Sina: Hello and welcome to Nicht Dein Typ Frau, the podcast in which we real stories of real women. It's that you turned dear ones. Today I'm here with the dear Natia Lensen. She the founder of Many & Nanny, a very well-known babysitter agency. Natia is a really cool life story today with lots of learnings that she with us. And of course, as always, our section where we read out the stories and our opinion. And we will do together and comment And yes, hello Natja, nice that you're How are you? Nadja Lenssen: Hello Sina, I'm fine. Thank you for the invitation. I was really forward the evening with you. It's great to your podcast. Sina: Yes, totally. We had such nice conversation and I think that fits very well. How are you? How was your day? More cozy or chaotic? So far? Nadja Lenssen: Yes, it definitely warm. I'll later, but I in my old shop today. I out a little bit and support the new owner. And I all day today. It was also super, super warm. But I am completely relaxed and enjoy my life that I am leading now. Sina: is actually... I myself that How does the name come about from Manny and Nanny? From your babysitter agency? Nadja Lenssen: I Mennie is the male Nennie. And that was us because of all gender stories and that we into this equality. Was that a topic Many people think that Nennies But the main reason is that we teach Nennies and many Nennies. Sina: okay, verstehe. Ja, Nadja Lenssen: You Sina: cool. Cooler Gedankengang. Ja, total spannend. Nadja Lenssen: It's great when young men go to school take and add value to And that's where equality starts for us. Sina: Absolutely, total. Nadja Lenssen: Yes, well what does many men It's definitely not 50-50. I would say Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: that 10 % of applications are men. And it's unfortunately also problem because many families like to want women. Sina: I can imagine that it's the other way around, that the men have with a lot of prejudices and they don't get like that. It's a real shame. Nadja Lenssen: But it's full, because there is so much empathy nowadays. they are us, so my children are already mid-20s, have been that they no longer these role models as extreme as it used be. And that's really Sina: Absolut. Nadja Lenssen: a great topic. And we know that when kindergartners or teachers and in elementary school, the children And actually for everyone it is a wonderful situation. Sina: I hope that this change more and more, that we more more men and that the society will open Nadja Lenssen: Yes, and is good for children when they different relationships and they are male or female. That's just wonderful. Sina: Yeah, total. Okay, Natja. Do you to bit about your life? I don't even know where to start. Maybe you can start where you want Nadja Lenssen: Mm-hmm. Sina: to I don't the story yet. We just talked roughly and I'm just really excited to hear it. Nadja Lenssen: Okay, I'll to structure a I'm Nadja Lentzen, I've 25 years and founder of Manynanny, babysitter agency, When I at my life I that four stations have Each one of shaped my view of family, responsibility, myself and freedom. Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: The first big decision in my life was that I fled from the GDR Through Hungary. And this decision Sina: krass. Nadja Lenssen: was Sina: Wow. Nadja Lenssen: so huge that it had huge impact and changed And once you have experienced how much courage you need to such a decision, later on big decisions. or the risk of size. Because Sina: Mm. Nadja Lenssen: this flight was so big that you can even top And that's how falls to in life, or me it's easier to make other big decisions in are often also existential, but never have a range as this one decision back then. Sina: Wow. Boah, Natja, Nadja Lenssen: You Sina: du flecht mich ja gerade komplett weg. Boah, das ist ja hammer, ey. Also da ganz, ganz großen Respekt. Wann war das? Nadja Lenssen: That was in 1989, before the border opening. We hadn't yet expected that it could an association. Sina: Klar, weiß man ja nicht. Nadja Lenssen: I didn't want to in that system. me, freedom has been very important. That was for me... I was just about I if I risked I might to live Mm-hmm. Maybe. Yeah. I started my friend on Friday night. He had a car. We had a visa we two days spying on the border and saw how to over Then saw that they were basically looking And Sina: Mmm. Nadja Lenssen: we could without them firing. It was through Gorbachev, who had just all the chains from Russia and then we went beginning of end of June, I don't even exactly anymore. Yep. Yes, that's true. It was a break for freedom. If that works, then all decisions will They are but it's not to be You And then came the second important station in my life. I to the labor office and wanted a job. I tried to the system. They then that I should an apprenticeship. And before I start should an apprenticeship so you can on something. I went to the savings bank and a banking training there. That was the next blueprint for my life, because it me to I understood that money is never just money. There are possibilities behind financial independence. I understood on how economic security can and how important it for a self-determined life. And that has me whole life. So, through this training I in this western system. I have understood how economy works and I have noticed that money will always me freedom. That it is only this East-West with freedom, but this training has actually shown that money will the key to your freedom. Sina: Very, very cool. And that's a topic in podcast here, the topic of independence, especially with women. A very, very important topic and totally exciting that you your basis there. And of course, very, I don't know, that was probably in the 90s. you an understanding of financial products and what money can you Nadja Lenssen: Yes, that's crazy. And because I was alone, and I an older network, it