speaker-0: Welcoming you back. It's your boys, Nick T and Chris Z and ⁓ another ep of another slice. And so to dive in, we thought we would first congratulate ourselves because we are streaming live now on the proverbial radio, which is really Spotify and check us out and listen listen to us and and have fun and relive the glory of Twin Peaks. Chris, you you start. Let's jump in and do a little who wrote and directed this.

speaker-1: Hi everybody. Okay. So this is it's so I guess it's it's the name of the episode that they came up with was r is Realization Time, is that right? And it's episode six or seven, depending on six seven, depending on but it was written by Harley Payton. He's this is like the second of one of his many that he did. And then it's directed by Caleb Dechanel. This is the first of I think he did three overall. And he's really

speaker-0: Related to Chloe and Mary Beth.

speaker-1: He's the mother well he's married to Mary Jo, who plays Mary. Yeah. And both of them are the parents to Zoe and Emily DeCanel.

speaker-0: My humble berry queen. Q Mary Mary J. Blige family affair.

speaker-1: So then yeah, that's all I wanted to I mean this I guess I was gonna say this first aired on May seventeenth, nineteen ninety. Lifetime ago.

speaker-0: Nineteen ninety. Well Yeah, I guess so. And yet here we are. And that's one thing that I do have to say when we going through this a a sort of ⁓ topic that's come out of it for me that I didn't really realize w going in is just the way that art evolves over a lifetime, the way that you can enjoy art over your whole life and how it can constantly be changing for you. Like we've talked about when you're Younger and see things more through the kids' eyes now at the adults' eyes. And it's just interesting to see that you can really spend a lifetime with a piece of art, especially one as rich as the

speaker-1: It's also I keep marveling at how y you can watch a sh an episode of a show or a movie or a scene and you've seen it so many times and then all of a sudden you r spot something that you're like, ⁓ that I never even really noticed that before but it was something that was intentional and there all all along. So it's nice when something has so much to give.

speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. And I feel grateful that I have a friend to watch it with. Because this is the first time in my life that that's been the case and it's nice. Yeah. Well, so speaking of friends friends waiting around hotels, ⁓ segue into we have Cooper hern returning home to find a ⁓ a dazzling looking Audrey waiting for him in nothing but a sheet and I won't even say a smile because she's had a sad interview when she saw Leland's

speaker-1: Crazy, yeah, I agree.

speaker-0: And she's crying in the corner and she runs to Coop for comfort. So he comes in and there she is in nothing but a sheet and that is our welcome to the Great Northern. How are you feeling at at this interval?

speaker-1: But he is he I feel like Cooper's using the gentlest of voices in this scene, the way he's talking to her is just soft and s soothing and understanding. But I feel like he he's really setting he sets the bar for in the scene for Cooper just being like a a true gentleman with in in terms of how he's treating her compared to how we s what we'll see later in the episode even in here how grown men may not Other grown men might not handle a situation with a teenage girl such as Laura Palmer. But he and he even has a a handkerchief thing to offer her for her tears. And but but it's yeah, he it's funny how he doesn't really deny that he's interested though.

speaker-0: Yeah. No. You know what it basically says, it's a truism that I wrote. This really does hit and because it's true to this day in so many contexts where he's like what I w what I want and what I need aren't the same thing. Yeah I mean and so he says he's a basically conceding, Yeah, of course I'm attracted to you, but like and I might want that, but that that's not the course of action that Yeah. I was just like, That really is a truism, isn't it? It's like ⁓

speaker-1: Yeah, go that way.

speaker-0: Yeah, it's like the stone song can't always get what you want, but get what you get what you need. So yeah, I was but yes, truly a gentleman and kind and agrees to spend the the night talking about their problems over milkshakes, which is very sweet.

speaker-1: Yeah, that's what I was I was thinking like the like the missing pieces of this episode, like the stuff in between the scenes that we don't see. So they the idea that that's in the world of the show, they actually they got their two malts and fries, and Audrey told Cooper all her troubles all night long. I was imagining that there's probably fan fiction out there for someone someone writing a scene with the two of them. The script actually is a funny it the script st starts it starts with the two of them, but it doesn't pick up directly in the hotel room still. It picks up the next morning and they're in the dining room having breakfast together. And it's got some of the same dialogue about the about secrets being dangerous and Laura having secrets and Cooper wanting to find them out and everything. But it's funny how it doesn't pick up right where we left off. I I think the version that we get is the more satisfying thing to follow up on to see the that conversation, that immediate conversation. But it was it was funny to see it's funny to see where It might have started out in the creative process.

speaker-0: It evolved. Well then we go to a ⁓ a frostier reception where we have Lucy giving Andy the cold shoulder when we don't know yet, and spoiler free, but we'll find out why soon enough as they are playing with their new friend, the Southeast Asia Minor Bird. Waldo.

speaker-1: Waldo. I like how the when they're yeah, they're trying to get Waldo feeling more comfortable and healthier so that he'll talk 'cause minor birds can mimic what they've heard. ⁓ The doc asks Cooper if he wants to try feeding the the bird and Cooper just says I don't like I don't like birds. He's very he's so serious about it.

speaker-0: Also, how about Doc Hayward is of course the bird sick and dehydrated because of course he knows midwifery, autopsy, common colds, and veterinary services. I was like, Of course Doc Hayward also is the local vet. He is a jack of all get this man a stethoscope. He is ready.

speaker-1: And then the Hawk comes in with the forensics report confirming that at Jacques Cabin that Laura, Ronette, and Leo were all there. And then there's the photo of Laura's shoulder with Waldo resting on it. And we get Cooper sets up his tape recorder, the voice activated tape recorder to try and s to pick up what Waldo might say while they're not there. And then yeah, there's a lot of clues and a lot of s table setting that happens here. They find out they get the chip they find out that the the plastic inside Laura matches a chip from one eye jack's. And so they're gonna go investigate at One Eye Jack's to try to find out about Jacques 'cause he works there too.

