Scene Interpretation: Alright, welcome back to another episode of Scene Interpretation. I am Dr. Sophia Murphy. I'm a licensed therapist here in Arizona, and I am an avid movie lover, kind of obsessive, and have been watching movies and loving movies and wanting to talk to my friends about movies for as long as I can remember. And so today I am joined by another lovely human being, a friend of mine, Elizabeth. If you want to introduce yourself, yeah, hi, I'm Elizabeth Swaggart. We are friends. Yes. I don't know what else to say. say anything you want to say or nothing more it's completely up to you. ⁓ I'm a stage manager. Love it. ⁓ I'm from Texas. I guess that's it. Okay. I don't know. What's your relationship to movies in general? I like movies. Okay, good. I was younger, one of my first boyfriends was like super into movies. Nice. And I had never really seen a lot of the classics, but I wanted to. Yeah. 'cause just in my family we didn't watch classics, we just watched like I don't know Lots of Disney movies and you know I think we all have that in common. Yeah. Yeah, like lots of decom whatever. decom extras. but yeah, so this one guy like introduced me to a ton of movies, so we just watch movies all the time. And I don't remember all of them. like we were also like making out I mean ⁓ like I didn't see a whole movie. I love the split attention and are you a Seinfeld fan at all? I've seen of it. Okay. So super quick side note because this makes me laugh so hard. There's a Seinfeld episode where Seinfeld goes to see ⁓ Schindler's list with his girlfriend. Okay. And they're long distance and so they haven't seen each other and they make out through the whole movie, but they get caught. And because he's Jewish, it becomes this whole thing of like how could you make out during the Schindler's list? But I just think that's hilarious thing. Yeah. I mean, you know, of course back then you had to go to the theater to see it, so it's a little different. Yeah, we were at this moment in high school. So hilarious. I love it Yeah. Well, this will be fun. I love that you have ⁓ affection for movies already. Yeah. And I'm so excited because today we are talking about the original, the OG Batman 1989. And I have to give the year because there have been so many, so many iterations of Batman that we are going back. And I haven't seen any of them. So none. Okay. Yeah. Well, I'm kind of excited to hear that because instead of having to like reverse engineer the story and compare it to all the new versions, you're really watching it in order. You're starting at the beginning. I yeah, which is really cool. And it's interesting because just living in the world, I know about Batman. Yes. But then there were things that I didn't know. And so I was like, ooh, like, or I was waiting for things too. I was like, so who is like Harley Quinn? Like she's not in this movie, but like is she one of these people? And like is a Robin gonna show up? There was no bat signal till the very end, but like I knew that was a thing. Yes. I feel like a lot of my references are from Spongebob, like Mermaid Man and Barnacle Boy. Which also because it's been spoofed and people have basically paid homage to it for years and years and years. Yeah, that was like my intro to it. So this is one of my favorite things about having these conversations so far is just seeing how everybody comes into these stories and has these associations because so many of the movies we've picked so far are really steeped in our culture and yet we've all connected with them in different ways. Yeah. This is great. Yeah, yeah. When I was younger, I was like, I don't know, I think that I thought this made me cool. I was like, I've never seen a superhero movie. ⁓ like anti culture. I know exactly. and like I think when I was younger, I just felt like they were like more targeted towards boys that I was like very, very girly, so I just was like, I'm not interested. Yeah, I did that. I think it was definitely like Barbie for girls and like superheroes for guys. Like that's kind of sadly how everything was just fell into that. My sister did not, she was like very tomboyish, which is awesome. but but yeah, I just wasn't into it. She never watched it either, I don't think. ⁓ even now? I don't know. Actually, we're not talking about it since now you're talking about it on the podcast. And now I've seen like a couple Avengers because like one of my ex-boyfriends made me watch Avengers. Sure. So I can't say that anymore. But but no, it was very good, and I want to watch more Batman movies now. ⁓ this is gonna open up a whole new world for you. My favorite superhero. So all right. since you haven't seen the ones that have come after, this first question might not land exactly the same. I've seen a couple seconds of The Joker, like the scary one, but it freaked me out. So I stopped watching it. A very dark, different interpretation. Yeah. Fabulous psychologically, ⁓ whoa, totally different vibe. Yeah, and fair. It's a heavy, heavy. I mean, I do recommend it. It's incredibly well done. And it is a totally different vibe. Yeah. I'm a big fan of the Tim Burton vibe. Yes. And I didn't know it was Tim Burton. I got so excited when I was seeing the credits at the beginning. Yes. Of I didn't know like anyone or anything, but I was like, Tim Burton isn't like directing. Yeah. And then the guy from the The Shining is the Joker. ⁓ yeah, Jack Nicholson. Yeah, and I love The Shining. Yes. And I in my mind, I've only ever seen him in that and this, and his name is Jack as a character in both. So I was like, he only pleased people named Jack. That's a true fetch. Not true, but like I was like, interesting. I love that you put two and two together. I didn't even think about it. I was like, it's always his own name. ⁓ And then I saw that Prince did the music. Yes. And so later my husband comes downstairs and watches the last like half hour with me. ⁓ and I was like, Prince did the music, did you know? And he was like, Yes, and he leaves and he comes back with the Batman album. If I fell in love with your husband. Look at this! It's on vinyl! It's on vinyl, it's from the original movie. We just owned this. I had no idea. Songs I don't even know how to My mind was blown. I like screamed. I wish I had a retro player. We could play this in the background. I know, he just like put this in front of me. I was like, ⁓ my god. Well, now I know all the music that's gonna go in the background of all the posts. Yeah. Please give him five stars for him. This is like the best thing I've ever seen. I was so excited. ⁓ I'm obsessed. Five stars for him. This is great. Yes. So I guess it has been rebooted so many times since 1989. So I'm wondering if now that you've seen the original original. If it's changed how you've thought about any of the later ones or how you might want to think about any of the newer ones? ⁓ the Joker's a lot sillier than I thought. Yeah. I don't know what I thought. Like, I guess I didn't know like any backstory. I know that Batman was like an orphan. Okay. But I didn't know like how his parents died and I know how the Joker killed them. Yes, and so that is an interesting storyline that isn't always the same for every version. It is key to this one. Yes for sure. It was mind blowing. Yeah. I was like, whoa. So I guess I'm wondering though because it is such a famous movie, if you felt any pressure about how maybe you were supposed to feel watching it versus just like going in without it having so much canon? Sure. ⁓ I wouldn't say I felt pressure. Okay. But I would say that I start when I started watching it, it was just so different than what I thought it would be. Okay. I just didn't think I would like it that much. I don't know. ⁓ but then the very beginning it's very theatrical. Yes. it looks like sets. Yes like in theater and I was like that's really cool. Yes. the special effects are so silly 'cause it's the eighties. Yes. And I loved all of those. ⁓ but it was just like a lot f more fun than I thought it would be. Because I was expecting like very serious like superhero. Sure. And we just live in a world where there are superheroes. Sure. But it was like a real world. Yeah. And they had to explain why they were there. And I was like, I didn't even think about that. Like I just assumed that everyone was like, Batman is a guy and in this world. But they were all like, and it just felt more realistic in a way. Like agreed. You know what I mean? And I think that's one of the things that makes this first one so special is it really does the comics justice of we're learning about him while Gotham is Learning about him. Yeah. And there's this mixed emotion around is he