Sam Wall: Welcome back to the topic. I'm Sam. Zach: I'm Zach. Sam Wall: And we're back at it with episode fifteen. Everybody clap it up. Zach: Teaker week. Sam Wall: Yeah, pretend as if we weren't just here. We're still doing Pika Week, like we were doing on Friday. If this is your first episode with Back to the Topic, we have a Patreon. We do episodes every single Wednesday. Make sure that you like, comment, subscribe, follow, rate the podcast wherever you listen. And also, if you are just a Spotify listener, this episode and Fridays are probably the first time you're seeing our faces. So drop a comment, Zach: Congratulations. Sam Wall: which one of us you think is more handsome. And Zach: We're moving up. Sam Wall: Yeah, we're making our way. So let's just get straight into peaker week, shall we? Zach: Yes. Sam Wall: Take number one. Simple one. Batman sucks. Picker week. Zach: Just just Batman. Totally fucking weak. Weak fucking take. Terrible take. Sam Wall: Yeah. Weak take, weak take, zero muscle take, zero training Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: take. Batman is sick, and he's tough. Those are two words Zach: He's so sick. Sam Wall: I'd use to describe him. Star Wars Episode three is one of the best and saddest tragedy movies ever produced. Zach: Deep. Sam Wall: Is it really that sad though? it's good. Zach: Bro, I was so unbelievably bought into that storyline as a kid. I can never unsee that. That was like the fucking I used to dread watching that movie knowing what was gonna happen. Sam Wall: But you're saying you were distraught about it. For real? Zach: No, I was genuinely devastated. Bro, bro, Anakin killing Padme, Sam Wall: Hmm. Interesting. I I think I would say weak, but Zach: Obi-Wan seeing how much like he can't do in that moment is like, it I think it does its job very well. Sam Wall: I would say weak, but I you know, I respect your take. P people should be more excited for Avengers Doomsday. Zach: Bro, who the fuck isn't excited for Avengers Doomsday right now? Sam Wall: Yeah, I I'm gonna say weak just because I don't see people not being excited for Doomsday. I feel like it has exactly how much hype Zach: Yeah. Bro, this is like I'm pretty sure this is like a holiday at this point. Sam Wall: Yeah, it should have exactly as much hype as it's getting right now. Zach: Yeah, I think we're good on that. Sam Wall: It's also, just so I I asked for MCU DC Marvel takes. It is wild. Zach: I did see that. Sam Wall: It's wild how many people are saying Last Jedi's a fantastic movie, which is a thrill for me. Yeah. Tony Stark's character development slash arc is one of the best character arcs in all of media. Zach: in the MCU. Sam Wall: Mm-hmm. Zach: Pretty damn good. Sam Wall: Yeah, I think it's good. I just don't I don't know if he has enough of in arc Zach: I think it's yeah. Sam Wall: for it to like be that crazy. Zach: I think I'm more attached to him as a character than his story actually. Sam Wall: Cause I feel like the whole argument for the arc is he becomes so selfless that he sacrifices himself. But in the first Avengers movie, he sacrifices himself. expecting to die. Zach: Yeah. Right. Sam Wall: he's like calling Pepper, expecting to first of all, first Avengers movie, horribly underrated. So good. Peak movie. And Zach: yeah, it's definitely it's I think I had it in my top five before brand new day. Sam Wall: So I don't even know if that's if I would count that as continuing on this crazy arc. Cause he's just always I feel like he's always doing the same thing. He's always getting in the same mess. He's scared of himself and is willing to sacrifice himself. That's the whole reason he does Ultron. That's the whole reason that whatever. So Zach: I agree. Sam Wall: Luke is petty and I hate him. Zach: Bro, I've seen this argument too many times. I just no, we take. Sam Wall: Yeah. I think that's totally weak and I feel like a lot of that take comes from Last Jedi and I think that's people misinterpreting his character in Last Jedi. Zach: No, dude, there's a f there's a huge group of people who say Luke is a whiny bitch in the original trilogy and it pisses them off. Yeah. Sam Wall: No way, dude. He like he sees his aunt and uncle burnt to a crisp, bro. Zach: I know. Sam Wall: And he's still thugging it out. Zach: