Lauren Miles: Welcome to CXO Loading. I'm Laura Miles, a CX director, using this podcast to build the insight, technical confidence, and career context that you and I need to make the move to C Suite. In this episode, I talk to Abby Sola Fabier about taking an approach to CX that is more human and built layer by layer. Abby Sola is a CX strategist, keynote speaker, founder and artist. Her career has moved from construction to technology. And that breadth shows up in the way that she sees CX problems. We get into the concept of quiet churn, the art of better interaction, the value of mentorship, and her very clear advice for anyone waiting to feel ready. Let's get into it. I know because we've spoken before, you didn't always plan to be in CX. How did that happen? I started with construction. I have a first degree in real estate. I was a project manager for the construction company at the time and I was managing everything from production on the site to vendors and all of the artisans that were there, moved on to a bilateral trade organization between Nigeria and the UK and then moved again into a Microsoft partner company. So when I was trying to do some sort of self-audit of, you know, how my career has gone, what's the focal point, I've moved a lot, but is there anything that ties all of this movement? And What was consistent was the fact that I had always dealt with customers. So I went on some sort of search to say how do I now hone in on what I have done and strengthen this process. And in doing that, I kind of found a name. Or what you've done is customer experience. There's been an element of that in your career progression. And so because of that, I went on to apply to the CX Academy in Ireland and decided to take an actual course in it. So I did a professional diploma in. the CX from the CX Academy and you know finished that ⁓ last year. I am conscious of this is what my career is, this is the progression that I'm going on. You know, what's the next level? What have I done? How can I just build on that as I go forward? And do you think that breadth of experience gives you a different, different lens now that you're in a senior CX consultancy role? I think it does. I think it does. I think the fact that, you know, I've dealt with in multiple industries, multiple levels, multiple people who have been in different seniority levels. I think that gives me a very different perspective. Another thing I think is giving me a good perspective is arts. I'd always been an artist. I'd always done a bit of chocolate and pastel and at some point acrylic paint. How I look at what I do right now, more often than not is from an artist lens. So there's that introduction of the history of my career as well as art been introduced into how I work today. I think that's really interesting, the view you have there as an artist and the concept of layers that you you got behind that CX. How's that feeding into what what you're building at the moment? Because you're building something big, right? I am building and I've been in this building mode for the last about a year. And one of the things I have built one is a solution called OnScript where you are Pretty much deconstructing the very scripted conversations that people would have, whether they would have that conversation via phone call or the scripted conversations you receive via email, whatever mode of communication you receive. So really making sure that there is that human element where in this bubble of there's so much technology, there's so much automation where we are removing the human interactions. Another one I'm currently building, which allows us to go through some sort of process, which is a free solution. It's called the human check. It's still bringing in that human element where you are looking at different aspects of your business and being able to sort of critique those aspects, whether it is the hard conversations you have or the first interaction that people have. So you go through very short 20 questions to answer, you do get a score over a hundred that gives you, you know, very clear picture into where there are gaps. So you go on to now get an actual detailed resolution to those gaps and to say that this is what I can implement. So you have that resolution, but what is more important is the fact that you have a solution that you can work with. So if this is what you are doing, this is what good looks like, this is what great looks like. So you're not leaving that space or that solution with a concept. The concept is nice, but you are leaving with actionable steps. And so you can take those steps and actually implement them into your business. And that's the intention of that one. So I wanted a flow. And so I try to look at six core areas. And so thinking about it, you're thinking about all aspects of a business, whether it is a small business or a medium-sized business, or whether a person is a solopreneur or not, just look at those multifaceted sides of the business and critique them and then get those actions that you can go forward and take on. And another one I am building, like I said, I am in the building era. Another one, ⁓ which is called, I will leave what it's called for now because I'm still building it. So the concept of that is to address churn. And be able to say why are people leaving or why are they not staying or why are my interactions just a one interaction with one person and then that person never returns. So it's a two-part solution where it does address churn on one side and on the other side it addresses escalation and de-escalation. Because what I did was to go in and search the 12 high critical problems that people complain about or have complained about in the last five years. In some way, there is a relationship between those two on one part why people are leaving and on the other part why you are not escalating or de-escalating properly. So it allows you to be able to have one, the correct language for escalation and de-escalation, because that's important. You can either blow up a problem or you know properly tame it if you do not use the right language. So language is important, nuance is important. And being able to talk to different aspects of you know how people reach out to you. So I can reach out to you on social media and say one thing, and then I reach out to you again, maybe on WhatsApp and say something else. And then I reach out to you again via phone call and there's another conversation. How do we bring an aggregation of all of those multiple conversations and then be able to give a response that is apt and proper for that situation? So taking all of those multifaceted conversations into one response. And making sure that it actually solves a problem. So these are the things that I'm thinking about. I probably will stop here. I don't build another one. Did I get that? You know, over the line. But yeah, I'm constantly in that state of want to solve CX problems and not just at an enterprise level. I want to bring beauty into how the customer experience is because I think there's an art to it. I think there's beauty in how, you know, the experience or of any solution of any product of anything ⁓ that you're interacting should be. It shouldn't and it doesn't have to be luxury for you to have a smooth and a beautiful experience. In the things I'm thinking about and in the things I'm conceptualizing, I want to make sure that I am giving and bringing the beauty of the customer