Jackie Hering: All right, hey everyone, and welcome to another episode of the Women's Race Podcast. I'm your host, Jackie Herring. I'm a professional triathlete, currently racing long-distance triathlon, Iron Man and Half Iron Man races. I'm glad you're here with me today. We have a great episode, an excellent interview with a short course athlete, Taylor Spivey. Taylor has been on the short course scene for quite a few years, and she is currently One of the leading US triathletes in the campaign working towards LA 2028 Olympics which happens to be where Taylor Spivey is from. So it's a really great episode. We talk about how Taylor got into triathlon, her path from being an ocean lifeguard in the beaches in LA through collegiate swimming and on to short course triathlon. We talked through some of the ups and downs that she's had in her career, what she's got going on now, her different training environments that have helped her to grow as an athlete. And then I guess what it's like to get into the Olympics and what she's looking forward to and what keeps her motivated. I have met Taylor as she has moved up to some middle distance and raced some T100 events. We raced together at T100 events. in Lake Las Vegas a couple years ago. She's really great, a really sweet girl, and I think you guys are really gonna enjoy this episode. Before we get going, make sure you're leaving comments and if you can, any episode that you enjoyed or you think other people might be interested in, share those, send them to your friends. We're still in the early stages of this baby podcast and I am loving it and I'm getting great feedback, but it still is a spreading the word type of deal. So anything you can do to help share really helps this podcast to grow and hopefully continue. I will keep it going. I love this project. You guys know I'm into it. I'm just really into triathlon. So whether I'm racing or not, I'll keep going. Anyhow, let's get into today's episode with Taylor Spivey. All right, I am here with Taylor Spivey. Some of you guys might be familiar with Taylor as she has moved over to a little bit of middle distance T100 racing, but mostly she has been crushing it for over 10 years on the short course scene. And she's got loads of experience. And I think she's really coming into form at a really great time. And although she's known as Miss Consistency, I feel like The consistency has jumped up to a high level of consistency. So, Taylor, how are you? Thanks for chatting with me today. Taylor: Hey Jackie. Yeah, thanks for having me. I guess that's a good summary of my my career. I am known as the most consistent athlete, but yeah, I'm always striving to be the best that I can be and adapting to how, you know, the race dynamics keep evolving over the course of my career. Jackie Hering: Yeah, and you've really you've been really doing it for a while. So you have been kind of part of all the different phases of triathlon. I wanna get into all that, but first off, you were a few minutes late, so I had some extra minutes to read all about you and get all about your history and we don't have to do all of it, but man, you've just been an athlete. Like it seems like you've just grown up this way. Can you just let us all know kind of about where you grew up, what it was like and what sports you were into that led you to triathlon? Taylor: Yeah, so I started out probably doing surf life saving when I was growing up in Los Angeles. I did this program called Junior Life Guards in LA. And I also did a lot of other sports, but I think that was like my primary focus and fun during the summer, and I think It's what led me to ultimately swimming in university and later, after after college, I started doing trathlon. So I think if it wasn't for that sport and you know, all of the other sports I did as a kid, soccer, water polo, a little bit of volleyball, Yeah, I don't think without these forts I would be doing trifond now and I don't think I would be able to still be doing it now after ten years and you know being one of the oldest on the circuit. So Jackie Hering: Isn't that weird 'cause you're not even old. You know? Taylor: Yeah, it's kind of weird. I was like, I think I'm all this on the start list. I think that's at first. but yeah, I've been like more or less committed to this sport full on without like a full time job for the last ten years, which is kind of crazy to think about. a lot of athletes I race against, they start doing trough on when they're a kid. But yeah, like you said, I had a different upbringing. I did Surf life saving. I raced on national surf life saving teams, worlds team. Not super seriously, but it was very fun and I think it kept me motivated and driven in the off season of my winter sports career, which was swimming. yeah. So Jackie Hering: Yeah. That's pretty sweet. So who got your your first bike and what was your first bike? Taylor: My first bike, my dad got it for me. I think at some point when I was in in college. I my so my parents met during triathlon. So they did traton, but I didn't know much about it. I just knew they did it. I didn't know anything about the distances or the different formats. until I started doing it myself. But my dad got me a bike and he's like, I'm just gonna get you a used bike. It was really nice though. It was like used cannondale durace, like great setup. but he always told me that it wasn't like the equipment that mattered, it was the engine, which was me, and I needed to like put in the hard work. So Jackie Hering: Nice. Taylor: At some point when I studied abroad my fourth year of college, I decided I would take a break from collegiate swimming and do a few triathlons. And I finally hopped on this bike that he had bought me a few years before. My one of my good friends, who was like the president of the Cal Poly triathlon team, which was the school I went to university at. she took me for my first ride. She taught me how to clip in. This club team really like introduced me to the sport, even though I was in a completely different sport, swimming. And yeah, from there I did my first triathlon and yeah, it was it was definitely a learning curve. I treated it like a swimmer. I went full sun on the swim and just hung on for dear life on the bike and the run. but I found it was a really rewarding experience. It was very fun. It was very different than swimming. You weren't just like head down in a pool the whole time. It was a bit more social and fun. You had a bit more variety in sports, which I I actually really liked. But yeah, so that fourth year of my college career, I was studying architecture for five years. So I ended up studying abroad and a coach had called me And he had seen one of my results and his name's Greg Mueller. He currently coaches a few other athletes now. but he called me and he wanted to coach me. And I was like, what are you talking about? Like who is this guy? And he wanted to bring me into short course for Offline and I had no idea what it was. I only knew about like Iron Man racing. Jackie Hering: Ha ha ha. Taylor: just what my parents did and that was the extent of my trial knowledge. But I said, okay, I listened to him and like he really developed me in in the right way, even though I was, you know, a college student studying abroad. And I bought a Bianchi when I was studying in Florence. I started running and I swam with I eventually found this swim team that was like coached