Daksha Nair: Namaste everyone and welcome back to the Ramayana Odyssey podcast. So, in this podcast, we journey through the Ramayana one story at a time. So, we listen to the story and then we pause to reflect on the deeper meanings associated with it. And from time to time, we also have the blessing of learning from revered teachers who help us see this great scripture through a deeper lens. And today's episode is so very special for me. And it is an absolute blessing and a privilege to welcome Fujiswami Mitrananda ji of Chinya. Mission Chennai. And Swamiji has always been an inspiring presence for us and someone who's always been there to encourage and support our efforts in projects such as the Ramana Odyssey and the Gita Odyssey. He's also one of those teachers who's inspired so many young people through his clarity, warmth, and ability to make timeless wisdom deeply relevant to modern day life. Swamiji is a respected teacher

swami mitrananda: Great.

Daksha Nair: ⁓ dedicated to sharing wisdom of Sanatana Dharma ⁓ and helping seekers with the spirit of our scriptures ⁓ in a thoughtful absolutely transformative way. ⁓ And for me this conversation is so very special because ⁓ one of my aspirations through the Ramayana Odyssey ⁓ is to help the Ramayna to my generation in a meaningful manner, ⁓ not just as story from the past, but rather as a living source. of guidance, inspiration, and inner strength. So Swamiji, it is truly a blessing to have you with me here reflecting on the Ramayna today. So thank you so much for your time and your blessings. so Swamiji, in Ramayana Odyssey, one of our visions is to really take the Ramaina to our younger generations in a way that is authentic, thoughtful, and deeply meaningful. ⁓ so many young people today, my age and even younger, ⁓ the Ramayana from a distance, but they also have a lot of questions associated with it ⁓ its relevance, its history, its universality, ⁓ the places it continues to hold in Bharat alongside the love. Of people across the world. So, with your permission, I would love to place a few of these questions before you. So, Swamiji, before we go into specific questions, could you help us understand why the Ramayana continues to matter so deeply even today? Not just as an epic, but rather as a guide for life.

swami mitrananda: Yeah sure. is history, very poetically written. This the base through which or the through which we need to see Ramayan. Lakshya can you name some ⁓ historians of 16th century. 17th century.

Daksha Nair: Not specific historians, no.

swami mitrananda: I won't ⁓ people have recorded but when history is poetically keeping the goal of life ⁓ then that history serves till date. ⁓ So Ramayan you see was few years BCE. ⁓ and it is still available today. Probably once it was on the verbal form to written script and then it has traveled. It has traveled minimum written script itself if you see the Lippi. It would have traveled close to 3000-4000 years BCE. The incident would have been long ago. Valmiki narrated it because Valmiki was Rama's contemporary. and that carried carried carried and the present style of Sanskrit in Devanagari it goes back to two or three thousand years BCE, the present script. The history was long before. But Valmiki wrote it in such a way that it is poetical. When history is poetically written, keeping how it can transform human beings ⁓ So Valmiki Ramayan ⁓ in poetic ⁓ So when is poetically written, ⁓ that is poetically expressed, ⁓ there will exaggerations. ⁓ So a child can also benefit from it. An adult also can benefit from it. And there is exaggerations. Poetry means exaggeration. That's why it is an interesting epic till today. Otherwise it could have been like a history book of 14th century or 15th century about whom have no idea. So this book has served. So first point is ⁓ expressed is now the by would help human to live well evolve to Imagine you imagine using history ⁓ for human live well ⁓ and evolve. So that's the style Mahabharata and Ramayana. These two books we call them as epics. History, and ⁓ poetically wrote it. ⁓ that's the background, the historical and it helps even today ⁓ for people to benefit, to ⁓ live well and grow. ⁓ that's the purpose the epic. Generally, you see history books, you would have spoken about a king who was born here, who lived and this was the difficulty he had. This is the territory he extended. know, with that it'll end. ⁓ here, ⁓ the man lived, ⁓ was his value system, ⁓ he responded to every ⁓ of his role. So for us is Dharma Shastra. How Ram ideal brother. ideal friend, ideal son, husband. At stage ⁓ what be the ideal? Valmiki has it that way. So every character, in fact in Ramayan the emotions which we see, whatever, there cannot be any other emotion outside Ramayan. the human possible emotions are brought into Ramayan. So you read it from beginning to end, ⁓ you find all possible ⁓ which humans ⁓ is recorded. So a history, historical text covered aspects and it the humankind till date.