was Sina: Stimmt, du warst eigentlich ganz alleine, ne? Nadja Lenssen: even more significant what freedom actually to And if you always in fear that you can't pay that you... you under financial pressure, it you down that I can to anyone, to to yourself and to with this topic. And are now quite a few women who are in this financial bubble. Sina: Yes, there are also just so cool content creators, financial schools for women. We definitely already on that. And it's just such an important topic that that women just gain control and just up knowledge about finances. It's really exciting that you confirm that this a very important pillar in your career. It's also really exciting that you back to the topic of First, freedom from GDR, but also the same time this financial freedom. Nadja Lenssen: In the GDR, was lot of equality. Mothers and fathers worked And here it was apparently that women didn't with finance in the And that we Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: now fight not only for equality, but also financial freedom. Or what do you it? Fight. That we work it. That we simply, no matter what the topic is, to deal with decision-making options. And that brings up the topic you just mentioned, which is freedom. These two things we should preserve. We should to decide And this decision is always easier when we financial power. When we independent and this freedom. That's these the ones women to financial education. and also say that it's never too late and that's Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: right. That's something very important. And fortunately I relatively early, because I Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: anything this Western economy or didn't know about That was of a very important step in my early life. So yes, actually the first point here. Sina: Yes, totally. Also really the crazy cut from GDR, then really, communism, then into total capitalism and into the bank. Nadja Lenssen: Yes, exactly. But I wasn't aware back But I it relatively quickly how good it was. I was that there was who me the right direction. Sina: Very cool. Totally. And what's next? Nadja Lenssen: And then the third stage in my life was that I had my own sports business for and the time three children. I raised and me there never the question of career or family. What is more The question did It was clear that both had work so that we could In the end, it because I had created Of course, kindergartens, were daycare were schools, there huts. And had the flexibility of my own company. I could about my time. And that was basically the next step towards freedom, towards financial independence. Then was about time. How do I my time in life and how can I these two great things, earning and being with the role of And then I also realized that this structure alone, which I in the background, doesn't everything, because I was still constantly organizing. Who's up the children? What happens if someone sick? How I my appointments? How do I my company stable My head was always one step ahead. Back then, was no thing as mental load. It was just everyday life. Later on, found out that there is even a term for And some point you have go to yourself and you have a very honest thought with yourself that changes By realizing that all this stress, all this power, doesn't a week or a month. But realize that it the next few years. You will the next few years in this state. And I knew then that I the next few years. I for 24 hours, which actually don't in 24 hours. And I have to make on which I consciously would For example, I wouldn't be able as much sport as I actually want. I wouldn't have as much time for I wouldn't be sitting on the sofa Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: I you have a little child you know what I'm And at that moment I something very important. I can't in everything at the time. And that's a claim that you some point. You have to priorities. And everyone for themselves where the priorities go. And I had to accept that. that some things can for a while. And what helped Sina, was that Sina: Yeah. Wow. Nadja Lenssen: I knew that this phase would pass. And doesn't that the children will Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: grow up, but it's a time period where everything into place. In the next 15 or 20 years, everything in And I also knew... What I doing for? Why I getting back? Why do less? Why can't I so much time for myself or my friends? And that gave me That I became very clear that this now a section where I just differently. And today would even say that I now life Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: quite well. I was able to organize I didn't constantly under the pressure of spending even more time with my children. I tried to out my life as much possible which of course didn't always work. Today know much more that life limits. Every human being has his limits. And can more, but in this situation you stuck in and you still to do And that changed my view today. And I understood that family does only of love. What is first impulse, is get a baby, you the child in arms and your life is full of love. And actually think at that moment, Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: love is But that's not Life and family consist of organizations, of time, of responsibility. And in the end, family is a system, company. Today I often say the sentence when I talk to a family system only stays stable when the structures are stable structures we walk in a hamster wheel physically and emotionally, is almost not possible Every mother knows that. Sina: Absolutely. Nadja Lenssen: this knowledge for oneself and where I belong and with what effort I this day or I it because the energy level is for people. You should never forget that. What one woman Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: can with ease is for another woman. We have aware and that doesn't a mother or a person any worse, but it's just the reality. To accept. And exactly from this situation, for me, many many came So this will to back something else to the world. And I also aware that a sports business is a tough domain for And for one... Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: I was one of very few women in Germany who ran a sports business as a woman. I knew that I couldn't old there. The older I got, the more Sina: Mm. Nadja Lenssen: it to in this male domain and to the business so that we could all live And I knew that when my children were big and I the most school the degree, I change again. I don't want to six days a week anymore. I don't want to a place anymore. Which was great because we are through the life of the children. And I wanted to change The question was then, what do I myself from? And the only thing I knew about for and finance was how can we actually live How can we... Ha Sina: It's really hard me to you managed to I imagine it your own business, which is really intense, and then three children alone. I don't know what of you had, but they really good. You the inspiration to do that. And also what you said about this organization and that... You have to some distance, so that everything perfect and so on. no, really cool. I have it again now. Really awesome. Nadja Lenssen: Well, perfectionism a little bit. I would myself in the following way. I was someone with extremely clear structures, but I was many things, because of this many outcomes that were, I was often also scattered or then forgot something. But everything that the children, I tried to as well as possible and the children had to just come along. You have to or you can you depending on how it for everyone, you just to a network. You know, you always about you need a village to raise Sina: Hmm? Nadja Lenssen: And the village consists of many different people. Of course, of friends. For me, was very much on childcare. I invested But without this big investment, I the other things. And I've always looked at... I small means to maintain stability. I bought a house, I it perfectly, I all my money I the childcare. We had a villa-counter with old tiles and a bathroom, but nobody disturbed it. Everything that was important was the functioning of life and emotions. Sina: Wow. Super, super inspiring. Total. Und dann mit all diesem Knowledge, was hast du ja grad eben gesagt, hast du dann Manny und Nanny gegründet. Nadja Lenssen: Exactly. Because for me was important to your age, with small children, the opportunity to on long-term, Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: reliable childcare, which is very important. And I know how nice it is when the children have someone who has time for each other And of course we need public facilities, kindergartens, schools, But children also at home. They have a tough day and they need good care at home. And you can't when you work full-time. And you have to individually. I mean, Sina, you know yourself, when you work and you come home, Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: how well you are And that's for children, and Sina: Yeah. Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: we understand It's a huge difference for us mothers as or for me was a huge difference to know, hey, they're home now, someone is of them, someone them, or doing individual homework. Does my child support individually? Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: Of course, a lot of peace and lot mental load, because it just little better. Sina: we miss Nostra. I'm for also a miss in frame. I'm not a sad. I'm a party. This is mum guilt. Miss in wegschieben. And we do have shown sex. That's a sad. I'll den kinder. they're good. Genkan. When see that toll betreut werden. I'm Morgan or I'm not. Mittag or we are. Nadja Lenssen: What do you think, Sina, why do we here in Germany? The question is constantly asked Permanently about any decisions that parents make. Instead of talking about what conditions we create, so that parents can really good decisions. We are so bad in this judgment and knowing what is right and what wrong. I somehow haven't understood that women are still Sina: Yeah, also. Nadja Lenssen: so honest that we don't a conscience, or this saying, that the children are not that small Yes, of course. But we are being questioned, or we question our friends, other women, why is that actually the Sina: Absolutely, yes. I can't answer why that is. I can only tell that I wrong and it doesn't help I think you have an extreme strengthening tube through social media in the last ten years. That you have opinions... that everyone their opinion in there and doesn't hold anymore we have to free We just to the decisions of others. And it's just important that we Germany or where we live, so that we simply in Both men and women, families. Nadja Lenssen: Exactly, and way that everyone wants it, or everyone makes their own But have Sina: Can I? Nadja Lenssen: to, or we are to, clarify what every decision has to Sina: Exactly. Okay, dear Nadja. So, this story has definitely really got for sharing that. So, also very exciting learnings. But that's not all. Now comes the exciting part. We're reading a few more I two pieces and I'm excited about your assessment. And then I would say, let's go. Nadja Lenssen: Let's go. Sina: I decided that I would go back. I, 34, have for 8 years. I haven't worked It was never a big plan, it just happened. First the wedding, then job change in another city, then our first child, two years later the second. At some point, I just at home and nobody ever in quotation marks, now it's not back to It was always just next logical step. My husband earns well. We have a nice house, two cars, holidays. I don't anything I have access to our common account and can freely have it Buying clothes for the children, small purchases, all of runs