even a good guy? Yeah. Right? Like is this an insane person who dresses up like a bat? Yeah. Is he actually the criminal? And then we're getting to see him as Bruce Wayne and like learning about his history. And so we're evolving as like he's evolving. Yeah. And everyone else is figuring him out too. And one of the things I love about Tim Burton is I think you nailed it, is he is known for really using all those actual sets. And you can feel his like fingerprint. all over it. You can't like every building and the cars and just the the grunginess of Gotham City feels really real. It's so cool. And then at towards the end when his like Batmobile crashes. Yes. during the crash fire scene, my husband pointed out that it was a like a little miniature set. And you could tell once he said that I was like, ⁓ my gosh, yeah, those are like miniatures. It was so cool. Which I love and I I do too. I say this and have said this on other Episodes, especially the Jaws episode, I miss that so much. Yeah. Even if it costs more money and takes more time, to me, you cannot compare anything to the practical effects. I agree. And the you know, the way that you have to edit the film and the way that you have to just use like creativity to make you know even his bat plane fly through the city. Yeah, like it's just I love every little detail, and I think that that's very at least old school Tim Burton to a T, and I'm a huge, huge fan of that. Yeah. So I guess walk me through. through that moment you realized that Batman really was not what you expected and what did you feel in your body and where did your mind go? Yeah. I didn't know that he didn't have like superhuman powers. Yes. And so I was like, can he fly? I just had so many questions. And then he has all these like gadgets. Yes. You know? And I was like, ⁓ like he's just a guy. Yes. Which I didn't realize at first. And so that was like interesting and added like a level to it, you know. Yes. Definitely. Because there's no like I don't again, I don't know superhero movies, but there's no like kryptonite or whatever for him. Yeah. So when later on he gets shot, but he has the the little metal tray. The little metal tray. Yes. And so I was like, wait a minute, is he invincible? And then I was like No, it's just a metal tray. But it was just like kind of trippy. I don't know. It changed my expectations of like what I thought the movie would be. Sure. Yeah. And I think that again And I liked it more, I think. Because he's more relatable. Like as a human. Maybe not something you would do in your evening, but relatable is like a non as a guy superpowered person. And I agree. And I think falling in love with Batman as a character, as a kid, there was this piece of like he's a person, he's a vigilante, right? So you could argue again, is this right? Is it wrong? Is it legal, illegal? And there is something very distinct about him willing to put himself in harm's way to help people, knowing that he is completely killable. Yes. He's just a person. Yeah, he's just a guy. Absolutely. And so we can get into the psychology a little bit of what would make a person want to do that. Yeah. ⁓ And kind of constantly put themselves in harm's way with kind of very little regard for them themselves. And I do love because even again the practical effects of all his tools. Like that man's always known for the tech. Yes. Because he isn't a superhero in the same way. What I was wondering too, who invents all that stuff? Is he an inventor? Like they didn't get into that at all. So in this version, it's very much him. Okay. And him sort of like problem solving what he needs to be able to do what he's gonna do. Okay. Batmobile, and it's you made that. Exactly. Where'd this come from? Exactly. And so my memory, and I've not read the actual comics, I've just consumed so much of the lore. Is that he has all the money in the world. Uh-huh. So he's a billionaire back when we didn't really have billionaires, right? And so he has How does he have all the money? Do we know he inherited it? It's very like gray in terms of like Wayne Enterprises. ⁓ his dad's company. Okay. Sets him up to be able to do any and everything. And basically, because they have these roots and got them and have made countless amounts of money, he can sort of play and, you know, experiment and design whatever he needs. In the Christian Bale Batman movies, one of the Wayne Enterprise contracts is military. So they write a storyline in where he has access to this technology through the military. And he's able to sort of ⁓ revamp an existing tank into the Batmobile. ⁓ interesting. And to take a plane and turn it into the Bat Plane. Because he has these connections through his businesses and he's sort of like, ⁓ what do you want to call it? Like pulling from his own pot of toys that are like built for the United States military. It's an interesting way that they explain that more in the newer Batman movies. Okay, cool. So but I do love the fact that he has to be Inventive in that way because he you can't shoot him without a suit on or without the metal trick. He'll die. Yeah. And if he falls off a building, he'll die. So he has all those cool little like repelling things that he shoots up and can pull himself up and down. It was also so funny, his costume in this movie ⁓ doesn't allow him to move his neck at all. Correct. So there are scenes where he's like like looking with his whole body and it's just so funny for no reason. And I think that's also like a very sweet part of the 80s. Was like they're building this costume of I'm assuming like neoprene or something. ⁓ yeah. And the cow is one piece. Uh-huh. And so it's like we created this amazing practical costume, and then we actually start shooting, and we realize, ⁓ no, we've created all these limitations for a lead actor, but we're already in it. Especially when he's running up the stairs at the end. He does a lot of like full lean back. Yeah, just a turn his whole chest. His whole body, yeah. And I was reading too, prepping some more fun trivia that they built that car, they retrogated his Batmobile from Several other cars. ⁓ And they forgot to make doors. So they had to make the sort of pilot style entrance that opens so we can get in from the top to like fix their mistake. But then with his cow on and his little ears, he was too tall. Did they stick out the top? Well, it smashed his little ears when the like hood would come up. So it's just all these little great details that I love about like the behind the scenes. Because it was practical. And you know. Trying to take this beloved character from a comic book and give it new life. One other thing you mentioned that I think is really important, and maybe for fun if you get into his character, is so there actually was a Batman TV show. Okay. I don't know about that. Yes. And it was incredibly campy. Okay. So it's funny in retrospect that this one feels funny now. Yes. Because in comparison to the TV show, which was what everybody knew, this was way dark. ⁓ interesting. Very serious. Wow. So you'll have to look up after. This, like just I'm sure it's on YouTube, scenes from the original TV show, and the Joker on that show is a total comedian. Okay. Like over the top, silly. Well, the acting is insane. Like it is a total camp, almost like the office style, so so funny TV show. Yeah. So when they gave it to Tim Burton and they made it literally and figuratively so dark, and with his backstory and his trauma, most people were almost like, this is too dark. Wow. But now we watch it, we're like, this is silly compared to what we watched today. I the opposite reaction to that. Yeah. Because I'd only seen a couple seconds of the Joker, the scary one. And so this Joker is like bringing a boom box everywhere, has like a flower that squirts acid. Like it was just so ridiculous. Yes. And like the first time he laughs, I'm like, Why is he I mean I know that the Joker laughs, but I was like, that's it just is weird. Like why is he laughing? Yes. Which is very silly. Yeah. ⁓ the whole thing he felt very Very clownish. So it's funny, but it's like the opposite. I was ⁓ it's a lot goofier than I thought. Whereas like people in the 60s who saw that one really. Yeah, you gotta watch some of those clips because in comparison, Jack Nicholson really takes it more to a psychotic stage. I love Jack Nicholson. Yes. And I was re-watching it thinking like there is a darkness to his comedy because what's happening isn't funny. Yes. Right? And so watching it again for the 50th time or whatever, I love that juxtaposition of him like electric. That guy to where he's a skeleton, but then having a conversation with him and laughing maniacally