experience from both sides, from the customer side and also from the business side. Yeah. And I think Everything you've said there just screams out to me as to what differentiates you from someone who might be still in a more kind of junior CX role. Because as a leader at the forefront at the top of the CX game, you're looking at, well, what are the gaps? What are the problems that everyone's experiencing? What solutions do we need as a community? And actually what does not even just good look like, but exceptional for every single journey. And I think one of the gaps that I'm always interested to hear about from you is most tools are built for a lot of noise. And you focus quite a lot on on this concept of of quiet churn, don't you, in terms of that as a gap. So what do most leaders get wrong when it comes to quiet churn? I think quiet chan, I mean, as the name implies, it's quiet. There's no noise. You do not get a bad feedback and then someone leaves. It's just I got there. It was fine. I didn't like it. You know what? I'll go somewhere else. And so it's one of the very it's one of those things that it's very hard to solve for because you never can tell where someone has left. And someone leaving could be the person's situation has changed. It could be the person's financial situation or life situation has changed. So it might not be a Bad thing. It's not always going to be a bad thing when people leave quietly. I think I saw something that I thought was very clever. It was a subscription of diapers. And what they did with their so-called churn was when people stop subscribing, what they do is to send a note to them to say you have graduated. Congratulations. Your child doesn't need diapers anymore. I thought that was brilliant. It's his churn. You've left for the reason why you should have left. Your child doesn't need diabetes anymore. So when we think about Quiet Chon, there's so many aspects to it. In solving for Quiet Chon, it has to be on a case by case basis. I really don't think there would be a blanket way to say, you know what, this is how all Quiet Chan's are going to you know, this is solution for all of them. I don't think that's going to happen. I think businesses will have to look at why will people leave, what are the ways we can in some ways stop people from leaving. But in other ways, when people have to leave, how do we encourage them or how do we, you know, allow them without any feeling of guilt to be able to part with the business amicably? No, that's really interesting. I love that example. What a brilliant example of someone taking something that could be potentially like quite a negative view internally and turn it into a positive customer experience. That's amazing. I think that comes right back to this kind of beauty in every experience that your beauty your stress. Amazing. I think for me, hearing you talk about that and the way you talk about it so passionately and and having the wisdom to see that there's not that one size fits all and knowing what might be dangerous quiet churn versus what's a necessary one. Do you find you lean on that experience when you're mentoring? Because you you run quite well, a part of quite a few different mentoring programs, aren't you? I think with mentoring, mentoring is such an important part of my life right now. I am a product of mentorship. I think that I am grounded because I do have solid mentors in my life and I do not take them for granted. I have mentors who have taken a chance on me in moments and seasons when I didn't even think I was ready, but they saw that readiness in me and they were able to just give me that nudge the necessary nudge. So it's my way of giving back. And so for the last maybe three years or more, I have made sure that on a yearly basis, I do sign up for at least one mentorship program. So I would have maybe one or two people who go through that journey. So I may not do a bulk mentorship. I want to be able to build a relationship with. The other woman that I'm dealing with. And I usually target just make sure that I am dealing with other women. So young women, because I know what my journey is. I know what the different seasons and phases of life can bring up, especially when it comes to the workplace. You know, you go and you start your journey as a young woman. You most likely at some point maybe get married, have children. Those seasons and those phases have an impact on the journey and have an impact on what your career will be. So it's important for me in how I think about mentorship and in how I give back when it comes to mentorship to be conscious of that. So I'm always going to be a part of mentorship cro programs. I'm always going to have mentors. The mentors I have in my life today are such an integral part of my success and my progress. I want to make sure that people can see representation because that's such an important thing too, where you have representation. So representation from community that you're familiar with, representation from people who look like you, representation from people who come from the same background or the same life experiences as I have come from. So those kind of women look and see this is a possibility for me. And then they can also begin to dream and dream big. Cause in particular in tech, I think as well, because you've got that such a strong tech. background as well that I think it's even more important that people be able to see the success that you've had to know what's possible. There's one piece of advice that you you can give to people that are looking to progress to that next kind of senior role, what would it be? Keep moving. Keep moving. Take chances. Don't stop. I think there's this popular saying that people seem to be peddling around right now on ⁓ social media, a moving person catches his luck, which is so true. Moving person would always meet their luck somehow. Apply for things. Audacious. You know what's and there's something that I'm always very conscious of. The worst thing anybody can tell you is no. It doesn't get worse than that. So you get into something, you want to do something and someone tells you no, that's fine. Go again. Try again. You know so there is that piece of you will try things, you will fail sometimes, and that's okay. But never let those things that you have tried and you have failed at stop you from keeping moving. So you will continue to move, you continue to make progress. As someone who is trying to get, you know, to the next phase of their life, of your career, just keep moving, just keep trying things. ⁓ putting yourself forward, even when you are not ready, where you do not feel ready, you'll get ready on the job, right? Get ready as you go on, you'll get ready, you'll rise to the occasion. You would do things afraid. I know it sounds like cliche, but yes, do things afraid. You're not always going to be a thousand percent ready. Do things afraid and make sure that you just keep moving. I'm I'm inspired. I I almost wanna keep moving now. I'm gonna I'm gonna get going right this second. That was incredible to hear about everything that you have achieved. I think we can all hear that you definitely ⁓ are practicing all of those things yourself and it's not just ⁓ it's not just something you're saying. Amazing. Thank you so much for your time today. That's been incredible. It's been beautiful spending this time with you, definitely. 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