Animal Aspirations: Hi, welcome back to the Animal Aspirations Podcast. A podcast conversations with the veterinary students, professionals, and people with animal related careers. Our goal is simple, to educate, inspire, and diversify the veterinary profession. so today we're joined by Dr. Balu Esso, a small animal vet who studied the veterinary medicine in Budapest before beginning his career in clinical practice in the UK. Alongside his work as a vet, Dr. has also built a presence online where he shares insights about the veterinary life, animal health, and the realities of the profession with a wider Through his work both in and outside of clinic, he's been helping open up conversations about the veterinary medicine, well-being in the profession and what the journey into his career can really look like. Dr. Bulu has been on an animal Aspirations podcast before where he spoke about his journey through vet school alongside Dr. Fabian, who is known online as the Dready Vet. We plan to have on in a future episode, so check that out. But you're curious about hearing more about that side of his journey, please check out our animal Aspirations channel. Hello and thank you so much for joining us today. To start us off, wondering why did you choose VetMed? Well, we straight into it. VetMed was an easy choice for me. When I was a kid, I just wanted to help people with their animals and trying to put things together. And VET med was what made the most sense it's how i got in to VET medicine. then, you kind of, from an early age, decided what you want to do, well, in my household And then I just followed that path of trying to become a vet. wasn't straightforward. So what inspired you to specialize in small animal medicine? Like, instead of farming or exotic, like why specifically small animal? That's a really good question. When I started out, at first I was kind of amazed by medicine and the way the medicine changes and the way it constantly evolving and learning things that i could do in medicine, that was like amazing to me. So I was drawn to all of medicine in general. Then when I got to university, I started learning more about individual like species and all that. We did a lot of work with horses in my school in Hungary. with lot of horses. And so when I saw the horse surgeons operating, was like, want to be one of them. They looked kind of cool. And like you see a horse surgeon for the first time, you're like, whoa, what is going on here? And I was like, this is cool. But then I realized very quickly, like when I did like my horse rotation stuff, I'm not in the horse world. I'm not a horse person. They're like, I don't have any horses, they're been to stables, they're ride Like, because what I knew from horses was from uni, whereas the horse environment felt very much like. kind of know what's going on. Everybody knows what's going on. I didn't want to do it on all the different bases. I was like, maybe not a horse person. When I was younger, what really drew me to it was zoo staff, and zoology, and the fascination with animals and adaptation. So it was partly about doing conservation work. But I realized that conservation work, I'd have to... like you'd have to have been well connected to get to conservation work and I had students in my university who were like from South Africa and their local vet was like a bush doctor to work with zebras they could go and do stuff with zebras when they went back and I was like dogs and cats and I'm like yeah I'm good I'll do with it. So that was that and then I was just kind of like okay what I do know was dogs and cats I know dogs and cats I've been doing that for a while. mean honestly, the veterinary medicine is so fast. It's so broad that even when you speak like when I say dogs and cats it sounds reductionary but there's so much to cover in dogs and cats like so yeah I kind of stick to dogs and cats. I want to try doing more exotics even have friends that do exotics but like still it takes a lot of like I think it takes a lot of like a big learning curve and building up your cane space and trying a lot of stuff. So it's going be very, very fragile. How did you end up choosing budapest as to where you were going to study veterinary medicine? Oh, great question. I applied to, I had four universities that I applied to, think. And I applied to Nottingham, Glasgow, RVC and Liverpool. And they all rejected me. None of them gave me an interview, not even look at it at. That was absolutely devastating. So I was planning on taking a gap year. So the plan was to take a gap year, come back, maybe resit an a level or two trying to my grades up and reapply again. But then when I came back from my gap year, I didn't quite get the grades I wanted. Somebody mentioned about mainland Europe, or universities in mainland Europe. I remember. having to go to people and go like what is this? up Hungarian is this? and they did that stuff with doctors, dentists, like transfers from the UK to Hungary. And then I just found out about Hungary, found out about the admissions process. There was a liaison back then that helped us fill out our forms. And then I went to Hungary and the rest was history. I did the exam and boom. next thing i knew i was a vet . Then you're a vet. Exactly, yeah, exactly. A few years later, I think. So how do you deal with rejection? How did I deal with the rejection? mean, rejection is a hard thing to process in general, I think, like as a human being, you have to get exposed to a lot of rejection. I think I was rejected by the first two universities and the last university I was waiting for was not the university. So was like, you're making a lot sense. So the first day, everybody kept telling me, through secondary school that you're going to get rejected, you're going to get rejected. Like it's natural, especially when you're applying to like Oxbridge or Medics. So when you're applying for those kind of courses, because they're competitive you're gonna be rejected. So don't worry about it too much. So I got rejected by my first three universities, Liverpool, RVC and Glasgow. then I was like, okay, I'll just leave it. sucks. And I was just really down and down. It was really in my feels. And I think Getting through it was very much like figuring out what my plan was because I think when you're rejected it is easy to be disheartened by ⁓ and but when you figure out, okay, when you accept the rejection that, okay, I have been rejected I'm not getting into the place. When you sit down and be like, hey, what do we next? I think that's what helps get through rejection. Kind of like planning and pivoting. like, okay, this happening. I need to make a pivot. I need to change. So I think that would be that. I think that's how I got through it was just. looking forward to the future. I'm a person that I'm heavy on my faith as well. So, leading on my faith as well, I