and like that mixture of like, ⁓ this is really what was supposed to make him scary. Uh-huh. Was that he's just randomly killing people and you can't tell when it's gonna happen. The flowers squirting acid, it's just unpredictable. Yes, and I love that piece of that's I think what's supposed to make it uncomfortable. Is he so silly looking, and then he just does this horrible and then they'll just murder you. Yeah. On with the next thing. Yeah. Like and he kills the guy, one of the crime lords who's giving that public speech, and he like kills him with the which I was thinking, would this kill somebody in real life? Yeah, great. The quill to the neck in front of all the people, and he's just like laughing. Yeah. And I think that's where we're supposed to feel that sort of like, ⁓ you don't know what he's capable of, yeah. And not to underestimate him. So it's interesting because yes, if you do ever watch the newer joker or even Keith Ledger's famous performance. Of the Joker in the Christian Bale Batman's, it takes that darkness ten notches. Wow. Where it is truly skin crawling of like this person is unhinged and has lost any connection to reality. Yeah. See, that seems interesting. I want to watch that. I highly recommend all of them. but Heath Ledger won an Oscar for that movie because he had already passed away. And so his version of the Joker is considered probably the best to date. I've ⁓ it's just very different. I think okay, yeah. Yeah, that it's again dark on a Totally different level. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Because this one he was just silly the whole time and creepy, like you said. But like even at the end, he's like, Batman stole my balloons. Like, that's so dumb. Exactly. Like, I don't know. It was just very silly. When I think you're right, like it's all relative, and that's what makes it so interesting. Is that he also announced that he was gonna murder everyone and no one reacted? Yeah. I was like, what? Why I was thinking that too of like he throws the money and he's like, now I'm gonna. kill you all because you're like scum of the earth like very very like mean ⁓ yes and no one said anything they just kept grabbing money no one was worried I was like well and I think are they distracted by the greed yes I think that's an interesting commentary of the 80s that also I was actually I'm glad you pointed to that thinking of today and like what would people look away from for this opportunity to get all this money or even ignore their own care It made me think of Squid Games. Yes. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. And I think it's interesting that all these years later, right, we kind of had this idea of like if a billionaire said, I'm gonna come out in Times Square and drop a billion dollars, would people be so money hungry and desperate that they would ignore any potential risk to themselves? Yeah. I don't know that that's far-fetched anymore. I know. That's really interesting. Which kind of gives me the like KVG a little bit. Yes. Of like, how are we kind of in a similar space to movie that took place in the eighties. Yeah. So I don't know, it's fascinating. ⁓ what were some of your notes? I've got lots of questions, but some things that stood out to you. We'll go back and forth. Okay, I have a question. Sure. ⁓ I'll do my best. So ⁓ She is with Batman. Batman like rescues what's her name? ⁓ Vicki. Yep. He rescues Vicky and then they get all like steamy for a moment back in his place. And then it cuts to black and then she's laying on a bed. Yeah. Did he have sex with her? So my understanding was. No. Okay. My understanding was that they had sex when he was Bruce Wayne. Uh-huh. ⁓ and then, you know, she's attracted to the Batman, but doesn't really understand that they're the same person. And he rescues. And if you notice, like when they're in the Batmobile too, she keeps looking at his face. Yeah. And when he's on the computer and explaining Joker's plan, she keeps trying to get close to him and like make out his features and he turns away from her. Yeah. So my understanding was he stops himself because of his like, you know, life that he lives. I'm assuming probably like drugs her to get her home. And so it's like a dream. I think she's questioning what happens. I see. That makes more sense. Or he steals the film from her because she is the only photo of him that we know of in existence. Okay. Yeah. So my my thought has always been he's torn because he lives these two lives. Yes. And he she's very torn of who she's more attracted to. I see. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. I like that. It's fascinating because I think there's a big part of like the risk in this movie, again, especially as the first one is telling her. ⁓ And can he tell her without also putting her in jeopardy? Yeah, true. Yeah, there's a little bit of that Superman storyline too. Of like Clark Kent and Superman both be with Lois Lane without her always making her a target. Yeah. There's a crossover, I think, between how DC did it and how Marvel did it. They're kind of always mirroring each other, but yeah. Yep. Wow. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. ⁓ let me look at my notes again. I didn't know there'd be real bats in the bat cave. I was surprised. Yes. Like he really lives down there. He really does. It's underneath his mansion. Yeah. ⁓ killing people. With smilax gas was really interesting. Yes. And like how they smile and laugh and then die, like that was very unnerving. I agree. And I love the part where the newscasters are just telling the regular news and then the woman basically laughs to death. Yes. And then when they cut to them on camera again, they're not wearing any makeup and like their hair is smoothy. Because nobody knows. Yes. They know that it's something they're either ingesting or putting. On their body, but they're not sure how. And I think again, for an idea of fear, what an interesting concept that, like, our everyday, you know, whatever you want to call it, toiletries, yeah, are now toxic. Yeah. That we don't know when or where how we're gonna die. It partially makes me think of early COVID when we didn't know how it was spread. Absolutely. We're like cleaning our pizza boxes because we're not simply bringing the virus in the house or like wiping down the groceries before you come in the house. Yeah, I was ⁓ my COVID story is long, so I won't do the whole thing. But at one point I was in Arizona, didn't live here. ⁓ wow. ⁓ my sister went to ASU and then I wanted to go back to Houston. and we didn't know how COVID worked. It was really early. So my sister drove halfway and my dad drove halfway and I was exchanged at a gas station. Wow because they didn't want to mess with hotels. I mean yes. Because it's like w is it like to like we didn't know. Yeah. So I mean that is pretty irrelevant other than one human being doing that to us. like torment us. So yeah. You make a really great point is like how does that affect that sort of psychological fear too of like I'm adding all these layers of anxiety to try to be safe because I don't really know how the rules work. And there was no vaccine, so there was it's like okay, you know Exactly. And so I love that part too in the movie where it's like we know that this man is out to get us, we don't really understand the plan. Yes. And here comes Bruce Wayne trying to figure out like what's the method to this madness and like how does it really work? I kind of Wish we'd gotten to see Batman do more of that, like figuring out because he kind of just tells us at some point. Right. ⁓ I've solved everything, here you go, Vicky. Exactly. Which is like, ⁓ I want the process. Like tell me, I don't know, the deep dives. Well, and in future movies when he's fighting different criminals, there is more of that, which is really exciting. I think in this first one, my guess is they just had such a heavy lift. Because, like you said, like we're learning everything about him. Yes. Two hours? It's not too long. Or superhero movies an hour. I think was about two hours. Yeah. So I think in the newer versions, the movies are always pushing two and a half, three hours, so they can fit in so much more of that. And in this one, we get the like ⁓ cliff like cliff note of it. Uh-huh. It's much more like, okay, here's the answer. I'm amazing. I figured everything. Exactly. Exactly. ⁓ so let's see. There's a really cool part about I think the relationship between Joker and Batman. So like you talked about Joker kills his parents when he's little. Yes. And then basically Batman tries to kill him when he goes into the vat of acid. Mm-hmm. And so there's the line where Joker says, You