by the former national head coach and it was just like three swimmers and I would swim with them every morning. And yeah, it was a really cool way for me to introduce myself to Trafon, but also to like be integrated into this totally different culture, which was Italy. And yeah, I had a really unique study abroad experience because of it. Jackie Hering: Yeah, that's great. I love it. I I was also a swimmer, not at the level of your swimming. I swam at a D3 school, but I remember my first sprint try, which sounds really similar. You know, in swim, it's just like you just go. And and I remember doing that in the first triathlon and coming out, and I was like in first. I'm like, all right, now what do we do? Like I'm changing my clothes, you know. Taylor: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Jackie Hering: It's fun to think back to those first memories of just like you are so clueless and and you're just out there for the fun of it. That's that's a good way to start. Taylor: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think we had similar experiences. I'd say we were just naive, but at the same time you're just like so excited to be there, so like motivated, you're like at the front of the race, but then the rest of the time you're like biking and running scared. You're like, please don't catch me. Jackie Hering: Yeah and and and coming from swim where like hundredths of seconds matter. It's just so freeing to be like, I have no clue what time like time doesn't even matter really. You're just racing a race. So Taylor: Yeah, yeah. Time is irrelevant in triathlons, in my opinion. So all the distances and courses vary so much that yeah, it's just fun to it's it was just like a fun new experience for me. Jackie Hering: Pretty much. Yeah, that's awesome. You got to explore it first off in Italy as well. so when did the Olympics come to your attention and the idea? Was it that first coach? Did he bring up like, hey, there's a pathway that you could make it to the Olympics? Do you want to try that? Or how did you get that idea? Taylor: Yeah, so this first coach was actually encouraged me not to do a long course. He said that like coming from swimming, I was more well suited for short course and that I could be an Olympia and I was like, yeah, okay. Like I had no idea, I didn't know anything about the sport. So I started to watch the Trifle and Live TV broadcast. I remember I watched I think it was I don't remember if it was the Olympics or the year before, but I think it was London and I think it was when Naan won maybe the World Championships. And I was riding the trainer in Florence, Italy, and I was just like absorbing all of these races while I rode the trainer and started my TRAF One pursuit, which was kind of ironic because like I was like so in awe of these people and it was so new to me. And then a few years later here I am racing them, which is, you know, kind of crazy. But yeah, this first coach really believed in me. He tried to get me into the collegiate recruitment program, which I don't think I quite met the criteria because I didn't come from running. So it took a little while. Jackie Hering: Mm. They want they're looking for s they're looking for swimmers and runners. Is that kind of their main thing? I'm sure it's changed over the years. Taylor: Yeah. Yeah, I think they look for now well everyone who was in the program when I was in it, they were runners who came from a swimming background. There weren't really any swimmers who could like run. it was always like someone who's a really good runner who used to swim before they just focused on running. So at some point I got an opportunity to be in the program, which was really nice because I was working full time as Jackie Hering: Mm-hmm. Taylor: an LA County Ocean Lifeguard in the summer while I still studied architecture in school. but yeah it gave me the opportunity to like take a year and not work, which was nice and kind of see what it took to go all in and focus on triathlon. And I'm really grateful for the opportunity to have been in that program because I think my first coach and then that CRP program the second year. I think those were like pretty fundamental to my development and my introduction to the sport. And I think without it, I don't know if I I think there would have been too many barriers to entry. And yeah, I think it's funny because one thing that my dad told me, he was like, if you want to be a professional athlete, you have to do it on your own. Like I'm not like I support you but I'm not gonna support you financially so you need to figure it out. Which I think is really good because that made me work at the start and then when I had the opportunity to get some support and go all in, I really went all in. And well I didn't necessarily like perform at that point. It was when I got went to my third coach who now is still my coach for the last nine years, Paulo Sousa. Jackie Hering: You're still with Paulo, that's amazing. Taylor: Yeah. Yeah. So it was basically Greg CRP Pollow and and Paulo for nine years. It wasn't until I was with Greg that I think I kind of absorbed all of that training and yeah with Paulo I finally set some reached some of the goals that I needed to or the standards I needed to hit. Jackie Hering: Whoa. Taylor: to get some more support from the Federation. But yeah, I was definitely seen as like, you know, the swimmer who couldn't really run and like it took a lot of hard work and grit, but I think I finally got there. And if it wasn't for all of these people and these training groups along the way, I don't think I I could have gotten there by myself. Jackie Hering: Yeah. In those early years and even now, have you been somebody that always kind of has like a group or a squad to train with? Or have you done periods where you're solo or maybe just with the people that kind of live by you? Like how has your training kind of looked over the years? Taylor: so when I first started with Greg, he organized a few camps for me and a few of the athletes that he was coaching, which I think was a good introduction to the sport, but I was also so used to, you know, swimming with the swim team and like doing these other things that it was a nice transition. when I was in the CRP, it was like an all inclusive, if you want to call it like all inclusive, like. 247 eat trade sleep. Yeah, we all lived mostly in Scottsville in Phoenix. and then we did some camps abroad. but yeah, so that was like the next step, and that was like a big shock to the system. but I think it was good for me to kind of like see how some of the others, you know. Jackie Hering: did you live did you live somewhere? Like wow. Taylor: trained and how to approach training for three sports whereas I was so used to just training for one. And then the next year when I didn't really earn a spot back in the CRP because I wasn't per performing well enough. I yeah. Jackie Hering: Like you weren't running fast enough. Was that essentially it? Or was your biking up to speed with the other people by then? Taylor: Yeah. I think I was strong swim biker, but I wasn't quite running well enough. But I hadn't really focused on the run. I think I was still developing it because as a swimmer, I was at least lucky to have coaches who kind of didn't like rush me into running. which I think is why I have that like longevity and Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: As a swimmer-turned runner, I don't get injured that much. Like occasionally injured, but I think everyone's occasionally injured. But in general, I'm pretty durable, which is good. And I think I had the right mentors along the way to keep me healthy and guide me along that like introduction to running, which was really also fundamental to my development as a swimmer-turned athlete. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: But yeah, so then I joined Paula's group, and that was kind of the time where he was like, he was a bit reluctant to actually take me on as an athlete because he was taking on a lot of international athletes that year. And I think he thought it was too easy because he was he was based in Southern California, and I was I'm originally from Los Angeles. And so all of these other athletes who were joining the group were international athletes. And I was just, you know, a two hour drive away. So he had me one day. He was like, told me I couldn't join the group. And I had to like beg him to join. Like it was so funny. And so I wrote Jackie Hering: How did you choose him that you decided this was the group for you? Taylor: I I don't I knew that there was like a group based in California. I know he had a few other Americans. At that time it was predominantly males. And I just thought like Summer Summer Cook, who is now a summer rapper port, was also in that group. And he had done a really good job of developing her. so I just thought like there were like a few boxes that it checked for me. and I just knew that if I wanted to do well in the sport, I needed a full-time trading environment. So yeah, he made me like drive, mysteriously drive two hours to meet him and then he told me I could join because I showed commitment. Which is kind of funny. And I always give him a hard time about it now. But he didn't make it easy for me. but yeah, I've been with him for nine years and everyone who joined my year is officially either retired or have moved to another coach, which is pretty funny. So Jackie Hering: Yeah. Well, Paula and Eric were there back then, weren't they? Or no? Did they join with later? Taylor: Yeah, so before I joined, actually Eric was in the group. it was like Eric, Joe Malloy, Greg Billington, Will Huffman. yeah, so there was like a big core group of like strong male American athletes. And then you had like Summer and a bunch of other females who were like joining, and there were international Jackie Hering: Okay. Taylor: short course athletes basically. And yeah, from my year on, it kind of evolved into this strong female group. which was really cool to see because we're all around the same age. We're all kind of at this I was probably like one of the more novice athletes. but he did a really good job of like especially those first two years seeing like who the runners were and who the swimmers were. And we kind of had the like learn to swim group and the learn to run group. And there was like a group of us and it was nice because you had like your people to like learn how to run with or learn how to swim with. And I think he did a really good job introducing all of us into, you know, our newer sports basically, which was yeah, he's Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: He's a very smart guy. He studied some sort of fluid dynamics at Vanderbelt, which has nothing to do with Terathlon, but I think he does a really good job of like evolving every year. Like I wouldn't say if he was still doing what he did the first year, like my first year with him, if he was still doing that now, I would not be with him anymore. But every year he's like Jackie Hering: Right. Taylor: doing his own research and evolving and adapting as a coach, which I think it's important. Yeah. Jackie Hering: Yeah, that's important. Yeah. Yeah. So man, that's a from those early years. It seems as if you've come an extremely long way. Pretty cool to do it with the same coach. I think that's neat. I'm somebody who's kind of jumped around coaching, self-coached, and I think it's awesome when an athlete can grow and mature along with a coach. That's cool. You don't have to reinvent the wheel every year, like learning each other. So you were you've been on a pretty like good trajectory. I know you had some crash early on in the beginning, but since then it seems like you've got yourself sorted out and just kept racing all your sprints at Olympics and probably learning tons, traveling all over the world. What was it? Was it the North Star of the Olympics that kind of was just in your mind that that kind of kept you going? Or was it just year by year, see how good you can get, keep improving? Like, what was your focus in in the early years? And then as the Olympics got closer, what were you were you thinking you were gonna make it? Or like what were the feelings in like your first five years there? Taylor: I think In the back of my mind, my focus was just predominantly on like getting better. I don't think I ever am like the most competent confident person on a start line or like in the room ever. so I always see my weaknesses for better or for worse, and I'm always trying to improve on them. So especially in triathlon as someone who came from one sport and saw a weakness in another sport, I just wanted to get better, you know, at my weakness, but also to get better at the whole triathlon itself, because it is three sports at the end of the day and seaming them together. but yeah, I'd say like So I'm I think I joined Paulo in 2017, which was the year after Rio, the Rio Olympics. And then I got my first podium with him. I think it was that year, actually, on a WTCS. It was Flora, who just recently retired, me, and Alicia Bete on one of the hardest courses on the circuit. And I think that was like a big stepping stone for me because the month before or the week before, I had had a really bad performance in like Yokohama. And I was told I was not on funding. I wasn't getting any sport. I had all my savings from lifeguarding. That was about it. And I went and I got second in this race. I er earned funding again. And it was just like Jackie Hering: Wow. Taylor: an eye-opening moment and I think I just proved to myself that I belong here and I can do this. And yeah, whereas like the week before I had like so much self-doubt and like questioning myself because I yeah, I didn't have any funding or support. And I was like, why am I here? Jackie Hering: That's in They just send they just send an email that's like, sorry, like you're out? Or is it like an annual like is it a certain like hey, kind of like you're on contract for funding for like a year? Or how does that work? Taylor: Yeah, I don't really remember how it was for that period, but I think it was like you hit certain standards in races. So say you get, you know, like a top ten in a World Cup or like a podium in a continental cup. So the way these w races work is like there's a Continental Cup, World Cup, and then the World Trathlon Championship series, which is like the pinnacle, the top level of the sport. And like each series is a stepping stone. And so I think they set it up so like if you podium at the lowest level, you earn some funding. And then if you get like a top eight at the next level, you earn some funding and so on. But if you like hit these criteria, then the next year or for that next, you know, 12 months, you'll have some sort of financial support or coaching stipend