want to get through my rejection. But get rejected often, but don't sit in it. And then plan forward. Is that kind of the advice that you give to students now that are going through that experience as well? 100% and failure, just got to sit in it. Like it's gonna be bad for a little bit ⁓ It's part of every nothing can happen without rejection or failure. mean, like things have to go wrong sometimes. If things are going well for too long, what we say to the vets as well, as a new grad, it's like you can go, you can do so many which ways or whatever it might be and not have any that believe, but then it doesn't necessarily make you a good surgeon. It just means that you just haven't done enough to see what happens when things go wrong because what makes you a good surgeon is when things go wrong, then you know what to do with it, afterwards But if you have so many things going right all the time, what's not going right? You have nothing to build on when things go wrong. Whereas if you lose to doing, yeah, nothing to grow back on, like, oh, this is what happened, this time, so let me go back and do what I did there to get out of I think it's really important that you just keep going and don't stop. things have kind of change now since Brexit with the accreditation of board, so would you still recommend studying abroad now? Yeah, think Hungary still retains its European accreditation. And the accreditation is always changing because I think It wasn't too long ago that America wasn't going to recognize you I don't think its still like that now Not anymore. it was a... But that was like a jeopardy. It was. yeah. its always changing. But I think the most important thing is getting the degree. doesn't matter how you get your degree. Because like I said, when I was applying, I used think that the UK was the be-all and end-all There's vets needed in multiple countries. Try and get your degree and then you can always build your experience or find your way in. Afterward, right? And like, know, people come from other countries and try to work here. So it's not the end of the world if you're from abroad But if you're trying to get a degree, I'd still recommend it. Yeah. what would you say to students who are dead set on attending their dream vet school? Do you think it matters? So my dream vet school was University of Liverpool That was my dream vet school because they had the most of work experience. I've always wanted to get into it. I guess the question is why you want to, so really telling me the why of why you want to to school, what's the name, is it prestigious, the location. I think you might want to get into a dream vet school, but mean getting into a vet school is an accomplishment in itself. Like you guys that are here at RVC you're living my dream. It's my dream. I would like to come here and sit down and give you advice. You're living in my dream but I want to be in obviously, you know. So I think it's just getting into the vet schools, most importantly. Yes, there are certain vet schools that give you certain more resources. But again, the measure of how much of a good vet you are going to be is not necessarily the vet school you're going to be, but your personal attributes and what are your abilities. you can go to as many shiny vet schools you want to go but if you're not willing to do the work. quickly, you can't help the people in the way they want to. So That's really insightful thinking. look, especially, and that's really, especially important for people going through that right now. moving on from vet school into like more the real world of clinical practice. you ever had a case that really stayed with you emotionally? Like every single one. There's so many cases, when I was a new grad the big thing for me was I would write down in a notepad all of my really complex cases, the cases that weren't like straightforward, the things that aren't difficult. And I'm very much, what I love about being a vet is being connected to people's lives and their story in their lives. you know, pets make up a big story in our lives. And I think when you're a local vet, you play such an important role in the story of people's lives. So. It was very, like you're very emotionally invested in this job. So a lot of it was like spending time with people. And I remember so many cases, there's so many cases I go through where I was so emotionally invested, like I had one where, I think her name was Perdi and she was a cocker spaniel What happened is, and I guess I'm gonna get stuck in the case, but what happened is that you get, the owner comes in one month and says that her daughter, who's like a six month old baby, has been coughing through the weekend and all. They went to emergency ANE and they put the daughter on the antibiotics and stuff like that. And the dog sleeps in close proximity to the daughter and all that. The dog started coughing. So had two dogs, you had a Jack russell and a cocker spaniel The jack russell was coughing and producing a little bit of phlegm and seemed to have a alright Whereas the cocker spaniel was coughing, but at this point it started coughing up blood. on the Monday and she was coughing up like jelly like blood and I was like this is crazy what's going on I remember this the new grad I was like what's going on now she's coughing up blood and I remember sitting there talking with her and trying to get the history and all this stuff people tell you so much like information about their own personal lives about their pets and like her daughter was sick and that she's really worried that the dog has given something to her daughter and the daughter gives something to the dog and then the other dog seems to be fine but this dog is now whatever. And we get more more history on the dog I said, look, I'm to do a test. I don't know how it works. She's coughing up blood. It's really serious. She's still bright, but it's just might be a downhill. And then start doing all the tests on her. And we find out what she had with it. we find out that she got into rat poison because she's been playing dog cat in grocery fields and finding the fine rats and such. And then, yeah, we gave her the vitamin k tablets and she was fine. did that two weeks after was the first time diagnosing this and then the first of the this type of the case and I was like, this is, oh, it's scary. And I like, and I can remember this throughout the time, because my first time prescribing with vitamin k you're like, Whoa, what's going on? And like, and so I'm calling every two days and be checking in on her every two days. Like how's your daughter doing? She's like, ⁓ and how's Perdi doing? She's seems then you know, like, you see, you see them on the seven week check, you see about the 14 week check, 14 day check, sorry, is getting better, looking good, Like, wow, like, you know, I fixed my first case. that was like, was like