made me, and Batman says you made me first. Yes. And so I'm curious what two people are so tied to each other's origin stories. ⁓ that's a good question. think isn't there a word for that in literature? You're a foil, a character foil to each other where you're like opposites. I mean I think that's that. I have to look it up. But I don't know, that it made me think of that. But I don't know I don't know what to say. I just agree that it's like interesting. Yeah. And they're tied together in that way. Yes. And you're right, like neither of them would have happened without the other one. But and it's interesting because one is negative and one is positive. And so they kind of cancel each other out anyway, but without either of them. But if you think about it, if the Joker hadn't killed his parents, he's still like an evil guy. Right. You know what I And Batman may not have become Batman. Yeah. So it's interesting. The Joker didn't help Batman, but like he made him who he is, also. Well, and I think in a weird way, it's almost like by creating Batman, it helped everybody else. Yes. Right? It was like the ultimate cost to Bruce Wayne. But then it created like a future where I think you're right, like Joker probably wasn't gonna stop. Like he was a criminal, right? And it probably killing lots of people, sadly. And then we would have no Batman to help counteract him down the road. And it's ironic then that. Joker made Batman, which is doing good to humanity when that's not his intention. Correct. And he basically created his own demise. Yes. If you look at it that way. Yes. Like it was, you know, I don't know how old Bruce Wayne's supposed to be in this version, but let's just say 25 years later, 30 years later, the thing that the Joker did as a young man is the thing that ends him as an adult. Yeah. Like it's pretty trippy, which I admit. It is. I do too. Yeah. ⁓ So kind of staying on the Joker and in his role he's such pure chaos and at the same time seems to be having like the time of his life just destroying everything. Uh-huh. And I wonder if any part of you found that compelling, like his freedom to just kind of run amok. it was interesting for sure. Like Being able to just do whatever you want, of course, is seems nice, you know. And he's like doing his passions. He's like, I'm an artist, and I'm like ⁓ which was so funny. This is gonna sound really dark. Can I change the subject slightly? Sure. But it has to do with him being an artist. He was like, I ⁓ let me I quoted it. Okay. sorry, this is related. ⁓ No, I love it, please. ⁓ he's also a Pisces, which I'm a Pisces. I thought that was funny. That was so funny. ⁓ where is it? ⁓ I ⁓ he calls himself a homicidal artist. Mm-hmm. ⁓ and he's seems like a failed artist in a w in a way. I wonder but it made me think of Hitler, which I know is very interesting very like dramatic. But like Hitler is a failed artist and takes it out on, you know his vision is to then create a perfect world. Not that Joker is Hitler, but I there I saw like a comparison. Well and honestly, if you do watch the other Batman movies and Joker gets increasingly darker, ⁓ I mean It's not the worst comparison. Okay, okay. See, I've only seen this one, and he's just a goofy damage if I say it nicely, yeah. You say psychotic, right? ⁓ that he does try to keep creating the world in his image in terms of like because of all the unfairness and injustice he's experienced and his worked view of everything, everyone else must suffer too. And it's just kind of the way the cards fall. Exactly. Yeah, intended. Yes, yes, yes, and so it's Interesting to see, I think, too, how iconic that character is and we don't ever get a ton of his backstory. It's less important. It comes up a little bit in the Heath Ledger version. Okay. ⁓ and in the Joker, the one that you're talking about, the really scary one with Joaquin Phoenix. But I haven't again read all the comics, I've just seen all the movies. It's less about his past and more about what it requires of Batman to go toe to toe with sort of like the ultimate foe. Because he is so unpredictable and seemingly unswayed. Yeah. Like there's nothing left in him that would make him stop. Mm-hmm. Which I think is what makes him scary. Yes. Yes. He'll push past everything. Yeah. So agreed. Batman operates outside the law because he doesn't trust the system. Mm-hmm. What do you think about the concept of people taking justice into their own hands when the system isn't working? ⁓ it's so complicated. But I think vigilante justice is good. Yeah. I think you gotta do what you gotta do in a way. Yep. ⁓ because yeah, the system is not correct. I don't know. You know what I mean? Yeah. Well I think that that's always one of the core sort of philosophical questions of the Batman story is like at what point is it justified for you to go outside the system to do what's right. And in this case it is 'cause like they wouldn't have done anything. Correct. But but I do think that that is still justified. Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's interesting too because at least in this version, the police are portrayed as really incompetent. ⁓ huh. And kind of like buffooned in that way. Like it's very Again, come eat it. Yep. And so we're I think we have more empathy for Batman doing what needs to be done, where there are probably situations where it would seem more gray. Yeah. And you know, kind of the end justifies the means is not always a great framework. And this one makes it a little bit more black and white. Yes. Of like this is an insane person, you have to stop him. Yes, exactly. It's like in every scenario, who knows? Fair would it turn out that way? Fair. ⁓ I think the other big part of this, especially is you learning about Bruce Wayne's story, is how much. impact his trauma plays in his life. And so in his storyline, he doesn't really ever heal from the trauma. It fuels him into this whole other identity. And so I wonder what you think about maybe someone who holds on to pain for purpose. Ooh. Pros and cons maybe. you say it again? Yeah, like what do you think about someone who might hold on to their pain as if it gives them a purpose? I think that's easy to do. ⁓ I think it's not good to do. I think he should go to therapy. Can you imagine? I mean a new version of Batman where he has to go to therapy. Yes, yes. The really updated twenty twenty-six version. Exactly. Face that trauma head on. He's just wearing his mask in a therapy session. Yes. But yeah. I don't know. Yeah, I mean it's fascinating just because if we take a step back like from a just fan standpoint, there is no Batman. Story if he gets his shit together to therapy in his twenties. Uh-huh. And at the same time though, yeah, it makes him who he is. Correct. And if you take that to a broader perspective, though, like how sustainable is it for your childhood trauma to define you in that way? Again, to the point that you would be willing to die on a nightly basis for vigilante justice. It's so heavy. Right, exactly. So in Batman R Forever, the third one. Okay. ⁓ the actor changes and it's Val Kilmer. Did it become second or no? No, so this kind of just became a thing. I can't remember why Michael Keaton so he's in the second one, which is excellent. Okay. The second one is fantastic. I want to watch that one next. Because I got an ad before it has Catwoman in it. Yes. Which I didn't realize she was a villain. She's a ⁓ she's kinda like most of these, both, right? So like has two sides, yeah, ⁓ Selena Kyle and Catwoman. It's fantastic. She's so cool. Yes, and Michelle Pfeiffer is five stars in that. Especially like early 90s, Michelle Pfeiffer. ⁓ yeah. Yeah. So Batman 3, Batman Forever, though, new actors, ⁓ new directors, so a slightly different tone. It's still darker, which I like. But he actually does go to therapy briefly. Really? Yeah. I can't remember she's a psychiatrist. Okay. But ⁓ played by Nicole Kidman, which is fantastic. And they start to poke around in some of his past. ⁓ but again, because he has to protect his identity, he's going as Bruce Wayne. Yes. So it's very Very interesting to see them sort of circle that idea with that ultimate risk of though he can't let his identity be discovered. Yes. And again, would that put the other person at risk? Which is a big hallmark of all the Batman stories of he has to stay almost isolated. Yes. Because of the dual life. Otherwise, if he ever loves somebody or pursues somebody, it puts them at risk. Yes. So there's always like a big kind of lost there where he sacrifices himself and what could be for the greater good. Yes. Yep. I really like spy movies and it reminded me of that, I feel like where they're