Mm-hmm. Sam Wall: And he kills that Wampa. He's tough for that. He's tough for that. I will say. Zach: Yeah, he does that. He does a lot of cool shit. Sam Wall: and I know a lot of people say this, but the plan at the beginning of Return of the Jedi makes zero sense. So Zach: Is that is that a take or are you just saying that? Sam Wall: No, that's a very real take. And it it's probably the worst plan of all time. Zach: No, wait, wait, wait, wait. Are you saying that or is did someone put that take in the comments? Sam Wall: No, I'm I'm saying that. Yeah. Zach: okay, okay. I thought that was a take. Sam Wall: Yeah. Hit let's do it as one though. What do you think? Peak or week? Zach: That shit is peak as fuck. Sam Wall: Dude, it's one of the worst plans in all of media ever. Ever. Genuinely. He sends the dr like he sends R2 D2 with his lightsaber in there, and they get captured, both of the droids, and then he sends Leia, and she gets captured as a slave, which is messed up. And then he pulls up. And Lando apparently is already in there, whatever. And then he gets thrown in the thing because he doesn't have his lightsaber because he gave it to R2. And then he gets captured, and then he gets thrown out with Han. it doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make any sense. Zach: Yeah but in what in what I'm trying to think what happened? was Luke ever known as a good fucking planner though? Honestly Sam Wall: I'm not saying that he's whatever. Whatever. Somebody should have come up with something better. Zach: No, no, like I'm saying, did he come up with any like he's like thrawn. He's not big brain, I'm gonna out fucking smart. What? Sam Wall: The whole rebellion is coming up with this plan, bro. The whole rebellion's coming up with this plan. He's working with everybody. He's Zach: I guess. Sam Wall: working with Lando, he's working like they're all there. It doesn't make any sense. It's literally just to incorporate Java. Zach: Bro, they you know what you bro, they were literally here's my argument against it. They were fucking rattled after Empire Strikes Back, bro. They didn't even know they had to get something going. They had to get a fu bro, this was like fucking coming out of the first half. You get the fucking belt to ass. You're down three touchdowns. You gotta get something on the board. They were trying to get something on the board. What? Sam Wall: But it's been a year since Empire. It's hasn't it been a year since Empire and Return of the Jedi? Zach: Yeah, I know, but if you knew what happened in Shadows of the Empire, you'd probably still say the same thing. And that's the only media we have between the two, so Sam Wall: Yeah, I think the plane is still stupid. I think the plane is still stupid, bro. It doesn't make any sense. Zach: All right. Sam Wall: I still love the movie though, Return of the Jedi's Peak. Zach: Return of the Giants, fantastic. Sam Wall: Star Wars is incredibly overrated and Dune is far superior in almost every way. Zach: That's such a weak brain take. Sam Wall: I I just think if we had as much Dune media as we have Star Wars media, I'd like I think it would be about the same. Zach: I agree with that and I would even say if we had if we had Sun Eater media like we did Dune and Star Wars, it would say the same. But like that's not how we have it right now. And like let's bring up somebody who just watched a Star Wars show who said he likes Star Wars, but hasn't watched Star Wars in a long time. Biggest Dune fan that I follow is Calder Dune on Instagram. He just watched Andor for the first time and he was literally like taken aback by everything that happened in that show, saying how amazing it was. So like I don't think that the k Sam Wall: Well and also I don't even think you can equivocate the two things because Dune one and Dune Two I think are equal to a new hope and empire for me. And we have we have nothing else to compare other than this Zach: That that's so fair. That's such a valid take. I gotta plug in my laptop. No, that's such a valid take. Sam Wall: one Dune show that's like fine. Like a lot of the Star Zach: Yeah, a hundred percent. Sam Wall: Wars shows are. And so if you had a whole universe, you would not believe that take. Zach: No. Sam Wall: Plus If you're like including the books in that, there's