one of those cases that kinda stuck with me. Because it was because And amongst all of that, there's a lot of heavy emotion attached. I think that's the bit sometimes you talk about clinical cases and stuff, but you forget about the emotional aspect of it. What the owners going through, why they're scared, why they're nervous, what they're worried about in their lives. The fact that she worried about her daughter and her dog, and she might lose her dog at the same time. know, there's those kind of cases. So there's that kind of case. And I've got like, you know, some of my most emotional euthanasias like... had one with a Rottweiler and every time it was a Rottweiler its always super emotional. don't know why, but the Rottweiler cases always so emotional I remember going to a house visit and they brought me into their home And we all sat in their living room and their old dog was there and we did it together. Sorry, I don't want to keep going. But one of the biggest cases that I did for euthanasia was a Saturday. I was working my first Saturday shift. and I was scared to be left alone because it's Saturday and my boss would be like, don't worry Bolu you're okay you can do stuff. I was like, yeah, okay. And I was walking towards the end there, I think we close at like four and around 3.30, Bear comes in. Bear's a Labrador, 12 year old, maybe like 13 year old Labrador, super dishevelled He has like a triple coat. There's a double coat, he has a triple coat and his hair is like poofed out, like it's crazy. He's all over, and he's super fluffy he's a bit obese. And he's on the tubby side, he just comes in, he gets panting, it's lethargic, it's chaos And I'm like, oh, Bear does not look good. yeah he's just been through a lot He's not seem himself as typical. We pop an ultrasound probe on him can kind of see that his spleen is bleeding and there's like blood filling up his abdomen I'm assuming that there's a splenic mass there It's not really a great time for us to do surgery. So I'd started discussing the next steps is not looking great. So they don't really have that much money and they're more rural and a bit more practical don't want things to on go So it's like, we'll just leave it. Do you want to do it now? Could you actually do a home visit for us? And I was like, we're closing in ten minutes. But like, know, the balance there, don't know, it's just a weekend. I could take the van, I could follow you to your house and we could do it in your house. You know, like, if you could, that would be great. And I felt like that could be great because this consult room was tiny and the walls were dark and there was nobody here on a Saturday and was me and that person who maybe had a nurse So was like, okay, you guys jump home , i'm going to take bear and then i'll follow you, follow them through the village, get to their estate. They pull up and their estate they got like a house on a massive hill and they've got so much grass land And you can see the coast up there and you can see windmills in the distance and they have this field of land. It was like, that's daffodils and like dandelions There's so many of them, I think, they're just floating in the breeze. And there's this massive tree in the middle of this field. you can hear the, they've got sheep in the background, the sheep are grazing And Bear just jumps down from the van like nothing happened. He runs into the field and he just runs around in the field. And it's like this picturesque, like painting scene. you see like, you know, can see the wind mill, you can see the water I think it's the Isle of Sheppey you can see. And you're like, well, this is crazy. And like he runs out into the field, there's this massive tree. And like, know, it's springtime, so everything's a little bit green. And then you're just running out into the field, nothing's happened. He just does a little bit for a little while, then he kind of just runs back to us. like, they have their back to the patio, kind of like next to this garden. And he comes in and just sits down next to us, he's like, okay, he's ready now. And he's like, he lies down and he's like he's almost like, he is ready now. And I start putting in the catheter, I'll put the stuff in, and then we put him to sleep there. and no he passed so peacefully and they said they're going to burry him around there in the garden and I was like, this is crazy because normally I'd be like to put some, some, pet to sleep in the practice but like when they ask for a home visit, the fact that I could follow them home and give the pet the release in some way that wasn't scary, that was familiar to in the serene nice environment It really touched me and that's that kind of thing of like if people do ask for a home visit, usually then i would always do it. Things changed about after COVID we had to stop doing home visits That really stuck with me in that moment of how sensitive the information process is. yeah, and I could go on and on and on, That's so special and I think it really goes to show the kind of connections that we can build with our clients. Big time. Big time. You're a big part of their lives. I think some of us don't realize it, You're not hyping yourself up enough about what you're doing. Like what you're doing is so important, undervaluing what you're doing. Like don't undervalue what you're doing, especially as a single vet soul charge. I'm really responsible in the community sometimes, you know? And so you're a part of so many people's lives, so so many people would look to you for that advice to help them through difficult times. And so you pay a key part of people's lives. And so that connection is super strong and you can... I've got lifelong clients that have just always messaged me because they find my Instagram and they're like, you must come and visit, you must stay for tea and I'm like, how would i ever get to you? But stuff like that, know, and it's like, even though I was at Crafts last week and the woman comes to me she's like, you're at my friends practice, you help me with my dog and me. and I was like, yeah, we did it, we did it. was like, yeah, we did it. I was like, guys, i was with were like, we'll going like, what was that? like, oh, just a client. Yeah, no, it'd nice. So it's really important what we do! so looking more broadly at your career, then how did you get started as a locum vet? What does that mean? What's process like? Yeah, so locuming was always a scary thing for me. It was very scary. Even when I was doing it, remember being, I'm gonna leave full-time work. Will I be able keep up the shifts? like self-employed and the tax situation was confusing as hell. what? what is this all about? But one thing my parents even said to me, because they're both consultants in their own respective work, but they were like, once you go to self-employed you kinda never want to go back. Right. think