like, I can't be too close to you because then you'll be targeted and hundred percent. And if you're like a really good spy, you're probably kind of always on the run or always taking on these other personas. Exactly. And you have to be so deeply embedded to whoever you are in that mission. So that's a great parallel too because that Is portrayed even more in the Christian Bale Batman. Okay. And like what it costs to try to set that aside and like settle down. Okay. Yeah. So I think you're gonna go on a whole new journey. I think I am. I'm excited. ⁓ so kind of in that same vein, Bruce Wayne spends his entire life with the two versions of himself. So he's the billionaire playboy, right? And then the vigilante. And so I guess I wonder what you think about living a double life and if there's a part of you that's ever experienced having to juggle two sides of yourself. yes, I would say that I have experienced that. so I'm a stage manager for corporate events. Yeah. I'm always the youngest one in the room and I'm in charge. And it's hard to do that and also be like a silly goofy lady that I am. Yourself. And so I do put on a different persona when I'm at work because I'm working with most of the time men in their 40s and 50s. Yeah. but I have to be in charge of the room. so it's it's hard. So and so so I do put on a different persona for that. And it is kind of tiring. I could see Because I come back and then I I don't know, I feel I can't talk about the things I would talk about with my friends. Right. ⁓ references are different. Yeah. ⁓ it's also a lot of corporate stuff. And I don't always agree with the messaging of like the shows that I'm doing. Totally fair. I don't know. I'm very liberal and bi and like sometimes they're very conservative and and so I put myself into the spaces and I have to ⁓ sure assimilate in a way ⁓ to have respect from other people. Yeah. and then I go home and I'm like pole dancing and making crafts and doing embroidery. so I really appreciate you sharing that example because I do think that is the core of what we're talking about, right? Is like you have to do your job, right? And you understand how you have to navigate the space. And if the space requires you to be essentially inauthentic, or again wear a mask to fit in, then you have to kind of leave part of yourself on the shelf to be able to do what you have to do. Yeah, and it's just hard. Take the mask off and be yourself. Yeah, I mean, I think you nail it like what does that do to you? And like how it's draining, it can be. Yeah. And so I've been trying to be. little bit more of myself. ⁓ but also, you know, that's what I'm working on right now personally. But I think that makes so much sense. Like how can you kind of lift the mask a little bit so the toll isn't quite so large? Again, I mean especially in a conservative state, like it's a very real thing to recognize like there could be significant consequences, which is just an unfortunate reality that we all have to navigate right now. So it's kind of like taking that toll is also a protective thing. Yeah. And I'm also just a shy person. Yeah. Yeah. So being myself like takes time, I guess, too, sometimes, like in any scenario. Sure. But and then you have to wage your safety in there too. ⁓ I think we have a little empathy for the person having to live those two versions of themselves. Yes. so one of the parts that I love about Batman in all the iterations is Alfred. So his butler is really his Yes, yes, and has raised him. Alfred is so sweet. ⁓ my gosh. And I feel so bad. I don't know that actor's name from the first few movies. ⁓ he stays pretty consistent until the newer movie. He's like another. He's hitting all of his needs. Yes. And he's like such a good figure and he looks out for him. He's like I Don't want to watch you die. He's always the voice of reason of like to what extent are we gonna do this experiment? Yes. Right? And to what cost are you going to keep putting yourself in these risky situations to stop this madman? Do you watch Archer? I did. I haven't stayed with it. Okay, well, there's like kind of the parody where he has a butler, but he just treats him horribly. Well, yeah. It's a little bit different. It's a yeah, it's different, but it just made me think of that. But yeah, Archer I think is a more complicated character. Yes, he's so complicated. Yeah. So spoiled. He is. Whereas like Bruce Wayne is spoiled, but he's not like a dick. I think they have always portrayed Bruce to just be more internally tortured. ⁓ huh. And so his spoiledness is more again around his isolation and like access to this, less about like treating Alfred like he's a second class. I know. Which from when I was watching Archer like religiously, that's what I remember. Yes. If he just treats everybody like they're beneath him. Exactly. ⁓ they're all total messes on this. Yeah, they are which was great though. I just fell off of it over the years. So I think the the double edged sword though is that Alfred does really enable Bruce to again kind of live in this trauma fueled stunted space. ⁓ and I guess I wonder what do you think about the idea of supporting someone no matter what, even if they're hurting themselves? That's hard because Because you want to be supportive of your friends and family. Of course. ⁓ but you don't want them to hurt themselves, like you said. And like like he says, he's like, don't go too far, basically. Right. So there is a limit to it. ⁓ I think Alfred rides that limit pretty well. Yeah, he does keep him stunted, but he's also being very supportive, and I think like in the world of Batman, he is good for him. I agree, and I do think he voices maybe some of our thoughts as the the viewer. True. Right. Like he gives sort of the audience a voice of just like again, like, how far are you willing to take this? And I don't want to lose you and I care about you. And even though maybe I can understand your reason for this, I have to at least acknowledge that this is getting really risky. Uh-huh. And so I do see both sides of like, you know, at what point would Alfred really say, like I can't support you putting yourself in this position as somebody who loves you. Yes. And that does come up In the Christian Bale series where he's Batman and his Alfred is a little bit more of like, I don't know that I can be a hundred percent team Batman if it means losing Bruce. Yeah. So it's neat to kind of see some of that play out in the later version of the That's really interesting. Yeah. I really think you're gonna love them. I'm so excited to watch all of them in order. ⁓ so I guess kind of on a lighter note, if you had to design your own bat suit, ⁓ what persona would you want? Want to create to face out to the world. Ooh. Like with the suit? Just the whole idea. So, like the suit being the literal thing that you would wear. If you think about the persona you would pick if you got to pick your vigilante version of yourself. ⁓ that's so interesting. It doesn't have to be bat related. Nope. Okay. just kind of like what would be your superhero persona? that's hard. Do you know what yours would be while I think about it? Actually, I didn't even think of it yet. I just had Ready to ask you, let's see. Hmm. I mean it's hard because I think I'm so heavily influenced by all of these stories that already exist. Like my brain automatically goes to catwoman, but I think that's kind of what I was I was like cats because I like cats and I have a cat. But I think it's me trying to like instantly pick a puzzle that already exists. Yeah. Exactly. And also I just don't know that I have that super creative gene of like if I was gonna start from scratch, I thought of something for me here. I love it. I think I would be fish related because I really like fish. Okay. And so it would be like watery. I'm a Pisces. That's right. I could tie it all in. I like it. Seaweed. Like I just think it could be fun to be like an oceany coral person. Yes, female aquaman. See, I've never seen Aquaman either. ⁓ I will say, no offense to any Aquaman stands out there. Not my top. Okay. Okay. Maybe I'd be female Aquaman, but better. Yeah, I mean, I it's just it doesn't hit for me. Okay. I love that idea. You could do it. Right. Like you could do I can talk to fish. Yes, a hundred percent. That is a a power that Aquaman has. Really? Wait, that's so cute. Does he like Does he just talk to little fish in fish tanks? Well no, he lives in the ocean and comes onto land. ⁓ So like his kingdom. ⁓ And his original. ⁓ like Neptune. So like he has like Atlantis underwater. Okay. And kind of similar to other superheroes trauma stories, he's like half I can't remember again, I'm not an Aquaman