Daksha Nair: Swamiji, that explanation was absolutely beautiful. And it really stood out to me how you said that the Ramaina is portrayed in a poetic form. And this is because in psychology, with my research and education. We've learned that emotions often stick more than just words. So that absolutely made complete sense. And with you acknowledging how every single emotion is mentioned in the Ramayana, it helps us learn that there's basically something for everybody within the Ramaina itself, which makes it so inspirational to want to learn about even more. And Swamiji, one of my dreams through the entire project of Ramayana Odyssey is to help others in my generation discover that the Ramayana is not some distant old text, but something that is very deeply relevant to the modern age. in your perspective, ⁓ can today's youth begin to connect with the Ramayana in a living and transformative way?

swami mitrananda: Okay, them in a situation, create a workshop, Create workshop, ⁓ you them, ⁓ give a situation and say what is the ideal response. ⁓ they need to choose between a and selfishness, what is the response? So they need to back and you know like on analysis they will say ⁓ the ideal response is keep the word you gave. you say that's what Ram So create situations, ⁓ and ask them what is the ideal response, debate on it. people will arrive saying, yeah, this was the ideal response. What did was ideal response. See, for example, Bharat was innocent. He had clue of what was happening. And when he back to Ayodhya and saw his father dead ⁓ and was on and there people thinking Bharat wrong. Bharat conspired with Kaikeyi. couldn't take all that and he was shattered. So he said, first thing I need to do is go bring back Ram to I'll it personally. went. Shatrughna joined and everybody joined him. Bharat tried his best ⁓ to Ram to come back. Ram refused. Now Bharat came back. What is the ideal way be a He did not enter the kingdom. He stayed outside, kept the padukas in the throne of Ayodhya, lived like a hermit and he said, now I have got a kingdom of my father. I need to give this to Ram after 14 years. When I give this to Ram, I will make it 10 times larger, bigger, mightier, richer ⁓ then hand over it to Ram. Now you see this. such a beautiful thing ⁓ someone has given it to you. You are a caretaker and you take care of it well. ⁓ expand it, you do it and then you offer it back. So, was of the richest countries at that time. And that Bharat expanded ten times If the cattle wealth was ⁓ when Ram came, he said, ⁓ what father left was much. In 14 years, I have expanded it 10 times and that's my offer. cattle, gold, anything take, ⁓ whatever required for a kingdom, Bharat made that I expanded 10 minimum, ⁓ not double, growing times more. a tremendous task to it in 14 years. A growth can be 3%, 4%. But you are making it ten times bigger. Now that was his gift back to Ram. Now see how ideal. When something has come to you, you did not want it but it came to you and you need to take care of it, you need to protect it, you need to look after it. Then you take care of it so well, you make it much more richer than what it was and then hand it over. Now that's a very beautiful way of taking care and handing it over. You can't find something more ideal than that. Now it's just one simple action. If someone gives us like now see how it is applicable. Your father gives you something you inherit from the parent. Let us say a business you have inherited from your dad. it is no use. Since have inherited expand it. That will be a tribute to your dad, to your parent. So now you see it is applicable. How many families inherit business? And then you expand. Suppose your father has left, let us say, a certain amount of wealth for you. Your job would be like you expand that, not stay with what your father gave you. Now this is a beautiful lesson, what Bharat did. So Ramayan is for all ages. The values are for all people. just that how we connect. ⁓ I would just say create a workshop ⁓ you ask for ideal response at every time. And you'd say, okay, look at this from Ramayan. Look at from Ramayan.

Daksha Nair: That makes perfect sense, Swamiji. And I was just thinking about a couple of things as you mentioned it. First of all, psychology very much agrees with this approach, which I find absolutely incredible, because if you put yourself in an experience, you are most likely to remember it and be able to apply it in the future. And the second thing I was thinking about was your explanation with Parat and the Kingdom. It really reminded me of the part from Advaita Vedanta that says the body is a gift from Bhagavan, so you must take care of it to your absolutely best ability. And that connection just very much popped into my mind, and I thought it was very Very interesting, especially with what you were saying.

swami mitrananda: Advaita Vedanta, to God, ⁓ the should be cleansed. Manashuddhi it called, ⁓ The mind has to cleansed. Except selfless work, there is no other method or deep meditation possible. Otherwise is through selfless seva, gets cleansed. So for Bharat, taking care of the kingdom was worship he to offer it to his brother. So the 14 years was only seva. So now when do 14 years of seva, you are cleansed. That's points out ⁓ as moksha happens. ⁓ Once mind is cleared, shuddhi mukti sadakam. So once mind gets cleansed, only mukti is attained. So 14 years he had an opportunity and used it brilliantly to cleanse that mind. So everyone, Lakshman served. You look at everybody in Ramayan, most of them would have come out and served their best. That cleanses the mind then Mukti possible only after mind being cleansed. ⁓