full time you that security. But sometimes when self-employed, you start to realize the freedom that you do have for your everyday decisions. The reason why i locum is actually birthed out of combination of social media and my television might increase it, but also be burning out. Yeah. I just want to take a step back from work. And I've been doing TV stuff and social media stuff and all that stuff with everybody like last minute okay, I'll do this. Can you make this video? I was like, I time to think. When you're on full-time work, you don't have enough time to think. So I said I'll take some time off. And then I realized that I just needed to be able to plan my own schedule. think part of burning out was not being able to control my decisions. I'll be able to have control of what I want to do. So part of taking that control back was locuming And locuming kind of, you sign with agencies that you can work for different practice owners and you just kind of look for shifts and there's always shifts going because everybody needs a vet And so that's kind of how it worked for me and it works really well for me. I'm looking potentially to go back into full time, but I still enjoy locuming a lot like know, balancing a lot of the other stuff I'm doing like I wouldn't do this podcast If I wasn't locuming need to have that work control my time to tell you that allows me to be a lot freer. Did you do it through an agency or is this like on your own? Yes, I do it on my own. through word of mouth but I always have an agency. So when you can call different groups and stuff like that, and they also are in touch with lots of their practices and then they put you in touch with their practice and then... through the development practice, they get a cut as well for everything they need work. And if you go full time with the practice eventually, they can also get a big bonus But yeah, I do mix both because also because I have my pages where I reach a lot of people as well. it's a big opportunity, like, oh, but even this area, you know, and weirdly I have a really big network. so, oh bolu can you help us cover this Yeah, sure. I think it works out my diary. I think the biggest thing for me before I was locuming was making sure that I had all the jobs, all the kind of skills under my belt. like surgery, under my belt, was comfortable in most consult situations, emergency sort of stuff under my belt. And feeling comfortable is just kind of because when we're locuming dropped into the deep end gotta figure out the computer system, gotta figure out the workflow and just go for it. Just being comfortable with that takes a little bit of experience. How did you get into like the Instagram side of it and stuff like that? Yes, I mean, so Instagram and TikTok were things I built and like, simultaneous at the same time. the reason why I started building them was at the same time. doing lot of TV stuff. And the reason I got into TV stuff was because Danielle who's in BVA she recommended me forward for TV stuff. she just, she said that they reach out to her, she said the first person she thought of was me, sent it my way, I did interviews and also got into TV stuff. At the same time, I was like, I should, build up my page a little bit But a big thing for me, and I still remember my first post on my socials on Instagram was like. The reason why I made this page is because a lot of my friends don't know what I'm doing, but also I just want to be able to share everything I'm passionate about in the attempt that it'll make somebody else just as passionate about it. And it just kind of kept growing from there as i was just posting stuff, posting content posting some stuff about my life, posting about cases, posting all the stuff I'd seen. And, you know, my friends would be able to get an insight into what I do every day. And TikTok was very much like Covid times. Everybody was at home. was bored in the house and I was bored. I had no choice but to show a little bit of a symptom, like scratching my throat. Two weeks of isolation, like, whoa. like, I already booked a holiday for march 2020 And that got cancelled so I already had a week of holiday. And then my throat was itchy. was like, And they were like, stay at home? No, I'm bored in the house. And so all that sort of stuff, it was just kind of building and before you know it tiktok had some kind of building, I had to go back to work and then I was like doing stuff like all those, that was back in the glam bot was just starting I made a big glam bot inside the practice was hardly any cases, And then it started becoming like emergency only cases. Then it was like, okay, now we're seeing vaccinations. It was such a weird, under-counter time. And it had to be filled with something. And so, yeah, it was just like slow trickle of like, vet life to TikTok and I started to get into day in the lives and I started to reach more and people. it just kept growing from there. Last time you were on, you were kind of just starting out your social media journey. How has social media changed since then? What kind of ways, how have you tried to keep up with it as well? wow that's a really good question Where do you start? It's so much that has changed. Like I think during COVID a lot of things are very much like this is new and this is trending and jump on trends and just post this and do whatever and that was one side of it. And then I think through like this like influencer wave, not just in vets but just in general. like there became a real fight against misinformation and disinformation. let's like, you know, people want to hear from experts and hear expert opinion. The good thing about being a vet is that you are qualified to talk about your stuff. So I could give information around subjects, is breeds and what are the most like diseases or cases that we give that kind of stuff. And then also it was like a period where vlogging became a bit more. like everyone was like, I'm vlogging and like, come with me, get ready to go in, there's gonna be people there, like, cook with me to da da da da da And I was doing something like, I'm not necessarily gonna come with me, just like, day in my life, or whatever. And day in the life and it's still a big thing to be fair. I think where there was, with TikTok, and the reason why I kind of shifted away from TikTok is because TikTok was very much random, like I thought that I was building the community, but then. It just wouldn't show it to people that were following me. It wouldn't show it to the existing community whereas instagram is very personal. All these people actually know me, they know my interests and they would ingage or reconnecting and stuff. whereas tiktok it's something like, somebody's like, oh, I why you doing that? like, I talked about this 10 videos and like, what's going on? And so it became like that. And then now I think social media is