stand. ⁓ There's the name for their people. Okay. And so his dad was one of them, or the other way around, his dad was a human and his mom is from that culture. Okay. So he's mixed, so he can be on lands. ⁓ in the ocean. And that's Yeah. Kind of. Like if Little Mermaid and Eric really had a kid. Yeah, yeah. ⁓ they do. Do they? Yeah, there's a Little Mermaid 2. I have never seen Little Mermaid 2. They have a kid. I feel like I only know the Disney classic as a classic. Yes. No, there's a sequel. So is the kid a human or a mermaid? Or both? I think I I I think both. Like can it do both? Like I don't it's been so long since I've seen this movie. I think so. Interesting. I know it has like Eric's black hair and like the Little Mermaid's face. Okay. And a very pretty name I don't remember. Wow. I mean again I was a kid when I watched it, so I don't remember that part. You have a lot of foundation for creating your fish superhero character. You could draw from Ariel and Eric's kid, and then you can draw from Aquaman and you could kind of create maybe even a better version of what's left. See all the good things. Yes. Yeah. So if you do watch Aquaman, then you can let me know what you would keep and what you would change. I love this. Alright, what other things did you write down? What else stood out to you? Okay. I wrote down just all my thoughts as they happen. I love them. So some of them are just like short little things. ⁓ I was like, the set is so theatrical. Yeah. Can he fly? Question mark. He can't. Nope. that's what the gadgets are for. I wrote down stuff filmed in the 80s looks older than I thought it would. It really does. It looks so old. The cars look like they're from eight decades ago. Like I don't know. I'm so surprised. Even up to like the late nineties. Yes. Like if you watch a movie. And I was born in the late nineties. From 99, early 2000s, it still looks like it was filmed in the early 80s at night. Like the cars didn't change till like mid-2000s. It's crazy how technology just advanced so quickly. Like it was very and then it exploded. Yes. 100%. No cell phones in this movie. Yeah. ⁓ The town says that he drinks blood, which I thought was funny. They were like, is he a vampire? Yep. Yeah, no point of reference for this man. Okay, the other thing I thought was so I don't know. when the Joker falls into the vat, yes, and then his skin in this movie after that is white with lipstick on. So like the vat gave him lipstick. Which I think is so funny. And so when like my husband came downstairs at one point, he's ⁓ yeah, he puts that makeup on. I was like, not in this version. He like paints over his white and red face with like his skin tone. Flesh tone. Flesh tone. Yeah. Brown that's supposed to be more normal. Yes. So that was interesting. I'm not sure if the red lips comes from the acid or when he tries to get surgery from the surgery. That's what I was wondering too. I think so. But because the poor man with all the instruments and that like creepy. And then he showed he shows like this is what I had to work with, and it's just like rusted nails. Like I'm just crazy. So creepy to think of like that was his only option. Obviously, he wasn't gonna go to a real hospital because he's a villain and he's on the run. ⁓ ⁓ but yeah and I was re-looking up because again movie magic obviously we know Jack Nicholson isn't white like that so the idea they had to create a white paint that they could then add the brown over I was thinking all about that because there's a point where he wipes off the brown and the white is showing and the white stays. Yes practical effect. Yes, I was like, how do they do that? And I was thinking, I was like you could put white on the washcloth and then wipe it and then you could add I was like trying to figure out all the ways they could do it. So clever. So what I read was they had to create almost like a sealant that went over the white that was oil-based. Okay. And then like painstakingly apply the brown onto it. Wow. But then when he would just wipe the brown, whatever he wiped the brown off with was not strong enough to remove the sealant from the white. That's so interesting. Yeah, okay. I was trying to figure that out. Like movie makeup magic. I like your idea too, though, that you're actually adding white now. Yeah, I was like, you could do it that way. Removing the brown. Yeah, that's brilliant. You have that creative I love it. ⁓ I liked all the mimes. Yes. He does different lips when he's with the mimes. Yes. They're like qu they remind me of like Queen of Heart. Yes. From Alice in Wonderland lips. Uhhuh. Which was fun. And then he has his commercials where he's just on the TV and he keeps taking over the TV and telling them I'm killing you. Yes. Like if you use the products, you're going to die. Yes. Like he's sowing that fear and anxiety. Which again I think was supposed to make him more unsettling and scary and it just comes off as silly now. But like you said, it was cool when you see how they take that and they don't wear any products. Right. Right. And it's like super affected by this. And we're all like frozen in fear. Yes. that The bowl of popcorn. So there's a bowl of popcorn. ⁓ when Batman's gonna tell her that he's Batman. Yeah. and in the in Vicky's house, and the Joker interrupts them. At one point, the Batman and the Joker are like talking. Yeah. And Vicky grabs a bowl of popcorn and hides behind it, and then starts eating the popcorn while she's watching them talk. And I thought it was so funny. She's like literally- Like invested. Well what's funny is like reading a lot about it, I don't know any background to that choice. Yeah. That's not one of those scenes where like I was like, Where the p it's ⁓ it's on her mantle. She has a bowl of popcorn on the mantle. I like, where did this come from? Why did she pop it? Is been sitting there? So many questions. I bet we could Google it specifically and be what's the deal with Vicky Vale eating the popcorn while Bruce and Joker go toe to toe? Yeah. He also pulled out an N ninety five mask at one point and I was like, How can you have that in your trunk? I thought that Yeah. And ⁓ And it was in Vicky's car. Yes, I don't know. So why did she and how he how'd he know it was there? I don't exact thought and I can't remember his name now, the other reporter guy. Yes, I don't either. Vicky's friend. But yes, when he puts her in the car and she's like rolling up the windows and he goes in the trunk. I thought the exact same thing. I don't remember ever seeing an N95 mask until me neither. I guess if you're a painter or you do something, you yeah, I guess I guess I've seen yeah, with like woodworking or something. But but just ha knowing that it there was Be one in the trunk for this exact scenario. Yes. Yeah, it was interesting. And I do think there's a little continuity error that her rolling up the windows would keep her safe. Yeah. Because every car has ventilation, hence how like the air conditioning works. True. And I'm like, she's just sitting there plain face against the glass, like, hurry, hurry. And everyone's dying. And I'm like, I do think the gas would be seeping into the car. And then she opens the door at one point to like talk to her friend, and it's there's still gas in the air. I know. That was one thing that really stood out to this time. Of like, I don't know that. should be safe. No, without taking a ⁓ her jacket or something to try to like protect herself. Yes. awesome. Any other things that stood out to you? I liked the gun at the end that how long it was. Yes. And it telescopes. Yes. And to shoot down the the back plane. Yes. Yes, and because it like telescopes, it's off center, so when he's holding it, it's a little bit wobbly. Yeah. And it makes it seem a lot and it's it's not like it's a shotgun, it's like a I don't know about guns, but it's like a small gun just with a really long Yeah. It's handgun that then has like the multi layer thing. Yes. And I just thought that was really funny. Yeah. And then it's practical. That's just where my heart lies. She also kept taking her heels off. It happened three times where she took her shoes off and I like, She needs to wear different shoes. She's so uncomfortable all the time. Well one thing I thought though was like, I don't know if you're a Jurassic Park fan. I ha Yes. Okay. I've seen it but it's been a while. The newer ones with Chris Pratt and I don't know if I've seen the newer ones actually. Okay, yeah, the Jurassic World ones where I apologize, I am totally blanking on the redhead actress's name who's fantastic. But she gets so much criticism or the movie gets so much criticism because she wears her high heels