Daksha Nair: Yeah. Thank you. Absolutely. I think this is one of the things that Ramaina teaches best. We can learn so much from each individual character, which is just another really beautiful aspect of the story. And Swamiji, how much of the Ramana do you feel is still visibly alive in Bharat today? Not only in sacred places or like historical memory, but also through like festivals, rituals, values, art, family life, and so on. So Would you be able to help us understand how deeply the Ramayna is woven into Indian civilization?

swami mitrananda: I'll explain a things. I go a little away from the question, you remind bring me back. and Vyasa had a unique style of writing. Their was to ⁓ very Very inclusive. So Ramayan or Mahabharat, you see, you will find Advaita philosophy. You will find Dvaita philosophy. You will find Vashistha Dvaita. will find a bit of Sankhya, bit of Nyaya, a bit of Yoga. You find everything there. They are all inclusive. It is only a Dvaita. ⁓ Because they seekers are of different levels of evolution. So each one seek ⁓ from their standpoint. when they know each one seeks from their standpoint, the philosophy should reach them. So, Vishishta Dvaita will find Ramayan very authentic. will find Ramayan very authentic. Advaitans find Ramayan very authentic saying, is my way. So, Vyasa's and Valmiki's style all inclusive. ⁓ They have written books that way. So now imagine the they have given, the way in which they described. But for Valmiki's description of Hanuman, or Valmiki's description of Rama, wouldn't have worshipped them as God. They and went, we would have forgotten. But somebody like this, so beautifully written, which has served purpose today. ⁓ Even today, now back to your question, how relevant is it? Are not people anchoring Hanuman even today? Are not people anchoring in even today? Are we feeling the courage and strength of Sita? brave woman she was. So we look at it, is still ⁓ very ⁓ We an anchor. Even today, of people ⁓ hold on Hanuman and ⁓ pass their What a wonderful gift Valmiki gave that we can hold to even today and pass through. ⁓ We can hold on to Ram even today and take our life through, navigate our life on to them. That itself is relevant even today. ⁓ description of Valmiki, ⁓ Hanuman, ⁓ Ram, Sita, Bharat, ⁓ almost place them at worship level. ⁓ have become our anchors in life. ⁓ have become an ideal which we can worship, ⁓ ⁓ and that gives us immense strength. It is serving us to evolve even today. the power of that term poetic

Daksha Nair: Absolutely Swamiji and I found myself very much relating to everything you were saying. I have my Hanumanji necklace that I wear all the time. And like you said, it makes me feel very courageous and stuff. So the way you put it was absolutely beautiful. And Swamiji, this year my family and I are actually visiting Bharat.

swami mitrananda: Okay.

Daksha Nair: And when we go, I actually requested my parents to bring me to Ayodhya for some time because I've always just loved Ramaina and I feel very deeply drawn to Ayodhya itself as a result. So could you help us understand the importance of the Ram Saitu in the larger civilizational and spiritual life Bharat. Yes.

swami mitrananda: ⁓ Now Ayodhya itself. The word means ⁓ no Ayodhya means no conflict. is conflict. Ayodhya means conflict. Where there no conflict, know, ⁓ person who controls his ten Dasaratha, One who manages dasha, of action, organs of perception, he knows to manage them well, his mind not have conflict. Mismanagement of ten creates conflict. Managing them, no conflict. there is conflict in mind, Rama will reveal it himself. That's Ayodhya. when you're going there, go Sarayu river, drop all conflicts, take a dip Sarayu and visit Mandir. It's a lot of struggle temple has come up and also go to place, Nandigram, where lived. also nearby. So make sure that you go there, then you will see that place. So it's a beautiful sacred pilgrim. back to Ram Setu, the mainly Valmiki has given ⁓ is Valmiki's style Ramayan, as I you, is poetry, geographical, historical, geographical, flora fauna. science description of science through narration of Ramayana. example, the fauna described in Ram's setu area. Dhanushkoti. Rameshwaram Dhanushkoti ⁓ exactly the same even today. The of trees grow there, ⁓ the of flowers blossom, all that same. And the description Hanuman wanted to fly, he wanted a hard You can't jump from a land. like a rocket launching, you need hard base. launching pad. Hanuman looks for a stronger mountain and he finds that mountain and then from that he takes a leap. Now when you thrust so much and when you take a leap what all can happen that area ⁓ Valmiki describes. Birds got trees started Imagine suddenly a flying ⁓ and what kind of a disturbance happen around. ⁓ So the birds were disturbed, the trees were shaking, some water came out from rocks. The thrust was so much that the water which was underneath was coming out. So now these kind of descriptions are there. So it's not just that Hanuman went, actually describes ⁓ all can happen suddenly ⁓ you launch a rocket. What can happen when you suddenly go up, ⁓ that and now this is where you see bit of science. bit of poetry, bit of ⁓ fauna, ⁓ ⁓ spiritual lessons to learn. And today if you go to Dhanushkoti, you will chorals. which can float. huge, huge corals which can float. remember getting one for one of our camps. We run a children's camp and was three feet in size, the And we a tub the ⁓ and asked all children to write on it. So every kid wrote Sriram, Sriram, Sriram then we dropped it into the water and it was floating. I had the stone for a very long time in our ashram in Chinmayatarangini. then I felt the better place for it would be Siddabari temple, Ram temple in Siddabari. ⁓ I sent it to Siddabari. Now also that stone, ⁓ stone is in Ram Mandir Siddabari. ⁓ floats. ⁓ ⁓ bridge was made by these kind of floating stuff. So it is poetically written.