so many peak Star Wars books too that people just haven't Zach: Yeah, the s Sam Wall: read. Zach: a hundred percent. And the the Star Wars universe is what makes it fantastic. It is the most vast sci fi universe of all time with the most diversity and the most characters and the most backstories ever. but Dune also has a pretty freaking insane gallery of shit, so Sam Wall: Yeah. Cap going back to dance with Peggy and live with her at the end of Endgame goes completely against his whole character arc. One thousand percent weak take, in my opinion. I think that's a terrible take. Zach: I feel like that was almost the whole point. Sam Wall: Yeah, that that's literally what he's had the whole thing is he can't rest and he can't settle down and he can't do anything for himself. And he's like learning how to go against these things that have been rooted in his mind. That's what civil war is completely about is the fact Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: that he's just become like a soldier and he needs to get alive. and Peggy Peggy dies in civil war because Zach: Mm-hmm. Sam Wall: like he and and he has this realization of like, my gosh, I'm like not autonomous. I'm I'm like just a soldier. And Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: so, yeah, I completely disagree. Wanda acts in the MCU as if she's never had an interest in being a hero. Zach: Wouldn't say directly. Sam Wall: Yeah. I feel like Mwanda's actions more so show that she wants to protect people than she wants to be a hero. Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: But I also I I don't think that it's enough to warrant saying like she's never wanted to be a hero. Zach: The way that's ki the way that's portrayed is like there's no like she's trying not to be a hero almost. Sam Wall: Yeah. Zach: and I don't think that's true. Sam Wall: Yeah. Filoni's better than Lucas. Zach: No. Weak. I disagree. Sam Wall: Yeah, I disagree. I disagree. Zach: However, I think that. I'm not gonna say Lucas is over glazed because Lucas is the GOAT. However, when people just assume, if you listen to some of the stuff that Lucas was saying after all the hate of the prequels, people just assume that he would have made a fucking banger third trilogy. it would have been so good. He made the prequels. People fucking hated the prequels for such a long time. people forget that. you're talking about the guy as the GOAT, but there's still people who hate those movies. He's He's literally three for six in some people's eyes. He's three f he's two for six in some people's eyes. Sam Wall: Yeah. But I also think Felone live action wise is just not even close to Lucas. And I don't think Zach: I will say Sam Wall: anybody makes makes Star Wars feel grander and bigger than Lucas did. Like Lucas Zach: Yeah, no. Sam Wall: is the only really like live action director other than like maybe JJ Abrams that like makes Star Wars feel like this huge experience. Zach: So I would say Hopefully that Falone turns around his resume with Ahsoka season two though. Cause like Mando season two is that technique that's technically Falone, right? Mando one and season Mando season one and two were awesome. Like really, really, really good TV. And I think that Ahsoka season two could be on that level. so whoever's in the room with him while they did those things. I would like to see that continued because I don't think he's necessarily bad at live action. I think he's just needs someone else with him to make that vision come to life. Someone was in there writing the rescue episode of Mandalorian season two with him. And that shit was the best fucking episode literally ever. So if that's possible, I'm it. I'm in on him doing more live action. Sam Wall: I will say Star Wars is known for like switching up its format, you know, and like being pretty inventive. I Zach: Mm-hmm. Sam Wall: think Felone should help head a new Star Wars trilogy that's like Spider-Verse Animation. I think that would be tough. Zach: That'd be awesome. I think that they should do more Star Wars animated movies. That's a good point. If anything, I Sam Wall: Yeah, mainline. I think that would be so sick. Zach: feel like instead of giving him Mando and Grogu, they should have done some type of sequel trilogy. Not sequel trilogy, a High Republic