or something like that. But yeah, I had a really bad race two weeks before this race and yeah, I was like they're basically like you're on your own, you're self-funded to this race. So I was like, okay, I'm just popping in for three days. And then I have a little bit of savings from my work and I'll hope for the best. And yeah, I had one of my best and most memorable races of my career. And it really set me up for what was to come later. Jackie Hering: That's awesome. How I mean, not awesome that the US pulls funding like that, but you know, awesome that you were able to perform when you needed to. How does the the funding of US athletes compare to athletes of other countries that you know of? Taylor: Yeah. I don't really know how a lot of other countries work. I know for us it has evolved over the years, like when the US women were really, really performing, like when there was like Jackie Hering: Like in the Gwen era or when? Taylor: no, because I wouldn't really say I raced in the Gwen era era. I raced more in like the Katie, it was like Katie, me, Summer, Kirsten. Sarah Two. Yeah. Yeah, kind of like the when she was at the end of her short course career and like going into long course. so yeah, I'd say that's kind of when I was entering into Jackie Hering: Yeah. Like the end of Sarah True or Taylor: To short course. So there were and Taylor Nib at a certain stage, but I think that was four years later. But yeah, there were so many of us and performing so well that they had to like elevate the standard for earning national team. Because like there was like six of us in like the top ten or something ridiculous, or top fifteen. I don't remember the statistic, but it was a lot of athletes and yeah, and Chelsea Burns and Jackie Hering: yeah. Taylor: Yeah, there were so many, like it was so hard to be an American female pretty much between yeah, I'd say like twenty well, probably in the Gwen area era. Yeah. All the way up until yeah, Paris. So it was Jackie Hering: Nineteen. Yeah. Well, there was that whole I I don't want to bring this up because it's probably painful for you, but I remember watching, I didn't pay any much attention to short course, except around the Olympics. And I remember there was some whole controversy and saga around the selection because we had so many good girls and that was for Tokyo, and you were like the one that kind of got screwed there. Wasn't that the case? Or was d how did you How is it from your end? Or if it's too painful. Taylor: No, it's I mean obviously it's very painful. But yeah, in that period I was so we have a bunch of different rankings, but I was ranked like number one and number two in like all of the rankings in the world, not just an American. so like me and Katie's affairs were more or less in like the top three of all of the rankings, which is kind of crazy to have two Americans. but yeah Jackie Hering: And this was in that was like in twenty nineteen or twenty it had to be twenty nineteen. Taylor: That was in twenty nineteen. Yeah. So we were like doing really well in the sport. And there was the the test event or there was the test event that had gotten like shortened or altered or something. I had like gotten like a stomach cramp on the run and I had like to walk for like a K of it. And I just missed the auto qualification spot by like a hundred meters. Katie had crashed out in that race, Katie and Kirsten. So there was like it it was like a worst case scenario for all of us. And then the next year the qualification was Yokohama. Or maybe it wasn't the next year, it was 2021 because of COVID. So it had been a whole year had passed. And yeah, Yokohama was a few months before the Olympics and it was our last qualification race, but it was complete lockdown. Like you couldn't leave your room. Like you couldn't leave the hotel room without like being escorted. And I didn't get my luggage at this race. And so not only could I not leave the room, I couldn't order anything online. I couldn't get I couldn't get Uber Eats, I couldn't get like clothes, I couldn't get anything. And this is like the most important race of my career. The last policy Jackie Hering: You're sitting in your room with like your travel outfit and your snacks. Taylor: Yeah, my towel out put in my backpack and nothing, nothing else. And like we were given food, but it was like traditional, like kind of Japanese daily food, which is okay, but it's not enough food. And like I had packed a bunch of stuff because I knew we were gonna be in this isolated environment, but I had nothing. Some of my friends gave me a few snacks and like they're like a sports bra and like some things to wear. But it was like I I was hungry. I was like isolated. I was like, I didn't have my bike. I didn't have anything. My teammate Yuko was like from Japan. So she had her sister go get me her old bike and we were trying to get that set up. but yeah have not having your luggage when you're that isolated before you know one of the most important races of your career. This is really stressful. but anyways, long story short, my luggage eventually arrived like the night before. I built my bike. I was crying. I was really upset. I was really hungry, I think. I think that was the the biggest thing where I was Yeah. Like all of the the things that make you like grumpy, right? And then Jackie Hering: Yeah. I'm sure You're like hunger, tired, stressed. Taylor: Yeah, then the race happens. I'm like half asleep because I'm so jell lagged and like nothing's going my way. There's like a breakaway that happens with Nib and someone else and I'm like just like kind of out of it. And I just like am paying attention. They break away, whatever, and then the run happens and I'm running and I'm in fourth place and I finish and I'm in fourth place and I don't get the auto qualification spot because the auto qualification spot was a top three. So it came down to me and Katie and we both had been she had been going through something. I had this experience and yeah, it was kind of crazy that it came down to the two of us and Jackie Hering: Came down to the two of you 'cause I just pulled up the Yokohama and Summer Rapaport ended up getting that was like Taylor Nib and Summer got one too in that race. That Yokoha. Taylor: Yeah, Summer had earned it the year earned twenty nineteen. Jackie Hering: she did it already Wow. Taylor: Yeah. And so it's crazy that yeah. So it came down to me and Katie and I just missed the Olympics. yeah, and I'd say that was Jackie Hering: That's rough. 