without a question. However, we have simply lived next to each No argument, no arguments, but no more closeness. I even that he has or had one. And to be I really care It somehow it even more I know about a year that I am no longer happy, that I have extremely from my partner and this life. I started to calculate. Right now, where there is of recession everything seems even more than usual. Rent for a small apartment, kindergarten for two children, a car, a job that I after six years break, and that in a time when even people with professional experience are afraid to place. The numbers just don't sense. I don't any training that still up to date, no savings, no network anymore. I anyone about it because I'm ashamed. My girlfriends see a woman with a beautiful house and think I would her well. And somehow that's right. A few weeks ago I decided to stop playing with It makes me so scared that I sometimes awake and just breathe to calm So I said to your best. Be grateful for the house, for the security, for my children who a good life. Maybe... Is that just my life now? I know it wrong when I write But it feels safer than recognizing That I don't stay because I'm happy. I stay because I to financially. Not now. Nadja Lenssen: I fall. Sina: ...awesome story. Absolutely. Nadja Lenssen: What really me now is that she doesn't talk about her relationship. She only about numbers. About apartment, kindergarten, car, job, money, job break. She doesn't any love stories anymore. Sina: Yeah, stimmt. I think the love story is over. Nadja Lenssen: She only a story about missing possibilities. And question is, Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: at what point did she become unconscious? I mean, all. She didn't to housewife Sina: Mm. Nadja Lenssen: She described as a transfer, first child, second child. And then everything was reasonable decisions. Sina: Yeah. Yeah, so. Nadja Lenssen: And that's what happens. I the example is great, Sina, because... Exactly that happens outside. And this dependency doesn't from a big mistake, but from all these small decisions that women make, they suddenly into such dependency. Because nobody gets up and says, I want to economically dependent. Or... Well, Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: that's so crazy this... Nobody would make Sina: Nee, absolut, ja. Nadja Lenssen: And when will a family decision actually become an economic decision? Sina: It may always be an economic decision. You just have it. You have to deal with the that a relationship might not forever. And what's really interesting is that nothing crazy happens. Nadja Lenssen: Mm-hmm. Sina: It's not like he went way or was very aggressive or whatever. There are also many cases, but she just I was so alienated from this man because, Maybe a lot of little things. Maybe they didn't work enough but she's already at this point where she doesn't any love at She even that he even an affair and I don't care. And that's just an example that shows that we all these positions a lot before we get married and before we... children and especially before we decide to into part-time or completely out of the profession. Nadja Lenssen: Exactly, because the economic independence actually much earlier. We have much earlier. How do we to life together? Sina: Mm. Nadja Lenssen: And structures are What I can understand, is happens when you get married and a baby, which you in your belly and then it into world and then you are overwhelmed by Sina: Mm. Nadja Lenssen: this love and want to take of I also notice that women think that their work is not fun and that it something nice and that they feel lifted. And that is a trick. Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: In this example it was a trick because she lost herself in these six years. In these six years at she lost and believed that Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: she would of her job. But she... should basically make that they just to the structures. They to try to back into their profession. Who says they can't work in this profession anymore? Or who says they can't back into their professional life? Of there break. And what I also believe, if they this decision, would on their financial feet. In this case, least half a day and then extend You can from 0 100. At least try to out the are. Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: This can relationships. Because you suddenly come this small, world, and this working world again, where what you do is extremely valued. Because often household and raising are Sina: Hmm. Nadja Lenssen: It's just normal. When the children 18, they say, they are great children. But the way to the sleepless nights, nobody Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: about anymore. And all struggle you had with school and everything, and whether everything fine, it's really unimaginable. Nobody that. we can't expect men to when they home from because they don't what happened all day. That's why they go home and the woman goes to so Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: they can understand what it means to at the to to coffee at the playground or whatever. And the woman can also the situation of the man. What happens when I home and... How does the man I worked all day, I was full of maybe I had a very important meeting at the end and then I home and then he me with what happened that day. You have to different lives back and that just Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: a lot of understanding and that's communication and clarity actually. Sina: absolute. Yes, totally. I go it everywhere. I think the advice you would her is very fitting. Before she feels very sad that she is the You lack the courage to change. Change can be that you this marriage, but change can also be that you instead of just say, okay, I need this change now that I'm a job. That I part-time again