this course in Nice, you have to be like very, very fit. Like you can't go there in the middle of an Ironman block and just, I don't think so. I can do that. Jackie: Yeah. No, I can't either because you're too bogged down. It's it's harder it's hard to go fast in that phase for most people. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, cool. Well, I think you're gonna do great in Lake Placid. It's good to have good good memories there and you'll have some I think there'll be some fast people. I know Holly Holly's most likely going. Lisa: Yeah, exactly. So. Yeah. Yeah, I'm sure she's going. I she said, no more, I mean, not that I'm sure she's going to do it. Yeah. Jackie: Well she ⁓ I think she f she wanted to do really well at Hamburg and I think she really wants to go back to Kona. Lisa: Yeah, she will do very well and I'm sure, yeah, in Lake Blessed. Jackie: Yep, I hope so. It's like a lot of people by this time of year are, you know, navigating little niggles and things like that. And I think that that's what she's dealing with as well. So you guys might be in a similar boat. Just go rage the swim and the bike and see what happens. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we talked in Hamburg already because we met before and she told me about it some nickel yet and I said, okay, you know what? I also can't just run over the street right now, you know? But we don't have to sprint, we just have to run a marathon, you know? Just a marathon, Yeah. Jackie: Only a marathon, no big deal, it's fine. yeah, well, I hope she makes it there as well. That'll be fun. I'm sad to miss it, although I ⁓ no, I'm gonna go do Boise 70.3, which is a pro series seventy point three, because ⁓ I just have bad scores so far in my 70 point threes. And but I'm gonna go do Iron Man Sweden. Lisa: Yeah. You won't race. Yeah. ⁓ you go to karma. Yeah. Jackie: Because I wanna I wanna do something new. You know, I'm kinda getting towards the end of my racing and I try to pick like one new cool place to visit each year. So that's that's part of it too. Like we have to keep it fun somehow, right? Lisa: Yeah, all nice. Yeah, because you see new places. When I went to Texas and I was just saying, I do all the same races again. When I started long course, I want to do cool Ironmans, know, like different ones. now it's a process to just do all the same races again. So maybe this in Texas need to happen because now I just added Hamburg, you know, because Hamburg was not my plan at all. So because I don't like the court and the short course, I had not good experience with Hamburg racing. Jackie: Yeah. Lisa: So, but I loved it. The run course, it was amazing. was, wow, really one of the coolest thing I've done. Yeah, it's the best. Yeah. ⁓ Jackie: It's the best. The best. The best run course. Because even like, can you imagine if you hadn't run, you're like kinda injured, and you're out on a course with no people, like that makes it so much it makes it hard. And at Hamburg, it's like all the people and the twists and the turns, like it just goes by so quickly. Lisa: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So for me, it was, ⁓ just one more lap right now. You know, like I just loved it. I mean, that was weird. And, but my mom was there because she drives me also to some short course races to Hamburg before. I never saw you so happy in Hamburg racing. Yeah, I was good. Yeah. Jackie: Yeah. ⁓ that's awesome. ⁓ All right, let's do a couple rapid fire questions. We'll close it out and then that'll be that and we'll get on with our day. ⁓ favorite place to train? Lisa: ⁓ Cosomel. I don't know, like it's crazy. Cosomel and home. And where I'm living, Cosomel and home. But it's weird. Cosomel never gets boring for me. It's, I don't know, it's stupid. know sometimes people ask me why and I just like the island vibes there probably. Yeah. Jackie: Really? Mm. Yeah, I love it. I haven't been there for a long, long time, but I did really I do love it there. Lisa: Yeah, now I actually where I'm living it's so perfect for training that I didn't don't need to go somewhere for training actually. Yeah Jackie: Yeah. That's really nice. ⁓ hard trainer session or a long run? If everything if you're completely healthy. Yeah. Same. Hills or on like road or trails? Lisa: Yeah, a long run. Yeah. ⁓ no trails. It's nothing better than a long run on trails, Jackie: Yeah, agree. All right. And the last question that I close out every pod with is something you're loving right now. It can be anything. Lisa: I'm longing right now. I love actually the fan. I'm not, because I have no air condition. It's so hot that in the night I always, I don't like fans and the air condition, but right now it's the game changer to sleep here. Jackie: ⁓ ⁓ man, ⁓ what is it with Europe and no air conditioning? Why is that a thing? Lisa: ⁓ I don't know. ⁓ We have very good houses. The walls are very thick, so it doesn't get very hot. And it wasn't that hot in Europe, especially where I'm living before. But the last couple of years, right now we have 40 degrees some days. And it's not even the walls. No, no, noisy at all. And you can imagine an American boyfriend coming into Europe. Jackie: It's crazy. And no AC. He's probably so sad. ⁓ he's complaining so much. I just know it. He's sweating. ⁓ for sure. 24-7. You know, I think that's why there's all these Europeans over here for the World Cup, you know, going on. And I think that's why they're having like I'm seeing so much about their enjoying the US so much. And half of them are just spouting off about how much they love air conditioning. It's like. Lisa: You know? Yeah. No, he have the best hip rap, you know, right now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, we don't have it at all. Jackie: The greatest thing they've ever had. So ⁓ well, good luck with that. That's why you're so good in the heat, because you just live it. Lisa: Yeah, probably. And we have so many temperature changes from 10 degrees to 30 degrees in one day. It's just normal here because you're living in the mountains. Maybe that's a secret. I don't know. Jackie: Mm. Well. Well That's the secret. All right. Well we'll we'll try it. Well, thanks Lisa for coming on. I'm glad to have the chat with you. It was super fun. And yeah, we'll talk to you soon. Lisa: Thank you, Jackie. Bye. Jackie: Yep, bye.