moving in the direction of communities. So building communities and ecosystems around yourself or creator. I think that's the big side of that. Because I think... whole idea of echo chambers on social media grows because we will follow each other because we have something in common I think that's building that forms communities that forms this sphere so people have different circles of the internet. So I think there is a big focus on that. People to try and find alignment, belonging to socials. I think there's a lot of focus on that. And now I think social media is shifting slowly to like two ways. think there's an avenue for higher polished, refined like good value content. There's still the kind of middle ground kind of what I do, where it's just like, I make some kinds of things, I just make stuff, just doing stuff like that. It's just between and then there's just like casual, just chatting it out like, it's just like, I saw, That kind of thing. I think there's just like, mix of. So the internet is so fast right now. think we're getting into this stage where we're almost overloading. ⁓ do we pay our attention to? What do we pay attention to? I think big things that people are just trying to find groups that connect to, place to talk And you're like, this person represents me, you know what I Yeah, I think that answers the question. no definitely ⁓ the is like so big, like so many different personalities and opinions. How do you take sort of like, criticism? Oh, yeah. Internet's huge. It's hard, I think. Sometimes I just don't even have time to entertain. Sometimes I'm just so busy, like, I just need to do what I'm doing. Like, I need to do what I'm doing. I think it's very important that when you're on the internet as well, that you're conscious of what you're doing. think that helps you grow. Being a well-rounded person is important if you're going to be on the internet. I think it's really important to... be able to listen to voices of different communities, communities that aren't like yourself. Because the internet is so good, of putting you in an echo chamber of what you used to hearing. It's very important that you take time to read and learn from groups that are nothing like you or the polar opposite of you. And that kind of works your way around the different views until it gets back to you, just so that you have a 360 view of what's going on so that you realize that you're not reinforcing yourself because like i said. there's going to be so many opinions out there. So how do you decide what the truth is or what's right? Because everybody's going to feel like they're entitled to their opinion. Like, for example, with everything that's happening with crufts right now. you know, I've talked to people that are working with their breeds, and they're like, yeah, but my breed is this and the breed is this and because of years of, like, their own confirmational bias. And then you've got the vet community where like, what does that actually mean? It's not like this. And it's like a typical example of like, a dog which is severely, you know, bull dogs or a french bull dog go-to a practice and the vet might say, yeah, it looks healthy. Just auto-pilot, without acknowledging all the underlying conditions. So something like that works like, okay, well, actually, as as I know that you guys are so invested in the breeding, you've really gone well for dogs and you've gone there, but you guys are missing. the underlying points where this dog has an ectropion or an entropion or the body confirmation means that it's going to get this disease or this disease. So there's all these kind of different bits that affect him, but then it's almost like trying to understand what these perspectives are. So I think you just have to be really well rounded and like spend time listening to voices that aren't your own and then taking in that information. And that's kind of how to balance with that I don't know, how to take criticism to be honest to such a real disaster, I was crying. we just don't take it too deep. That is not too personal. You know, everybody's going to say something like that and you can't get everything perfectly You can't do anything. Yeah. So what sort of advice would you give to, because we have a lot of students now they're like developing their own like vet accounts and stuff like that. like, what would you say, what kind of advice would you give to them on how to pursue that and stay confident and keep up with their social media presence? Yeah, I'll say the big thing, especially if you're a vet, think the big thing is knowing that we are science based people. So if you're going to say some things online, have something in the background. don't always have to engage with that talk because sometimes it's not even fruitful. Like I remember the first time I did a post, like it was like a 10 second post on no sound, so I was like, check this out, was like, don't scruff cats! like that thing, don't scruff cats, below, there. And some American lady laid it to me, was like, oh yeah, you don't scruff cats these guys immature, this guy, this guy doesn't care about them, he only cares about himself, but he's narcisstic So I mean, putting in my comments that all these good ladies abusing me back then, my followers were really engaged. So one of them just powered onto her page and like, oh, what are you doing? And then it was on Smog. I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa. And then it just turned into like a back and forth because I got something about like, well, it's that page three of the British feline Association or whatever. It's like a bullying tactic. not, it's not proper handling. And then she started going, oh, you know, it's on TikTok. She me some horrible, horrible names. I still have her on the video somewhere. It's like proper Karen like She was clapping along, like her face was all swollen up with a hand on her head. She's so visibly mad at me. But I just her because it just didn't feel... When I gave her that, ⁓ it didn't bring anything It didn't do anything. It didn't even vindicate me when I was like, oh, well, actually, it didn't vindicate me. It felt like I was like, just going down to her level to play. And sometimes I just felt personally. I don't always just engage with the stuff. I have some friends who are really good at engaging and grabbing back before the game is dead. It just doesn't, you're never going to see my point of view. Like I can say it, but it's just like, I'm getting trapped in it all over again. What's the point? if I could just stay true to myself and stay true to what I think is true, I would be fine. So having the opportunity to back out but just not engaging. It's hard. hard when somebody wants to say that about you and you're like, wait a minute, joke on me. But it's like, just make yourself feel good. If it's really affecting you, write it down