Jessie: Good morning and welcome back to the VIP seat. Starlink is doubling prices and Embraer has a new airplane. Sit back, buckle up, and let's take off. All right, Preston, so the thing that's got everybody in a tizzy this week is Starlink has once again changed its packages.

Preston Holland: Yeah, I heard this referred to as Elonomics, where you get someone hooked on it and then you just raise the price, right? So you look at self-driving. It was pay one time, then it turned into a subscription. Now he's doing it with Starlink. And once you get a taste of the supply, then you know, maybe you start coming back. So and it makes it it's a very sticky product. And, you know, principals are wanting it, backlogs are huge, everybody wants it certified on their airplane, everybody wants Starlink on their airplane, and now Starlink is testing how serious people are about wanting Starlink on their airplanes.

Jessie: Yeah, and some of the headlines were a little bit misleading. Yes, some of the packages have doubled, but there is an instance, like it used to be they had an A Aviation Regional Unlimited plan, or the unlimited plan that was high speed and no data caps. That was $10,000 a month. Now it's been increased to $12,500, which is still unlimited, but you are capped at 500 megabit speeds per second. Which quite honestly is probably more than most of us could ever possibly need in an airplane. So that has not doubled. but the smaller plan, which was like a 25 gig plan, has gone from two to four thousand. And the worldwide, totally unlimited one gigabit per second download speed plan is 20,000 a month. So if you wanted that unlimited super speed, yeah, you're gonna have to pay twice as much for it.

Preston Holland: Yeah, I think a couple of things that really stand out to me about the pricing model is at $20,000 per month, you are basically you pay $300,000 to $500,000 to install the hardware. And then you're going to pay almost one times the install price per year to run it. Right. And and I think that it's a lit it the just the discrimination is, I think, not as well thought out, which is Pretty historical in Starlink. They don't really understand aviation's use case in our world. So you look at what they did to the GA pilots and doing the speed limits and making it right on a lot of barriers where if you're in a TBM with a tailwind, you got priced out, but when you had a headwind, then you didn't, right? And so it was like the discrimination line against the price discrimination was not as well thought out. I think the challenge here is.

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: The people it's not a problem for is people buying brand new golf streams. Yeah, it goes up, but when you're spending three, four, five million dollars a year to operate your airplane anyways, and you're spending $75 million on your new plane, new delivery from the factory. Okay, as a percentage of all of that, okay, it stinks. It's no one likes things going up and being more expensive, but you kind of swallow the pill. I think where it gets really interesting is.

Jessie: Mm.

Preston Holland: in the G five charter fleet or the G four SP charter fleet, which are doing international trips. So they're gonna have to get the $20,000 a month. But you can buy these things for like three, four million dollars. So you're talking about your connectivity bill is going to be like 10% of your airplane's value per year. That's that is a lot.

Jessie: Yeah. Yeah, I think I mean, look, you know, I think competition is always a good thing. And a lot of their competitors are going, Yes, you know, we finally like have a way to actually like have a foothold here again. But they're gonna change things over and over again. I'll tell you, I've had Starlink in my farm for gosh, probably like three years now. They're constantly changing the packages. So to someone who's already a Starlink user, not surprising in the least, especially because they just went public. And guess who wants to sow strong growth and earnings over the next few quarters? So unsurprising, certainly frustrating. For people, but I think most people probably saw this coming. Go go did the exact same thing when they first came out with the ATG system. Everybody had to have it. It was the go-to system. As soon as everyone switched over, guess what happened? Prices went through the roof. That's how it goes.

Preston Holland: Yep. Here is an interesting fact. So I don't know if you I Israel Slaud, who is the CEO of Craft Charter, he sent out a tweet and basically said, Look, I run a 135 operation, five Challenger 350s. They only fly North America. So the $12,500 regional plan should fit perfectly. Miami to LA crosses the Gulf way beyond 12 nautical miles, and Hawaii is a domestic destination, but you have to have the $20,000 global plan. But The problem is it covers land plus 12 nautical miles offshore, which in a Challenger 300 is not very far when you consider like Miami to New York or you consider going to LA. Like there's a lot of flights that don't fit that barrier. And once again, it's showing that I don't know if they totally thought this one all the way through when they discriminated against those things because now you're having to what, you're gonna reroute and stay over the continental US? That feels Silly?