'Cause you guys I you guys were both so good then too, like Taylor: Yeah, the race dynamics really were different then. It was more of a swim bike breakaway. Like the swim and bike used to be so hard. Like it was incredible. but I loved that style of racing. It was great. It was like Katie, me, Flora, Jess Lair Moth, like Maya King Ma, like consistently in the breakaway and you know, just making time on the runners so It wasn't just a run race. It was who can swim, bike and run really well. And yeah, it was it was a tough era to be a part of, but I really enjoyed that style of racing a lot. Jackie Hering: Well I had to make you guys so strong. Well, more on to Happy Story. You did go to Paris Olympics. and that's awesome. You got a medal in the relay, which we all saw. how did your individual race go there? Do we want to talk about that or skip over that? Taylor: Yes. Yeah. yeah, we can talk about it. Jackie Hering: What was the Olympic experience like? Taylor: So yeah, qualifying for Paris was a little different. There was a fourth place involved again. But I I was really happy to qualify for this games finally. one second, sorry, I need a charger for my computer. Hold up. I think Jackie Hering: Okay, hit the charger. I can talk about it. You had a really good twenty twenty three with a whole bunch of results and that's probably what got you or maybe qualifying as the year before, twenty twenty two. You raced all WTCS. Okay. wow. From twenty nineteen on, only WTCS. Taylor: yeah, sorry, we have the charger. I was yeah, I was fully focused. I I maybe, you know, wanted to prove that I belonged there. and yeah, I think that year Jackie Hering: So you were fully focused on your Olympics. Taylor: The Olympic year of Tokyo, I'd finished third in the series and then thereafter I finished fourth in the series pretty much every year. but yeah, I really wanted to qualify for Paris and I wanted to make sure I didn't have any regrets again. Jackie Hering: Yeah, you just gotta race and show what's up. You want you're like that's something about having to prove yourself definitely like I feel like kind of elevates you to this like level of like motivation and like stick it to kind of feeling, which seems like it worked for you. Taylor: Yeah, I guess I guess I had that, you know, when I needed to earn that funding again. And then now again later in my career when I wanted to qualify for the Olympics. But there was definitely I was told there was a string of like forty five races in a row where I hadn't gotten worse than top ten. So that was yeah, very consistent, but also frustratingly forth lot. But yeah, leading up to Paris was was a different experience. And I was really happy to qualify. And then yeah, I I finally made my Olympic dream come true. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Was it was it pretty cool? I mean, it had to be actually kind of weird because I remember there was all that chatter about the water quality. Like, are those conversations that you guys are like letting affect you? Or are you guys really focused on like, okay, we're doing this no matter what day, where or when they tell us we're just doing this. I mean, it's gotta be weird thinking like, wow, we might not have a swim. That'd be terrible. Taylor: Yeah, especially in the Olympics, right? Like you would think they would kind of have the foresight of maybe having a contingency plan or something. But yeah, I think it's funny because I think around the Olympics especially the media likes to focus on one thing. And in the last few years it was always talk about water quality. If you think about like Rio, Tokyo and then Paris, was Jackie Hering: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Taylor: All I remember hearing about was water quality. And it's funny. Yeah. Yeah, so it's funny that they're, you know, the reporters aren't asking us any other questions when we go to these like media things every single day. You gonna have just got the same question over and over and over again. And Jackie Hering: Always the water or the heat. It's like water or the temperature. my gosh. Taylor: Yeah, it was like it got to the point where I think one of my teammates, Seth Ryder, he made a joke that he was like microdosing E. coli as like a joke. And because we got these questions constantly. Like I if we were at the pinnacle of a sport, I don't even want to know what these people have to go through when they're getting asked these questions every day. But like he made this joke and it like blew up on the internet. It was really funny. Jackie Hering: I remember reading that. I'm like, this guy is ridiculous. Taylor: He was just joking, but the reporter was like not having it. She was like, she was like, yeah, like this guy would like rip him to shreds. It was so funny. but yeah, the Olympics was a very unique experience, not just with the the redundant questions, but it was a lot and I think it looking back, I definitely made some mistakes going into it. I think staying in the village. I was the only athlete in the top ten to stay in the village who finished in the top ten. Jackie Hering: Is does that mean you're staying in like like dorm type things or what does it mean to be staying in there? Taylor: Yeah, it was like it was like dorms. We had at least the USA facility had like a portable AC. I was sharing a room. It was a really small room with all all of our luggage, all of our bikes, all of our backup bikes. all of the new gear we got, and it was like the most claustrophobic experience. And you're just like hot and sweaty, and like it was a lot of like walking and time on your feet, which is generally like something you avoid before race, and a lot of like socializing and interacting with people that you see that are your friends, which is great, but like for me as someone who's introverted, While I love seeing these people, I like am bad at like saying no. And then I get really exhausted afterwards. So going into this race, I was so tired. Because we were we'd be gone, we'd be heavily scheduled from like morning to evening. And walking around, we didn't really have staff helping us do anything. we were kind of on our own. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: And it was just like rushing from training to interview to fitting to eating to this and that. And then like it's nine PM and it's okay, it's time for bed. Like it wasn't like the best relaxing environment leading into what was, you know, in many people's eyes, the most important race of your career. And I think in my mind like my legs I never felt that bad running in my life on a race. And yeah, in the Paris Olympics, like when it came to the run, I was like, I don't know why I feel like this. This is awful. I was training so well. I was so fit. Like this shouldn't have been the case. And like I realize now why it's just because I was, you know Jackie Hering: Mm. All that extra walking around and yeah. Taylor: But I think our whole team kind of underperformed in the individual race. So we took a step back in between the individual race and the relay. And I went to go stay at an Airbnb with my boyfriend, just put my feet up, like relaxed for a few days, ate home cooked meals, you know, kind of like chilled, was a bit antisocial for a few days and Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: I know a few other athletes did that as well and we just had like a big reset and we also I think wanted to prove that prove something because we didn't really hit the mark in the individual race and yeah luckily we we watched Miracle together and found some motivation and Jackie Hering: yes, that does it. Taylor: Yeah, we came away with the silver medal in the relay and I think we all performed really well and you know more up to par with where I think we should have also performed in the individual race. Jackie Hering: Yeah, yeah. I mean what is Taylor Nib like in that scenario? Does she stay out on her own? Does she come like do the stuff with you guys? Taylor: so she was racing the T T as well. so she we had a rooming block. I was with Kirsten in one room and Nib had her own room, which was fine because she was racing multiple races. but I think she wanted to actually stay outside of the village and she was kind of forced to stay inside of the village. Jackie Hering: yeah. Taylor: But after the