trilogy, not High Republic, New Republic trilogy. bringing together some of the shows, like Ahsoka, Mandalorian. You can have Thrawn be a big part of it. bro, Thrawn. The only problem I have with the Soga season two so far is Thrawn versus Akbar Space Battle should be on the big screen. That is an event that is worthy of the movie theater. Like that that I'm like I just don't think Star Wars has enough backing right now to get that on the movie the like in the movie theater, but it should be. Sam Wall: I also I enjoy Ahsoka, but I wish that it was animated. And I think anyways, that's a tangent. We won't go down that. Anyways, next. without a thought, Andrew Garfield is the best Spider-Man. Zach: Peak. Absolutely. Sam Wall: Yeah, I think I agree. I think Zach: I Sam Wall: I agree. Zach: I really do love Tom. Like I'm a I'm a Toby hater. I'm not actually like I like those movies and I think Toby's Sam Wall: He's just kinda corny. Zach: yeah, a hundred percent does not do it for me like the other two. Tom Holland in Brand New Day. Sam Wall: Yeah. I didn't grow up with it. Zach: Tom Holland in Brand New Day is as good as it gets. There is something that Andrew Garfield has that cannot be taught or practiced or anything. It is just there. And it's fucking awesome and I wish he got the fucking justice he deserved for his movies so badly. Sam Wall: Yeah. I agree. Zach: TASM three. Where is it at? He could still do it. He could still Sam Wall: Yes, please. Zach: do it. Sam Wall: Obi-Wan is unforgivable for not mercy killing Anakin. Zach: Weak. Sam Wall: I think that's a terrible take. Zach: That's a weak take. Sam Wall: Yeah. First of all, the only reason he walks away from Anakin is because he thinks he's good as dead. Zach: Mm-hmm. Sam Wall: And second of all, Zach: Jedi don't kill. Sam Wall: yeah. Yeah. That's like the whole thing. Anyways. Anyways. The Zach: Yeah. Yeah. I was I was like really fine trying to struggling to find what I wanted to say and that came to my mind. I'm like, I don't even think he could have, technically. Sam Wall: Also, everybody everybody brings up Obi-Wan killing Grievous as well, he killed. He sees Grievous as a machine. Grievous Zach: He is a machine. Sam Wall: has a heart, but Grievous is a machine. That's the reason that he kills him. It's not like Obi-Wan's just a killer. he follow Zach: Yeah. Hm. Yeah. Sam Wall: like he's part of the Jedi Council. I Zach: Mm-hmm. Sam Wall: don't know. Cad Bain is one of the best Star Wars characters, Zach: Cheat. Sam Wall: and I need more than just cameos from. Zach: Yeah, he's awesome. He's great. His moments, his Sam Wall: Yeah, I agree. Even the design. Zach: arcs in the Clone Wars are as good as they get. he actually is so good at his fucking job of being a bounty hunter. He's awesome. Sam Wall: He's literally like the Batman of Star Wars. He's sick. Zach: Yeah, he's sick. He flies too. Sam Wall: Maul is yeah, which is tough. Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: Maul is the embodiment of the dark side after the Mortis arc in Clone Wars along with Ahsoka and Anakin. I don't understand that take at all. What is what are they trying to say? Zach: Maul is the embodiment of the dark side after the mortis arc. Sam Wall: Yeah, I don't know. I don't know what they're trying to say. I don't know what they're trying to say. Zach: I don't Ahsoka's definitely not at all involved in the dark side, so I wouldn't say that, but Sam Wall: Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I feel like part of part of what makes Siege of Mandalore so special is that Ahsoka after she leaves the Jedi Order is like caught in between the light side and the dark side. And Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: like they're like pulling at her, which is how the Jedi are supposed to be. Like they're supposed to like a pure Jedi like interacts with both the light side and the dark side. Zach: Yeah, they're always trying to balance. Sam Wall: Which is what makes Maul like I agree that Maul is sure, maybe an embodiment of the dark side, but Zach: I actually don't really agree with that, honestly, because there's some perspectives you could take on the siege on Mandalore, where his actions are justified. not actually, but like what he's saying is facts. he sees something that nobody else can see because he's been through the Rags and Riches, Rags to Riches story, and he tried to be the, the ruler of Mandalore. He got shot down by Palpatine who killed his brother. honestly I feel like Dooku and Maul are very interesting for that reason because people only ever look at him as they're Sith, they have red lightsabers. the two of those characters are extremely complex and do not even come close to agreeing with most of the dark side stuff. So Sam Wall: Yeah. Okay. Here's another take from Joner. Starkiller isn't a good character and shouldn't be canon. Zach: I don't think he's in enough to say no, to say weak. 