Jessie: Well, it was the same kind of problem with ATG. You know, if you had to ATG you couldn't really go offshore and sometimes, you know, we would ask the principals, Hey, do you want us to hug close to the shore so you're still connected? Or are you okay with, you know, an hour and a half of of no Wi Fi on the plane? You know, those decisions might have to get made.

Preston Holland: Yeah. Although I mean I I understand the counter argument that, well, it's Starlink and so it should be connected. you know, should you stay out, should you stay in? I I get the frustration. I think that extending that out to include domestic flying makes a lot of sense because that's TVM, that's Phenom 300, that's a lot. That's not just super mid aircraft, which are probably the ones that have the larger install base here, anyways. I think the other thing that this does is it creates an interesting gap in the market for Galileo, which was previously looked at as kind of the it costs the same, but it's not as good, and it's less good service and less satellites. Now Galileo has a clear lane to be the $10,000 a month unlimited provider worldwide. And now you can actually make the decision between Starlink and Galileo.

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Yeah, but still When you look at speeds and capabilities, it's not it there. No, they are not apples to apples. But I think that's what Starlink's plan is. We're like, hey, we're the premium product. If you want the best, like you're gonna have to pay what the traditional SATCOM providers have charged you. So that's where they're going. I will be interested to see though, I feel like Starlink will announce new prices and then it will start to come up with like little package changes in the the terms and conditions. Like if I go into my system, yes, okay, there's a monthly rate, but then you can pay for overages. And even with like the yachting industry, there's time. where you like turn it off and on for specific trips if you want to go offshore. So I would hope maybe with enough complaints and pushing from the industry, maybe there's a simple, hey, let's can we flip the switch just for this one trip to go across the ocean and get that global coverage? Who knows? but I think the best thing to do is probably just voice your concerns with your Starlink connections if you have any that aren't just a computer.

Preston Holland: Right. Well, and operators then can just charge the client the thousand bucks or the two thousand bucks for the extra star. You know, if you Starlink to Hawaii, that's fine. It's an extra two grand on a sixty, eighty thousand dollar trip. You know, it's it's a rounding error at that point. And then you're not putting the onus on the charter operator to have to stomach the extra hundred and twenty thousand dollars a year in cost that they can now no longer avoid. So I think that that would be pretty logical. So if you're from Starlink and you're listening, we'd be happy to help you. I don't I

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Preston Holland: highly doubt that any of them listen to business aviation shows. But yeah, we'd be happy to help. Well, speaking of Starlink, you know who does have Starlink on their brand new Challenger 3500s?

Jessie: A B Jets does and it works fantastically. We use it ourselves. we actually haven't checked in with them today. I hope they're okay. But I guess they'll be on the regional plan, so they're probably fine, because that's 500 megabit per second is still fantastic speed. I mean, you could have 10 people in the airplane, all streaming videos, all downloading and be totally fine.

Preston Holland: Yeah, so thanks to A B Jets for sponsoring this week's episode of the VIPC with their awesome Starlink on their Challenger 3500s. Well, Jesse, it's time for everyone's favorite segment, which is Mile Hyde Madness. I feel like every week that we do Mile High Madness, it encourages more people to send me ridiculous stuff on the internet. So Mile Hide Madness is constantly compoundingly getting better.

Jessie: Yes. Yes, so mine this week, I usually bring the animals, so I have brought the animals again. I just want to show everybody once again that business aviation does such an amazing service to the world. Look at this horse that was airlifted from Andorra by helicopter. Look at the little fella. Do you think he's scared or is he enjoying it? Yeah.