somewhere else. write on a piece of paper and crumple it up... So following off from that, do you have any tips to remain confident with an online profile? Yeah, think the biggest thing is staying true to yourself. But not only that, it's just kind of like being consistent and having evidence. not being disheartened. Like it's not a metric thing. you know, sometimes our numbers right now are shot all over the place different companies would come in and help me with it and do that and they want me to run this ..... But I'm like, it's not the numbers that I'm in for, it's stuff like when I come to college and you guys tell me, oh, I've watched this video or I've done this, or actually you did this, not like, oh, that's sick!! I didn't even know anybody could. So even though there is sometimes when you do something, you forget quickly and I've done stuff where I've had stuff with. Tens of millions of people, to be honest, you don't want anything going viral because when they do this, like, then theres all these weirdos and it's just not fun. But when you think about it, you could be majorly impacting them. Big thing is, like, I don't like to tell people, you could do this. If I think you could do it, I'd rather show you how I did it rather than be telling you how to do it. So the big thing for me is not following the numbers and just being in your own head. it back to myself, I share what I want to share. If it does reach somebody, does inspire somebody, ...... That's all I can ask for. So that's how I keep it. Following on from social media, how did you get into business? Because most vets just stay in a clinical environment side of it. Can you tell us a bit about the transition into the business side of it? Yeah, was joking with my friend the other day I was like, tell me what's happening. Yeah, i was like at RVC And they were asking me, how do you get into business? How do you get into it? what? Yeah, always been a very lateral thinker I've always been very like, like how do we solve problems in general? Because we are problem solvers at vets how do you, like how is it solved? But what are the, what are the mental models that we're using to solve the problems? And has somebody solved this problem in another landscape or another profession? I don't know, first I'll sit down with my friend. he was an engineer, and he was like a senior lead in the team. And he was talking about stress and strain, and like how they would check in with their employees to see, they'd give them a questionnaire and check in to see whether not they're conflicting your work and how much you're conflicting your work it would able to tell you if that is overloaded or under loaded, if they have capacity to do more work, or if you should take back some of their work so they can complete their work to a higher standard. I mean, this is stuff that we have been applying, ⁓ right? And it's like that where I'm like, ⁓ you know, thinking about even like, there's a there's a mental model, there's different, there's so many different mental models, right? And shane Parrish has a book called mental models where you can understand, like, theres mental models of ways of thinking, so that you can deduce an answer. So like the great example is Occam's Razor a lot of people have heard Occam's Razor, but basically the simplest explanation is the most likely interpretation. So the whole thing of when people say when you hear hoofs think horses, not zebra. Like the simplest explanation is that there's there's a horse walking down the street and a zebra. ⁓ It's the same. many other ones, like so examples like for example, that's a mental model. It's basically like if you look at the tube map, and you were to try and use that when you were driving in London as a way to not be in London, you'd pretty lost. You have to remember who the cartographer was, why they designed it and what the purpose was for and not just go with it in like, you know, you need to couple a proper map for the right things you can do and you don't have to do those are like mental models. So these are the things that help me think laterally and like reading books from other professions and other places helped broaden my mind. And I think from that, I can't just extrapolate those things back to my life. And that's one of those things that allow me to expand laterally because I think there's one way you can So you can get deeper in veterinary medicine for example, so you can go, you know, become a diplomat, a diplomat, become a professor, like, you know, certified you know double board certified. But it's another way of expanding laterally and using your skills to expand naturally, especially as a vet you're so well rounded. You can apply your knowledge in some aspects. I think First I started looking at social media like, I went to vet school, surely I can study social media in a similar way like how does it work. And I started doing social media and like, through that I started working with brands. And I was like, what is the brand's doing that, it's different to what I could possibly do. So there's that and like, so I worked with brands and all of them. And then I started learning stuff, asking questions, people I think were learning. And when I'm in different rooms, I'm just like, okay, all this is how you.... this is how you... talk about this. And I've been to different podcasts and I'm like, oh, this is how you... I'm getting ideas now, this is cool, I might try it, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work any problem with it. You know, so then I start seeing different opportunities and so like for me, you guys have business but like, what I've been doing, mean, littersense is something that's a recent business venture for me and that's an extension in brand work and for me just an actual extension of like, i'm a vet I've been working on lots of brands for years, my brand reached out to me, it's a product that I really think is valuable. It makes sense to me to be like, okay, let's work this out and do more and help people through this. it's just like, I've got the tools through my experience to able to use that. Do you think business is for everyone in the veterinary profession? What do you think it takes to pursue that? ability to step back and be like you don't know anything and willing to learn. I think it's not for everybody in veterinary medicine I think you have to have a stripping of yourself to the common ground to go into business, I think, because you have to be like, oh, I have to do this and ask the right questions. I thought it was hard and I'm now talking to accounting. how to do this, then I go, actually, you need to sort this out and do this, do this, do this, on. like, okay, And then I go to different lawyer people like, lawyer people see what i'm saying i go to lawyers So you I'm I'm talking to them for advice and they're explaining stuff