'Cause there's a million other characters I'd say shouldn't be canon over Star Killer. That would be my argument. Sam Wall: I think Starkiller is a good character, but I do think I agree that he shouldn't be canon. Zach: I'm fine with him not being canon, but well actually we're getting a we're getting a star killer minifig next year is one of the concept art minifigs. So once that happens I Sam Wall: Which is tough. Zach: don't care what what you do with them. Sam Wall: Yeah. This is an interesting take. Spider-Man should have died in brand new day. Zach: I yeah, Sam Wall: I think weak. I don't think it would have added anything to the movie. Zach: I don't think it would have added anything. The shock factor of people walking out of the movies if he never made it out of the hospital would be crazy. But I don't know what you would have done after that. You can't just like have Miles Morales just jump in. Sam Wall: Yeah. You're setting all of this stuff up. And also Tom Holland's been clear that he wants to hand it off to Miles in the MCU, which I think is awesome. Zach: Yeah, yeah. He said he will do it for as long as he can before he wants to give whoever's gonna do Miles a chance. Sam Wall: Yeah, and I think it'll be awesome to see a little mentor relationship before he leaves. Zach: Yeah, no, for sure. Sam Wall: Star Wars has always in all caps been a mixed bag quality wise. Zach: I would agree. I'd say peak. Sam Wall: I would say this is something we've talked about before, but from the peaks to the valleys of Star Wars, it's always been a mixed bag. But Star Wars is Star Wars. Star Wars is always gonna be six or above. I like mixed bag quality wise of all media, disagree. Mixed bag Zach: Yeah. Sam Wall: Star Wars wise, agree. Zach: I agree. It's like we're operating in the Star Wars universe, therefore we're already better than most fucking things. Sam Wall: We'll do a couple more questions. this one's topical because you've just rewatched. Force Awakens was genuinely good. Zach: It's fucking great. I s I Sam Wall: I agree. Zach: I'm serious. It's genuinely great. We could we Sam Wall: It's so good. Zach: can we actually talk about Force Awakens for like a minute? Because I I'm gonna post my video on it, but like everyone here. Dude, Sam Wall: Adam Driver's tough in that movie, bro. He's tough in that movie. Zach: it's an electric movie from start to finish. Like literally everything makes sense. It's paced very well. All of the character introductions are very compelling. You are so excited to see what happens next at the end of that movie. the only two things that I was like after watching it where I was like, these would be my real complaints. There were three things that would be my real complaints. the the Wrathtar scene, I feel like people would give a hard time for, but I think that that scene works because it was just like it showed that Han Solo was in such deep shit from being a scoundrel in the galaxy for such a long time. That that hasn't changed about Han solo. And then honestly, I remember that scene Sam Wall: Yeah. I love that scene. Zach: be I remember that scene being way longer than it was. It was really short. It was like they they were like chased by Wrath Tars like five minutes. That was it. And also Ray removing the restraints with her mind. I was like, what the fuck? And then I realized and I looked into it a little bit more. the the reason that was able to happen, I think this is an important point, is because when Kylo was trying to interrogate her. She he doesn't fully know how to utilize that part of the force. He was unlocking force techniques in her brain as he was interrogating her, which makes it even