speaker-0: Yeah. And I can't I'll wait until we get to that scene, but I made an observation that's sort of of Ed's costume that sparked a thought in me, but I'll share I'll share when we get there. Yeah, so we have and then cut two as we're talking about how the and this is like the classic, I feel like crime taper red herring where it's like all the evidence is pointing towards Jacques and Leo, which means they for sure did not do it. Yeah. Right? 'Cause that's usually like

speaker-1: Much that way.

speaker-0: They're laying it on so thick, pointing to these two. Although we do understand that they are just generally really bad dudes. Yeah. But did they murder Laura? I feel like the more they want us to think it, the less likely it is, but we'll see, right? So w Leo is very very barely hidden out of view spot in his house, and Shelley and Bobby are making out in the doorway. It's like he's literally holding up a branch and it's I'm like, this is not a discreet hideout. ⁓ shit, and I just realized I'm wearing my one eye jacks T shirt.

speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah, sister got me that

speaker-0: This for Christmas a couple years ago, so I'm in the spirit. I I tried to find one of those costumes the girls wear. It was i I wasn't able to source it in time.

speaker-1: Yeah, go to what's it? Spirit Halloween. Yeah.

speaker-0: What it is upon us, right? It is upon us. But no, yeah, so here we have a barely hidden Leo, Shelly and Bobby getting it on, Bobby kind of sauntering up with lots of swagger, ⁓ i looking great as always. I always have to give a a a moment to swoon over Bobby Briggs. Swag.

speaker-1: I don't remember I don't remember how old the actor was. But he pla he does he play I every time I see that character, he I I recognize him so much of a high school kid like that age, 'cause the way he walks and carries himself and

speaker-0: Hold on, I am gonna Google Ashra age in Twin Peaks. Let's see. He was tw approximately twenty one to twenty two.

speaker-1: Okay, so pretty close. And then he so Shelly's she's really intense in this scene when she's laying out how she shot Leo and how scared she is. And of course Bobby is saying he's gonna handle everything. He's always gonna he's he's like an overly confident reassurer of being able to handle everything. And then we and we see so Leo is watching I don't understand why he has a police

speaker-0: Yeah.

speaker-1: radio thing in his truck that he can hear what the police are saying, that he's just and not only that, wh who Lucy's talking to on the thing about the bird. But it's perfect 'cause Leo needs to hear that so he can go

speaker-0: I it is very similar to what's to Donna being at the house where they were drawing the picture of Bob. Some of these things it's just 'cause he needed to know.

speaker-1: We need yeah, we need this information to pass to these ears. But then also that's what I guess if he hadn't h heard about Waldo the bird, then he would have potentially shot at Bobby ⁓ on his way out. So Yeah.

speaker-0: Thanks, Waldo. You know Giving giving his of his self to others. Truly. Well, and then we cut over to the Hayward house. And so this scene is always interesting because to me it's very fun and interesting and very film noir watching Maddie listen to Laura on tape with James and Donna. She's really settling into Laura's life and and we know her arc and no spoilers, but it is very sort of film noir of that double indemnity or Hitchcocky and even of the beautiful woman and her twin and and what's gonna happen who who's good, who's evil. I don't know. It definitely gives me both soap opera and also film noir, watching her almost settle into Laura's life.

speaker-1: Yeah. There's definitely a lot of noir imagery in in this episode in particular that we'll see with a lot of the voyeurism that we get. But the I was when they're listening to the tape of L Laura talking to Dr. Jacoby, I was thinking about how it is this is where I was thinking about with the w with the parallel to Cooper and Audrey at the beginning of the episode where and then in this case it was it's Laura talking to Dr. Jacoby. She's clearly coming on to him in a way with like I like I'm talking to you before I go to bed, I'm gonna have all these dreams and everything and it's and she talks about how she's like attractive to old older men and all this stuff and and this is where I was thinking how that if if the other men in Twin Peaks were to be as upstanding, maybe as Cooper, to resist something like that. But of course it's it is Twin Peaks and there are forces at play that don't have decency on their mind, so

speaker-0: Well and it's even I remember Cheryl Lee said this when we were at the speaking tour. I remember saying because I remember the the moderator asking her, Do you think if people had paid better attention, maybe Laura could have been saved? And her view was that yes, that there were all these signs. And if you listen, sometimes it's just a whisper, but in Laura's case it really was a crying out. And unfortunately no one was inclined to help, most of them were just inclined to take advantage. That's they all one person killed her, but everyone everyone to Bobby's point at the funeral played a role.

speaker-1: Yeah. And then so they see there's an empty cassette tape c the case for the cassettes dated the night that Laura died. And they figure J Jacoby must have that tape. And are these tapes that she record 'cause they have a bunch of tapes there, is that right? Are they tapes that she recorded but did not s give him? Or are they tapes he did he give them back to her or?

speaker-0: Wait, I think it's I think that he ⁓ it must have been maybe I don't know. When I'm really thinking about it, 'cause we know where she was hiding them, but it does presuppose that she would be like taping them to send to him, right? If they had multiples. So that I don't know, we may have to read it that one a bit.

speaker-1: 'Cause 'cause later on when they we'll get to it, but the when they call Jacoby, I was wondering is like had he heard that particular tape that we're hearing at the beginning of this or what? But anyway, they realize so they think he's got the missing tape. And I was thinking how James is quite quick here. He comes up with the plan to get the tape from Jacoby and that they'll lure him out. And he d it's n it's very un James like to be

speaker-0: Yeah, 'cause usually he's such a dumbass, right? And you're right. It was a little that that would maybe have been more co better continuity to have Donna come up with it. Yeah. Yeah. 'Cause she's usually the brains of the operation. But

speaker-1: Let's see here. Shall we move on to

speaker-0: Audrey giving major attitude for Hume Counter really reinforces it really reinforces to me that she would have been better in gift wrapping. I think that she would have been better in gift wrapping. She is not cut out to interact with snotty old rich ladies. But yeah, she's great. It's it's fun watching her. I had ⁓ I laughed out loud with her lighting a cigarette in the manager's office and then continuing to smoke it in the closet. He's like pimping out this girl. It's like it's so funny.