to me, Oh bolu you should do this this way. Then have an agent who helps me with like brand deal stuff. I've kind of got a little team going now. This is scary. Like, how does that work? Because I don't think it's for everybody, but I think it's for anybody that's willing to learn. I suppose that's most of our stuff I think after a while you can get closed off I think you should never be afraid to try. And if you fail, you fail. I think pick yourself up So, you know, we'll see how we do. I'm trying my hardest to stay true to myself. Beyond business, earlier you mentioned like some of the TV opportunities you've had. Have you had any like challenges with that or kind of highlights? Yeah, I mean, even with business and TV, all of it's constant challenge. I'm constantly learning because I'm entering it. lot of things for the first time. The biggest challenge for me is that a lot of these productions or brands have their own agendas. Right. Whether it's to make money, whether it's to be viewed, whether to, you know... be on air for as many seasons as possible. And all those things require certain things like controversy, whatever. That can be really difficult to navigate You're like, guys, I just want to be honest i don't want to be in the middle of the job. I'm not trying to get somebody to come back at me and say this. But the big thing for me is always negotiating that. So sometimes you have to be very strong, in voicing my opinion. I don't think that's the right word. That's not something we should do. Sometimes I might take it back seat You know what mean? So I'm still fancying them, and I think it's very important that sometimes you do have to bring your foot down, because I know you have to be like this can't work. Sometimes you can really let it go out and see what the response is, and then you're like, oh, no, we look bad. But I think that's the hardest part for me is trying to voice my values to value my heart as a person, but being able to speak up for myself. This can't run. I think that's really important across the board. Highlights on tv so far? Yes, highlights. Being on national TV is always a highlight. I have a friend that messaged me we've been in the gym and love your weekend is playing one time when I was finishing church and I came, I went to morisons just to buy like a protein shake So a woman came up to me and like a really big like Scandi Swedish kind of accent. She was like, oh you're Dr. bolu I'm like, That's crazy. She's like, I'm just in London for the weekend. i walk into the store and you're there like, that's insane. So those are like cool things. And every now and then people on the street might stop me here. Highlights of like when I come to do some of this and you guys like know who I am or even want to hear some advice. these are all highlights you know Like last week I was at crufts There are a lot of things with crufts that are wrong. But I had a really good day with this. I was with Kat The team that I worked with for such a long time. doing a lot of stuff was like, I get to do this. That's so cool. So super highlights Hopefully I got some trips coming up that highlight. So yeah, there's a lot of highlights. think a lot of it's just living in the moment I guess it's cool. And the fact that i get to practice at the same time. Yeah, you can have it all It's kind of a different question But I guess why do you think representation on television, both as a vet and honestly as a minority too, it's really great. It matters. It is so important because I had no representation. I think representation comes in so many different forms of however it's the exact person that's likely to be doing it or someone that's come off from a similar upbringing to you or somebody that speaks so much to you and has similar difficulties as you may have or somebody that even considers your perspective online. think all these things are really important because it gives you strength to be like, okay, if they can do it, I might be able to do it too. I think that's the biggest thing about like, like, role model should be real models and they should be real people. Sometimes they're like, we're doing it in their own difficulties. They're not perfectionists and they're not perfecting themselves. But as you can see, as we people doing it, think that's why representation is so important. Not only that, think representation and diversity is important because it has The more we include diverse thought, the more we include people from different backgrounds, different margins of oppression different factors. When you consider everybody, and I think it's funny for people to talk about, know, being man, being liberal, but all a liberal person really is is somebody that cares about everybody and wants everyone to be included. and once you start leaning to the fact that you want everyone to be included in case for us especially the most vulnerable person they can know. then, not suddenly you're not liberal, but you know, but you've got to think about that person. think that's why representation, why diversity is so important because you have to factor in so many things like for other people so that the people who are most affected by it can have a better feel forward because if we're looking at things that are most vulnerable or least represented, then we're doing okay as a society if we can actually look after them where it's a bit more important. we're just serving myself. We have a creative question what's your dream show? Dream show? Oh, to have a dream show? know, They have a dream TV show, I don't necessarily have a dream TV show. What would have been really cool would have been just like growing up seeing David attenborough do all these like major documentaries of Steve backshall going to like, in nature like, you know, there's some stuff, I used to tell my my secondary school teacher you ever catch me on TV one day looking for an exotic bat in the amazon rainforest just know i've made it You know, it was like, well, I wasn't in the I wasn't on TV doing it, but I've been on TV doing stuff. so it'd really cool to do that kind of stuff. Or just like see how nature documentaries film, but like finish being involved in that. don't think I have a voice for animation, but I mean, that's, you know, I'm not going to, but like, you know, that kind of film would be really cool. Yeah, I think that would be really cool. We were saying it'd be really cool to see you on Survivor or something. Yeah. I like those kind of stuff Yeah. I always think i'm always with my friends, end of the world kinda stuff i'm into big games, i watched enough walking dead to figure out how to get my resources done. So yeah. starting to wrap up we've got some advice questions, How can students stand out when applying to vet school? Well, didn't know because I did everything, i still got rejected i had A*AA I had sent in my personal statement