cooler. That makes it cooler. That's sick. Sam Wall: Yeah, which is awesome. Yeah. Cause you can see for a second that she's like getting into his mind, which is awesome. Yeah. That movie is so sick. I would also Zach: Yeah. Yeah. And then he literally bro Yeah, that's so fire. Sam Wall: I would say debatably the best looking Star Wars movie. Zach: It's so good, dude. And the whole Maz's castle thing, when Poe and the entire resistance comes flying in on the X Wings, Sam Wall: I love Mars. Zach: awesome. And then the last thing I'll say, like I said, I've said this to you last week. Star killer base. another Death Star, whatever. Like they just redo the Death Star. Kylo Ren looks at Darth Vader's helmet in the face and says, I'm gonna finish what you started. That's the entire point. I mean They ha they replaced Moff Tarkin with General Hux, who could have arguably been a better officer. Sam Wall: Dude, dude. Zach: Huh. Sam Wall: Our introduction to Kylo Wren where they shoot the blaster from the Zach: Unreal. Sam Wall: and he stops. my gosh. Zach: Bro. Sam Wall: One of the best scenes in any Star Wars movie, period. Zach: Let's talk about the fact that he slices that old dude's head off and then turns around and grabs the blaster bowl. He holds it there till he walks back on his ship and then lets it go. Yeah. Dude, I gave Sam Wall: He's nuts. He's nuts. And then it goes. It's crazy. It's so good. Zach: the movie a nine out of ten on my rewatch, by the way. Honestly, might be a might be a top six Star Wars movie. Like genuinely. It's fucking awesome. Sam Wall: I honestly I feel like we should end it there. I feel like we should end it there. Zach: I'm gonna start I'm gonna start a tirade of like the sequels aren't bad. It's just the rise of Skywalker. It's just the rise of Skywalker. I think even after I will rewatch The Last Jedi, I will say, hey, this might not be as good as the best Star Wars movies, but I don't think it's significantly better or worse than Attack of the Clones. I think it could be on par with that, probably. The Force Awakens is a great movie, though. it really is. I Sam Wall: Yeah. I agree. Zach: think people. And I said this in my review, I think people just got their judgment cloudied by how bad. whether you think the rise of the last Jedi is bad or not, and then the rise of Skywalker, Sam Wall: Riser Skywalker ruined it. Zach: Yeah, we forgot about what it felt like to go that was my first movie I think I ever saw in the movies that was Star Wars. I think. Yeah, it was. Sam Wall: Also, we still had all that mystery around Snoke and we didn't know what he was actually like and Zach: Yes. Yes. Sam Wall: it was awesome. Zach: Yeah. Actually that was the only other thing I was gonna say is like when you're watching that movie, you're like, who the hell is Snoke and where did he come from? But that I know, but then I thought back to Sam Wall: But he's scary, bro. He's scary. Zach: I was like, we need to know more about that. But at the same time, bro, when you re when you watch the original trilogy, you have no fucking clue who Palpatine is. literally no clue. So Sam Wall: Yeah. Yeah. Zach: if they did an animated series that was good, that Kinda showed Snoke's rise to power and shit like that. detailed Finn's time in the first order, I guess. I Sam Wall: Would have been tough. Zach: don't know if it would be first order yet, but like, I would love that. Like a supplementary Clone Wars show. Sam Wall: Alright, y'all. This has been episode fifteen. Since Zach: Yeah, I have a lot to say about this, sorry. Sam Wall: we just did two whole episodes of Peek a Week, I think Friday we'll probably do something different. So maybe we can run back our Rotten Tomatoes game. You guys just let us know. You guys loved that episode, so maybe we'll bring it back. And otherwise this has been episode fifteen. Clap it up. And we're only here 'cause of you guys, so make sure that you like, comment, subscribe, and Patreon is up. So we'll see you guys soon. Zach: comment, subscribe, Patreon. Sam Wall: Yeah. What's the thing you said on the last episode? Zach: I said LCS. comment, subscribe. LCS P like, Sam Wall: Heck yeah. Heck yeah. Zach: comment, subscribe, Patreon. Yeah. Alright, peace. Sam Wall: Heck yeah. Alright, y'all. We'll see you on the next one. Bye.