speaker-1: And then even at the end she like she drops the cigarette on the floor of the closet and stunts So he's like at some point he's gonna come in there and and be like, What the fuck is this?

speaker-0: Yeah, I just Yeah, yeah. She's going I don't give a fuck.

speaker-1: And the ⁓ she goes in the and she's snooping around in there and she but she knows that the manager guy asked to s to see the other girl and then Audrey goes she goes to the bathroom or something. But it's so so basically though there's nobody manning the ⁓ perfume can't all this is all going on.

speaker-0: Yeah, there are angry denizen, female denizens of Twin Peaks, hungry for expensive perfume, and all these girls can think about is prostitution. Really disappointing. It's disappointing.

speaker-1: the world coming to. But this when she is in the closet watching this is more of that the voyeurism that I was mentioning and the noir game. And then the blinds, the this is it's also very much right out of blue velvet too, 'cause ⁓ Kyle McLaughlin in the closet.

speaker-0: Smoke. Claudia, you're right. Very same imagery, huh? Yeah.

speaker-1: And then so Audrey learns about how this guy is helping to recruit people the the girls to work at When I Jack's. He gives her a business card to call the he says ask for black rose, who I guess is the funny thing in the script I saw that it was in instead of saying black rose, it was special ed, which is weird. And I imagine it would be confusing 'cause of big ed too being

speaker-0: Black Euros. Maybe that

speaker-1: But I don't know what so at the when she eventually gets the later when she gets the phone number from the coworker, sh in the script, she calls and she asks for special ed. And I was like, This is

speaker-0: I get what they're doing there with special education. Right? It's like a a special education all right. But Yeah. But yeah, it probably did. They were sort of like, well, that's maybe one ed too many. Maybe we'll just stick with Blackie.

speaker-1: I like the when Audrey's looking through the little notebook thing and it's got all the names and dates and there's this weird rating system with hearts, little hearts next to the names. And Ronette has four hearts, so she was I guess she had a lot of

speaker-0: It's sales girl. But it is hard watching again, it's coming back to that the way that art changes over a li it's so hard when you are older as a dad watching this disgusting sleaze, like recruiting girls to be prostitutes that probably are like could be his daughter's age. It just lands differently when you're like it's the same kind of thing of no one helped Laura, they all just took advantage. And it's the same kind of thing. It's like here's this guy actively helping corrupt high school kids, high school girls. It's just sad.

speaker-1: And they're just and they're just they're growing up and going out into the world and trying to navigate things while people are trying to take advantage of them.

speaker-0: Which I guess is real life, but sad. Yeah.

speaker-1: Onto the R Diner.

speaker-0: The diner I have I'll talk more about it in spoilers, but it's just how it lands differently this diner scene when I watch kind of spoiler free, but when you just see the the lifetime path both of them have ahead of them of choosing the wrong man. You know what I mean? Or always being drawn towards the or found in a situation with not the best guy. It's the it's having just been watching the return and then dipping back to this episode. I'm like, God, this is like this is a life sentence for these

speaker-1: Yeah. The ⁓ yeah, Hank is this is a very this is I guess it starts off this is w one of those scenes that has a bunch of different steps to it. And it starts off with Hank really running like at least sh he's sharing with Shelly what prison life is was like. And thanks her for helping Norma through rough times. But he's he's clearly trying to fish for ed not special ed, but big ed. He and then he when he's still I forget, did we talk about this before?

speaker-0: Yeah. Information. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

speaker-1: Well, not on the podcast, but when he steals the lighter that the customer left

speaker-0: ⁓ yeah, the zippo. We haven't talked about that, but I did notice it. I was like, Why is he why did he lift that?

speaker-1: Is it just 'cause he's a thief? Yeah, I don't know.

speaker-0: Yeah. I didn't know if there was more to it than that. Like when he first lifted it, I like, Was he trying to get prints of someone?

speaker-1: I I remember it coming back.

speaker-0: Maybe it was like ⁓ a little bit of a MacGuffin, maybe he lifted it with the idea of ⁓ maybe I was gonna say maybe he lifted it with the idea of leaving it at a different crime scene to scrame someone else. Yeah. But I don't know if they ever do I don't remember them ever

speaker-1: I there is a ⁓ some arson planned but

speaker-0: Yeah, so yeah, too big.

speaker-1: But then so we have Truman and Cooper enter and Hank is being like super f fr playing friendly with Truman, but Truman's not having any of it. I one thing I thought was interesting was when I'm reading the book The Secret History of Twin Peaks, it it mentions how there's one section that talks about tw the more recent history of Twin Peaks and that basically ⁓ just to jump to the end of what I'm trying to get out, that Hank was once a bookhouse boy.

speaker-0: Yeah.

speaker-1: That there's a thing that says that the how the bookhouse boy bookhouse boys started with I think with Truman's father. And then it mentions that in the year nineteen sixty eight or something like that. The whole starting lineup for I think the high school football team was all bookhouse boys and it listed listed them all. And Hank was one of them. But the weird thing I'm trying to

speaker-0: Yeah.

speaker-1: It says it it listed all the names. It was Harry Truman and then what's in the return? Frank Truman, Hawk. I think it even and Jerry Jerry was on the team as a special. I think it said that Ben Horn was like a ⁓ a manager or something like that. There was somebody else. ⁓ Ed. And then it mentioned that not that he was part of the team, but that Pete was apparently the boot the most the biggest booster that the team had.