Preston Holland: Definitely. He's a hundred percent scared. That looks terrifying. Of course he's scared, Jesse.

Jessie: But they saved his life. He was injured. He couldn't get out of this ravine. And so he was airlifted with a helicopter. So good on you, little fella. Also, there was a recent one that I didn't share that was a a Thailand search and rescue dog that was also being lifted by drone. And the dog was like totally chill, totally fine with him. He was an internet sensation. So I don't know. Maybe the horse is just like, whatever.

Preston Holland: Yeah, well, that is a good one. I would be terrified personally. if that was me. I mean, can you imagine getting lifted up like this, just like helicoptered out? Yeah, that looks terrifying. Well, my Mile Hide Madness. I need to grab the MA Gong for my Mile Hide Madness. wait, there's no way. There is no way that this is the case. The Mile Hyde Madness, sponsored by Oshman Aviation. Thank you for sponsoring the MA Gong, but it's not ringing today. This is for This guy who has bought Worldwide Jet and Carlisle Air Group for what it says six hundred million dollar valuation. And there is no freaking way that it traded for six hundred million dollars. It would that would it would be on way more news articles than just this random traded traded VC Instagram account.

Jessie: Yeah. Yeah, I was trying to figure out I hadn't have yet to see a real press release on this news from anyone. Now we know that it's actually true. There have been acquisitions, but where the valuation number came from, we have no idea who put that number out there. But I can tell you as someone who sold a fleet of, you know, fifteen owned and operated airplanes, I didn't even get six hundred million dollars in twenty twenty one. So don't even like that's not possible. Yeah. Yes.

Preston Holland: And you and you had much newer airplanes and a lot more of them. So I think that this is a case of someone got a number that may not have actually been what the number is. there is more to this story. I feel like there has got to be more of this story. If I had to guess, I would guess that there are too many, there's one too many zeros on this Instagram post, but that's just my guess.

Jessie: Aspirational. Mm-hmm. Well, they are welcome to come on the show and tell us what the actual valuation is. We love to hear those numbers. so give us a shout if you want to come on.

Preston Holland: Come on and talk numbers. Well, moving on to our next story. there is some tension in crew rest and crew breaks. We've got a bit of a regulation update for you this week. So, Jesse, give us a little bit of background here on this state on this crew rest issue.

Jessie: Yes. So anyone who has ever employed someone in California will understand the massive frustration that I'm about to talk about because I had the same frustration. so we were paying pilots, you know, great salaries, great rest and duty rules. We actually had 10-hour max duty days, all the all the goodies that you could give an employee. But California is funny and they have funny employment laws. And one of the things that is a law in California is if you do not provide a 30-minute break for lunch or a meal within a four-hour period, you have to pay the employee. working time. Now, if it's salaried, sometimes that can fall into overtime pay. Basically very, very complicated. And the FAA is now taking action. I think obviously the airlines have lobbied for this specifically because it only affects the airlines for now. 135 is not included, but the FAA is coming out with proposed rulemaking that says, hey, California or other states, you can't come up with your own rules. We've already established, you know, fair rest and duty periods, rest periods, periods, lunch periods, everything else to ensure safety. So you putting this on the employer just makes things more complicated. Now I the question is like, does the FAA get to just like overwrite state law? I don't know. And this is an interesting case.

Preston Holland: Yeah, this sounds like a constitutional issue more than it is a regulatory issue. So I would imagine that this gets contested at a higher level, especially if the state of California is really going to go after this one. Now, the two to one ratio, I feel like is probably fair if you're working a desk job, right? Like if you're not going to give somebody a lunch break or a smoke break, right? Like getting a two to one ratio feels fair.

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Fair. Right.

Preston Holland: It that is also probably designed for people who are making significantly less money than airline pilots. And the other thing, well, and then from a from like a legit I'm just imagining a logistics burden here. So then is it only intra-California flights? Or is is it everybody who's based in California? Or is it if it departs in California? Like this is an interstate commerce thing. So, you know, it's like

Jessie: Right. We're making like half a million a year. Right.