throughout the entire movie. ⁓ Because she has them on for a business meeting at the beginning and then you know the park security fails and the dinosaurs get loose and she has to like run with him further along. Lives for the rest of the movie, and she never takes her heels off. ⁓ So I think I have this like it almost feels natural that Vicky would like have her heels on for a certain reason. And then take them off. And then take them off like intuitively. Yeah. Like either because she's flirting with him or you know, in the a lot of times even though she's walking up the stairs, she just can't deal with that. She's like, I'm not messing with these. But then in the end, when she's like running for safety, I kinda liked that piece of like, I'm not gonna fuck with these heels. Yeah, true. This is like the end of the days. Yes. People are falling dead. Around me, fuck these. She likes to take her heels off and runs. And it was interesting at the very end, she the Joker's dancing with her and she's not into it. And then later on, Batman and her are hanging from a thing, and it kind of looks like they're dancing. They're like swaying. ⁓ that's a good idea. And I thought that was a cool comparison because she's a lot happier and of course. It parallels what just happened in a way. Well, and one thing I also liked about how Kim Beachinger plays it in this movie is she seems It feels very realistic. Yes. Like there's one part where Batman is saving her, and I can't remember exactly what's pre The predecessor to that scene, but it's the first time he like shoots his little repeller thing up, asks her how much she weighs, picks her up and they go. And she makes this face like she's just so exhausted from all this insanity. And then at the end, too, when they're hanging off the building and then they're falling, and he shoots the repeller thing up and catches her, she just makes this look like she even puts her face in her hands. Yes. This has been a day. And I just love It's so relatable. Yeah, yeah. She's like a superhero, right? And so she's another human being who's swept up in this and I just love how realistically stressed she seems by trying to survive. Yeah. Getting pulled between Joker and Batman. Yes. And Joker basically trying to kill her, marry her. I don't know. He likes is obsessed with her. Yes. So maybe Joker's just an incel after all. Yeah maybe. That's the real twist at the end is that he was just a lonely white incel. Uh-huh. ⁓ okay anything else? ⁓ That stood out to you you want to touch on as we're winding down? ⁓ not really. here's a little thing. It's not very deep, but her house ⁓ is so fancy, and she was just gone. I don't think she's from there either. I agree. At the beginning, she shows up and she's like, I'm here to visit to do this Batman thing. And then you go to her and she's a photographer, and you go to her house and she lives in this gorgeous, like how did she get that house? I don't know that I'm Photographers don't have that money. I mean. I guess if she did for Time magazine. Maybe. Okay, that's fair. That could be true. Like when and how did she get this beautiful apartment? Yes. And well furnished. So this is interesting. I don't remember that little detail that I love nitpicking sometimes. I do too. How wait, how does this work into the larger story? Yeah. Unless maybe she was from there and had been gone for like a couple years. Maybe it just seemed like when she was introduced at the very beginning, sitting at that guy's desk, that she was visiting. Was the vibe I got. I think you're right. Like she's in town for work. And yeah, she has this fully furnished apartment late 80s. Yeah. Yeah. Very dated. All of the architecture was gorgeous. And the whole movie, all of the like the desks with the evil guys, and you would see like giant windows with statues in the background. It was very, very pretty. Which I think is also very Tim Burton. Yes. Like you said, the theatricality of it is very consistent across his whole thing. It's so cool that Tim. I Tim Burton. Same. And I should not know that he did not buy all of his stuff. Really speaks to me. same. So I guess watching this now as an adult, is there anything you think would have hit differently if you had seen this as a kid? Honestly, I think as a kid I was stubborn. I think I would have not liked it because principle. Of principle. Yeah. an example. I didn't watch Lord of the Rings until a couple months ago. Loved it. When I was a kid, my family wanted to watch Lord of the Rings one night. I really wanted to watch Princess Protection program. I don't even know what that is. ⁓ it was like dim ⁓ Selena Gomez, some Disney movie. It was interesting. Not great Disney movie. ⁓ but we watched Lord of the Rings instead. And so for the entire Lord of the Rings movie I sat backwards on the couch. Wow. I was so committed. So I think I would have just been like I don't like Batman because it's not cool. I don't know. It's not me. Like. I mean, I get that. I think And I was a little more open-minded now. Yeah. You would have been ten toes down, I'm not here for this. Yeah. So I actually maybe it's better. I also didn't used to like action movies as much as I do now. Yeah. ⁓ it was good that you got to see it. Because I really like backstory and character develop which you get all of that, but it's just glossed over more in this. It is very light. Light again, I think, because this was the first iteration of that. And almost every time Batman's been redone, you get more. And so, like, I personally love, like, love the three with Christian Bale that Christopher Nolan did. Okay. Christopher Nolan is like one of my favorite directors. Okay. And again, it takes the darkness to another place. He's also a very, very big practical effects director. Cool. Which for the mid 2000s to now I think was really going out. ⁓ and he brought it back. Yeah. And so I highly Recommend watching those three in order because of his attention to detail and because he I don't know if he knew he was gonna get three movies when he got to do the first one. Okay, it seems like he did, it seems like he had this grand vision. So you get ⁓ that's cool. The entire first movie is the entire origin of Batman becoming Batman. ⁓ like he's not Batman until like maybe the last 30 or 40 minutes of the movie. ⁓ cool. So you get, I think, a lot of what I think I would like you would like. And then if you stick with it, you get the gadgets. The toys, incredible action. Yeah. Because I just want to know like how everything I think is made and like you know and he does give you that. That's cool. So his version is literally like how did they even make the Batmobile? Yeah. Like from scratch. Yeah. So I think you would totally jive with that. And then again, Heath Ledger as the Joker is a once in a lifetime performance. Yes. It's excellent. Okay. I'm so excited. You'll have to watch all of them. Please, I want to know what you think. Yes. So I guess. Maybe I'll come back for like the last one and we can do like a all of Batman. Or at least, I mean, I'm telling you, there's like so how to How many are there? So there's the two with Michael Keaton. Then we have Val Kilmer with ⁓ Nicole Kidman. Then there's the really terrible one where This is really putting my trivia on the spot. George Clooney becomes Batman. And no offense to George Clooney, because he's amazing. That that movie is insane. It's so ridiculous. If you think this one is cheesy, I don't know what happened in Batman 4, Batman and Robin. then we had a big break, and then we get the Christopher Nolan's Batman Begins, Dark Knight, Dark Knight returns. No, that's not the right title. There's the third one that I'm forgetting. Those are excellent. Excellent. Like Oscar winning, fantastic. Amazing. Then we get the crossover with Superman where ⁓ Ben Affleck became Batman. That movie's unwatchable. Wow. I think. It is horrific. And I think there's two. Okay. With Ben Affleck as Batman and it's so bad. And I think part of the reason, at least for me, is it's the other swing where the CGI is just so over the top. ⁓ yeah. And I I can't do it. Yeah. Where it's like if we're having a fight that spans like I'm throwing you through eight buildings across town and we're still fighting, and we're not ever addressing how many like civilians. We're killing, I I just I'm out. Yeah. Like it's so un I mean, it's all unrealistic. But the unrealistic is so high. Yes. That it's just all computerized and we're fighting a villain that's like not even here, some space alien. I just I don't care. Yeah, that's fair. And then they redid Batman again more recently with My gosh, my brain. The guy from Twilight. ⁓ What can I do? Robert