speaker-0: On vet tracks.

speaker-1: But so basically my point is that Truman and Hank have clearly they've known each other their whole lives probably. And I guess Tr Truman was probably involved in Hank going to jail and everything and he he says here how he doesn't believe people can change and he's just not gonna let it go. And Cooper Cooper's pretty quiet, just kinda watching this until and then Shelley comes over and like all of a sudden Cooper kinda lights up. And tr

speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

speaker-1: Truman wants to go back just get back to work, but this is where we're we get one of one of the famous lines of the show Cooper the Cooper Ism every day, once a day, give yourself a present.

speaker-0: Yeah, and it's really it's very meta because it's more like once a week, but it's ⁓ the treat for us actually is watching Twin Peaks, right? Talk about it and download and digest it. But it is it is a tr ⁓ a nice Cooper true.

speaker-1: Yeah. It I feel I assume that something like that is also a lynchism. You can imagine that was like something that was I love watching the one watching the return. especially 'cause Lynch is in it so much. There's so many little and seeing him with Laura Dern in particular and knowing that they're almost like a father daughter kind of thing in real life and it's can you imagine how fun that was.

speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah, and the scenes where even though there's not a ton of them, but where it's Gordon Cole's with Laura Dern and with Cooper, or with Kyle McGaughlin, the three of them sharing that same space. God, what a unit, what a trio. What a lot of magic they've created together. Yeah. Invitation to love. There's a treat every day. We have here we have Nadine who's drowning her despair and bonbons because turns out the patent attorney has told her. There's no chance of her silent drape runners. And here we see Ed's being really sweet. He's just see constantly reminded that Ed's just a fundamentally good dude. Here's Nadine kinda inconsolable, and there he is consoling her and telling her, Don't you give up, Nadine. Yeah. Don't you give up on your Drape runners. It's nice. Yeah.

speaker-1: There go. He sees her pain and he's there for her. Yeah, they hear cheese like.

speaker-0: Their relationship and why he never walks away from her. It's like he sees that pain in her and he w almost wants to fix her, right?

speaker-1: Yeah. He I like her she I had all these plans, a new TV, a motorboat

speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. It is the kind of thing when you think you might win the lottery, the plant it's cute. It's a nice scene. Yeah.

speaker-1: And then we we go to the the Blue Pine Lodge.

speaker-0: Walking Josie is a walking red flag. She is a walking red flag. She lies to Truman. Then under duress, clearly she wanted to talk about it, to confesses she's staking out Catherine and Ben, but she was totally trying to hook him with her like, no, I wasn't there. And then she's like, ⁓ please don't ask me. All right. And then it's she's just giving real again, she's just giving real classic femme fatale. Noir. She Joan Chen crushes it. She crushes every scene. She chews the scenery, right? But I do have to say I wonder in a scene like this what Isabella Rossellini would have done with it. I can picture Dorothy Vallins kind of having this like, ⁓ they're after me. You can hear I I because originally she was the one who was supposed to play this role. So I do. I am very glad it was Joan Chen, but this role scene in particular, I'm like, ooh, I bet Isel Isabella Rossellini would have done this just.

speaker-1: Exactly. Yeah, they're they both would be gr are great options. So it'd be it's fun to have to imagine the other version.

speaker-0: Yeah. We can do it now. Now we can actually see what it would have been like. We pop it in and see what she would have looked like. Funny.

speaker-1: Wow. That's I heard a there's a there's some podcast, I forget which one it w I think it might have been might be part of ⁓ Mubi, but there was like something about the the the women of Lynch movies and things like that. And it had a lot of interviews. I haven't listened to all of it, but there was I think the first one was an interview with Isabella Rossellini talking about her experiences with with Lynch and how I guess it was I don't know when they stopped being a couple. Like yeah, well, in terms of when Twin Twin Peaks was happening, but she she comments about how like they broke up and then they didn't work together again after that. But like she she still like has only like good things to say about him, but she was like she's like, I wish we could've kept working together but after we broke up it just that was just wasn't gonna go in that way.

speaker-0: Yeah. I remember her giving like a like an interview after he died and just being really crying and just saying, ⁓ thank you. I just I loved him so much. And so I'm so heartbroken. And I was like, Well that's a nice and if you feel that way about an ex, that's they must have shared something really nice.

speaker-1: Yeah. I mean she's she I think she's pretty pretty amazing. And yeah. So many so many men were qu very much enraptured by her, you know, wanting to to to date her.

speaker-0: Yeah, and I mean, excuse me, how about her fucking role in Death Becomes Her? She was so good as like the magician woman with nothing but like a chain on.

speaker-1: That might have that might have been the first time I saw her in something. I don't remember Me too. 'Cause the age I was and all that. Yeah, when that came out, Who is this?

speaker-0: Yeah, I'm bombshell, but little did we know she was this bombshell and model and lynch girl. But like yeah, to me that was my first, you know, it was like eighth grade. That was my first encounter with her.

speaker-1: Have you seen the movie Big Night? It's Stanley Tucci. The movie that he I he is a f I mean a few people, but I I like to watch it. It's a good like it's not set during Thanksgiving, but it's a good Thanksgiving movie because it's a big like food movie. And he Stanley Tucci and what's the act the actor, Tony Shaloub, who is from they play they play these two brothers that they're Italian but living in New York in the

speaker-0: No. Good one.

speaker-1: I wanna it's like the fifties or something like that. And they've got a struggling restaurant, and they're trying to get the the Tony Shaloub is the is the chef, and Stanley Cucci is kind of like the manager, and they're and they have opposing views on how to do things, and they come up with this one night to try to they think they're gonna get a big actor to come and have dinner and they're trying to use that to drum up publicity. But anyway, Isabella Rossellini plays kind of like a mistress of sorts to Stanley Tucci. Like she's married to a rival b restaurant owner. But she's she's wonderful in Big Knight. Anyway, I highly recommend Big Knight. This it's like

speaker-0: I mean look, I'm always happy to brush up on some older school filmography and certainly anything involving Isabella Rossellini as a line. Including that new AI pilot of her as Giovanna Packard that I'm going to make. That was originally the character's name, Giovanni. ⁓

speaker-1: Wait, I wanna see.