Preston Holland: I'm not sure exactly how this is all gonna shake out in Supreme Court. I am no s I am no lawyer, so I'm sure that there's a lot that are ready to jump on this one.

Jessie: Yeah. It's in the Ninth Circuit right now, and California's Ninth Circuit did rule that the flight attendants were entitled to these protections. So that's kind of what's created this and that even for interstate flying. so i i everyone who's operating in California knows about this. How we handled it at the time was we just automatically included that in the pay. If you were gonna have an eight hour shift, we went ahead and included like whatever the break period was and adjusted like the salary amounts. I but it it's just silly. And this shows you the the complication. Of working in multiple states as a company is that you have to deal with every state's crazy rules. And let me tell you, California has some real crazy ones, not only on the employment side, but also on the taxes side, you know, aviation, sales and everything else. So watch out for California if you're gonna try to operate there. Now, I I hope that someone in our lobbying group says says, hey, you know, you got it for 117. Why can't 135 get this as well? Because we have the same problem.

Preston Holland: Yeah, exactly. And I think that that is where it's going to become tricky, especially because that's an administrative burden that maybe the airlines can possibly figure out. But your mom and pop one thirty five operator or your small scale one thirty-five operator is gonna have a really difficult time doing that. And it may just mean you don't hire based in California. But again, is it do you live is it when you live in California? Is it when you fly out of California? Is it f when you fly into California? Yeah.

Jessie: You don't. It's the employment. It is where the person is employed and where they where they live and you you list them as employed in that state. Yeah. So just go to Nevada. Right, right. Exactly.

Preston Holland: Which is which is why a lot of people just say no California at all, right? It's just easier to not hire there. I mean, I'm not saying that you should, but I'm saying I know that there's a lot of people that do.

Jessie: That's what happens. It's that's just what happens. right, so one more little quick hit on regulatory. it's dropping today, but it was published this week already before it's coming out. The Trump administration is releasing a request from the Department of Commerce to investigate tariffs on aerospace products that face potential national security issues and other issues. so everyone should go check out and read this. Don't really know what the intent of this document is yet. they just came from a World Summit and I don't know where we're headed.

Preston Holland: Yeah, I don't know if this is targeted at supply chain and commercial aviation, which is kind of how the document reads. Like if you read it, it talks about commercial airline parts and but then it says a very generic jet engine parts. I I think back to if you remember a couple of months ago, we had the fraudulent part dealer, right? The guy who was fraudulently hawking parts.

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: I wonder if there's some sort of tie into that. Maybe there's more issues there on importing parts from outside the US. Maybe they're not as genuine or authentic, and maybe that's what it's talking about. But usually tariffs is a bit of a hammer looking for a nail in that scenario, than maybe some sort of more systematic problem or trying to use it as a trade leverage. Now, tariffs did get shot down and they're all getting you not all a lot of tariffs got shut down. And they're having to be refunded. So I don't think that you follow on with more tariff talk after probably taking an L there if there's not something legitimate here.

Jessie: Well, I think this whole point is that it's talking about national security in that direction. You know, before it was just blanket tariffs and I'm gonna tariff whoever I want to, whenever I want to. This is now saying, All right, Take a few months, research what we're over reliant on from a national security perspective, and then start to go that way. So I I don't know what to expect. Maybe this is just, you know, China or something else, some real, you know, security concerns, or it's another excuse to talk tariffs, but in a very different way. We'll just have to see.

Preston Holland: Yeah, exactly. I mean, you think about who's at risk here. I mean, it's Pratt and Whitney if you have a problem with Canada. It's Airbus if you have a problem with France. It's everybody if you have a problem with Mexico. It's Embryer if you have a problem with Brazil. So, you know, those are kind of the first ones that everybody goes to look at. And then you start looking at the downstream effects of if Airbus goes, then Desso follows, you know, a lot of that kind of stuff. I don't know. It will be it's something it is something to keep an eye on. I don't think that it's time to to wave the tariff flag and everybody start freaking out again, but I think that it's something to observe and to keep an eye on.