in the field and then she can and from there she can again. However, be it going full time, be it out of the marriage, be it, as you already said, is a new perspective, a new taste in life, that you might change little, see things differently. totally meaningful. Nadja Lenssen: maybe herself again. You through this expansion again, that you Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: back work, other people, you other people, that opens the door. Am I ready to and effort into Because, I mean, was love there. And you can also remember love, Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: what was our What was the magic at the beginning and how can we back? Because we have two children, we something wonderful. But it doesn't that you always everything. I mean, was raised it wasn't like that either. But it definitely up perspectives. And that's a good, I think it's a great example, because I think many women recognize themselves again in this example and are now to Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: Just think How do you see your life in the next few What would you like to How can you in financial freedom? Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: Or how can you free Sina: Yes, absolutely. You lose your freedom when you financially dependent. And... Yes. I definitely say don't up, keep going. Don't up on this situation. Nadja Lenssen: Yeah, I know. Sina: Just keep going. Nadja Lenssen: Yes, absolutely. Especially if you are in such an emotionally Sina: Done. Nadja Lenssen: sad situation. The situation could also be that Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: these framework conditions are and she is totally happy. Then she just has to make that Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: she does not get into this situation and that you your partner on how it actually looks like, how I financially secured. other countries, the state That's Germany, even if at of 12 or 13. Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: And I every woman, so that they about their situation. Sina: Yeah, total. Okay, then I would say let's the next stories. Is my mom's justified or am I myself? I, 37, love my job. I am in a position for which I have I am being used and that makes me happy. The problem is I see my children, 7 and 9, barely especially in afternoon. They to school in an afternoon care center, do their homework there and I'm still in meetings. My husband also but he ends up and takes it off. For him, it's just division It's completely計算able and he doesn't it bad But in my head, the every day. I'm important moments. Do the children notice that it's who there and I'm the only one who appears If I that from a friend, would say, fair division. For me, still like failure. I ask myself, is this guilt feeling justified or is it simply burned in? Because mothers expect that they bad conscience, no matter how fair the solution is. My husband never up with idea of bad. I don't know how I'll these guilt feelings without my job or my soul for Nadja Lenssen: You Sina: I think that's a good topic for you. topic mum. He already talked it Nadja Lenssen: Yes, yes, exactly. First of all, don't about this guilt feeling. I'm that the mother describes what we want from She loves her job, she likes to both parents work, Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: the father takes responsibility, the children are well cared the division works. The family system and yet the mother feels guilty. And where does the guilt come Do you a father would the same letter she wrote? Don't you that really exciting? How often mothers judge Sina: Total spannend. Nadja Lenssen: themselves How often judge themselves How much time they with their children? and fathers after how present they are. And that's the real point. That we take this time with a lot of time, and with men, presence is just mega. Why can't we that for us, Sina: Yeah. Nadja Lenssen: that it's basically about presence? And you can confirm this really present time, when you full focus on the child, how important it which is and not this number of hours. Sina: You just quality time is more than quantity. And I feel that totally. for me it's like that. I also my job. I feel very represented in this story. I love my job and do my things, have my private projects and I just to follow it. And that's a big part of me. And my daughter will be... I'm at the moment. everything and I'm a when she's But in we have 4-5 hours. Or maybe 4 hours. And that's when I'm only for her. I don't anything. It could be that the household just down. It's just like that. But for me it's such an enormous... quality time with her. When we're sitting here on the floor and playing together and so on. I just that it's me in my life. I have everything. I have my job, I my projects, but I also this quality time. And when I... I found the parental time difficult, actually, from morning to evening. To her like Of course that's nice, but sometimes it's just so exhausting, you don't really the strength for quality time anymore, but just quantity. From morning to evening together and really exhausted. So, as I Nadja, can completely understand what you're just saying. That's just presence. And that's what I am. I'm present her That it really counts. And sorry, I don't want to about myself. It's just that I'm in this situation myself. And that it really gets Nadja Lenssen: And now it's even like I also that many mothers not only responsibility, but they often this own expectation of constantly feeling responsible. And that's another topic that men don't at all. Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: And that's for me now also a guilt feeling is not all a sign that something wrong, but it's more of a sign for and expectations we in ourselves. And that's how it Sina: And they are infinitely high. They are infinitely high, the expectations of society. Nadja Lenssen: Yeah, yeah. Sina: And you have to say, you see so much on social media, all these stay at home moms, who these perfect bread boxes for their children and whatever. And then your reality with full-time work and somehow not so much time for the child and is that okay And I understand that you are very, very questioning that. And plus ... As a mother you judged you have to to lot of But this mom-gild is fatal. think the mom-gild is one of the things that women and apart. It's so brutal, it stones in the way, whether it's about financial freedom, or about passion in job. And that's one of the things we have to And where we we have it. Endlessly. That everyone can their own models. Nadja Lenssen: Absolutely. I talk a lot about time. me, is a very important topic. Time as a mother or time for health. I think children don't as many hours They just reliable relationships. They need adults who emotionally available. They don't 24 hours of Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: presence. There is a says that children can as well when the care is high quality. Like children who only with their mothers. And we know from the binding research that children develop very well when they several secure binding persons. So a mother, father, grandparents, mother babysitter. And for me, always something very important. Binding is not a competition. So it's not about who the child has the biggest binding but it's just about that kindling, that kindling to many different people, people they can rely And that's something very, very nice. And I think that's what makes the children strong. Sina: And yes, is just very interesting is why doesn't the father himself? Why only the mother? The father could just ask that and say I only home or at 16 o'clock and they are not with me But that happens very, very rarely because is simply no expectation and never was. The expectation of a man is that he to from 8 to 17 o'clock, earns the money. And that's it. Nadja Lenssen: Well, Sina: And a woman it's just much more. Nadja Lenssen: these the old role models in which we grew up they still us. That's why we on these role models. And the young fathers that too. They want to more present. I'm to the first fathers who also mental load, because they say, hey, do I you enough or would you to introduce Often it's men who very good at who start to wonder if it's enough. It's actually exciting to see. That's why need for this change. We need men who are willing to responsibility, who don't want to the financial burden alone. We that before. We this misunderstanding. Sina: Absolut. Was würdest du, hast du denn irgendwelche Tricks auf Lager, wie man sich vom Mammengild frei machen kann? Also sag ich mal, sie weiß ja die Theorie, ist ja bei ihr, sie weiß, ich mach das alles richtig. Ich würd jetzt auch meiner besten Freundin, wenn die mir das so erzählen würde, würd ich sagen, ey das ist doch super fair aufgeteilt, top. Aber du hast halt dieses Gefühl drin, ne? Immer dieses, irgendwo drin. Wie kriegen wir das los? Wie kriegen wir das weg? Hast du Ideen dazu? Nadja Lenssen: I didn't because I few partners. It wasn't a topic. I at the dinosaurium 25 years The world wasn't that open. The other women who had such life, whether it was in single or married it's not interesting. But the women worked with me, I didn't into conversation. Everyone was so busy. my environment, the mothers were at Today I to mothers who in my agency, together their husbands in the first meetings. Most of don't this very bad conscience because they know where they belong, that they a great contribution to the family and they usually have in their circle of who also full-time or work and respect that. And that's basically about, when we stop, this bashing that we had before. when a woman says, Sina: Mm-hmm. Nadja Lenssen: okay, I just to stay What does that that's wrong expression. When a woman decides, I want to stay and that's fulfilling me completely and that's my way and we this financial security open, discussed and clarified, then that to completely okay. And just like the other person can completely okay. And we can support and women who stay and a great job are to say, hey, think cool that you go and that you life like that. I think that's the only way to this bad conscience, by supporting each other, each advice and saying, hey, cool what you're and us. Sina: So important. Okay, good. I think we've the end of the podcast. Yes, Nadja, thank so much for being there and for telling your story here. So it completely me away. So again, you rocked there, starting from the GDR flight to single-parent with three children and still a sports business and then still the independence and still new company founded. Just really, really crazy and really inspiring. So thank you Nadja Lenssen: Thank you very much. Sina: for sharing this story and thank you. And thank you for sharing your sense of stories you've with me. Nadja Lenssen: I'd to, Sina, and great that you're a podcast like Women really lot of courage and support for what they live. And as little spoiler, I'm a podcast, because I think we still to lot more and Sina: Ooh! Nadja Lenssen: lot more stories. I be happy to invite to us. Sina: Oh, yes, I'm curious. Okay, then you it right away. As soon as the project is live, Nadja Lenssen: Mm-hmm. Sina: you to it right away. And then I'll also the podcast by Natja here in the podcast description. And then can take look if that suits Nadja Lenssen: because really need these different perspectives. For all the mothers out and all the fathers Sina: Yeah, it's so important. Nadja Lenssen: out there, and for all those who are considering to start a family. They need support, need great Sina: dance canal. Nadja Lenssen: stories, and they have see that it's really always possible. Sina: So is it. Okay, Nadja, I thank you very much. All right, okay. Bye, see soon. Nadja Lenssen: Thank you