speaker-0: AI AI fails. Wait, so Coop this is the part. Coop and Truman getting ready to go undercover at One Eyed Jacks. Coop looking like James Bond. Good. And then Big Ed, it's so funny. He just I it's like he really is looks like. a seventies porn star. And you know what it really was? I was like, he looks like Burt Reynolds and Burt Reynolds was the guy in the best little whorehouse in Texas with Dolly Parton. And I'm like, this can't be on accident. This can't be an accident.

speaker-1: It's no, that has to be intentional. Right.

speaker-0: 'Cause it looks like Bert fucking Reynolds and then that's like they're going to this like the Black Lodge whorehouse in Texas, like the the reverse version of it, and there's Burt Reynolds. I was just like that's the first time I ever noticed it, but I was like this had to have been in

speaker-1: Yeah. And I I mean when they made this it wasn't like too long after. It's not like it's not like this is like s is like some like decades old thing that they were That's so funny. Yeah, no, he ⁓ definitely with the with once he once he has the wig and the mustache on

speaker-0: Right. So good. I mean it's so good. He is just a really but they really were giving him the the Burt Reynolds, you know, porn star seven, Magnum PI makeover.

speaker-1: Yeah. The yeah, so yeah, Cooper and is f well I mean, this is a kind of a weird thing about the Cooper meets up with Truman and Ed and they mention that Hawk is waiting outside. But then later on we're gonna see that they they go from there to the police station bef but before going to and so I was just like, I mean, why did we why did they just not meet at the police station? But we I g we do get while we're here, we see Audrey after they all head out, Audrey Cooper and she she's leav leaves a phone message for him. I always no noticed in the script here there's a few things that happen here that are not in the show where after she call tries to get Cooper, she then calls Donna's house in the script, trying to I guess c connect with Donna 'cause they they'd made a plan to kind of

speaker-0: Yeah, some Like keep each other in the loop. Yeah.

speaker-1: And she get only gets Doc Hayward on the phone and says to like just let her know I called. So it's like another person she's trying to reach out to. And then this is this is like the crazy, crazy thing. Audrey's we'll we'll see her eventually in the hallways of the Great Northern, but in the script right here, she's walking through the hallway and she hears she walks by her dad's office and she hears her brother inside. She then goes into her secret hiding space. And it's another scene of it's J Jacoby is with Johnny and what's her f and the and the mom is there too, Mrs. Horn. And they're basically having like a therapy session and Audrey's and Ben's not there. And then the is it okay that I'm telling you? I guess it's okay I'm telling you. This is I guess a bunch of stuff. It's a weird so he's he has he says some really like moving stuff ⁓ Jacoby does to to Johnny to try to calm him down about like what happens when you die and how like you hear it's like hearing a s you hear a song that you've always like known but not been able to like to to place and finally you get to hear and you say how like now Laura can now hear that song and she's singing it and you know it's it's like this weird, kind of beautiful, soothing, kind of like nice way to think about like what happens.

speaker-0: And it got cut all together, huh?

speaker-1: Yeah, and then there's even more. Jacoby then pulls the mom aside and Audrey hears the mom say that when Audrey first came home from like and she was st like crawling and stuff, that Johnny was so such a great brother and Lay loved her. But at some point they were all they were at the top of the stairs and a baby Audrey was trying to stand up and she wound up accidentally pushing Johnny down the stairs. And that the mom thinks that that that's what caused Johnny to be in the state he's in. And then Audrey hears this while in her hiding spot and she's all of a sudden like devastated. And then she runs off, but she doesn't hear Jacoby continue saying how like whatever's going on with Johnny is not from that. It's he it's he's there's some kind of trauma that he had when he was younger. And if we can get to the bottom of the trauma, then we might we might be able to bring Johnny kind of back to the way he was. But Audrey doesn't hear Jacoby say that part. So anyway, there's like kind of this like I was reading that in the script and I like, Holy crap, there's like so much stuff.

speaker-0: Like a lot of guilt. They must have just decided they didn't want to do that to her. Yeah. Because that's that's heavy. That's but that could have been, you know, they maybe were setting it up if the seas if the series had had a longer run, might have been interesting in a third or fourth season to see a different like a Johnny Horn coming out of that. Right. sort of catatonia, but well that is and it also kind of ties back in too like with the Josie comment about like the haunting melody and then there's always music in the air and yeah, I mean there could have been there could have been some tie in there, but it's that part it would have been nice if it made it in.

speaker-1: Yeah. I I love all the I'll like comment on something and then you you you f you you find a way to pull it into something else it in the in another thing that I never thought of so I

speaker-0: Well, that's what's nice about talking about it was yeah, I mean it does, it reframes a lot of the way you think about it. But that's I always, you know, I I hear it in my head like some haunting melody and so now I'm always acutely aware of like a song reference or something to see what he might be doing. So no, that's a pretty scene. Although I'm glad Audrey didn't hear that 'cause, you know, she goes through it now.

speaker-1: Yeah, especially where she's going.

speaker-0: Yeah, she doesn't need it. ⁓ here we go. J ⁓ now this scene is pretty is pretty good with we have ⁓ Catherine learning she's been double crossed by ⁓ sort of an ambitious insurance man. Kind of like senses maybe something was up, comes looking for in-person signatures. Yeah. And this is where Catherine sees that Josie and Ben have taken out this policy on her life and that it's she's not. burning the mill, she's she's gonna be burned with the mill. So that's the double cross.

