Caroline: Hey Paloma. Paloma: Hey Caroline, how are you? Caroline: I'm well. How are you doing? Good, good, good. Paloma: I'm doing well. Yes. Just surviving in this heat. Caroline: Yeah, my God, it's miserable. It's miserable. It is. It's welcome to late summer in the south. Paloma: Yeah. I think the the temperature the air temp today in Houston is like a hundred and two, but the heat index is a hundred and fourteen, which is crazy. Like you just can't be outside. Caroline: I had tennis on Monday morning earlier this week and I've been lucky all summer in that it's either been overcast or cloudy or for most of the summer when I've been here Monday mornings it has been very pleasant and we've been very thankful. Well this Monday I really, I thought at one point I was like, is this, am I having like a heat stroke? Is this what, is this Paloma: No. Caroline: how this starts? Cause I was like, listen, stop hitting the ball. Guys, either hit it straight to me or we're done. Because I Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: am not, I cannot, by the time we were up on an hour, I'm like, I cannot run. I had already poured two cups of ice water straight on the top of my head. Ha ha ha. Paloma: Well, it's crazy because I feel like the heat just drains your energy. It just zaps it all. It's so crazy. So I Caroline: I I Paloma: I can only imagine chasing after a tennis ball for an hour in that heat. That would be intense. Caroline: my gosh. my God. It wasn't even like there was no pride. It was just like, mm-mm. Sorry. Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: Somebody else, you know, like somebody get the point. I don't care. I am not running in this kind of heat. Like when I'm already completely spent and exhausted. It's just not important. The points are less important to me, like winning. become secondary. But Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: but anyway, I think that's that's I I remember last summer towards the end of the summer it getting really bad like this too, which makes me Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: want to call in and fake some illness or scheduling Paloma: Yeah Caroline: conflict or something. Paloma: Well, I mean, you realize why everybody that can go away for the summer does. I mean, Houston really Caroline: For sure. Paloma: I mean, so many people end up leaving. but you know, there are those of us who have to stay back and work. Caroline: That's right. That's right. Including me. Including me. Okay, tell me what's Paloma: Yeah. Me too. Caroline: your high and low this week? Paloma: gosh, well, I guess my low would be this heat, you know, just I feel like I it's it's hard because I enjoy being outdoors and I feel like in the summertime y the pace is a little bit slower, like you would have the time to go for a leisurely walk after dinner, but it's just it's just too hot to do it. So we're just sort of confined to being indoors. Not that that's like a news flash. I mean that's nothing different from any summer I can recall for the longest time. and then my high I've had some downtime. So I had I don't know how much I'll talk about it, but I had a procedure. I had a surgery last week, a week ago. And I've just had some downtime recovering for the last week. And it's been kinda nice to just like disconnect and have some slow time and read and Caroline: Yeah, for sure. Paloma: catch up on T V shows because I never get to do that. Caroline: Right. Paloma: And my family's been doting on me, so that's been really nice. Yeah. Caroline: That's great. Yeah. That's really wonderful. And you're doing good, recovering nicely through the woods. Paloma: Doing well, yeah. Yes, I think so. I mean everything's g going smoothly, recovering well. the pain is tolerable. So yeah, we'll Caroline: Great. Paloma: see. I don't know I don't know how much I'll talk about it. I feel like we're we're pretty open on this pod about lots of things and I feel like maybe we'll get into it on a sub stack or something at some point. I don't know how much I'll talk like how much I'll share, but I've never been a closed book before. So I'm just not ready to completely talk about it 'cause it's still so fresh. But yeah, if I fe if I seem a little bit more low energy today, that that's why I'm still in a little bit of pain and Caroline: Sure. Paloma: you know, just getting accustomed to some things. Caroline: We'll give you a pass. We're just glad you're here. Yeah. Paloma: Yeah, I'm glad to be here. I'm actually I'm I'm I would say, you know, that's part of my high is feeling well enough to have done this 'cause originally I like, Caroline: Yeah, yeah. Paloma: I'll have to take the week off and no, I felt well enough to to do it. Caroline: The miracles of modern medicine never cease to amaze me. Paloma: That's right. Caroline: Okay, so my high and low this week is last I'm gonna start with my low and work my way right into the the high. Last week I had something called TechNec. Okay, so this Paloma: no. Caroline: is the this is the scientific, you know, diagnosis that I got off of both TikTok and Instagram. We're on the same page with this. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: And helping me to self-diagnose that what is going on here is tech neck. And it's this muscle that connects the vertebrae in your neck to the Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: base of your skull. Paloma: Okay. Caroline: And it gets, it can get irritated from doing too much dustwork, too much typing, Paloma: huh. Caroline: and looking at your phone. For me, it was more, it's I don't know about y'all, but we have been flat. out pedal to the metal, wide open, nonstop work. And Lou's been Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: out of town. I've had all this not being in the office. So when I'm here, I've been working at the office until like seven or eight o'clock at night. And Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: and all of a sudden by Wednesday of last week, by the time I got home, I was like, man, I have a splitting headache. And I thought it was sinuses. Because it was these nerves coming around my eye. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: And the next day I had to go home from work early and lay down, which did nothing to help it. It it just like aggravated it. And it just Paloma: Hmm. Caroline: kept getting worse. on Thursday morning, I went to the chiropractor. I sat in the sauna. I took a hot bath. Like I was doing everything I could to try and make my headache go away. And I don't have migraines. And it was like clearly coming out of my neck. Paloma: Hmm. Caroline: And I went to work for a while and then I had to come home and like just rest because I just couldn't take it. Same thing on Friday. It was starting to get a little bit better, but I went to the gym and the instead of working out, the guy like stretched my lower body because it was like maybe this'll help you if you stretch out your lower back and all that kind of stuff. Anyway, started feeling better, but by the time I got home from work about eight o'clock on Friday night, it was killing me still again. Paloma: no. Caroline: So, but the good week is my favorite thing in the whole world in the summer. is to A lay in the sun. I know Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: that's a hot take. but it feels good to me. I mean, it's just something my physiology. And number two is to get in a cold pool. Now in Alabama, around these parts, by second week of June, you're not going to find a cold pool. Everything's going to be warm, soupy