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: Yeah, well speaking of crazy things and a California tie, Peter Thiel's husband has allegedly thrown a cooler at a flight attendant, and there is a few lawsuits flying around.

Jessie: Yeah, so this one was just too juicy, not for us to cover, and just an interesting case, too. So there it's all allegations and it's back and forth. You know, Peter Thiel's husband's side says, Hey, this is just an an attempt to extort us and to get money out of billionaires. But then there's a flight attendant who was on this airplane, said that she was there's something something happened in the cabin where She says a cooler was thrown at her and she fell against the wall, cutting a tendon, having to have surgery after she fell and was crying and on the floor. That's the allegation. On the other side, the attorney for Peter Teal's family is saying, no, like maybe a cooler brushed her leg and that was it. But the interesting part of this too is that she was actually employed by Solaris. So there's no case against Solaris in this case, it's against the principal who were involved.

Preston Holland: Yeah, that is really interesting that the suit was not against Solaris. And there was not or at least that in all the reporting that we've read, that they weren't necessarily named. I think that it's and maybe I I'm gonna ask this question. In that scenario, would it mean that the flight attendant may not have been directly employed by Solaris via management fees and maybe employed directly by the family or Like, how do you think that that is structured? If you had a let's sit let's talk generalizations because we don't know what the situation is in this case.

Jessie: Yeah, I mean look, I am not an attorney by any means, but you know, when I asked my handy dandy AI what it thought, and it wasn't legal advice, and neither is this, is that there are certain things that can't go against workers' comp, such as distress, you know, all the big ticket items that could probably get her millions aren't things that you would necessarily get from the workers' comp suit. So that's probably why she's going after them specifically.

Preston Holland: Yeah, no, that's very interesting. we will see how that shakes out, but it is a very juicy, spicy, interesting in the news story. That's a yeah, I don't know. It's there's some crazy p there's crazy people out there on both sides of this issue, whether you did it or whether you're you know, it's it's a crazy world out there.

Jessie: Yeah. Yeah, but airplanes are small, so you should be careful. Make sure you don't trip and fall, 'cause they're very easy to trip and fall. And, you know, don't keep stuff in the way. safety safety. we'll just have to see how this works out. I I don't know who to feel bad for yet 'cause I don't know who's telling the truth.

Preston Holland: Yeah, exactly. Well, moving to our next story, the MBAA has issued an AI warning because of course AI is in the news, isn't we like to talk about AI. We're a new show. So if you don't talk about AI, I think you get dinged in the algorithm. So we're gonna talk about AI today.

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Yeah, and usually I I think this is not really that new, but it is good for everyone to kind of like put their ears up and pay a little more attention to what's going on because cyber criminals have always come after private aviation specifically because we do massive deals, we do complicated deals, but everyone needs to be aware that at this point principles can be copied. The voice of your CFO can be copied, the emails are getting better, the messaging is getting better. So I think everyone just has to really start to pay attention. And that's what this report is from NBAA is like, hey. These are the ways to avoid getting scammed by AI because there's so much more that it can do now.

Preston Holland: Yeah. And you know, you think about transaction integrity, right? Like escrow companies, when you start talking about authorizing wires and, you know, giving routing numbers and account numbers and you verbally confirm them over the phone and all of those kinds of things. it's it's something to definitely look out for. And I think that that is a huge challenge in AI, is that people are bad, right? Whether there are bad people out there. And they are very smart and they can use tools like AI just like you can, the smart good person. And so you have to be vigilant and on the lookout for those things. Maybe this is like a step change where you couldn't necessarily authenticate bank account information over an email, right? But now it's like even more crazy because now it's like you can't a phone call. You can't, you they can be duped and spoofed and all that kind of stuff. So there's some interesting tools out there, and people are trying to solve this problem.

Jessie: Even a phone call.