speaker-1: Yeah. W did I'm trying to I was trying to remember were Catherine and Ben plotting to have Josie get killed in their scheming? It was just to like have her kinda lose the mill and burn it down and

speaker-0: Yeah.

speaker-1: So it's interesting how this is this is a plot to like have K Catherine die.

speaker-0: And that's almost like a ratcheting up of like, ⁓ you th you've been thinking Katherine's bad but Josie's like real bad. You know what I mean? Like she wasn't just gonna frame her and send her to jail, she's gonna fucking kill this lady.

speaker-1: Yeah. And she and she and she reali so she realizes that she's being double crossed and then she finds that her hid that hidden book is gone. And I I love the the gasp that she has when she sees that the that book is missing.

speaker-0: knows her goose is cooked. And I like when she's like, Think, Catherine, think. Like she knows she's on borrowed time and she's gotta really be wily if she's gonna make it kinda through the night, you know.

speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah, it's c it's it's fun. There's like you say, ratcheting up going on. Yeah. And then so we have this brief moment here where we see Audrey slipping the note under Cooper's door. Yeah. Which I liked 'cause we we've already seen the other side of that in terms of him getting a note from her. And then of course this note that she slips will be like a major plot point in season two. Finding that note. And then we have some right the sheriff's department with them finished. This is where

speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah.

speaker-1: Ed gets his his Purt Reynolds.

speaker-0: His Vert Reynolds take over. I just I just love it. It's so good. It's so good. And then ⁓ you know, I have to say we we cut to poor Waldo regains his voice only to be slaughtered. But I have to say the blood spattering on the donuts is so it's such evocative imagery and it is actually how I feel when I succumb to a plate of donuts. As if there is my own Blood spatter at the so my soul spattered on the donut. So when I saw it, I was like, that is exactly how I feel when I eat a plate of donuts. Like so that that really was spoke to me. But yeah, I I just love that where it's like the I don't know, something about that particular frame with like the blood on the donut.

speaker-1: It's very it shows the ⁓ like the loss the loss of innocence in a way that's going on too with the town and like the like their their donut spread that they would have every night is now just covered in blood. It's kinda and the ⁓ they their their reaction when they walk in they're like somebody shot Waldo. And we we hear ⁓ that Cooper plays that tape back and we hear everything Waldo did. At least Waldo got out all that he got out to ⁓

speaker-0: Waldo. ⁓

speaker-1: Did did you know that that ⁓ I read that Sh Cheryl Lee is the one that did the voice of Waldo? Yeah, that she that she's the one that like says all that stuff and yeah.

speaker-0: Really? Me really? ⁓ that's over? ⁓

speaker-1: But yeah, the I I don't know, I like I w I'd like to have that be like my it's kinda dark to say this, but I guess I'd I'd like to have that as my ring tone.

speaker-0: Okay, that would be good. I feel like it might get ⁓ I feel like your wife might not love that. That's an abrupt wake up every morning.

speaker-1: Well, if I have th my her ringtone when she calls me, that's what she'll never really hear it probably, so

speaker-0: Fair enough. ⁓ I w yeah, I was thinking if you said it as your alarm and that's what she wake up to every day. Alarm It's really soothing. What is wrong with you?

speaker-1: ⁓ Let's see here. So we they go straight from there to the one I Jacks, I guess we

speaker-0: Welcome back to the narrative special Ed Blackie. great great banter with b ⁓ banter with ⁓ Blackie and Ed. I really liked that.

speaker-1: There's a lot of ⁓ innu ⁓ at first it's like baseball innuendo with Cooper and then it's like car repair innuendo with

speaker-0: You're alright. What's his name on it? What do they say their names are? And Barney. You're all right, Barney. ⁓

speaker-1: Fred Fred and Barney. Barney and Fred. I and I like ⁓ I love how she she says that Ed looks like the cop and then Cooper's like, I'm the cop and she just laughs. Yeah.

speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like Yeah, no, I like that whole interaction of the two of them with Bla I mean I I would have loved even like more Blackie in this series. I just feel like she just she just pulls focus every scene she's in.

speaker-1: Yeah, she it's one of those characters where when they when they show up you're you're just like there's there's another like fun, great character to watch. There's another great

speaker-0: You real and you know and on the back of I know you have the album too. If you look on the back of the vinyl, like the case of it has like pi has little thumbnails of all the people who were in it from season one. And there's like it it's fun to see 'cause it does. It has all of the characters. Like it has like Blackie, has like the ⁓ Jerry Horn, like all the people. So it's yeah, I I I don't know why I thought of that when you said it, but it's just sort of like there's a fun ons it's a good ensemble. People with small parts.

speaker-1: Yeah, little

speaker-0: Sort of like a Nadine character. Doesn't get a ton of screen time but like chooses the scenery and really leaves a mark.

speaker-1: Yeah. It's it's a good show.

speaker-0: Yes it is. Yes it is. Really? Yeah, this I I just I I watched that scene twice and then I I but then, you know, watching you know, then we f we sneak to Maddie sneaking out of the house and and Leland sort of catching wind of it and it just sort of sent shivers down my spine thinking how he must feel like, you know, with his daughter had gone out and didn't come back and the f you know, the

speaker-1: We ⁓

speaker-0: the sort of headspace he must be in and also just seeing again I couldn't help but get that film noir vibe of like like double indemnity, you know, like she's taking over the life of the dead girl and like where is that gonna lead her? Like the last girl who who tread this path, you know, was was brutally murdered. You know it it did. And then also just sort of James seeing Maddie as Laura. Yeah. I I love that scene 'cause he really is like at that point he's a stand in for for us, right?

speaker-1: Yeah, I was yeah, I was thinking 'cause it's it's it's really powerful seeing her 'cause it was ⁓ you know it's not Laura, but it is Shirellee, so it's still it still hits like it's like it's Laura.