hot. Paloma: Yeah. It's soup. Yep. Caroline: But this year we have had So much rain. I'm so done with El Nino. So done Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: with El Nino. Tired of the rain, ready for it to move on. All the rivers and the streams are full up. We don't need any more rain. And here comes another this big storm like you were talking about. It's coming at us. But because we've had so much rain, when I I thought I'm just gonna go get my body really hot and just jump in the pool anyway, the pool was really cool and fresh. And So I did that like I'm gonna say about four times. By the time I left the pool, my neck, like I at one point felt it like pop, it eventually released, and man, I was feeling better. So I've been feeling great since that time, but Paloma: that's good. Caroline: I've been real sensitive about how I sleep and also trying to not look down at my phone, like not be on my phone, Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: either be on my iPad and set it up and do all that kind of stuff because I mean, you get that little muscle irritated and it can really be debilitating. So Paloma: Yeah. Has your trainer talked to you about like working out your traps? 'Cause apparently we store Caroline: Yeah, I do that. Paloma: a lot of tension there. I wonder if that's related at all or if that would be helpful. Caroline: It was not in these muscles. It's not Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: in this. It is a it it's a it's hard to say. It's a little muscle that goes from the side of this vertebrae to the base of your neck. And it it really is this. Paloma: per the American medical journal of TikTok. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Of course it is. Caroline: That's right. That's right. Which so you know it's right. Don't even question it, Paloma. Don't even question it. It is not, but I I mean, like last night I had an issue with my traps and in the gym today we did some exercises to strengthen and loosen that up. But this was this was just my neck. So we put a heating Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: pad on my neck and then he stretched out my lower back. So anyway, feeling better. Yeah. Paloma: Well, I'm glad you're feeling better. Yeah. I'm I mean, I feel like there's always something. There's not a day that goes by where you're like I mean, at least for me, after a certain age, where I'm like, I am operating at a hundred percent today. Everything is firing on all cylinders, you know, like that's rare to feel like perfectly well on all fronts. Caroline: Yeah. Yeah. I usually I feel I feel lucky in that I usually feel really good. And that's fortunate for everybody around me because Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: you know everybody knows it when I'm not feeling well. But Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: I'm not a napper, I'm not a snoozer, I'm not a go home from work earlier kind of person. and so when I'm like it's three o'clock guys and I've got to go. Because I cannot take it anymore. I've got such a bad headache. You know it's a situation, but it's like I need everybody to know. Paloma: Yeah. That's bad, of course. Sure. Caroline: Like y'all don't even talk to me. Don't ask me to cook dinner. Don't ask me what it is, where are we going? What are we doing? I'm out a hundred percent. But anyway, okay, Paloma: Mm-hmm. Goodness. Caroline: lit you have been working a lot too, and you got a fun project. You just got back from New York. Paloma: Yeah, I did. so I went to visit a longtime client. We've worked on several houses together. their Palm Beach home is on the cover of my most recent book, The New Classic Home. and I've done some work Caroline: yeah. Gorgeous. Paloma: at their house in New York and their daughter's former apartment in Tribeca and so we recently reconnected and We're doing some additional things at their home at New York and finishing that project, which is super exciting. It's a beautiful home, gorgeous location right on the water on Long Island. and then the daughter's apartment, she just got a new place in Soho, which is really cool. It's really well done. The former owner was an architect, so the bones are fabulous. And then we're also doing a couple of little things for my client's mother, who is the most Together, in shape, with it 97 year old you've Caroline: Mm. Paloma: ever met. I mean, she works out like five times a week and not Caroline: Nice. Paloma: only is she physically with it, but just like mentally. She's Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: so lovely and so charming. I adore her. so we're doing a a very small project for her, but it's just so fun. I w I was talking to you about this offline. when you get to do something that's like multi-generational f within a family, you know, we've done Caroline: Yeah, yeah. Paloma: this before where We've worked with a client and then eventually like the children are old enough that you end up doing the kids home. so that's happened before, but to simultaneously be working on three generations of the same family's homes is really special and I feel like it's just such a testament of our relationship and the Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: trust that we have in one another and certainly not something that I take for granted. So really fun. Caroline: It's funny, you you mentioned that and I said that I didn't think I'd done that. But as you're talking about it, it's like, what am I talking about? I have a client who it was a good friend first. Her father had moved back to town, bought a Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: a condo, and she was like, Will you help him? So I helped him put his condo together. And then she was like, I told my mom she needs to hire you. So I went and worked on her mom's house, which is in my book. And then Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: she was like, okay, now it's time to do my house. And now, so that her mom and her house are both in my book. And now her daughter, who's in high school, is gonna be our intern this fall. So we've got three generations as well. Paloma: how fun. Yeah. Caroline: She she now wants to be an interior decorator. And so she's gonna come work with us this next year. They have a co-op program. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: At the high school, and she'll be co-oping with us all year next year. So I'm excited about it. Yeah, it is fun. Paloma: That's awesome. That's so great. Well, totally. And you know, it goes back to something that we've touched on on multiple episodes, and that's I guess the the issue of fit, you know, finding the right fit, whether you're the client or the designer, and how relationship based these well, how how important Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: I guess like a a fit is in these relationships between client and designer, and when you get it right. this is sort of the result is you have either multiple projects with the same family or it becomes multi generational or, Caroline: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Paloma: you know, friendships come out of it. So you really have to find the right person for you and when it works, it works. And I I feel like that's like s such a beautiful and lovely and fruitful part of what we get to do is to really become a part of people's lives in this way. Caroline: Yeah. And I think being able to really see your clients, you know, to say Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: to to know them well enough to be like, but you're not