Matthew Brooks: Bye. Ann: Perfect. I hope that that goes for the rest of the recording. Hi everybody. Matthew Brooks: Hello. Ann: Today is gonna Today is gonna Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: go ahead. Today's gonna be interesting because we're like already Matthew Brooks: Now go home. Ann: experiencing delayed Video, whatever this is. Why Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: are we like this? whatever. Matthew Brooks: how long do we have to explain that? Ann: I just realized that I usually have a giant painting behind me like when I'm in my office and I moved it home because Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: I am gonna get it like f and now there's just what is this? There's a dog sweater. Matthew Brooks: It's definitely something. Yeah. Ann: my daughter's butterfly and like the painting background was much better. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Well, you just have to do another painting. Ann: Sorry everyone. I could put it I can put another one up there. Alright, so we have we have fun things going on. Well, we have one fun thing and Matthew Brooks: Yes. Ann: then we did we also wanted to talk today. Look at what I'm doing. Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: Problem. Matthew Brooks: What is the problem? Everything's always a problem. Ann: That's mad right now. Matthew Brooks: I'm mad? Never. Not at you. I always think you're mad at me. We're like blown out Ann: Is that better? Look, I put a painting I put a painting in. Matthew Brooks: with the light. There we go. Hey, there you go. You got it. Ann: Yeah. Okay. Anyway, okay, so Matthew Brooks: You feel better? Ann: yeah. Stupid. but I do. okay, so first of all, let's start off with exciting news because then we're gonna get into Matthew Brooks: Okay. Ann: how all art therapists' world blew up this past Matthew Brooks: Yes. Ann: week. but Matthew Brooks: You Ann: Let's start off with fun news. Matthew Brooks: Okay. Ann: I just dropped off our book at the Children's Museum of Pittsburgh. Matt. Matthew Brooks: Snap, snap, snap. Ann: Did you give snaps? That's not the first Matthew Brooks: I did. Ann: time you've done you've done snaps in celebration of something. yeah, Matthew Brooks: I know. Ann: I dropped it off. I was emailing the the Children's Museum of Pittsburgh, purchased some books to sell in the gift shop, which I'm so excited about because I just I think from the beginning Obviously we're both from Pittsburgh. Obviously this is our like hometown. but I just really wanted the book to be in creative spaces in kid spaces. Like yes, bookstores, but I wanted it to be and the children's museum is so perfect. And honestly, when I was mailing out copies to local bookstores, stores, businesses, whatever, the children's museum was like a Whatever, we'll see what happens. Like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: sh shoot your shot, just like throw it out there. And I was Matthew Brooks: Yeah Ann: actually not laughing, but I was like, I guess I'm just gifting somebody a copy at the children's museum because they're so amazing and they have so many things going on at all times that I was like, This probably isn't even gonna get to somebody's hands for a while. But they're actually so personable, so hands-on, like Emailed me very quickly. I've been talking back and forth. And the guys their name is Matt too. So it's another Matt. Matthew Brooks: Hey! Yay for Matt! Ann: and they yay for Matt's. They should be I mean I don't know when they're actually gonna get them. They're there. So I don't know when they're actually going to be on shelves. but probably pretty soon, and Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: that's exciting. That's like a little celebration for me and you, Matt. Matthew Brooks: Yeah, yeah, that's great. And some progress on the new book coming out. I have to get more motivation to work on it more. I currently don't... I'm getting Ann: Well, like same. Matthew Brooks: distracted and I bonked my head and life was getting in the way, so... Ann: Life has been a shit show. Like li it's been super hectic, busy. It's just it's just like there's this is the normal time of year where everything's insane. because it's like back to school. Schedules are all shifting and changing. Summers at and whether you have kids or not, I think that this is a hectic time because it's still all surrounding all of that. And especially as therapists, our schedules I don't know, my schedule always shifts. and yes, I see kids, but with adults too. Like everything shifts for the summer and everything shifts back. Summer Matthew Brooks: Yes. Ann: is like everybody's on vacation. It's summer schedule. It's the season of cancellations. You kind of get used to that. And then the school year kicks in and everybody's like, Holy shit We need to go to therapy Matthew Brooks: Hmm? Ann: or what different times do you have or and it's just hectic and things get pushed aside. So I also haven't Matthew Brooks: Yeah. I've been, I've been one that in the past couple of years, just because I've worked heavily with kids in years past, that I would provide the opportunity to come during the daytime. One, cause I was actually seeing a lot of kids to like eight o'clock at night. Right. And then I was like, I really don't want to do that. So I would shift it during the day for the summer and. Then when I had my own kiddo and everything, there was this process where I'm just like, yeah, no, like if you're going to have your time in the winter, fall, spring. that'll be your time for the summer and like, can kind of shift around it if needed. just because the absolute chaos when August comes and the parents are like, Hey, do you have a different time? Do you have eight 30 at night? Do you have six 30 at night? Like, do you have these different times? And I'm trying to play Tetris with the thing. It was so incredibly stressful and difficult because then somebody would make a decision and then retract the decision and want a different time. And like, there's all these different. moving parts so I'm just like dope like your time is your time if we're moving it you might lose it you know kind of a thing and that works Ann: Yeah, it took me when I when I first started private practice I was seeing a lot more kids and it is crazy now thinking back that I used to be at the office till like nine PM. I know that people are Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: falling out of their chairs with that. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: But I what was I did not have kids. I also was working full time jobs, so it that was partially because of my schedule, like s building up clients Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: to go full time in the evenings and weekends. but yeah, I was here so late and I remember the start of school being like, my gosh, now I'm gonna be like in the office so late. And now not so much, but I started having my kids schedule their school year times like two two weeks ago I started having like hey guys we Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: gotta lock in a time and then that's your that's it. Like because it gets so hectic. And now obviously with my schedule as well, how are it just you can't it can't be moved around. And I think when I was a younger clinician or newer to private practice, I had it in my mind like we've talked about this. It was this like Of course I'll be flexible. I don't wanna upset anybody. I very quickly learned that most parents, the majority of parents now parents have their shit. We all know what it's like Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: to be working with parents, but most parents are very understanding of like, no, that's the time. they're not They they don't cross at least for me, they don't cross boundaries with ti session times often, like asking it's like they Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: get that that's what their time slot is. All the other stuff, I'll get like a million phone calls at the beginning of the year and like but Matthew Brooks: Yes Ann: there's that understanding 'cause they're managing schedules too. Matthew Brooks: Absolutely, yeah. And that's where I wanted to make it easier and consistent. So it's not this like giant pushback of me being like, no, it was more of like, no, this is going to be the constant because I know when August comes, your entire like family calendar is going to go out the window. So I want you to know, like, this is your time. And like, whatever you can, like work around that, that's what we can do. kind of a thing. And I've gotten more responses from parents saying like, yeah, we know like Tuesdays are, you know, therapy day. So like we just, we flex around that. Are there times where it's like, hey, they joined a club in the school or they're, they're sports or something they're joining and that like that time's not gonna work? Yeah. You know, yeah. So we can work Ann: yeah, and that's like a positive Matthew Brooks: with that, but I like to keep the consistency because everyone else's families are in chaos and like trying to do things. So. Ann: We're all just in chaos. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Well, speaking of chaos, should we segue into this lovely weekend? It was over the weekend, right? It was, yeah, when was August 1st? Because it was August 1st it came out. Ann: Like I said, everything has been such a blur, and it was in the middle of so much chaos in my world Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: that I saw the email, and I was just like, makes sense, whatever. Like, I guess I'm gonna deal with this now. Like, I guess. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Ann: Well, so what we're talking about, I'm sure all art therapists that are listening know. now other Matthew Brooks: You Ann: other People, other practitioners, humans, individuals of the world might not know that our credentialing board had an oops and sent an email out to it seems like everyone, Matthew Brooks: It seems like everyone. Ann: but a ma at a mass amount of licensed professionals saying that they're License was inactive because they didn't we we didn't do the requirements or whatever. It was a jarring email to receive and whenever I woke up six AM Yeah. Well what was funny is what was funny is when Matthew Brooks: Yeah, it was like 6, 7 a.m. because I was already up because my kiddo was up and I was eating breakfast. Yeah. And I was just like, OK. Ann: I woke up, I woke up to text messages of non of just other art therapists who are up at night who received it in real time and they were like I was like, what is going on? But none of the text messages, they were, it was like deciphering a code. I was like, what are we talking about here? It was like, did you look at Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: your email? And then I started sending, well, I saw the email, and then I was sending texts like, did you get this email? Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: But I immediately was like, what's going on? And I read it, and I did. I had this reaction, I was like, okay, check tracks. This Matthew Brooks: Yep. Ann: We just talked last episode about like the full moon shittery and I like, Shittery's a new word. There we go. and I was I'm Matthew Brooks: Yep. I like it. Ann: gonna keep I'm gonna stick to it. and I was like, Okay, I guess I'm gonna deal with this now. But I also was like I also immediately was like, This is incorrect. I know that Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: this is incorrect. but now what do I have to do? Yeah. Matthew Brooks: Can we pause for a second? How good does it feel to be our chaotic brains to know for 100 % sure this is wrong? Like, I know I did this thing right. Like, I felt so good because I'm like, I have the receipt. I know I paid my dues. I know I did all this stuff. So I'm like. I'm not freaking out panicking of like, like what's happening? Cause I'm like, no, they're wrong. That for me, because I know most of time, like with bullshit stuff in my life, like I'm like, I could have, I could have probably messed that up cause I wasn't thinking or I forgot about it or whatever. And this one is like, no, I know. Like, Ann: I don't have my shit together. It's very possible. Matthew Brooks: yeah, this one's like a hundred percent. No, I got it. Like I felt so good. Like going, okay. Yeah. This is them, Ann: I Matthew Brooks: this is not me. Ann: Well, the pa the the panic that I went into was responding to everybody else's text messages and also being like, Okay, Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: wait, pause Because I don't know why my brain did this. It makes no sense. I would just like everyone to know before I say this I know that this doesn't track. I know that this is illogical thinking. But I was like, did Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: they somehow Like I was like somebody at my practice Matthew Brooks: Mmm. Ann: and what am I gonna do if they if there was like a mistake and they don't have their license and then I have to figure out clo like whatever. I was just like, are is is this impacting the group as a whole? And then I was like, Wait, what the hell am I talking about? Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: But it was it was literally when you wake up, that's the first thing that I saw. I was both children Matthew Brooks: yeah! Ann: Both children were sleeping on either side of me 'cause it was that kind of night. Everybody ended up in my Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: bed. And I I know we tell clients not to do this, but of course I'm laying there looking through my phone and the quiet moments I have staying still so I don't wake them up. Like before Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: they s and that's like an email that I see. My brain wasn't even functioning and I was like, wait. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Who is this really? What is going I know it's not me, but is it Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: the practice? Is it and then I was like, wait, this isn't the LPC? This is or like my Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: brain was just like mush. And then as I I got up and I had like my walk downstairs and my c I was like, wait a second, this is insane. Matthew Brooks: You Ann: And all of the text messages that I was receiving, I was like, what is going on? But it was Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: a pure panic and could you imagine? I actually do f I felt bad for Matthew Brooks: yeah! Ann: the ATCB handling it, having to handle it on their end, because can you imagine the amount of emails and Matthew Brooks: Well yeah, it... Yeah. Ann: messages? Because you can't directly e you have to like go to their website. Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: and send a message. You could when you reply to that email you just get like a general I was like their wor Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: their imagine their morning waking up. Matthew Brooks: Well, that's the thing. so backing up, big picture for a lot of people who either aren't therapists, know, are therapists and stuff like that. What we received on Saturday morning was an automated email that stated that due to some forms not being filled out or your CEU is not being completed or your dues not being paid. It was kind of this veil like something you did not complete For your June, right was a June or July like dues It immediately kicked you off Yeah, it's for the year, but it always comes like June or July I think Ann: Year. The year. We don't see I in yeah. It was July, right? It was it Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: the other thing that really would mess with that messed with people's brains was we did just do this. It wasn't like some random middle of the wait a second, it wasn't even renewed. Like everybody just went through this of paying Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: cause I remember having a conversation with you where I was like, Matt I can't remember if it's this year or like when my renewal year is. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: And then I looked and it's not even this I that's why I was so sure. I like, it's even this year. Like that I had to do my AT C B stuff. But Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: but yeah, it had all just happened. So very easily could you question, like, did I do it right? Did I miss something? 'Cause we just did it. Matthew Brooks: Yeah, we just did it. And so like it wasn't, I don't think, and this is speculation, but I don't think this was a human being sitting there emailing thousands of people. Ann: No. No, they they emailed and said what it was. They were like Matthew Brooks: Well, they had to after that, yeah, like you said, waking up on Saturday morning and getting flooded with emails of like, Ann: could you Matthew Brooks: what are you talking about? Yeah. Ann: Could could you imag like again, I so in mental health it's not like we deal with and especially in private practice, like we deal with like big HR issues. Like it's not like it's not like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: we're like our tech company messed up. Like what it's me. I guess I Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: forgot to text you back or like something. But Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Could you imagine waking up? And I mean there are larger organizations, obviously, so that's different. But could I couldn't. I could not. All of the art therapists were angry. We're not really an angry group. We're not really an angry group. But then Matthew Brooks: All of them. Saturday was not a great day for our therapists. Yeah. Ann: I was thinking of like all of the different characters that are Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: that make up our profession. And I was like, man, Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: they got some crazy emails, they got some nasty emails, they got some very empathetic but what the fuck emails. Like I like what Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yup. Panicked, anxious emails of like, what am I going to do? How can I? Yeah. Ann: Ma I I mean I messaged them and I was kinda like, I know that I'm right. I have all my receipts, but I'm just like double checking. That was fine. And then I was like, I Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: got other shit to deal with. Can you please just let me know that I'm not that I'm right? That's all. And then they did. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Well, you know what I did? I called you. Ann: You did, yeah. Matthew Brooks: I called you. And I was like, hey. And you're like, hey, really funny you called because I got this weird email. And I was like, thank god. OK. Like, I don't even need to email the credentials board. Like, if Anne is saying it's weird, it's like, I'm good. yeah. Ann: You called me at it was like seven fifteen AM Which actually isn't abnormal. We're we're te like we we're communicating that early sometimes 'cause it we're Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: children, we're awake, whatever. But I think my son was awake at that point. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: And I was just like, hey Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah, I was already up like my kiddo I think climbed into the bed and then put his lips to my ear and just screamed like dad wake up like Centimeters away from my eardrum So I was up and then I saw that email and I was like, okay Let me deal with this after my caffeine. And then it was like 7 15. And I was like, I went downstairs and I like, I'm just going to call Ann to figure this out. And yeah. Ann: You were you were much like, relaxed about it then Matthew Brooks: Yeah, because I knew I didn't do anything wrong. Ann: Ha ha ha. Matthew Brooks: At that point, I drew the conclusion of like, this is not a me thing. Like I know if I forget to pay a bill or something, like, and it comes up and I'm like, yeah, that one's on me. Like accountability is there because I'm like, yeah, you're right. You could probably convince me I forgot to give you money, right? Be like, hey, you owe Ann: You could go You could Matthew Brooks: me like $200. And I'd be like, for what? And then, Ann: Probably. Matthew Brooks: yeah. And I'm like, probably. Ann: Yeah. Matthew Brooks: Now if we ever do meet and greet, fans cannot convince me to give them money, but... Ann: They probably they probably could. For me. They'd be like, You emailed Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: and said that you would give me a free copy of the book for my shop or something. I'd be like, Okay. I'd be like, You're right. Here we here you go. You're right, I do that. That's something that Matthew Brooks: Yeah, yeah, I probably did. Yeah, yeah. Ann: I do. It's something that I do not keep track of like at all. Matthew Brooks: Nope. Nope. Ann: I have no idea how many a Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: couple local shops in Pittsburgh like done events for the book, sold things and now the children's now I know the children's museum because I like so excited. but if somebody else walked up and they're like, hey do you remember when we talked at that thing like a couple months ago? No. But I believe you. So here you go. But the yeah Matthew Brooks: No. Yeah. Yeah. Ann: but this was like wait a second I got this one locked in. I know that I paid. I went back and looked at my bake statement, like I definitely did pay. Could Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: you imagine being one of those people that was like 'cause you still double checked. One of those people that was like, I'm a hundred Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: percent sure I don't even need to check. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Imagine having a brain like that, where you just remember those things. Ann: I am confident that I did that. I don't have that pr I'm not confident that I did anything. Matthew Brooks: Yeah, I am not confident, but I am also confident in remembering anything about my clients. Ann: Yeah, I'm super confident. I am not confident that I remember doing a thing. Like, Matthew Brooks: Yeah, yeah. Ann: sorry. It's just like, did I? I think I did. I knew I Matthew Brooks: Did I do that? Ann: said I would. And Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: we're all over the place, but we've talked about this. Like, the creative brain and the Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: and the therapist brain has that like Like you remember everything in session and everything else is like out the window like a chaos goblin. Could you imagine like all of the art therapists being like, Did I? Matthew Brooks: Yeah. There is definitely a group feeling, a hive mind of like, did, did we do it? Yeah. Who's the, who's the most stable art therapist I can call? Ann: All of our personality types like shit. Shit shit shit shit. I know I did, I think I did. Did I? Like, wait yeah. Why'd you call me? Waking up. We're like waking up with like paint on our hands. There's like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: dinner, half-eaten dinner in the sink. Like we're Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: just trying to get to coffee and it's like, wait. Did I? Matthew Brooks: Yeah, the biggest thing Ann: Mm-hmm. Matthew Brooks: in the mornings to make sure of is not to drink out of the paintbrush wash cup versus the coffee cup Yeah Ann: I know I saw all my clients, I know everybody that I'm seeing today, I got but I don't know what's going on in my life and I like have to be somewhere in ten minutes and I just woke up. What is this email? Did I do this? Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: Yeah. Yeah, it would threw everybody for a loop. And again, going back to I I can't stress enough that if anybody that works for or is involved in the AT C B, I It sounds like it was something like everybody makes mistakes. It sounds like it was something that's like outside of control. I could not imagine being somebody responsible for Matthew Brooks: Ugh. Ann: responding to those in waking up that morning. I would explode. I think I would st I Matthew Brooks: It would be a very, very long day. Ann: think yeah, but I would start like his like I would just start laughing, I think, out of like, I don't know. I don't know what we're gonna do with this. Like it'd be crazy to deal with. So Matthew Brooks: Yeah. I, I don't know if we could do this. I just had a, what is it? Shmee from hook. Like lightning bolt just came down and struck me in the brain. Right. Could we get an ATCB person on the podcast to ask him how that day went? They might be a little busy. Ann: Not now. Not they're a little busy. I I don't think now's the time. But maybe. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: I would like to understand some things. not related Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: to not related to this at all. I just Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: have personal questions. But yeah, I couldn't imagine waking up that day and being like, that Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: would be the worst. But this is falling in this category, this is another one of those things that I think that other professionals, new professionals, that you don't understand that it's an it's an extra add on that we are Not like that we are upkeeping as therapists. It is the reason why it it caused such a ripple effect, even though it was a really big fluke that was stressful for them to deal with, is because it is really important for Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: all of us practicing art therapists. We work hard for those credentials. We're like you said, paying our dues, doing our CUs, doing our trainings, like now there's this whole new tracking system. We're we it is work, it is a lot of work for us to be upkeeping all of that and it's part of what we have to do for our jobs and it's a it's a part that we have expenses for, so and need to keep our licensure. So it's really, really significant. And it isn't a it's not it's a that's outside of everything, all the other hats we wear. And so it is a big deal. And it's another thing we're balancing. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. And I, and I think the reason it becomes so I'm going to say forgettable, but like lowest priority where then when the email pops up Ann: Yeah. Matthew Brooks: of like, we're like, we're screwed if this actually happens is the fact that we are, we are people who are focused on doing the therapy and doing the notes and running the business or like filling out cases or whatever it is. Right. And I know. Ann: You could take out the notes part. I don't know if we're all focused if the pri notes is all everybody's priority. No, I'm just kidding. Yeah, we're focused on the clinical piece. Matthew Brooks: But it becomes a lower one because it's an annual thing that comes around where it is, shit, I need to do my CEUs, shit, I got to pay my dues. Those types of things, because it is very much of like, there's an ease of process, But we are just doing our job, and we're like, I got to do this extra thing. Ann: Yeah. Pause. You're right. Matthew Brooks: Hahaha Ann: You're you are correct. That is something that we're all carrying. I think that I think there are two types of I'll just say therapists, not even art therapists. Matthew Brooks: You Ann: As far as CEUs and ki g and like your Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: your annual or biannual or whatever coming Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: There's the shit it's coming up therapists. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: And then there's the therapists that actually do have their shit together. And Matthew Brooks: Absolutely Ann: with that s with that kind of thing. And you know what I actually Matthew Brooks: And that's why the shit, the shit therapists call the therapists who have their shit together. Yeah, but see, you're Ann: You didn't, you called me. We're in the same category. Matthew Brooks: a hybrid. You're a hybrid because you're a Scorpio. Ann: Well actually that is what I was just gonna say. I did used to be the didn't ever have to worry about my CEUs being done. I really did and net and Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: it wasn't it wasn't because I was like on top of it, it was because I was just doing so much shit that there was no way that I couldn't have them on track. that was not me this Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then you had children. Ann: yeah, that was not well, then a lot of things happened, but that wasn't me this past year. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: But but I know I'm still nowhere near some other art therapists that I literally Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: am like applause all around because Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: they're asking me about like are you doing this training or did you hear about this thing? months in advan as soon as they're renewed, I'm they're Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: talking about and I'm like, you are very Matthew Brooks: Yeah Ann: And they have like a spread I'm thinking about one person in particular. But like they exist. There's a spreadsheet that's happening. They're Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: always always asking questions about being on top of that. So that Matthew Brooks: Yes. And then you have to stop and make sure you have the same matching socks on. Socks, I forgot, you Ann: Yeah, socks. Matthew Brooks: in socks. Ann: I don't wear socks. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: In the winter, maybe. I in the winter I wear socks. I can't stand this is a complete, complete tangent, but let's just talk about my sensory issues. As soon as it gets over like 60 degrees, if anything's on my feet, I'm gonna like be a miserable human to be around. Like I just have Matthew Brooks: Hahaha Ann: to. If I could not ever wear shoes, I wouldn't. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. I'm the same way. And it's funny because even the Mrs. Like would get me. They're probably. Yeah, they're around here. Look. These are lovely like slides that are like real squishy and everything. I know. Ann: yeah. Pee My son has those exact same shoes. You guys are matching. They're kids version. Matthew Brooks: Never wear them. Because I'm walking in my bare feet all the time. Like all Ann: yeah. I'm in my bare feet always. Matthew Brooks: the time. All the time. Ann: Yeah. But actually my my kids are also in their bare peas often. Like for around my yard you've been in my house. Like around my yard in my house, whatever. And it's not like we're we we don't have we're not community street playing kids, we're yard kids. Yard family. And so we don't Matthew Brooks: Yeah. I mean, your house is adjacent to like a cornfield or something, right? Yeah. Ann: Yeah. Yeah. So whatever. We're bare feet, people. And now the the king who reigned, you know, we've Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: talked about this. This the book. There's one of the pages is like, It's like dad mommy says I'm always kids are always in their bare feet and they have a illustration of them having like fuzzy bare feet. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: And my daughter always asks, Is it like, explain to me what's going on in this one? What do they mean by lambs on the yard? Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Or what do they mean by and she's like, I know bare feet. We're up we're always in bare feet. And and I'm like, yeah, you know that one. And she's been struggling with going to this kindergarten camp, which is amazing that they offer it. They offer like a camp before school starts. And she went into class for half the time each day. And she was in there. And the one of the teachers, Kate, walked her back out when she said she didn't want to come and walked her out. And sh they were like they were like We were talking about feelings and what makes us comfortable and she told us that she was like, When my dog gets anxious, she pants and she would 'cause they were talking about things that made them nervous and my daughter Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: was like, When my my dog gets anxious and she pants And she was like, It makes me comfortable to be in my bare feet And I was like, my god. Matthew Brooks: Yeah Ann: My kids in this class are for like the first time probably taking her shoes off, like talking panting like a dog. I don't know what's going on there. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: I'm like, thank you so much. I'm glad you were using your words. Did you take your Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: shoes off? You I don't know. Matthew Brooks: Well, and actually that brings up a good thing for like the back half of this, the segment is like hard pivot, but transitions, right? Transitions because Ann: my gosh. Matthew Brooks: a lot of kids are going into kindergarten, going into fifth to sixth grade if they're going into middle school transition, high school transition, even college transition. Like this is the season for those transitions. So what As a mom, but a mom therapist, like what advice would you give parents for those transitions to, you know, kindergarten or middle school or high school or anything like that? What has helped your daughter? Nothing. Ann: airs. Positive Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: positive thoughts and good vibes. No, it's a it's insane. but I think something that we've been working on personally because she's ha she's been struggling and then what I'm always working on with clients as well is there's prep work, there's Like we went to I'll just talk about what we did personally and then what I'm also recommending clients is like we went to the library and checked out the kindergarten books so that we could read about them. We drive we drove by her school. Well, I mean, we've been in it now 'cause there's been like a introducing day or whatever. But we would drive by her school so she could see where it was from the house and she could see the outside and the playground and where she would be dropped off and all this stuff. had a lot a lot of play dates with kids that are gonna be in her school 'cause everybody from preschool went a different dri like pre K went a different direction. so but it's prep work. It is a lot of prep prep work. we do the stories at night and then we just talk about what kindergarten's like. I like literally weave it into so many discussions where it's in a obviously a positive light. and she is really excited to go. It's just such a big jump. And you're talking about because we're talking about school transitions. I have a a kiddo that I'm gonna see later today that's starting middle school that since the end of last year was like absolutely not. And I've been doing the we've been working on the same thing all summer and giving parents resources and tools or suggestions to do to do over the summer to talk about it and figure out the if we need to schedule any meetings with the school or anything like that. It's really hard to find a positive about middle school. You're like, actually, Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: it does suck. Actually it's everybody, everyone that experienced middle school looks back and says that was the worst. But but it's gonna be great. You're gonna do great. Yay, algebra. Right, everyone? Matthew Brooks: Yeah, yes. You're going to do great. It's Mad Max. It's in a apocalyptic hormonal landscape. And good luck. Yeah. Ann: Yeah. Everybody's gonna be a shit. Your friends are no longer your friends. They're gonna be don't even talk to any of them going through puberty. They're gonna murder each other. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. And to the teachers and staff, thank you for your service. May the odds be ever in your favor. Ann: Yeah, good luck to you. I don't even know why you chose this job. Short straw. Yeah. We're being really negative, but it is funny because with so having my clients that are going through these transitions of like Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: older grades and then my daughter who's just going into kindergarten and my son is starting preschool this year and he's just like, see ya. Like he walked into her kindergarten camp and was like, I wanna go. And walked Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Like w the the staff had to bring him back and he was like upset that he wasn't going. I'm like d okay. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: Cool. Cool cool cool. so I'm not as watch him have a meltdown first day and I'm like, What? Missed it. but having having Matthew Brooks: He's gotta keep you on your toes. Ann: I guess whatever. but like highlighting all these positive things for like the start 'cause it is such a big transition for like the start of kindergarten personally and then helping older clients navigate high school, starting college. some of them have already headed back. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: like get settled in and things. And I even have some seniors in college that are still like like it's their senior year, they they know the deal, but it's their senior Matthew Brooks: Mm-hmm. Ann: year. It's like, my gosh, this is it. Then then the real world. I mean that's the you're f we're forever going through these things and we're guides for it. And it's all Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: prep, prep, prep, plan, plan, plan, get the information you need, but also the confidence that you have done big changes before. I I've told my daughter this and all of my clients. You've done big things before. You've started preschool and you've n you never did that and then you loved that and that was really great. And yeah, there was like hard times and good, but overall you wanted to go. And so you've done new things before. This is just a different new thing. so that's a lot of it. Matthew Brooks: Yeah, and one of the things that I usually tell parents for guidance is because they'll come in and be like, I'm really worried about them, like not being able to make friends or getting bullied or, you know, I think that they might be feeling this way or that way. And I'm like, OK, but have you actually talked to them? Like not trying to guess. what's going on, not trying to figure out or prevent or protect from this adversity that your child's going to experience. Because part of that is getting them to critically think and solve their own problems. And you are there as the mentor and the guide, where if they get in the car in that 15 minute ride or whatever amount of time, debriefing from school to home. It is like, how was your day? What was the best part about your day? What was the worst part about your day? What is something? Because I've even had kindergartners who that first week of school, they're like, no, I don't, I don't want to go. I hate it. Like all of this stuff. And the parents are like, I think they're having trouble with this or that. And then in the session, I'll turn and be like, why don't you want to go like to the kid? And they're like, they served us broccoli and I don't like broccoli. And like, that's why they never want to go to kindergarten. You know, so it's like, okay, like Ann: Guess? Matthew Brooks: this is what we can work with. And that's where I usually tell parents of like, figure out what is like, what's going on for them in their perspective of whatever it is. And then you work with that. Ann: And we lose that so much. the older that we get, the more adult the more whatever. We lose this is their first time doing it. And their Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: view the things that you think that they're thinking about aren't the s guess what my daughter's fear of kindergarten is? Guess what her biggest fear is? Matthew Brooks: wearing socks and shoes. Ann: No. No, that's mine. Not in a million years. The the s the school principal who was like helping us said or Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: was it the school psychologist, whoever was out there, everybody was helping. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: they were like, I have never heard a kid say this. Recess. Matthew Brooks: Yeah? Ann: She's afraid of recess. She's scared of recess. And it is actually like I'm my mom heart is like She's like, I her older cousin was talking about recess whatever, and she's like, I don't know anybody yet. I don't want to go to recess. I don't know who I'm going to play with or what I'm supposed to do. And they Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: didn't call it recess in Riquet they just like every once in a while got to go to the playground. It was like two hours, you know what I Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. Ann: mean? So like or like free time in the room. I was like, Honey, it's playtime. It's free time. Like you can do Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: whatever and the teachers there, like, to help