speaker-0: the first time we've seen her walk and talk not like in a a video flashback and it's like even though it's not her you're like but it is Laura you know what I mean it but it is her it's Cheryl Lee right so it's I I found that to be pretty impactful on this rewatch just the gives you a little bit like there she is.

speaker-1: Yeah. And and it's and it's it's it's s sort of ⁓ f it always feels a bit unexpected because you you know that they're scheming to do something but and you know it's the same actress playing both parts, but you don't necessarily I feel like you ⁓ you don't necessarily know that she's gonna pop out dressed up like that with the wig and everything like that. So it's it's always like like ⁓ wow. And you you understand what they're doing, but it's still it still hits ya.

speaker-0: Feel it. You're like, there's Laura Palmer.

speaker-1: And then let's see here. Okay, we're at the Great Northern

speaker-0: ⁓ I love Ben and Jerry sharing a pint of I love the Horn Boys sharing a pint of ice cream. It was just like again, giving that that vibe of like they've just been like best friends and partners in crime for a lifetime. It's like giving like thirteen year olds sleepover, like you know, ice cream and like watching movies and like making fart noises. It's like so juvenile, you know.

speaker-1: Well. No, they're just yeah, they're just grown men playing playing at grown being grown men and doing all these deals, but with it yet without their parents around to tell them to knock it off. ⁓ and then ⁓ so yeah, they're still g trying to get the Icelanders to sign this deal and then while and then Ben Ben eventually calls Josie. So I guess it's this is c clearly setting up that the plan is to burn the mill t like tonight and that they've got to get

speaker-0: Yeah.

speaker-1: Catherine has to get into they've got to get her into the mill. And but there's a funny thing where it rev there's the reveal that Hank is

speaker-0: There with Josie. And there's the reveal that they've styled Josie to look like Joan Collins from Dynasty. I'm like, is she trying out for the Twin Peaks football team with those shoulder pads? I'm like, she's really packing heat with those. I'm like they're really they were like, you know what we're gonna make her look like? Dynasty. They're like, We will know she is a villain if we dress her like

speaker-1: Lucy. When did s did the shoulder pad thing stop, I guess?

speaker-0: I don't know and it's a shame because I mean really you it people were just safer from falling objects or whatever.

speaker-1: It's I assume it's gonna come back at some point, right? Everything comes back. But ⁓ so Hank ⁓ I mean, I don't rem I don't remember exactly what the next thing is that we see with Hank, but he 'cause he like he's there and he takes his coat off to show he's gonna be sticking around and he like kind of gives a look to Josie, but I don't rem I don't remember exactly where what he's doing there. Yeah.

speaker-0: Yeah. ⁓ Something there because ⁓ it's sort of giving the vibe like he's maybe gonna be the one tasked with helping do the mill or maybe he's just worming his way back into her life.

speaker-1: And whatever she whatever she's gonna get out of this, he he's gonna get All right, and then Audrey we'll get Audrey and Blackie together now.

speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, yeah. ⁓ good pairing. Audrey's decision to to go ⁓ undercover in a brothel known for recruiting underage girls that end up like raped, murdered, and dead is very ill advised. This is an ill advised plan.

speaker-1: She could have if only she could have gotten Cooper or Donna on the phone to like ⁓

speaker-0: ⁓ I know. Don't do it. You know, it was although like yeah, Coop would have said no, Donna probably would have like, Yeah, do it. She's also busy making questionable choices. But yeah, Audrey and Blackie.

speaker-1: ⁓ b sh and she's I love how she's got like a it's basically a job interview audition kind of thing and she has a she has a resume to hand over, like l like let's do in these places where she's worked supposedly.

speaker-0: In the pre in the pre internet era, I'm like, how the hell did she find clubs in Canada to put out her resume?

speaker-1: Yeah. But Blackie sees through all of all of the lies and she but she g she gives Audrey a chance to to prove her worth or her value and she and she does so with a with a cherry stem, tying it with her tongue, which is like if Audrey couldn't be any hotter, like th this is

speaker-0: Really, it's so seductive and campy and absurd and hot. It's like a really, a really good scene. And it's like she names herself Hester Prynn. You know, like the the the whore from Scarlet Letter, right? And it it really it's giving all of that. It's it's just like high camp and also like super sexy. It's a great scene with the two of them. Yep. She gets the j I mean look, anyone who can tie

speaker-1: She and she gets the job.

speaker-0: carry stem into a knot with their tongue should get hired at the brothel. You know what I mean? And looks like Sheryl and Finn, like, give her the job. She's gonna get it. She'll she'll you know, she's gonna pay return on investment.

speaker-1: Meanwhile, Cooper is having is doing really well with his blackjack. ⁓ but Ed is not doing well apparently.

speaker-0: No, but you know what I was gonna say too, just before I I I sort of forgot to mention this, but you are feeling, aren't you feeling the like the nervous energy and the tension starting to rise as everything passes? It's like people are coming closer, like people that we care about are coming closer to like danger now. Yeah. Right? It's like we've we've got Catherine Josie Ben, like someone here is gonna die. Someone here's a bad guy, probably all of them. We've got like here we have Audrey in getting into Blackie's clutches. You know what I mean? We have we have Donna and you know, James and Maddie slash Laura like trying to lure someone who might be the killer out but ⁓ through pretending to be the murdered girl. Like you just feel like I found myself at this point in the episode starting to feel tense. Where I'm like people we care about are like it's coming to like a bit of a crescendo, like people could get hurt.

speaker-1: Definitely. So yeah, when when Ben called Josie and mentioned about it happening tonight, like it really hit me that like we 'cause it each episode is is a new day kind of a thing. And then at this point you're like, ⁓ no, we're we're we're we're getting to the end of like like stuff is is coming to the boil right now. Yeah. And it's yeah.