gonna want that in the thing because of X or what have you. And Paloma: Right. Caroline: they you are able to develop so much trust because they know you you've got them. Like you're thinking Paloma: Right. Caroline: of all the things for them and you know them well enough so that they can just relax. And I think I find and I'm sure you find it. to be the case. The longer we work together, the less involvement my clients have because Paloma: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Caroline: they're just like, you just you just do it. Like yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Paloma: Exactly. Yeah, they know you get it and you you understand there's like a shorthand that you understand between one another and they they know that you're gonna take care of them and that that's, you know, your top priority and so they just let you run with it and that's the absolute Caroline: Yeah. Yeah. Paloma: best. Caroline: Yes, absolutely. Really fun. Okay. Well, we have a fun thing that we're gonna do today. this will really get your spirits up, I'm sure. Paluma. Paloma: Yes. Caroline: So we there's a little thing going around TikTok, five things that are worth it. And Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: so we're gonna go through ours today and then This is a great time if you are not following our Substack, if you are not subscribed, if you want these links and you want to see what these products are and check them out yourself, you are going to have to go to the Substack and check it out. and it is the install edit and on Substack and you it comes out on Fridays. And Paloma's really at the helm over there working through the substack and getting it Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: up and up and going. Paloma: it's the install edit at Substack. you can just Google that and you'll find it. We've also linked it in our Instagram profile. so you can find it really easily. We're also as the posts come out on Wednesdays and Fridays, we're publishing them on Instagram as well, so you can find the links very easily. today's post, as a matter of fact, has gotten a lot of conversation going. We talked about Where Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: have all the blue hydrangeas gone? This is a post that Caroline wrote and people have a lot of opinions. Yeah. Caroline: I knew people were gonna come in. Paloma: People have had a lot of opinions, a lot of ideas, and obviously like there's some regionalities that come into play. So Caroline: Sure, sure. Paloma: there's a lot of fun topics that we discuss at length and it's been really fun sort of digging a little bit more deeply into things than we can in the podcast. Caroline: Absolutely. It's a lot of fun. I'm excited. I'm really enjoying it. Paloma: Me too. Caroline: so if you're not subscribed, please go and do that. And also, let me just take a little time out and a little commercial for the old install pod over here. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: We have broken through like a numbers barrier, but I was doing some research on our podcast and I'm proud to report, Paluma, that our pod with our statistics and all of our streams and downloads and everything puts us in. the top five percent of all podcasts currently. Yeah. I know. Yeah. Thanks guys. Paloma: That's amazing. Go us. That's awesome. That's awesome. Well, thank you to the listeners for tuning in and subscribing and downloading, rating, all of that Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: helps us a ton. Caroline: It really, really, really does. And if you have not subscribed, rated, reviewed, downloaded, or do the automatic download, those things really, really, really, really do help as we're trying to get this fledgling pod off the ground. We're only four months in, but Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: we're doing good. but we, you know, we've got a long way to go on this thing. So all of the help really helps. And I will say too. I met somebody at Starbucks, like two Meredith, I think her name was. two mornings ago, I was talking. They there's a 90-year-old Scottish couple that's at Starbucks every morning that I speak to. They are so delightful. I just love them to death. They're so friendly and they speak to everybody. They kind of everybody they hold court. Everybody speaks. Paloma: Love that. Caroline: And I was speaking to them, and it's how you meet everybody in Starbucks, really, because The they all come to speak to them while you're standing there and Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: they introduce everybody. And they said, Do you know Meredith? And I said, No, I'm Caroline. She said, I know you. I just finished listening to your podcast just now. It was like, Paloma: amazing. That's awesome. Caroline: wow. And she wasn't like, I know your book or I know your work. It was like, I know you're from your podcast. So that felt really good. Yeah. That was good. It should have been my good week. Paloma: That's so cool. That is great. Yeah, we've gotten some really nice, really nice feedback. I feel like the topics we're discussing are really resonating with people. It sounds like the listeners tend to really enjoy the variety of topics that we talk about. I mean, there really isn't anything that's off limits, yes, at its core, you know, we're both designers and design and beauty are such a big part of, you know, our daily lives and inspirations and professions, but we Talk about all the things we would talk about if we were offline, just two girlfriends chatting. Caroline: That's right. Paloma: And I think that people really enjoy that and identify with it. And we've loved hearing your feedback. If there's anything you want us to, you know, Caroline: Absolutely. Paloma: chat more about, we we would love to hear any suggestions or questions as well. Caroline: Yes, anytime we get an email, we send it to each other and put it on the put it on the schedule. So just know that we see you, we hear you, we want to hear from you, and we wanna be responsive because it just makes it more interesting. And I mean, Lord knows too, we can't it's better when these are authentic questions that come from people, Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: their actual authentic thoughts of here's here's something I wanna know. So I really love it. Okay. So without further ado, Paloma, why don't you kick Paloma: Yes. Caroline: us off with five things that are worth it, according to Paloma Paloma: Okay, well, Caroline: Contreras? Paloma: five things that are worth it. I feel like it was hard to narrow it down to five because I guess that's just the consumer in me. So maybe we'll add some bonus bonus items on the sub stack, but my top five things that I think are really worth it, I would say, are monthly facials. I do think that that makes a big difference. we talk a lot about like beauty and maintenance and that kind of thing. And in my mid forties I feel like those monthly facials have made a big difference for me in terms of the way that I'm aging and just maintaining my skin laxity and quality. so I see somebody here in Houston named Deborah Michelson at Bella Vernova and she is fabulous and does a lot of like facial massage. It's a very French technique. She has some really cool machines as well. So I think that's really worth it because it makes a difference in my skin quality. And it's also you know, it's just like me time. It's a it's a little time out for myself. I really love my aesthetician, and so I get to chat with her for an hour. so that's really nice. And