Sam Fordham: Welcome today to Ask Doctor Fordham and today we're going to do kind of a a bonus episode to a bonus series and that has to do with the book that you wrote and mentioned it in the series introduction, but that is the book I have decided and so there'll be a few podcasts, don't know how many yet, but we'll look at the book and and the contents of it and Maybe even end up doing a a couple of them that would be useful for training. And that's again the idea is this the book that you did, the I have decided that has to do with training decision advisors, right? Okay, Keith Fordham: Right. Sam Fordham: so that is that's the plan anyway. if you go to Amazon you can find all of Keith's books are there. The Evangelist, The Heart of God And then the worth and work of the Evangelist and then the book that we're talking about today I have decided. And if you do the paperback copy you'll get that nice blue cover. if you do the Kindle edition, then it's got this other cover on it. And so that just that's just for you to to know what you're getting. But I don't have the physical copy with me. I do have the the Kindle edition, pulled it up yesterday. So Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: Anyway. The book is divided into a couple of different parts. You've got the first part there is a training the training itself, the guide for training decision advisors. And in that section you've got first there to is entitled Remember What Preaching Christ Can Do. And I think there you really delve into the idea that we ought to be expecting God to save people. is is kind of what I took away from that. The importance of being a decision advisor, the decision advisor spiritual preparation, the decision advising material and area, and so talks about the process of actually having things organized and put together, and then the procedure itself, what what a a person who's going to be assisting those coming to an altar, what they need to be doing before the invitation is extended during the invitation. the advice section it session itself when you're actually helping someone and then after that what you need to do. And so that's the first first portion of the book, first part of the book. The second part has to do with people that are making commitments to Christ and actually helping them in those particular commitments, whether they've said, I've decided to accept Christ as personal savior. Follow the Lord in believers baptism, have assurance about salvation, if they want to rededicate their life, or the process of joining the church, and there's several different ways to do that. And then also, in in I should say in most Baptist churches anyway, is kind of our context. But then answering God's call to vocational ministry, whether that's full time, part time, Or con time is another another word that's being used and tossed about today. those that may be more than just part time, some other employment, but are still still focusing on ministry. And so why I guess the first question is, well, what is the purpose of the book? How how did you come to the the conclusion that this book needed to be written? Keith Fordham: Paul Allen is the family minister at our church, family and discipleship minister. And he said, Keith, I have looked all over the internet for a book on training decision advisors for Christ. And he said, I have found nothing. And literally, I I began to look and I didn't find anything. There you have to go back literally to the eighties and they they that was kind of redone in the late nineties and the early two thousands, but virtually nothing in the last twenty five years has been written new and written by the mindset that we have today. So Sam Fordham: Hmm. just recently we had a a football stadium crusade in our our hometown area and had a had an evangelist bring his organization in and they did now they called them something else. They didn't call them decision advisors or counselors, they called them prayer partners, which was Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: which is fine. It's kind of confusing though because we had a Keith Fordham: He Sam Fordham: prayer team, but then the Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: prayer partner team was was Keith Fordham: Right. Sam Fordham: there and and and it worked all right. but about halfway through the the week one of our leaders coined the term altar assistant and so and so we in instead of having a prayer Keith Fordham: Alter us. Okay, good. Sam Fordham: partner meeting before every night to get everybody organized we'd have our AA meeting so d d d but Keith Fordham: Right. Alter a system. I like that. Sam Fordham: but I I like that I like decision advisor. again the the need for somebody to help i we'll and we'll talk more about that in just a few minutes. but you need when when you are coming out of darkness into light, just just like if you were coming out of a dark room or if you've ever been to to mammoth cave and they turn all the lights out, as soon as you come out of darkness into light, it takes your eyes a moment to adjust. for somebody that's living in spiritual darkness. and all of sudden th the light's shining and and they and they hear the call but but when you're bleary eyed and and what do I need to do now? Well you know, what do I need to do? That was the question Paul asked when he saw Jesus is Lord, what do I need to do? And so I think trying to answer that question is what Paul Allen was was saying. I I need something to help train people to help people when they're ready to make a decision. Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: now another doctor for now Keith is Dr. Fordham of Ask Doctor Fordham. I am Sam Fordham. I also have a doctorate. now I've got a a cousin that's also a Doctor Fordham, Caleb, and we'll probably have him on the cast sometime. but then there's also my dad's brother, Lane Fordham, and he's a doctor as well, but he said this. He said the great, the greatest advice. that you ever gave to me as a pastor, and Lane pastored for years, but he said the greatest you advice that you ever gave to me as a pastor was to train and use decision advisors. And Keith Fordham: What ha would happen was we would have a revival meeting and people would be saved in the service. Sometimes it would be a teenager or a child. And Lane and I would wait and go see them the next day. on rare occasion we'd go home with them, but we usually didn't do that. And then sometimes he would have to wait until after the revival and then go follow up on these people. But once he started training those advisors, we discovered that they would go home with the people the night of the revival. And oftentimes if it was a child or teenager saved, there would be one or two of the parents saved when the advisor went into their home and shared the decision. Yeah, yeah. And so the next Sam Fordham: And got to explain what was happening. Good gracious. Yeah, that's fantastic. Keith Fordham: night we would have all of them come and be presented to the church instead of waiting We know till the next Sunday or or whatever and the so the follow through was done rapidly, once he had a bunch of people trained to do that. Sam Fordham: I got you. on page sixteen, at least on the again, that's the Kendall version of the Keith Fordham: yeah. Sam Fordham: book, it says, Serving as a decision advisor is a tremendous responsibility. The eternal destiny of an inquirer may well be in your hands. The person making a public decision is saying, Help me. And so that's again Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: the the purpose of the advisor to sit there. Now we got this this picture and this is all the Keith Fordham: Draw one, yeah. Sam Fordham: all these pictures I think are in the book, but Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: you've got people coming forward during an altar call the responding and again that that is a very confusing time because there are a lot of things going on and all sorts of people making all sorts of decisions or commitments. but decision advisors are especially important in clarifying decisions for Christ and starting the follow-up for the Christian life. I'm gonna go back to that that event that we had. One of the first things that they had you do as a as a decision advisor is when somebody came down for the invitation, you partnered with them and you went and and first question you asked, why did you come tonight? What is your decision? And and so clarifying that was great. But then after the decision advisor prayed with the inquirer And they'd made a commitment. The f the next thing they were supposed to do is bring them to one of our one of our our leadership members for the prayer partner team and to have the person that made the decision communicate to that leader, this is what I did tonight. And and and again to try to help clarify. not just in the inquirer's mind but also in everybody else's mind that that decision, whatever it may have been. and then let's see, we've got this picture as well and I go ahead yeah. Keith Fordham: Well, let me give a little background on the on the picture. The North American Mission Board searched for a church that had not baptized anybody in years, and they found in Kansas City, Missouri, the Central Baptist Church had not baptized anyone in 30 years. And so they decided to try to have a revival and see if that would do anything in in the most crime ridden, dangerous part of the city. Sam Fordham: Yeah, yeah. Keith Fordham: you and and part of the problem was you notice the 110 degree heat. The air conditioner was stolen the day before we started the revival. We had a tent put up and we used it on Friday and Saturday. And we we did that because the Muslims would come and listen to us preach, but they wouldn't come in the building, but they would come under the tent. And so Sam Fordham: Right. So so even though even though the tent was in the parking lot of the church, again that Keith Fordham: Right. Sam Fordham: and and I can't remember how many languages they said they'd put out information in forty something different languages, you know, and Keith Fordham: Yeah, yeah, that's right. Sam Fordham: and again the Muslims couldn't come to the church building, but they were free to come under the tent, as long as it was outside. So Keith Fordham: Right. And and the thing about it was the seminary there at Kansas City, the Midwestern Seminary, they'd gone out and passed out flyers, put pictures of me in the windows, you know, saying a crusade is coming, and they got a horse trough and baptized their first person in thirty years on Friday night, I think it was. And Sam Fordham: Yeah. Keith Fordham: then Saturday we had decisions and I forget how many were saved that particular week, but I do know they baptized ten before we left the property Sunday night. And one of those men said I we told him we don't have towels and we don't have a change of clothes and we're out of robes and so he said I'm