Preston Holland: Talking about like transactional integrity and making sure that you know who who is who and where money's going and all of that kind of stuff. So I so I think that it's an interesting opportunity for the aspiring entrepreneur to figure out how to make sure that in aviation, how do you make sure that you can keep those fraudulent layers from kind of inserting themselves into it? So

Jessie: Yeah, no, I think you just need to be triple checking everything that looked fishy before now is even more fishy. And you probably need two levels of confirmation, not just a verbal from a known phone number, but even, you know, an authentication token or something else when you're dealing with millions of dollars. And even charters, like they come after charter companies specifically too, you know, the flight ops person who's new to the job and you know, she gets a call from the CEO saying that she needs XYZ done and to wire this or do that. gift cards.

Preston Holland: Gift cards. Go send some gift cards. Gift cards are my favorite my that is my favorite text scam. If you ever get a if you ever get a text message from me that I need gift cards and I'm somewhere that I really need g gift cards, I can't tell you the last time I bought gift cards, so it is definitely not me.

Jessie: Hmm. It happened to one of my employees. I I mean, you know, and and smart people. But again, you know, it's like that sense of pressure, you know, and and my gosh, it's the boss calling me. I gotta do it. I gotta figure it out. You know, just make sure your team knows. nothing is common sense anymore when it comes to this stuff.

Preston Holland: Yep, exactly. Well, speaking of AI and trying to talk to a human on the phone, it reminds me of our sponsor, Realjet, who is very much individual relationship forward. And we are so thankful for Realjet for sponsoring this week's episode of the VIP Seat.

Jessie: and while, you know, we like Starlink, there's certain things like not being able to reach customer service when you need them, or we haven't reaching support when you need them. But RealJet, on the other hand, based on real relationships, long-term relationships, they always pick up the phone when you call. You know the person you're dealing with and talking to. So thank you so much to RealJet for sponsoring this episode and providing these real experiences.

Preston Holland: Well, Jesse, the Phenom 300 has gotten an upgrade. That announcement came out yesterday morning. If you're listening to this on Wednesday, the show releases Wednesday mornings. the new Phenom 300 EV, which I know you think, electric vehicle. No, that's not what this is. It is the upgraded, new, and improved Phenom 300.

Jessie: Yeah, and I was actually amazed because I was looking back at the story and trying to remember when the E came out. The E came out in 2017. It's actually been a really long time since we've had like the next evolution, which is what they're calling the EV, of this airplane. But yeah, a little more capacity, a little more range, probably Starlink connectivity. They didn't say, but they said Leo connectivity. I'm not sure who they're gonna select for that.

Preston Holland: yeah, new list price of $13.99 million dollars. So not only is it better, it's also more expensive because inflation is coming for everybody, including the Phenom 300. and another piece just to point out is they did get Autoland, which is fantastic for owner operators, for in you know, single pilot operations, things like that. So

Jessie: Yes. Cool.

Preston Holland: Big huge plus for that. They also have this really interesting fly-by-wire system, which is incredibly unique. So they are calling it, they created this themselves, the multi-purpose electronic controller, which integrates rudder by wire and other electronically controlled aircraft functions. It also adds new auto brake and a lot of those reduce pilot workload, but they also make the auto land possible for the one or for the 300 EV. And so I think that it's a big integrated system, which is pretty neat.

Jessie: Yeah, and that's one of their big selling points. I mean, although this is a very sophisticated and complex aircraft for a single pilot, they do market that it is for a single pilot. Have I ever flown a single pilot? No. But anyway, that's different story. Maybe with all these tools and these improvements, I would feel more comfortable doing that. but the Autoland is so cool. Like I just I cannot wait to see this on every airframe because it's just such a cool safety feature. And you know, we always worry, like, what if something happens and you got a lot of workload? Boom, you just press the button and it's taken care of.