then something that I do at home that I really enjoy is my Therabody face mask. So my LED mask. Caroline: Mm. Paloma: And that one I like in particular because It has more coverage. It has more lights than most of the other brands have. it has red light and blue light. And it also does like scalp massage. So I find sometimes if I have a headache and I put the massage feature on, that really helps. So that's something that I think is totally worth it. I am a complete and total convert to Crown Affair and their hair products. I started out using the volumizing shampoo and hydrating conditioner and have basically branched out to use most of their their line their hair like the I guess signature hair mask that you use in the shower and then there's also like an overnight repair mask that's a leave-in serum Caroline: Mm. Paloma: a leave-in conditioner the dry shampoo there's a bit the hair oil there's a lot of stuff that I use I feel like It's really made a difference for my hair. So I not please don't judge me by today because like I said, I'm recovering from surgery. So not washing it and styling it as I typically would. Caroline: It still looks great. Paloma: but that I think is really worth it. another thing in our house that is worth it is French butter. Margot Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: is a butter snob, and I feel like just like good ingredients in general. I'll you know, just sort of I guess like a little Ina ism. Take it from my girl Ina Garten. She always talks about like the good mayonnaise, the good butter, the good olive oil. Like it really Caroline: Mm. Paloma: does make a difference in the final product. So we love a good salted French butter. And the last thing I would say is a s having a signature fragrance. I think signature fragrance both personally like a perfume that you wear Or a signature fragrance for your home, be it a candle or a room spray, I think is a worthwhile investment just because it's something that is very experiential. it's funny, anytime we see Mark, he'll always be like, I smelled you before I saw you. Like he'll know that I was coming off the elevator because he recognizes my perfume. Caroline: Ha ha ha Paloma: and you know, it's always nice like going into someone's home and they've got some candles burning and it just, you know, it sort Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: of sets a nice ambiance. Caroline: No, I totally agree. I had a signature candle and then they discontinued it. And I keep looking for them on the black market, and it's it's out of commission and it makes you really Paloma: no. Caroline: sad. Kind of like your Chanel loose Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: powder or press powder. Press powder. Paloma: What was it? What candle? Caroline: It was what do you call it? The French company, not diptyque, but the one that's on. Bull of our And the name of it is Proletaire is the fragrance. it's in the dark green, yeah, with the Paloma: In the dark green. Yeah. Caroline: crust on it. Seer Trudon. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Seer Paloma: Yeah, why why can we never think of things? Caroline: Trudon. And it was the flavor, the the aroma, the scent. Proletaire, it was gorgeous. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: Absolutely loved it. I bought all that I could find and I can't find any more. And they don't they don't seem to make it. But yeah, no, I totally agree. Paloma: It's such a bummer. It just you know, I feel like any time that happens, I like to tell myself that it's because fewer people have refined taste and so the b the good stuff gets discontinued because the masses just they don't quite get it, you Caroline: Mm. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Paloma: know, 'cause I'm like, Why would you discontinue something that's so amazing? Or like that smells divine, but I guess not enough Caroline: On the Paloma: people are refined enough. Caroline: It's funny too on the French butter because I had seen a thing come across my desk Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: of a technique and something to do, which I love it as well. but before I left Paris, I went to La Grande Epicerie and bought Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: eight big things of French butter. And Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: then I put them in the freezer so that they were rock solid, and then I put them in my carry-on luggage the morning Paloma: Right. Caroline: took it out of the freezer the morning that we were leaving. And then when I got home, it was still cold because you know it's cold down in the cabin underneath. I mean, it could Paloma: Yeah, mm-hmm. Caroline: have sat on the runway for like hours and we would have had a total mess. But I had them in Ziploc bags. But I brought them back and put them all in my freezer. So I'm taking them out one at a one at a time. Cause and I really love it when it has those little salt crunchy crystals in it, you know? Paloma: Yes, me too. Mm-hmm. It's so good. Caroline: I really feel like I'm getting something when I come across one of those little crunchy salt flakes in there. Okay. Paloma: I mean, there's nothing better than like a piece of cr crusty French bread with salted butter on top. It's just the best. Caroline: Yeah. Absolutely. And my I to the like I said before, if you have a teenage daughter, she is gonna check you on everything that you do. And when I got home, she was like, What is your deal? Why do you need so much butter? I was like, I Paloma: Ha ha ha. Caroline: got it for us. She was like, You got it for you. And I was like, Paloma: Ha ha ha. Caroline: No, I got it for us. It's for all of us. You're the one who's in here making cinnamon toast every morning. Don't you want it with like super nice Butter, but I digress. Anyway, something to look forward to, Paluma. Paloma: Yes. Caroline: It's delightful, actually, but it is funny. okay, so my first stop thing, and I may just throw a curveball in here and add something and Paloma: Okay. Caroline: take something out on the fly. but first stop is Dr. Diamond's medicine. I really Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: You know, I love to try products and I'm always on the hunt for products and trying them. I know it doesn't work for all skin types. To wit, it does not work with your skin type. So this Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: is not an across the board. But I find the trio has your serums and your lotion and your pre serum, whatever it's got three things. When you put all those together, you're spending less than you would for If you tried to do all of those products in something like La Mer, and Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: I've seen but much better results with Dr. Diamond's medicine than I ever did with La Mer. And also find La Mer, even because you have to like warm it up and do all that kind Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: of stuff, and then it doesn't either feels like water or it's not really spreading. It's a little clunky to me, even though I get the the pristine nature of the ingredients and Like sometimes when you're working with something so fabulous, you really have to be more accommodating in mindset of how you're going to use it. But Dr. Diamonds, we don't have any of those issues. I feel like it works great. I've really seen my skin come around, although I have added in a estradiol cream, which may be making all the difference. I don't know. I'm afraid to take either one of them out. But anyway, so I find Dr. Diamonds works really good. This is not a paid promotional. This is just those products I think really work. The number two is I we've discussed I had to get rid of my parabol because it broke. A wheel came Paloma: Yes. Caroline: off of it and like completely busted out. And I wanted another Parabol suitcase, but they have gone out of business. So I had to find another option. And I got the Ramoa polycarbonate version. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: And it is so great. I've got a couple of reasons why it's better than Parabol. It's not better for the environment. Okay. And it's a little bit more expensive, but not that much more expensive. Okay. But it is shiny and dark, and it really doesn't show the scuffs like the mat does. So they Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: really figured something out when they went with that shiny and dark. And now I suspect we're going to start seeing everything coming off the conveyor belt is going to be this shiny polycarbonate. Just watch for it. I bet. That's my prediction. because Paloma: Hmm. Okay. Caroline: it works really well because it's very, but it's very lightweight. It is a lot bigger and yet the same size. I don't know. I don't know how they do that, but there's a lot more space to pack on the inside. Paloma: Nice. Caroline: And I mean, it has been with me through three European trips and it still looks brand new. So it's worth the money. Yeah. Paloma: That's a big endorsement. Yeah. I mean, for it to not be beat up after three long trips like that is great. Caroline: It looks fantastic. It's got this little tracking card. I mean, we all throw, you know, anybody can do that. That's not something special for them, but they have their own that like tracks their bag. You just like register it Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: when you and you can log into the app and and it tells you where your bag is all always. So you don't have to remember to throw your tile in your suitcase. Your suitcase has a tracking device in the little thing. So so that's nice. Paloma: Very cool. Caroline: not worth buying it for that. I mean, that's just something that they do. It's the other things that have me sold on it. Okay. Next up is a row, belt by the row. A plain, basic, no logos, no labels, quality, Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: understated belt with a quiet, nice buckle. People don't invest enough money in belts, I don't think. It's hard. to throw some serious coin at a belt when there's so many other things that you need to buy. I get it. This Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: is why this is something that I often ask for at Christmas, even though I Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: always am kind of blue the next day, like, woe is me, I only got this belt for Christmas. But the rest of Paloma: Huh. Caroline: the year is really great when I throw it on. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I got this belt that is so it they are so nice. And I think that really elevates anything that you wear. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: And I've slowly like every year try to add one to my collection so that I have like the right belt with everything. It takes a minute and you can't go out and buy them all, but I think going for something without a label makes a huge difference. I used to have a Celine belt and I used to have Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: well, I still have it, and an Hermes belt, but I've gotten to an age where I don't want to have anybody's logo on my body. I Paloma: Yeah. Yeah. Caroline: and so the row, I think, you know, there's some good ones from Kate, but I think Kate is really much more trendy, so that you might Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: Find in three years from now, nobody wears that belt anymore because it spoke to a moment. You're not gonna have that problem with the rope because there's just nothing about these belts outside of quality. Paloma: Right. Caroline: Okay, next up, the Margot tea by Lissette. Okay, so Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: this is a seventy to eighty dollar white t shirt, which is like all we gotta do is, you know, like drop one drop of coffee and we're out, right? I mean for me, I I'm I'm I'm the worst to ruin something white. But the fit and the quality, the sh just the fit for me. I'm always looking for a white t-shirt either to throw on with a skirt in the summertime or to wear under like a V-neck sweater or my blazers and slacks in the fall. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: it's really only a lead in the summertime. And you know, but The thing about this shirt is I probably have 20 white t-shirts that I've collected over the years. I keep trying to find one, kind of like my blue jeans collection, that it actually Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: works well and I've stopped. Like this is the best because of the cut on the where it hits on my arms. It's not too Paloma: Okay. Caroline: high and it's not too low. There's not too much bulk. Because if you get a lot of bulk, then you can get it all up underneath your arm, particularly Paloma: Yep. Caroline: if you're trying to wear a sweater or something, or wear a blazer. You can have too much width on that sleeve. It can be too long and it's hard to tuck in, or it can be too short and it comes untucked, right? Or Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: like a little bit of midrift shows. So this is the right length, it's got the right volume. Is they have put so much thought into this t-shirt. It is a real winner, okay. Paloma: Wow, okay. Caroline: So check it out. It's worth the eighty dollars. It's worth the gamble. Paloma: Well, and I would say like the little white t shirt is probably the equivalent of like finding the right shade of white paint. It's something that seemingly is so simple, but Caroline: Yeah, so personal. Yeah. Paloma: it takes so much research because just the smallest deviation, as you said, can either make it like the perfect fit or not. So it sounds like they've really put a lot of thought into that one. And I know Caroline: It's a Paloma: I know that you love your white t shirt. So I I feel like if Car it's been vetted by Caroline: Honey. Paloma: Caroline that it's a winner. Caroline: It is. I and I I truly do have a stack of I've tried everybody's white t-shirt over the years. And this is by far the best for all of my purposes. you know, Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: I'm sure like if you're twenty-five years old, this is not the t-shirt for you, but it's a great one for all the rest of us, ladies. Paloma: Ha ha ha. Caroline: So all right, my fifth and final is gonna be a real hot take. And I don't know why people out here in in the world in Instagram can't leave Tracy Anderson alone. But Paloma: Ha ha ha. Caroline: My Tracy Anderson streaming subscription is worth the money. A hundred percent. I've had it for seven or eight years now. No, it was during the pandemic. So it's six years. And I did it before. And if you grew up dancing, if you like, there didn't used to be sports for girls. Okay, so if you Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: wanted to stay active in the afternoon or your mom wanted you to, you had to like take ballet where I was from. That's l either ballet or gymnastics. My mother wouldn't let us take gymnastics because she said we would develop muscles. Yeah. Paloma: Your body, yeah. Caroline: She was like, Women don't need muscles. Now listen, I don't agree with her. Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: She never really exercised a day in her life. I mean, she had like one pair of kids ever. She was in a tennis shee wearer and she had one yellow sweatsuit that I remember that she threw on with those kids and went to one jazzer size class. But outside of that, so it's a different concept, but she wouldn't let us Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: do gymnastics. Okay. So it was either PE and I every day after school, really the her babysitter is she took me and my sister to take ballet. And we took ballet By the time I quit, it was tap ballet jazz and point five days a week, every afternoon for like two or three hours, we were doing dance. And so if Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: you've ever, if you have and there's so many girls in Gen X who are that same way because that's just Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: it wasn't a soccer team or volleyball or stuff organized after school for girls. So there are a lot of us out here. And if you have that background, it's because you're gonna have a lot of muscle memory. But people love to hate on Tracy Anderson. It's she's the only person that I know who's out here every single week doing four different routines. And I it's not a routine, but it's she changes up the exercise and she's a real student. And it like Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: she's real focused on your spine. And your spinal alignment and keeping all of that strong. And the young girls do it for their bodies, but I'm out here doing it so when I'm 85, I can get up off the floor. You know what I'm saying? Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: Like it is one of those things that in addition to l lifting heavy weights, it is the thing that some people like yoga, some people like Pilates, whatever, where you're lengthening and twisting Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: your muscles. and then strengthening them when they're in this lengthened and twisted, you know, torque situation. and I think it's like $95 a month for the streaming. And Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: I mean there's not a better bargain out there as far as like Paloma: Well, when you think about what a class costs, like if you were going to a you know, private or semi private class or even a group class at your local gym, you know, you would get to that number in a c you know, a class or two. Caroline: But they I mean, the every time I turn around, I guess I'm in that algorithm. There's somebody out here wanting to hate on Tracy Anderson. And I wish they would leave her alone. Paloma: Well, she's been around a long time. I mean I I remember when she first came out, it must have been twenty years ago. It's been a long time when she first started. I don't I don't remember if it was like with Gwyneth. Yeah, like it must have been was it with Gwyneth that she came out? Madonna. Okay, so she had her studio and then they were their students and then eventually Gwyneth invested Caroline: It is s seventeen years ago. Seventeen years ago. Mm-hmm. Madonna and and Gwyneth. What mm-hmm? That was when Paloma: and talked about it a lot on goop and then it blew up. Caroline: Because that was when Gwyneth was newly married to Chris Martin and they were all in London together that Paloma: Chris Martin, mm-hmm. Yeah. Caroline: moment in time. And there's that iconic picture of the three of them walking down the street together, Tracy, Paloma: Uh-huh. Caroline: Madonna, and but and I think it was maybe it was Gwyneth and she introduced her to Madonna who was doing her tour, her big Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: tour then. Yeah. Yeah. Paloma: Yeah, I I I did Tracy Anderson years and years ago. I haven't done it in a really long time. I remember liking it for all the reasons you listed. Yeah. Okay. Caroline: It's evolved. It's not the same thing that it used to be. Paloma: I mean I remember her mur like j really focusing on working small muscle groups and all of that. I think, you know, she gets hate because she's tiny and like her boobs are out and people are like, this is not like y did you get like that with your exercise routine or were you naturally that way? And I think there's probably like people criticize, you know, the injury rate. I guess you can get yourself injured somewhat easily. Caroline: Well, you can get yourself because you're doing it at home and you're maybe not doing it right. You know what I'm saying? But she puts a lot of money. Paloma: Right. And that that's any exercise. Caroline: Yeah, she puts a lot of money in making instruction available for every single Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: There's 15 minute instructions on exactly how to do each move. so that's I mean, there's some value right there. Paloma: Yeah, that's amazing. No, it's a it's a Caroline: but it's those boobs, those fake boobs, and Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: honey, she's got the worst taste in clothes. I mean, so it just kind Paloma: Yeah. And the hair. Caroline: of makes her a lightning rod. but the exercise is legitimate. It is great and Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: It is very good for longevity and strength, Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: overall strength. And I've been in the studio and done the class. I've told you that's the most humiliating day of my life. It was hot in there, honey. Paloma: Ha ha. Caroline: I couldn't take it. But that doesn't mean that this streaming thing that I do at home and I call Tracy Anderson is not fabulous and worth the money. Paloma: Yeah. Well good. And I you know, so much of it is finding something that you enjoy. I Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: am not an athlete. I'm not someone I will say this has changed as I've gotten older. I I would tell you, I would have told you years ago that I didn't enjoy working out or exercising. I really do enjoy it now. Like when I have Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: the time to do it at the you know, in the middle of a session, at the end of a session Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: Even if my legs feel like jello because I've worked them to exhaustion, I feel great. I love that hit of endorphins. I love knowing Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: that I'm doing something that's good for me, that's good for my longevity. So I've come around. Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: but yeah, I'm a big proponent of, you know, find what works for you, find what you Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: feel is enjoyable and that you look forward to doing. Cause Lord knows like time is a premi at a premium for all of us. So if that you know, checks all your boxes Caroline: Sure. Paloma: and more power to you. That's great. Caroline: So I'm not doing it to try to make my body look like Tracy Anderson's. I'm doing it because of how I feel when I Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: do it, when I'm finished and how long that, you know, lasts. Whenever I've had, and I do it four days a week. I really, I and I just Paloma: That's good. Caroline: because it because of how it makes me feel, just exactly what you said. Okay, so those are my five, and we'll link those in the sub stack. Paloma: Yes. Caroline: Okay, so. New collab that I'm crazy about that's coming out. I think actually they're having a dinner that coming up here in Birmingham. I'm excited to go to. And that is Wheezy collaboration with Lee Jopha. Have you seen it? Paloma: Yeah. I have seen it. It's really pretty. They have a couple of different Caroline: Gorgeous. Paloma: patterns. we use a lot of Wheezy for projects. I have Wheezy in my house. I feel like it's a great quality, great price point. you know, generally with towels. I I tend to like a white towel with some sort of piping or monogram and so they're only gonna look regardless of the brand or how much you invest, they're only gonna look fresh and crisp and bright, you know, for so long. You do have to replace them Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: after a while. So I feel like for the price point, Wheezy is a total winner. So we love them and I know they've done several collabs over the years with Peter Dunham. I think we have some Peter Dunham fig beach Caroline: Mm-hmm. And Meg Brat? Paloma: towels. McBrath, I have a couple of their Gracie hand towels that they did a few Caroline: Mm, mm-hmm. Paloma: years ago that were really pretty. So yeah, super excited to see all of the different pieces in the Lee Joefa collection. Caroline: Yeah, I I love a printed towel. Paloma: Yes, I know you do. Caroline: I I used to do white with trim and and and monograms on them. but you know, we this just just like all my lotions and potions, always wanted to keep moving. It'll be something else next, I'm sure. Paloma: Mhm. Yeah. I love I love that about you. I feel like we balance each other well in that sense 'cause you love to try new things and I am very much a creature of habit. So you you push me, which is good. Caroline: Yeah. Okay. Also, another collaboration is Laura Laura Piano. No, I always because it's O and A, it's Paloma: Lauro piano. Yeah. Caroline: and I'm always like, no, it's Piana instead of piano, because it's not a piano, it's the name. So it's Paloma: Ha ha ha. Caroline: Laura, but I always trip over it. Laura Piana. and the Manil collection, which you Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: out in Houston, this is a big deal. Paloma: Well, it's they just came out with this brilliant marketing campaign. It's beautifully Caroline: Mm. Paloma: done and the premise I guess is as if Laura Piana was going to visit the Demonille family. And so they have done some editorial, some video content as well in the Demonille house, which is this beautiful modernist house in River Oaks. Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: designed by Charles James, the dress designer actually, the fashion designer. it's a beautiful and iconic house and so the clothing, the palettes of the clothing are very reflective of the palettes in the house. And then they go to both the Manil collection and the Rothco Chapel. The Manil collection was designed the building itself by Renzo Piano, an Italian architect, and it opened in 1987. I remember when it opened and going to visit as a young child. And then the Rothko Chapel I didn't realize actually came first. It opened in 1971 after Dominique de Manil had commissioned Mark Rothko to to Paint a series of canvases to fill this chapel, and they are all done in this sort of inky purpley black color. So they're very somber. it's a very moving and striking experience. It's vastly different from what you would imagine Rothko's color studies to be, which usually have more vibrant colors. These sort of Caroline: Mm. Paloma: pull you in. but those colors, again, also reflected in the Laura Piana collection and it's just a really interesting way, I mean, I think to sort of merge fashion with culture and this iconic institution and family. And, you know, for me it's pretty cool because it's you know, five, ten minutes from my house. So it's Caroline: Sure. Paloma: really interesting to see that they would select, you know, a an artistic institution here and build a whole campaign around it. Caroline: Sure. I love it when brands such as a fashion brands Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: tend to be the ones that bring us all along on a art Paloma: Right. Caroline: history journey, right? The Roe does this, Dior does it, Chanel is doing it. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: and it's really beautiful. I really love it. It helps remind everyone of the value of fine art, you know. and Paloma: Exactly. Caroline: how inspiring it is and and that can be kinda easy to forget. You can quickly fall into a loop of like balancing priorities You're always gonna have to make a point for a priority for fine art, which it it is exceedingly valuable and So I'm just I'm always glad when these big brands that have the platform and they have the money and they can bring Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: the culture along with them on a little h history lesson, you know. Paloma: Yeah. Well it's a it's a great way to disseminate that message to a broader audience because I feel Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: like so many people are tapped into fashion and fashion is such a tangible art that, you know, whether directly or indirectly, I mean if you go back to like the original Devil Wears Prada and that scene where they have the two cerulean belts and, you Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: know, sh sh Miranda Priestley goes into the whole monologue about how important that decision was and who made it and why and the trickle down effect, you know, I think when you tie actual culture to a fashion movement, it has the opportunity to reach so many more people. Caroline: Sure, sure. And then it does themselves that it does their brand a a service because it wordlessly says we have the most exclusive tastes. If you Paloma: Right. Caroline: want good taste, I'm gonna teach you something about art history that you didn't know. And that's what we do over here. We're pretty, pretty highbrow. You know what I'm saying? Like, so it's a win-win. Yeah. Paloma: Yeah, it's signals authority. Mm-hmm. Totally. Caroline: Absolutely. Okay, so we have a listener question. What are your tips and tricks for getting scale correct on various elements such as lighting, lampshades, furniture, rugs, etc.? What do you think, P? Paloma: you know, I don't know that there's like one hard and fast rule and so much of it is instinctual. but I would say if you were to utilize one sort of general truism, I would say you always err on the side of things being slightly bigger than too small. So like the rug should always be big enough for all of the furniture legs to sit on it. So you certainly don't want a smaller rug, you know, even though it might fit, you want to go bigger. For lighting, I feel like that's a big one where I see scale can really be off. you want to ensure that your chandelier, your pendants are substantial enough in scale. You never want anything to feel kind of Rinky dinky and like too tiny, too small, where it's like comical lampshades, especially when people do custom lampshades. If I can see the harp, it's too small. You always need to go bigger. Caroline: I don't wanna see this socket. Paloma: No, you don't want to see the socket, you don't want to see the harp, you don't want to see any of it. So, like it's always gonna need to be slightly bigger than you think. And it's interesting because that's a tricky one. I feel like the dimensions for Custom shades tend to be slightly different than those for standard shades that ship with your piece. So you're Caroline: Mm. Paloma: always gonna want to go slightly up versus going slightly smaller because I I mean they just look ridiculous to me when they're too small. So Caroline: Yeah. Paloma: generally, I mean, again, I think it's just like training your eye to understand when the proportion feels correct. and that's not necessarily like an easy tip for me to to give to someone where it's like, okay, do X, Y, and Z and then you're gonna get it right. I think you really have to sort of study things that Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: feel right. Maybe that's looking through books or magazines and figuring out like what feels right, what feels off. but more often than not, I think you have to sort of skew slightly larger than ever going too small. That always feels like a mistake. Caroline: I am not sure. I think you know, one of the main reasons that you would hire a decorator is for this right here. This Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: is like the thing that you're coming to a decorator for because those those these are the things that are the hardest to get right. You know, like I think you could Paloma: Yes. Agreed. Caroline: have good taste, but be challenged on scale because it's hard to predict, you know. Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: some things that I can tell you from just getting started. all the girls in my office can do CAD. I mean, like we are CAD whizzes up over here. We're we are ginning up a CAD every 15 minutes. Every time I turn around, I mean it's like we can throw it in CAD and I can see the scale now. Okay. So Paloma: Yes. Caroline: I have techniques and mechanisms at my fingertips through the people that I hire. That I can figure all that out. But before I had that, for instance, when I was building my house and I was still practicing law, and James Carter was the architect. And James, unlike most architects left, is from the old school and he hand draws everything. And there are these beautiful plans, but he doesn't run the computer programs. He does everything Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: by hand and it's they're just gorgeous. But between the two of us, we were trying to figure out. how big to do the pendant in my stair hall because there were three sizes. Paloma: Right. Caroline: And so what I did is I did, I took three large boxes and I did cardboard cutouts that I did the cross Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: thing. And we had somebody get up there and hold the three different sizes up and in the place so that I could see the size in the space to make a decision. which size to purchase. I Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: I have also measured, I've gotten graph paper out and I've measured and laid things out before I had CAD when I was very before I even opened my practice. I would start with graph paper and a measuring tape and measure things and just plot it out so that I could make sure that things would fit. And I will say lampshades, we we mainly Do custom sometimes we buy things from like Fermoy and the shade shop and places like that that have ready made fabric Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: shades that we use most everything else is custom, whether it's card or not. And we do spend a lot of time working on lampshade dimensions. I think that takes a deft hand to get a lampshade right. And I I'm not a huge fan of any lampshade that comes with a lamp. Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: I just I feel like they're all a drum and they're just kind of like You can have a fabulous lamp, but it kind of falls flat if you just put that Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: linen drum on top of it. that's just Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: me. That's for my design. So I'm so I spend a lot of time on lampshades. But anyway. Paloma: I thought of one other thing. So, you know, I think in terms of scale, there's the size, but the thing that maybe people don't always realize is the volume also. So like length times width, but also like you were talking about the lantern, just the volume of the space. And you can Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: sort of start to see that if you're building a new house, if it is, you know, if the house is Once it starts to get sheetrocked in, you get to feel the volume, you know, this Caroline: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Paloma: the the real sort of overall feeling of the space. And the same can be said for furnishings. And I think it's very different to look at it in CAD from a bird's eye view than it is to see something in elevation. Caroline: Mm-hmm. A hundred percent. Paloma: I think you also have to really look at things in elevation to make s sure that they make sense. with one another, like one piece to the next. Caroline: Mm-hmm. Paloma: and I know Alexa Hampton and I think David Neto have famously posted, they do these like Alexa does Sharpie sketches in elevation. And Caroline: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Paloma: David, I wanna say, does the like blue tape that he measures out in the space where like they Caroline: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Paloma: will measure everything out in elevation, tape the room out with the furnishing so you see like, okay, the nightstand hits here and the headboard hits here and you see the relationship from one piece Caroline: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yeah. Paloma: to the next. And I think that's another part that's super important beyond just like which size is appropriate. But yes, these are the things that you go to your designer for. It's a lot to figure out on your own. Caroline: That's a good point. We do I do that around here all the time. I'm always grouping random pieces of furniture or office equipment or different things to assimilate a situation when I'm challenged to like how is this gonna feel? Like, how big is this Paloma: Mm-hmm. Caroline: actually? How is it gonna feel this close to this other piece of furniture? Or what can we do to approximate, take the measurements and approximate it in the space? And it tells you. So much. You know, you can look at the measurements. They don't tell you anything. Get your measuring tape out, measure a table that you already have. And when it says, like, you know, that this table height is 26, and then you notice your kitchen table is 29. You're like, mm, mmm, that's too short, you know, Paloma: Yeah. Caroline: or this is 13 inches longer than my sofa right now. And that's gonna be too big. I mean, like, you can use things around you. And take the measurements of your proposed item and begin to piece together how it's gonna work. it'll tell you a lot more, honestly, than trying to drum up your own homemade CAD drawing. For sure. That's right. That's right. Paloma: Yeah, Yeah. but I feel like if you have a designer in your wheelhouse, you know, on your side, then that's always gonna be a lot better and more foolproof 'cause there are so many, so many measurements, so many different things to take into account. Caroline: Yes, that's what you that's what you're paying for when you get a designer Paloma: Exactly. Caroline: or somebody to figure all that out for you. Okay, well, I always love being with you. I'm so glad to see Paloma: Likewise. Caroline: you healthy, happy, doing great. And Paloma: Thank you. Caroline: I hope you have a restful week in your recovery and all goes really well. Well, I hope it's a great Paloma: Yes. All right. Caroline: week. Get some rest. We'll see you next week. Okay, thanks. Bye. Paloma: Thank you. See you next week. All right, bye.