ringing wet anyway and I don't know, can they see the picture of the counselors Sam Fordham: Yeah. Keith Fordham: and you there you'll notice Sam right, he's r yeah he's ringing Sam Fordham: Yeah, yeah, I look like I've been baptized almost. Keith Fordham: wet and and by the way, I I talk about dressing neat and and so forth, but there's some circumstances where you just you have to go you have to be have to be in reality. And so Sam Fordham: Pra practicality. Yeah, takes over. Yeah. Keith Fordham: dressed in flip flops and shorts, but that that man accepted Christ and and Sam Fordham: Mm-hmm. Keith Fordham: s these others did as well. the church was just on fire when we left and they jumped fifty in t attendance starting the next Sunday that began they were running forty two and they st started running ninety two and they held that for about two or three years Sam Fordham: yeah. Keith Fordham: you know after after the revival meeting. So Sam Fordham: Fantastic. Yeah. It's in it's important. the g the the f the first step and and and I I'm I'm I'm going to refrain from from getting too It's hard to even know what the word is, not political, but it is political in our day and our age. There are a lot of people that are that are geared towards don't give public officer calls, don't give invitations. But but the problem is those people are the same ones that say, well, the most important thing is following up and discipling. And and what I have seen throughout my life and and what you indicate is the follow-up, the discipleship discipleship. begins at the altar. It that that's when Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: it starts. And so if you're not if you're not engaging with that person at the point of decision, you are missing a huge opportunity towards putting that person on the right path for discipleship and and growing spiritually. well let let me ask you about this picture. Keith Fordham: Well, that skinny young man standing up there is actually me. I guess I weighed about a hundred and ninety pounds in those days. And I was we would go to the Sales, Arizona to the Papago Indian Reservation, P A P A G O Papago, and we would do vacation bible schools out as far as fifty and sixty miles out of the central village. And then we would come back to the central village at night and would have the revivals and or have revival services. And we always had around thirty or more saved at the church and he would follow they would follow through and baptism at First Baptist Sales, Arizona, and then the S E L L S they would the group that came with us, we had about forty. young people they would train and and go out witnessing in their home church and get this decision for Christ counseling training and the preacher would hand them off to our people. But also we had a number of young men answer the call to preach out of out of that. Danny Aiken, who for years was a seminary president and and teacher and so forth. he was one of those and and and we've had I think that year we had four young men answer the call to preach. And so Sam Fordham: Wow. Amen. And and for those those that are just listening, this is a old black and white picture a and a small church building, you know, just Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: just the bare bare pews, no pads. Keith Fordham: That's right. Sam Fordham: but but you've got Keith is up there on the platform a lot s a lot less of a man than he is today. And and then Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: and then in front of him you have I reckon that's the pastor. Keith Fordham: Yes. Right. Sam Fordham: who's receiving the people coming down and there's a line of people. So he's got a young lady with him, a young man Keith Fordham: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Sam Fordham: right behind her, another child, and then it looks like a grown adult man, some more kids, a grown adult lady, and again all are waiting to come to talk Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: to the pastor. and the and the problem is when people are responding, you you got a line like that is and and we're not you know, it's not a quick service that's sitting Chick fil A. You're not gonna get in and in and Keith Fordham: Ha ha ha. Sam Fordham: out. You th each of those individuals needs time to talk with someone and Keith Fordham: And so the pastor would act as a field general and he would see what decision the person was going to make and then we would get an appropriate decision advisor to talk Sam Fordham: Yeah, true. Keith Fordham: to them and and give them materials and so forth. Sam Fordham: Yeah. And that you know, something I don't know that we I can't remember. usually with with that kind of thing you would like for your decision advisor to be if it's a lady you want a lady to talk with If a man you want a man to talk with them. Keith Fordham: Right. Yes. Sam Fordham: and and those kind of things. The same thing even even with kids, nowadays, preferably male with male, female with female, Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: it just works better. just and protects everybody involved. Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: but that's fantastic. In the forward to your book, you've got Dr. Gerald Harris, and he served as a pastor, but also as the editor of the Christian Index. And there are a couple of things that he says in regards to the the book and about you. first thing he says is few men have the kind of earnest, compassionate longing for the lost to be saved today, as evangelist Keith Fordham. And I would I would expand that out. Evangelists are just different. wired differently, gifted differently. but and I don't know that I've ever met an evangelist whose primary passion was not to see people be saved. That that just seem Keith Fordham: Right. Sam Fordham: it seems a universal thing. Maybe there's one out there that's not that way, but but and and and evangelists when when we say they are different, every evangelist is different from the every other one. it's just Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: it is a e eclectic bunch of of of folks. But God seems to use that. And Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: the but here I would say even though that is the case The evangelist, according to Ephesians, is a gift that God gives to the church. And so even though their focus tends to be for the salvation of the lost, I know throughout your ministry, usually the first message you would preach on Sunday mornings had to do with with Christians behaving like Christians and Keith Fordham: Yes. Sam Fordham: church members being being obedient and and and again, when the church behaves like the church is supposed to, people are going to be saved. That that seems Keith Fordham: Right. Sam Fordham: to be seems to be the way that the Lord does it. something else he said was that in this book I have decided fordom calls the whole church of the redeemed to get involved in sowing gospel seeds, cultivating those seeds, and seeing those seeds become trees that bear fruit. for the kingdom of God. And so again, that call is beyond just just the sharing of the gospel. It it is the the the full work of the gospel. the you know chang changing hearts but also changing lives and making disciples who go on to make disciples. and again that's something that speaks to the to the whole church and and you said it was Paul Allen the the minister there one of the associate pastors, family pastor. Keith Fordham: Family Yeah, family and discipleship. Sam Fordham: Yeah, and and he said, I need something to train church people. And so that's who the book is for. something else, Dr. Harris said is in all my years of ministry, I've never seen a book that is so thorough and comprehensive in ministering to the person who comes to the altar seeking God's grace, forgiveness, and guidance. And So I thought those were that was a very good Ford. very complimentary. But again that hopefully that helps people that may have a question as to what this book is, why it exists and what it's for. And then I I started doing something the other day. We had I'm teaching on Daniel on Sunday nights at our church. And you know, you you need illustrations. I like to I like to put pictures up in my PowerPoints 'cause it just helps people like me to to pay better attention. And so I found you could you could go and use some of the AI engines to create something and and I did that the other night and so when I got to thinking about you know this this particular book and decision advisors I I asked I think it was Chat GPT, I said, Hey, give give me a picture with a man standing holding a book and a light shining out of it. And then two individuals, one that's helping the other find their way through darkness towards that light. And to me, the decision advisor is the person that's there in the picture. He's got the other by the hand. There's a there's mist, there's rocky terrain, there's darkness, but that that person is helping the other person to make their way towards the light. And to me that's what a decision advisor really is, is somebody who's accomplishing that process. Anything else you'd like to say about that about that process or about the book in general? Keith Fordham: No, I just think that's a that's a great great thing. People come from the confusion of sin and are brought into the light of the Lord Jesus Christ. And I think that is huge. Acts chapter eight, I think it's verse fourteen, says that Simon Peter would be sent to Cornelius and he would come and he would tell That's the Hebrew word Laleo, and it has to do with ordered speech, ordered words. And Sam Fordham: Yeah. Keith Fordham: then it says he will tell you words of eternal life. And and that word there is the word Ramatos. And it means Holy Spirit or God breathed words spoken out loud. Sam Fordham: Mm-hmm. Keith Fordham: And so it's important that the people can either see a picture or hear, and we have those pictures in the book or the guide, and we also have the words, exact words that you can say that are very helpful. of course a lot of people will read those words and turn them into their own, which works great too. Sam Fordham: Absolutely. Again, this is not a this is not perfection. This is just trying to get something done. Something to able to help somebody. and so that's that's your hope. I I'm thinking on Amazon the book itself was ten dollars for a paper copy and Keith Fordham: Yeah. Sam Fordham: that's that's I think that's with Prime, so that would be delivered. and then I think it's half the price for the Kindle edition. So Keith Fordham: Yeah, five dollars for the Kindle edition. Sam Fordham: but it's a it's a handy thing, and we'll do more. I think next time we'll look at that first part in particular the preaching and and what we ought to be expecting to have happen at the altar. What what Keith Fordham: Okay. Sam Fordham: can God do? So until next time, this has been Ask Dr. Fordham.