Patton's Yes. Okay. Thank you. So he's the Batman. ⁓ And Zoe Kravitz is Catwoman. ⁓ okay. And it's a complete reboot. And it's very, very good. Okay. And it's about to get a sequel. ⁓ cool. So what is that? Nine? I lost. Wow, probably. Yeah, there was all. There's so many. ⁓ there's also Lego Batman. Yes. Which I have seen. You have? Well, I've seen the Lego movie, I should say. You've got to watch Lego. Is Lego Batman in the Lego movie? Or maybe I've just seen the Yes, and then you gotta spend Off. Okay, I've I've met that voice actor. and he did the Batman voice. So I was just I did a why can't I remember his name? ⁓ I can't either. Will Arnett. Yes. Will Arnett, which I knew him from ⁓ Lego Masters. I love Lego Masters. Yes, for sure. which came after he played that role. Yes, apparently he's been the voice of General Motors for 27 years. I didn't know that. Had no idea, but I was doing a show for General Motors, and he was like a guest speaker, and at one point he he does the voice, but he's like general mode. No, no, no, no. And it's not very much like I'm Batman. Like that might be the greatest for her. So you have to watch the full Lego Batman. I do, I do. Especially now that you've seen the original, you'll get all the references. Yes. And there's even a part where like in the Lego version, he comes home and his mansion, you know, is so big and Alfred leaves him some food and he's all by himself. And so he's just like he takes a whole Lego lobster and puts it on a plate and puts it in the microwave. And he's just like hanging Out by himself, but he's really lonely. Like that's the point. They take the story and make it, I think, very heartfelt. Uh-huh. And he's just like rapping by himself because he wants to really be a rapper, but he doesn't know how to like break in. So he's just like a by himself in his mansion eating his giant lobster. Uh-huh. And then he'll break into a rap. And like, I think I've just seen the Lego movie then. Yeah. Yeah. So it's the spin-off of the Lego movie on his own because he was so good. Yes. I actually used to have a Lego Batman shirt, and I'm trying to do like my shirts for the episode. Yes. I tore my closet apart this morning. I might have already donated it at some point. ⁓ But I couldn't find it because I love Lego Batman so much. Well, I do like your shirt. Thank you. ⁓ but definitely I would say as some homework if you're open. If you have three Christopher Nolan, Christian Bale ones, and then we can do a follow up of just those three because they are deep. Yeah. So well done. Like cried, like made me cry because they're just so human. Where this is again can't be compared to that. Yeah. ⁓ but ⁓ I'll watch all of them. I've watched, I think, all of the Friday the 13th movies. ⁓ there's a at least 10. If not more. And then there's like Freddy versus Jason. So then I had to watch all of the Nightmare on Elm Street movies. And then they go in space. They go to space. They go to Manhattan. Yes. They're on a boat. I there's I love those. They're just okay. Yeah. So I'm like, I'm down to watch all of the movies, is what I'm saying. So I'm feeling confident. Yes. Absolutely have you back. I love this. I would love to have you back too. We'll have to do maybe like some I'm already trying to figure out who's gonna watch some scary movies for October. I like scary movies. Okay, perfect. So we have to find you some that you haven't seen though. Yeah. Some of the s I haven't seen Halloween well, actually, is that true? Which one is Halloween? Jamie Lee Curtis from the 70s. I have seen it. The original Final Girl. Never mind. Yeah. She's great. She's got it all. I have to think about it. All right. Yeah. So as we're wrapping up, what image or moment from this film do you think will live rent head rent free in your head maybe a week? Ooh. I just really like the mimes. I just thought they were so funny. Yes. ⁓ maybe that and the bat cave itself. Yes. Because I've again like Mermaid Man has his little cave and I've never seen the Bat Cave and there were bats in it. I know. And it's such a great set piece. It's such a great set piece. Yes. It's just done so well. Agreed. ⁓ it's like a secret lair and you can see when he goes into it at the beginning, you see there's like a window or a mirror, yeah, two sided thing. So he's like watching them in that big Room with all the statues. Yes, I love that part. You're making fun of him. Yes. And then he walks in. Yes. Yes. And just all of his stuff and that part's so funny. Kind of crazy. Yeah. you already mentioned one of mine. It's the extendable gun that the joke pulls out. I love that scene where he shoots down the plane, and again, it's like the miniatures for the practical effects. But what really got me this time, and maybe it's just I don't know the state of the world, but when we finally see the bat signal at the end, yes. I like got so emotional. Okay, I did too. I had goosebumps all over my body and I was like, this is why I love movies. I just went, wow. Yeah. It's the perfect ending to the first movie. It is. And it's that symbol of hope of like now we have a plan if we're ever endangered. I really thought that was sweet. Yeah, and I mean again I've seen this so many times in the Well, I was waiting for the bat signal to happen because I knew it was a thing, but the way they introduced it was just so touching. Yep. And it leads into the second one beautifully. Aww. Yeah. With him and Catwoman. So all right. So I mean I think that's pretty much it, unless you have any final thoughts. I don't think so. Okay. Yeah. The movie 10 out of 10. I was gonna say it's exciting to have you see something you hadn't seen before and it land so well. I love the concept of this podcast. ⁓ I'm so excited. It's been a blast. So, one other thing I'm ending every episode with now is ⁓ what's a movie that you love, love, love? Yes. That maybe I haven't seen. Have you seen all the Studio Ghibli movies? No, I haven't seen any. ⁓ my god, okay. Where do I start? Spirit It Away. Okay. Start with Spirited Away. ⁓ I first saw that. My aunt showed it to me. loved it. I love it so much that I have tattoos. So I have ⁓ the little Soot Sprites from Spirited Away, and then from Princess Mononoke, I have the forest spirits, and I walked down the aisle at my wedding to a song from Howell's Moving Castle, which is another one of the movies. I love Studio Ghibli. Okay. So it's like animated movies. Yes. They're done really, really well. I've I'm blanking on the guy's name, The Animator. Yeah. But he's he's like a genius and he's retiring and I think he wanted his son to do it, but his son's like not really into it or something. Or maybe he tried. I'm not sure. There's a new one that I haven't seen yet. Okay. ⁓ it's like the boy in the sky or clouds or something. ⁓ But this is a great start. But yeah, I recommend Spirited Away as your first one. 'Cause there's a lot of great characters in that one. Okay. I love it. This has been fun because I'm building up my own homework. Yes. So we'll do a handful of these, you know, where I'm interviewing other people and then as I'm getting a list from all of you Going to do my homework and then we'll kind of do round twos. love that. And then you can ask me questions. I was hoping for that. Yes. Okay. So we'll flip the script. So Lexi's ⁓ recommendation was Mean Girls. So that's my homework. Yes. Mean Girls is great. Having her back at some point. So you haven't seen any of them? No. Okay, wow. Yeah. So I I am making my homework list and I'm committed to there's so many great references from Mean Girls. And that's what she was saying, too. It's like it influences so many things. So it'll be good for me to watch that. And I'm very familiar with Studio. ⁓ I've just never seen any of them. ⁓ and I know like the type of animation I've seen, all the still images, and it's beautiful. I think it just kind of flew by my radar. So this is great. I would say spirited away, and then if you love that, Totoro is the next one. I would say no matter I think personally. There's no order to them, they're all separate stories, but ⁓ got it. But it's like recommendation is that order. I th I mean I just started with spirit 'cause Spirited Away, that's what I started with. Yeah. This is great. They're all different, but yeah. Awesome. Yeah. Alright, well, I hope you all enjoyed our ⁓ newest episode. ⁓ getting another fan into the Batman lore, which is I consider a mission accomplished. ⁓ but please follow on Instagram, we're available on Spotify, Apple, and YouTube. ⁓ like, comment, let me know what you're thinking, and can't wait to have more amazing people on to talk about more amazing movies. All right, bye. Choo!