Daksha Nair: Mm-hmm.

swami mitrananda: but signs that there are floating corals with which you can tie up and do. and the bridge is real. internet pictures show that, satellite pictures show that and it is man-made structure everybody has accepted and if you fly across Tamil Nadu to Sri you will see an aerial view of the bridge. That is Ram Setu is made by man and it's a very deep symbol of values love. To bring beloved, he built a bridge across the sea. went there and brought her back. So it's a very deep sign, symbol. ⁓ the Jeeva gets connected Ram. When Sita went back, her mind turned towards Ram again. That devotion what she had, a bridge has to come from Paramatma to Jeeva and go back. So Ram Setu is a deeper connection, expression of love and commitment and it is historical even today it standing there. So when you come to Bharat, not only Ayodhya, go to Dhanushkoti.

Daksha Nair: Yeah. Absolutely. story, Swamiji, with the corals, really melted my heart with everybody writing Sri Ram on it. That sounds absolutely beautiful and I would love to see it at some point to go like visit in person. ⁓ ⁓

swami mitrananda: In Rameshwaram, in some temples they have, when you go to Rameshwaram in few temples you will find this stone floating

Daksha Nair: in that's absolutely incredible to me. ⁓ my god. And Swamiji, thank you so so much for sharing all of these insights with ⁓ This has been such a deeply meaningful conversation because ⁓ Ramana is so dear my heart and because your words help all of approach it with such great clarity and inspiration. ⁓ And we would also very humbly seek your continued guidance going forward as ⁓ continue learning our scriptures. And carrying forward efforts like Ramaina Odyssey, it's really heartening for me to see that now we have a youth team in my college that's sincerely interested in learning our scriptures and helping take this message to others. And I also feel very grateful that our listeners, especially our younger ones, are able to receive this wisdom from you, Swamiji.

swami mitrananda: you are talking to university students and they are going to be involved in this, ⁓ take chapter 100.

Daksha Nair: Yes.

swami mitrananda: of Valmiki Ramayan, chapter 100. There are some 75 verses. and Bharat conversation. ⁓ Bharat goes to forest to bring back Ram.

Daksha Nair: Okay.

swami mitrananda: So Sarga 100, chapter 100, this conversation I can forward link. ⁓ This a pure science of management, administration, governance. questioning Bharat. As a king, you taking care of this, ⁓ this, ⁓ this, this? What of you need to select? ⁓ What kind of time you have to spend? When is the ideal time for you to think about your country? you indulging in excessive sleep? Are denying yourself ⁓ the sleep? A king not do all this. You know that ⁓ And early mornings, you spending time about your day? Are you very clear when have to announce your projects? You should know when to announce. should not announce too early.

Daksha Nair: Mm-hmm.

swami mitrananda: When you very sure of happening you should do it. you have a spy ⁓ every department of your governance who be loyal ⁓ and are the qualities a person should have ⁓ to a spy who will come back and report to you ⁓ and says ⁓ have more spy who will spy only these guys ⁓ who spy the spies and report you. So it's a brilliant conversation on management, ⁓ 75 verses are there. So that portion of Ramayan, which can of great value for ⁓ with the Those are looking at ⁓ looking at governance, leadership.

Daksha Nair: Mm-hmm.

swami mitrananda: this conversation between Bharat and Ram is an absolute delight to read.

Daksha Nair: Thank you so much for that specific chapter, Swamiji. I'm definitely gonna be looking into it more. And To our listeners, thank you so much for being with us in this episode. And we hope this conversation helps you approach the Ranlina not just as a sacred story from the past, but as a living source of strength, wisdom, belonging, and direction. So if you do find this episode meaningful, please do share your thoughts with us in the comments. And feel free to share this episode with others who might benefit from it. And you can follow the Ranlina Odyssey Podcast on YouTube, Spotify, and Apple Podcast. if this journey is meaningful to you, ⁓ help us take the message of the Ramaina to more seekers. ⁓ next time, let's keep deeply, ⁓ keep sincerely, ⁓ and walking this sacred path together. J. She Ram. ⁓

swami mitrananda: Yes,