individual race, she was like, no, I'm not staying in the village anymore. because I think she also realized that it was exhausting for her as well. Like she's also pretty introverted. I think it's one thing when you're doing a race that's, you know, two minutes long, twenty minutes long. But it's very different when you're doing a race that's two hours. And I think you need like to hold on to as much energy as you can. And trough leads aren't really that social to begin with. So when y you're just like being pulled in all these different directions and using a little bit of energy here and there, it just takes a lot out of you. And yeah, I think she ended up staying with the cycling team or with her family. I don't remember. but yeah she was much happier afterwards. Jackie Hering: Bet. I mean, we're used to kind of, I mean, except for people that are in a squad all the time. I don't, and Taylor isn't really like this. I think she does like almost all her training alone, except for swim, where you're not really used to talking to generally that many people throughout the day. You're talking to like one or two people, you're talking to your partner, your family. You're not talking to the at least for me, like I'm just not really talking to that many folks. And when you're in, I know when I've gone to like the T one hundred races, I'll get back to the room, even after one of those, which is like barely anything compared to I'm sure what you guys did at the Olympics, I get back to the room, I'm like, all right, I just gotta lay here for a good hour and like recalibrate. And talking takes energy, seeing people all around, it's a lot. So Taylor: Yeah. Yeah, it's a lot and I think you really understand it and like you have more empathy for it once you experience it. Like now when I see say like the Tour de France and I see all these people like coming up to these people after the race, I'm like, my gosh, these guys must be eggs. Like I can't imagine what this feels like. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: But yeah, like f like for us, like now when I'm at races, if I can bring like my boyfriend with me just so he can like go downstairs and like if he runs into people, it's not gonna like take a lot of his energy. But he can just like go on a grocery run for me and it's like I can just chill, which is great. And like I love seeing these people. And I like catching up with them, but it's just like the small talk sometimes can be so exhausting and it's like absolutely nothing personal against these people. But like at the end of the day, you're here to race and perform and that's what all these people are expecting of you. so yeah, I like it's funny. I think I told my dad once, because he he likes to come to my races and he's like, Why aren't you coming out with me like for lunch and stuff? And I'm like, I will do whatever you want after the race. After the race we can do anything you want. So I tried to like put it into perspective for him. I'm like, say you have like a work presentation. Right. And you're really preparing for it. It's like, you know, the most important presentation of your career. Before it, you're gonna be pretty stressed out. You're probably not gonna wanna like hang out with me. So, but afterwards we can like celebrate it. So that's kind of like how I tried to put it into perspective for him, and I think you really understood. And so yeah, now he like just goes and does touristy things and then afterwards we'll like go have dinner and like hang out, which is nice. But yeah, it's just Jackie Hering: Yes. Taylor: It's hard because y you wanna see all these people and you wanna do all these things, but you know that it can potentially be a detriment to your performance. So you need a little bit of like self-preservation. Jackie Hering: It's Yeah, that's extremely hard. That's something I struggle with majorly. Like when the fam comes, I have a really hard time knowing where the right boundary is, where I don't want to be missing out on all the fun stuff before. But sometimes you do have to just say, okay, you know, we need to do some things after. You guys go do your thing before. And that's nice with the presentation, but it's like okay dad, it's not like a 15-minute presentation. It's like a two-hour presentation. It's a big it's a big one. So that's good to make that. So sounds like Taylor: Yeah. I can't imagine having like kids like all of the moms that do the sport. I'm like, yeah, I want a family, but I don't know if I can do this sport with the family. Like it's tough. Jackie Hering: You'd be able to it you learn as you go. It's hard. It is pretty hard when they're little because then like they really need mom. As they get older, like it's really easier to kind of say, you guys just go. Just actually they can just all leave and go do something. And then you have time to chill and get your stuff done. But sounds like you and the rest of the US team has learned a lot. and I know you're crushing it, so you're looking to Make it to LA, it looks like, from my perspective. And that would be a home race. So where's your head at with this upcoming Olympics? We want to get the listeners excited about LA. Like get us hyped up. What do you think it's going to look like for the US? And what how this is a lot of questions in one, but how do the US triathletes qualify and how many people are we gonna have there? Taylor: okay, so the Olympics, which will be twenty twenty eight in Venice Beach. it's actually like a twenty minute, thirty minute drive from where I grew up, which is kind of crazy. So yeah, and like Jackie Hering: That's crazy. Taylor: It's basically on the beaches where I grew up doing all of this like junior lifeguards summer programs, which is like really fun. And yeah, we have, you know, the ocean conditions, which is something that I love and I grew up with and I'm hoping we get some waves and like can, you know, you know, get a little bit more dynamic racing involved and it's not just, you know. around race. so yeah, I'm really excited. I know a lot of my friends and my lifeguard coworkers will come watch and support us. And Yeah, it's gonna be really an incredible experience. I think next year we have our first like test event. I don't have like the complete schedule yet of next year, but I believe there'll be a test event, which is kind of like a like a trial race on what will be like a similar, more or less the same course in the same place and the same menu in a similar time of the year. Just so that like That area can prep for the next year when it's you know show time. And we've had that for every Olympics. so yeah, I'm really looking forward to doing that next year. I think it will be really cool. I don't get to go home very often and to race at home, doing you know, the sport that is now my full-time job with like all my friends watching will be really cool. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: But I am guessing the qualification will be similar to what it's been in the past. I don't know the criteria yet. It'll in the past it's been a podium at the test event will automatically qualify one person. And then the next qualification will be say if you get in the top eight at the test event. But if only one person gets in the top eight, then only like the highest ring. person qualifies. And yeah, it's like there's a lot of like subjects. If no one qualifies that way, then it will go, I think maybe to the grand final, which is like the most important race at the end of this series next year. And I think it'll be similar, like a podium at the grand final auto-qualifies you, et cetera. Jackie Hering: There's a lot of little yeah. Taylor: and if no one auto-qualifies or the all the spots aren't full, then it's usually this race where I lost the race where I lost my luggage, Yokohama, that's usually the last qualification race. It's usually a podium. If not, then it becomes discretionary. So that's generally what it looks like, at least the last two Olympic cycles that I've experienced. I think they learned a lot from the Tokyo situation, so that. Jackie Hering: Discretionary Taylor: maybe they had a little bit more room for discretion because sometimes people have like a one off race and maybe they're not the best suited for the conditions of the Olympic race or the relay team and things like that. So maybe they have a little bit more subtext or more discretionary criteria involved. I don't know if we will qualify three people or if we'll only qualify two, but I do know Because we're the host country, the host country always is always gets a relay. So we will for sure have two men and two women. And I really hope we have three men and three women. But to earn three men and three women, you need three from your country in the top 30 of the Olympic ranking. I believe. Something like that. And it's like really competitive. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Taylor: And everyone's always like trying to find ways to get points and spots and it's like very strategic and some federations really go all in and like focus on earning these three spots by sending athletes to specific races and some federations kind of use it as an afterthought. So I'm hoping that we do earn three spots because that would be really Jackie Hering: Yeah, it w it seems from the outside like a major thing to focus on. A home Olympics, you want to have as many athletes representing as possible. And it's nice to have that third, like just in case, heaven forbid something happens to somebody there. Of course, you probably also have an alternate, right? Would that be a thing? Taylor: Yeah. I mean in in Tokyo I was an alternate. I was in in my COVID room. I was there in a room by myself. Tiny hot room. It was really sad. But there was another reserve athlete there, so we weren't alone. But yeah, you weren't allowed to exercise outside. It was a very, very sad time. Jackie Hering: You were there. that's actually more sad. Yeah, that's brutal times. Well Taylor: Because of because of COVID. So yeah, there will always be like a reserve athlete there, but it's so much nicer when like the reserve athlete is also competing in the individual race. Because I think you also like gain so much experience in the individual race that can also help for the relief. So yeah, atrophy is Jackie Hering: Yeah, yeah, for sure. And it'll be interesting to see what Nib does with the bike racing. I guess she probably only qualifies to do the time trial if she wants to do the time trial. Taylor: Yeah, I think I feel like she has something to prove to herself in both the time trial and triathlon. I I know people often like criticize her for maybe trying to do too many things, you know, instead of just picking one. But I think she's just honestly last year had really bad luck with the rain on the T T course and falling and then, you know, having to have a backup race like two days after in the triathlon. So hopefully she has a bit better luck. But I also think in the triathlon she hasn't really performed to what I think she's capable of and what I like know she knows she's capable of. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: So I'm sure she'll be back and yeah, just in the right time. But she does need to earn some points so that we have three women in the top thirty. Well we Jackie Hering: really? I know she just went and did that Edmonton race. Taylor: Yeah, she's she's been she's aware of it. So she did this race in Tisvaras. She also raced Algero and she raced Edmonton because she basically had no points because she had taken like a long time off with racing. Jackie Hering: Because she went on like a Iron Man mission. Taylor: Yeah, and I think she also has something to prove at Kona. So she will embrace Kona this year and I hope she does well and she finishes the race. Yeah, please. Please. I hope she just yeah, she has a really good one and then she can like focus on the Olympics and we can have like a solid team and like even break array crew again and that would be fabulous. So Nim, I hope you listen to this. Jackie Hering: Like just let her get it out of her system so she can go try to win the Olympics or whatever. Yeah. It yes. Taylor: Please take us. Yes. Jackie Hering: We can send it to her. We're really rooting for her. I mean, everyone wants to see her do well at Kona, 'cause it looks like it is tormenting her at this point, and she is very talented and she just goes for it. And it's Iron Man is such a beast. Do you want to do an Iron Man ever? Taylor: Yeah, I have no I have no doubt she will perform there one day. But as for myself, I I think like at the end of my career, like maybe like after LA, I would maybe dabble in one or two. But I think I would be like kind of fading out. like at some point, you know, I wanna have my own family, but like I said Jackie Hering: Yeah. Taylor: having a family and trial fund is really hard. So we'll see like where that phase of my career is post-LA, how my body is tolerating training, being one of the older people in the short course circuit. I think, yeah, I think like I don't know, it's just so different long course racing. I would really need to like dedicate time to the TT bike, which I still haven't done enough of. but yeah, we'll see. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I think you've gotten a tiny sense of it just with your T one hundred stuff, which you've really improved. It seems like you've taken to the T T bike much better. But yes, for Iron Man or the long s even longer than, you know, I guess half Iron Man, it really is just time on that bike. Other than that, you could just do the same training. Well, just same. You don't even have to go as fast. You just go slower. It's actually easier. Taylor: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I'd say I do like quite high volume training for a short course athlete, but I really need to dedicate time to the TTV bike. Like I'm good on a hilly course, but give me a flat course, man. Like I'm not made for flat courses. I need to really work on getting like arrow and I need to like dedicate time to some doing some testing and then just like committing to like a training block on the TT bike. Yeah. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Riding that bike. Yeah. That's the part no one wants to do. I mean, we're all just doing it 'cause we have to and we're not fast enough. But you're gonna Taylor: You're pretty good, I must say. You're kicking ass. Jackie Hering: Hey, I'm representing for the moms and the 40 plus. So I'm hanging in there. I'm definitely now experiencing being the oldest one on the start list quite often. And it used to really like bother me. but recently I've kind of felt a little more proud about it. So it's a mindset. It's like you have to like accept like, hey, experience matters a lot in this sport, short course or long course, because you know. Taylor: Yeah. Jackie Hering: what you're doing, you know how to race. And and I think that does go a long way. So yeah. Taylor: Yeah, I think you're right. I'll I try to tell myself this. Like I have the experience. Like I think it does go a long way. Like you've you've had so many failures, so many successes, you can like pull from all of those and and learn from all of that. And yeah, that's crazy. You're on the we're both in a similar experiencing something similar. But yeah, it's funny because you have like this a bit of self doubt, you're like, I'm the oldest person, but you're like, no, I'm a baras. I like I have all this experience. I can do this. Jackie Hering: Yeah, I mean I I get a little messed up when I'm racing people that are like legit 20 years younger than me and I'm like, like you could be my child, but let's not think about that. So yes, it's best not to consider age at all and just be like, I'm out here doing it. I'm still crushing it. I kind of want to close down this episode with two things. I don't want to take too much of your time. Taylor: Yeah. yeah. Jackie Hering: There's a lot of people, women and men apparently listen to this as well, which thank you guys for supporting women's racing. there's a lot of people chasing big goals. Not all of us are like aiming at the Olympics, but people are trying to do their first trathlon, trying to qualify for Kona, trying to do Boston, all sorts of stuff that, you know, they're gonna hit setbacks or these might feel a little bit out of reach. And I have been very inspired by you over the years, just continuing to go after it and keep pursuing these big goals. what's some advice you have to the people out there that that may get a little discouraged and but want to keep pursuing their goals? What is something you can you can kind of leave with them to just keep going for it? Taylor: Yeah, I think that's a good question. I think everyone experiences setbacks in their career. Like everyone. And I think the only difference between like people who, you know, you see or consider people who are succeeding is just like the people that you know keep going after it and like, you know, it's like a silly saying, but like you fall down and you get back up and you just like keep going after it and you kind of have to grit your teeth sometimes and it's not always gonna be easy. And that's part of the reason why some people succeed is because, you know, they're just they're just willing to put in that extra work and grit their teeth. And one s saying I've always like had written written down, even when I was before trial phone, it was like, What was it? nothing worthwhile ever comes easy. So yeah, just setbacks are part of it. Everyone goes through it and I think it's about how you handle that and how you overcome that. That makes the difference between, you know, the people you see who are succeeding and yourself. Jackie Hering: Yeah, so true. In everything, right? Every part of life, pretty much. And the bigger the setback, it makes the reward of doing the thing that much greater, I think. So, yeah. Taylor: Yeah, I think you like appreciate it a lot more when there's been a bigger challenge or something greater that you've had to overcome because you just like see it from a different perspective. Jackie Hering: Yep. All right, that's good. the last, very last thing we close out the show with is I always like to ask, something that you are loving right now. Anything you love, triathlon related or just generally in life, something you're enjoying. Taylor: That is a good question. let's see. Something I've think I've recently started to enjoy was I try to take a certain periods or just even like a day after like a big training block and a race block to just like do something easy and relaxing and just like take my mind off of trial phone. And one of my new favorite things is to like go to like a water feature. This sounds really silly. Like so like I went on like an easy bike ride with a bunch of my girlfriends and we like went to a waterfall. Or like the other day like before the last few races, I went to like this natural hot springs. And it's like, I don't know, I think in the past I've been like so focused and I don't have that like mental balance and Jackie Hering: Ooh. Taylor: I just need to dedicate like one day every once in a while to like doing something that kind of makes me feel like a human again. And maybe this isn't relatable to your average person, but yeah, I really like going to like find a destination, something that you wouldn't normally do. Go bike there, go hop in like this waterfall, go to hot springs, go do something fun. And While like grinding is like really important in training, I think also like occasionally taking a step back and having a little fun with it is also equally important. Jackie Hering: Yeah, I think that is relatable for the regular person because they may not be grinding in the same way as a professional triathlete is grinding, but they are grinding working out before work, getting their kids out the door, going to work. Like it is quite a busy life that most people lead. So it is important to maybe they can't ride to a waterfall, but they can take a you can take a slow walk around the block with your coffee. You can take Taylor: On the big Jackie Hering: you know, take a few moments to just just chill. And I think it's just like taking that time to recenter yourself and kind of appreciate the things you do have that going on have going on that don't stress you out. And yeah, just appreciate. Good. Taylor: Yeah, yeah, definitely. I can imagine a person who has a full time job and does travel and kids like, yeah, just take a day every month to just like recenter yourself and like do something that like makes you happy. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Yep. There we go. We'll all do that. Everyone can share your relaxing pictures. I do that every morning, but it's just like a two minute thing with my coffee that I'm like, all right, I'm chillin'. But Taylor: Ha ha Yeah. What do you do? Like meditate? Jackie Hering: I don't got time to meditate, but I just sit there for like two minutes before swim. Yeah, nice quiet. Just relax. Yeah, nothing crazy. All right, that's it. Thank you so much for chatting. I am hoping that everybody listens and go and follow Taylor. We can all follow just the journey now to the Olympics. We got a couple of years to build up the hype. People, we can. Taylor: You still silence. Yeah. That's good. Jackie Hering: Travel to triathlon and watch it in LA because okay, I got on the list for tickets for some other sports. I'm not paying a thousand bucks to watch a swim meet. I'm sorry, I've been to many swim meets. You can go stand out there and watch the triathlon without paying, right? Yes. Taylor: Yeah, yeah. It's gonna be super easy to watch compared to all of the other sports. So like you might need to like find a good place for parking and walk a little bit, but it'll be free. It'll be like a vibe, you'll be at the beach, like it'll be super cool. Yeah. Jackie Hering: Yeah. Yes. Yeah, I think that's the best thing is that it is accessible for anybody to watch the triathlon and we can get pumped for it for a couple of years. So thank you, Taylor, for taking the time and coming on the show. Taylor: Yeah, thank you so much for having me. Jackie Hering: Okay.