to like everybody. But everybody said, oh, you're good to go and I still didn't get it. But be authentic to yourself. Also do it for you And then maybe the university might end up seeing you, but I'm the worst person in case, i got rejected I guess then what kind of advice would you give to students currently in vet school? In vet school? shadow where you can. shadow where you can and ask questions to as many senior vets as you can Listen, take advice. Build a strong pile of evidence advice. what they struggle with, they struggle, ask questions, how they come to their decisions, how do they handle things, how do they do surgery, like watch, be a sponge and that's you're students, it's your time to be a sponge, bring in tangents, see see see try and get to a point where you can do as well, strategy to do more confidently What sort of mindset helped you get to where you are now? in the event? Thoughtful mindset, I think that's like the basic answer, it's like... So try not to be, because I think it needs to be in a scarcity mindset, especially coming from like a minority background or a lot of things very much like protected You can have a bit of savings for a rainy day But I think the big thing is that you have to think of There's so much opportunity out there. Everybody can space for this. So you being willing to go and take the leap or projecting your dreams. It's not detrimental, everybody can get it. but you just put yourself out there There's lots of opportunities there so just keep yourself out there. For those that are currently considering the veterinary medicine as like a career path, what would you say, I guess, what sort of attributes should they possess? And what would make them successful in this kind of career? So being stubborn helps. mean, everybody, there's a little bit of stubbornness, like trying to like, it's maybe not stubborn is not the best word, but resilience. know, pushing for it, getting up every time you're getting knocked out and struggling for it. Wanting to learn is also a big thing. So the ability and wanting to learn and really being able to sit down and be like, look, I don't know this. I honesty helps as well. Like being honest helps to know your intentions. being hungry for more knowledge. I think that's a really good trait to have. like, no, I really want to know how this works. And ⁓ you're trying to question things and do that. And I think there's an element of understanding processes and maybe that's more personal to me. Being able to just follow things, like have processes and logic to support your stuff, putting things together, like thinking ideas and to maybe make sure that's relevant. you worked on anything else that's exciting? Can say something? What can say? Watch this space, think. littersense is the big one that's happening. There's a team working behind that. And obviously, our launch date keeps getting pushed. it might launch this week it might launch next week It'll come when it comes. So, it looks like, littersense is the the thing in background, I definitely want to work on building that. I have some exciting plans myself, personally, that is coming, both in the social world, TV world, the real world. Hopefully fingers crossed things i'll be maybe going my way into the Himalayas, on a mission But yeah, just, to be honest, I'm just vessel i want to be used and be used just let me know if there's something I can talk with, and then I'm happy to help and do stuff. But yeah, there's always something exciting. just need to know what I'm saying, you know, I guess. yeah, goodwoof is coming up. goodwoof is in May, and that's a big festival, Dog, Dogs and Dog lovers That's really great. I'll be talking at that in May. That's always fun. love that. Yeah, that's about it. Awesome. To finish things off, we have some rapid fire questions. I'm not allowed to talk too much. who's dramatic? Cats or dogs? Who's more dramatic? Cats. Cats. Cats. Favorite breed to treat? Oh, I love rotweiler , i love working with them One thing every pet owner should know? Brush your dog's teeth or their cat's teeth. Any animal they have brushes teeth. teeth. Yeah. But what is your go-to drink at work? Water. Yeah, just a H2O guy. Being a student or being a vet? Being a vet. Student life is fun, but I like having adult money. surgery or consultations? I really like both, but yes, surgeon. Favourite snack during a long day? who asked me this recently? percy pigs! Oh yeah. Yeah, if I'm struggling, i want a percy pigs think I'm recording. If I'm struggling, the day's like... I haven't eaten anything. do i see the percy pigs? give me the percy pigs! The rainbow ones as well. funniest pet name? That's so many silly one, is like. Okay, molesta that was a recent one because she was supposed to called molly and then they found out molly was a boy so they told the girl they told their daughter or son to rename him, he said we could call him molstar but they spelt it molesta is your most used phrase in the clinic? I would always say, I'd be like, yeah, but not really. Yeah, but not really. It's like, what is the answer then? Yeah, but no no but yeah. So yeah, i use that a lot if you weren't a vet what would you be? ⁓ question. i don't know man there's so many things that interest me, like, it'd be cool to be an electrician. It'd be cool to be a chef. I think it'd cool to be a finance broker. I don't know, there's certain things that I would like, this would be cool. I don't know, like, this would be cool. It'd be cool to be like an actor or a biologist or something. Palaeontologist is pretty cool. I could keep going for it. I'd love to be a guy that's like really handy, like, I love building build stuff, like carpentry, like, definitely great. I'd to be a painter. I'm sorry, I'm just... Yeah, this is I'm like your 18th career. 18th career, I just get so much like, oh, movie director. It would be great, yeah, it's such a job, yeah. Finishing off with a crazy one. If you were recruited for i'm a celeb would you go on? No, no. I've been asked about this sort of stuff before and I'm like, we can't do this, guys, because they abuse animals and animals , come on now! People don't think about that, but they do, yeah. All the animals, the poor animals that in there, there's a whole campaign about like, who's stopping them. Like the animals that are in there, they don't have no food at all. They've got a bunch of snakes in a box and somebody's here. Little rats are in there. not fun so yeah. There you go guys. Love you. Some reflection there. Thank you so much, bolu That's been super informative And thank you for listening to the podcast Thank you so much for having me. To learn more about animal aspirations and the work we do, please visit our website at animalaspirations.com. And don't forget to follow the podcast so you don't miss out on future episodes. Educate, Inspire, diversify to my intro