you. And Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: she's asking these questions like, So it's the same when we went to the Playground, like where she went to pre and I was like, Yes. Exactly the same. Like you just get to go outside and there's probably and she's it's she did this morning while we were driving there, she's like, Do they have sidewalk chalk? I was like, I don't know, you want me to go get some? To give like I don't Matthew Brooks: You Ann: I'm sure they'd welcome that. It's recess. Like you but this the school psychologist's like Yeah, she was like, I've never Matthew Brooks: Yeah. It's that unknown, like being afraid of the unknown. Ann: heard a kid say that and I was like welcome Matthew Brooks: Hahaha Ann: Welcome to this. so yeah, Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: and she just has she's not it's so funny because when you're guiding clients through it, you do know them so well, like you know your clients so well, but they're not your kids. With your kids, it's so crazy because my son is I said this a million times, he is me socially. Hey, how's it going, everybody? Let's do this. Like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: and you I I forget that my daughter is the is the part of me that's like the leave introverted ar artist. She does. She would Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: just sit and paint in the corner all day if she wanted if you let her. And that's all she wants to do. And so it's like yeah, that would be Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: a really scary thing. And with clients you're talking about it in real time. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Well, and that's where I like telling the parents too is like whatever you're coming up with is probably not what they're worried about. Right? Yeah. Ann: Or it's part of it, but not the it's what your main thing is, 'cause Matthew Brooks: Yes. Ann: I was all the things that I was prepping for her, I did not prep recess. And then I f Matthew Brooks: You Ann: when I figured it out, like day two of this camp, I was like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Where like I didn't connect? Matthew Brooks: Yeah, so I mean maybe in the next couple weeks, too, we'll do another like school breakdown prep, little prep kit for them. Ann: Yeah, we should do a probably next week since school frickin' starts in two weeks. Isn't Matthew Brooks: yeah. Ann: that insane? Matthew Brooks: It is, summer flew by. I always know summer is like almost over when my birthday comes. Like that's, that is like the halfway mark that I always grew up knowing. Ann: Yeah. You're like, it's coming. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Doesn't it feel I we we have to get wrapped up, but doesn't this time of year even if it's like sticky hot out like it is in Pittsburgh today, it I feel fall coming. You like f I don't no matter how old you get, you're like school's about to start. Fall's Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: about to come. Like you've it's in you. I like feel it. Which is kind of exciting. I basic Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Yeah. I'm very excited for fall. If we actually have fall, not going into like October with a heat wave or something like the past couple of years. Yeah. I want to fall. Ann: Yeah, I'll be so I've been pretty pissed about that. I'm still putting up my Halloween decorations September first. I don't care what anybody says. We are big Halloweeners. Matthew Brooks: I have a dream every year and I never do it and I want to do it. I have like where my house is there's like we have a yard but it's like this kind of corner intersection part right and I've always wanted to set up like a yard Halloween display but have various Halloween characters interacting with each other. And basically, here's my thing. Have you ever seen Over the Garden Wall? You need to watch that one. But in there, there's a little town. It's called the Pottsville, Pottsfield, Pottsfield Pumpkin Festival. All the people are like pumpkin-headed people, right? Yes. Ann: my gosh. Go ahead, finish. Matthew Brooks: And Enoch is like their mayor or whatever. And I want to make a like 20 foot tall Enoch. because he has like cornstalk ribbons and like Ann: Yes. Matthew Brooks: the kids are like holding parts of the ribbons and like dancing around him and stuff. I like want to make some of that, but then I want to add like Jack Skellington, but not even Jack Skellington. It's the scarecrow version of Jack Skellington, like in the beginning, like the pumpkin king Ann: Yes. Matthew Brooks: one and like different Halloween, like movie, pop culture characters, like at this festival. I don't want that in my yard. I think that would be amazing. Ann: I would come. People I would come. Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Now I do too. We took a walk out to my garden this morning and everything is shit except for the pumpkins are out of control, Matthew Brooks: Yeah! Ann: growing over my fence into the yard. So I'm like, and my my daughter was like, What are we gonna do with all these pumpkins? And I was like, Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: I don't know, but now I might know. But in my mind. Alright, fall's coming, school's starting, everything's chaos. The book is at Children's Museum. Moon Magic is at Children's Museum, Matthew Brooks: Children's Museum. Ann: which is awesome. And don't worry everybody, you still have your board certification. Matthew Brooks: Yes, if if you completed it you still have it Ann: Our chaos episode in a nutshell. Thanks for following along. Our like Matthew Brooks: Yeah. Ann: Mickey little ball. It does not go in order. We Matthew Brooks: No. We're all over the place. Ann: So just here we are again, but thanks for listening everyone. Tune in next week for Matthew Brooks: Yeah, thank your therapist. Ann: What are we doing? Matthew Brooks: I don't know. Bye!