Preston Holland: Yep, exactly. They are also, from what I read, is that you cannot retrofit the 300 E to be the 300 E V because of this system, right? Because it would just be way too cumbersome to integrate a new flyby wire system on an existing airframe. And so that is a big piece of it. I think it also helps for like there are a lot of 300 E's that are flown single pilot, like owner flown. They go from a TBM.

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: you know, to a Mustang or an M2 and then the M2 into the Phenom 300. And it's kind of the last stop for single pilot ops for owner flown aircraft. And so this just makes it that much more appealing to those types of folks. I think it also makes it maybe to where, you know, if you have auto land and you have reduced workload and now maybe it's like I'm more comfortable with single pilot ops. it cannot run it cannot land off

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: runway still. So like people said, is this the end of the PC twenty four? Probably not, because of that big advantage and big fact. And the cargo door, I mean pretty awesome.

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Also the the lav and the lavatory's in the right place on the phenom though, so that is a plus. Yep, that's you.

Preston Holland: That's a good point. That yeah, that is a plus. Speaking of the lavatory, they did get a vacuum lavatory instead of the liquid lavatory, so that's good.

Jessie: so to all those external lab servicers that is a positive, I guess. I don't really know because I fortunately haven't had to service a lab myself.

Preston Holland: Yeah, no, that is I I think it is definitely a positive. it makes it a little bit less messy. the LEO satellite. So I just want to sprinkle in just a thought and pulling a couple of threads together. If you remember, John Owen at AirShare, they announced they're going Galileo on their three hundreds. If you think about the operating costs and how much, you know, that fifteen twelve twelve five probably is gonna go to fifteen thousand eventually.

Jessie: Mm-hmm.

Preston Holland: Puts the burden on the Phenom 300 operators. I wonder if the LEO satellite is is maybe leaning towards another lower cost alternative.

Jessie: Interesting. Or maybe they're figuring out how to you know, give just the option for both, you know, so you can choose what you want to install. You know the other piece of this that I think is interesting to point out, and this is something that like my husband says all the time, because these deposits have become so huge for these aircraft, it's not only important now to look at what the retail price is and with all the options are added on, but also how much of a deposit you're gonna have to give up front for how many years. I mean, we're getting to the point where even on, you know, a light jet, five million dollar deposit over a one two year period, 500,000 to 750,000. an additional cost just from what interest you could have been making on that money. all airplanes are getting expensive and more expensive and longer lead times. It's all kind of crazy.

Preston Holland: Yeah, exactly. And maybe the progress payments and pre-delivery payments become more attractive, you know, as you talk about financing those. And I know that I know manufacturers don't love that because it's, you know, not seen as a very resilient order book and things like that. But I think if you're going to start kicking them out, I mean, these aren't delivering until 2027. And I would imagine it's the week before Oshkosh. I would imagine they're going to start taking orders as soon as this week. Right. And so it's like,

Jessie: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Preston Holland: If you're not going to deliver it to 2027, all of a sudden people are going to start accusing you of being a PC twelve, which I don't know. They're probably selling it in 2028 at this point. So but yeah, it's it's it's gonna be it's gonna be a great airplane, you know, Phenon 300, the best selling light jet in the segment. And so it will continue on. And they just continue to pull away, it seems, in technology and announcements from the CJ4. So Textron is time to Follow this up with some sort of a big announcement sometime soon.

Jessie: Yeah. Well yeah, honestly, you know, as a former operator, you just cannot beat the reliability of this airplane and it is just I don't know. I've got I'm partial 'cause I had so many of them, but I think it's just the it's the best light jet out there and it's obvious through the sales and and the improvements that they've made that that's gonna continue.

Preston Holland: Yeah, exactly. Well, this has been another awesome episode of the VIP Seat Podcast. As a reminder, we bring you the top five news stories every week so that you are a little bit smarter about business aviation. If you want a friend to be smarter about business aviation, share the show with them. That's the best way for us to grow. For my awesome co-host Jesse Naor, I am Preston Holland. Thanks to A B Jets and Real Jet for sponsoring this week's episode of the podcast. We will see you all next week.