speaker-0: Realization time as the Germans say, it's realization time.

speaker-1: ⁓ and it's and then and we get Cooper get comes ⁓ face to face with Jacques finally here with the the the thing he's been com going looking for. Yeah. ⁓ but we we won't we don't get their full interaction until the next episode.

speaker-0: And it's very ⁓ this is the first time it's occurred to me after watching this for over three decades, but we have Jacques dealing card at one eye jacks. I'm like, ⁓ that's very on the nose. Jack at Jacks.

speaker-1: ⁓ yeah. Yeah. And then Jack Jacoby, we with Jacoby is there at ⁓ so I like it so so we get so this is thinking how earlier when Nadine was watching Invitation to Love, I was thinking how it's a soap opera, which is often it's women watching it. But here we get a male character watching Invitation to Love. But it's also it's nighttime right now and he's watching it. And I was wondering if th like did he tape the show earlier and he's watching a recording.

speaker-0: Yeah. ⁓

speaker-1: Since usually soap operas are on during the day and I was thinking how it's probably ⁓ maybe as a as a psychiatrist or whatever that he's ⁓ or a therapist, it's maybe lots of his patients watch the show, so he figured it'd be good to be versed in ⁓ in all of that. Yeah I I did I l I ⁓ was w w reading the script. It it s specifically says that he pulls a tape out and puts it in the V C R to watch it. So he is watching a tape recording.

speaker-0: So there you go. And it dovetails in because they're gonna send him the video. Exactly. He's also setting the scene that he's like a you know, a v a VHS user.

speaker-1: Yeah we Yeah. But and then yeah, the the he gets the call. James calls, but then Maddie's and she starts basically talking as though she's Laura. Yeah. Qu ⁓ can imagine how thrown Jacoby must be at f like overwhelmed he must be at first to hear that voice and her say those things when he's like to imagine hearing that after s Laura's b like been buried. But he doesn't he doesn't believe it's her. Like he's he kinda he knows something who he d he believes that there's something up.

speaker-0: Then he sees the video, right? They left him the video of ⁓ Maddie as Laura holding like that day's news. And that's harder to dispute. But then again, cross-reference, Audrey heading to the brothel, like leaving Matt they're like, okay, now let's split up. You stay here alone in the dark, dressed like a girl who was brutally murdered, and we'll head on out. You know what I mean? It just feels like I'm like, I feel like this plan is ill advised.

speaker-1: Paper. Yeah, not yeah. ⁓ yeah, they they tell they tell him to Kobe to meet at Sparkwood in twenty one, which is like that intersection that's keeps cropping back up. And this is this is like a funny thing 'cause we get we reveal Bobby watching. So so he's kind of the voyeur and the

speaker-0: Circles. Yeah. Yeah. Woods also meta and noir, like it's all like interlapping, right?

speaker-1: I mean in the beginning Leo was watching Bobby through the woods and then and then and then all and then we jump out to yeah yet another voyeuristic POV of someone watching Bobby watch these people.

speaker-0: It is. I have that too. It's like we have Bobby spying, Jacoby's on his way, and then someone more sinister even is in the woods around like that the woods around that trellis are hopping. Yeah like or w whatever it is, a gazebo, right? The town gazebo. It is busy.

speaker-1: And has has Bobby I guess he's must have seen her at but like has he met Maddie? I don't remember.

speaker-0: You know, they don't do that, and I felt like they didn't do maybe because they didn't want to pull focus, 'cause they didn't do a thing like it seems like Bobby sees her, but he doesn't really register it. It's almost like he looks past her. You know what I mean? And I guess they just felt like that was gonna pull the it in a direction they didn't need. Like Bob if 'cause if Bobby saw Laura, obviously he'd be like Yeah go speak to her, right? So I guess they were just like, Yeah, we don't need that whole side.

speaker-1: Should focus on James, maybe.

speaker-0: Side Chow.

speaker-1: So then ⁓ see so Jacoby so the plan was for Jacoby to go to Sparkwood in twenty-one while Donna and James sneak into his office and Maddie waits for some reason at the gazebo. But Jacoby watches while he like rewatches the video and he s realizes that the that Maddie is by the gazebo, like the Maddie posting, he sees the gazebo in the video. So he's gonna wind up going to the gazebo instead of Sparkwood in twenty-one. But but so but he does leave, which was part of the plan, and James and Donna do sneak into his office while Bobby stuffs was like a bunch of cocaine in James's motorcycle, like the gas To frame him, I guess.

speaker-0: Yeah, it's like a drug dealer or something. It's sort of like I don't know. Bobby always seems to have through s ⁓ a plethora of coke when he needs it. You know what I mean? It seems to have always be a bag around, so

speaker-1: And then so we we and we end with Maddie at the gazebo and that creepy POV watching her, so leaving us feeling very, very worried about her her safety.

speaker-0: Very unsettled and I just felt like I really was sitting with a as soon as it ended, I felt sort of hit by the notion of like what con what really kind of stuck with me was just that it's such a universal message, but just like being careful what you wish for. You know what I mean? It's like Catherine wanted the mill to burn, Jacoby wanted to see Laura, James and Donna wanting to know what happened to Laura, like Maddie wanting to see the world through Laura's eyes, Audrey wanting to be a grown up, not a little girl. And it's like all of them are getting what they wanted, right? But like it's it's all just sort of Yeah, it just sat with me of being like none of them, they all should have should have been more careful or or or or questioned what they wanted, you know?

speaker-1: Yeah. So it's a really great penultimate episode to the season finale for season one. I've got a few little like spoileries. ⁓

speaker-0: Spoilers, so for those who don't want them, check us out next week. But for those who do, let's get on it.

speaker-1: Okay, my okay, I've got it so I'll just go through what I had, I guess. One one thing that was just an observation was the scene when with James when we first see James and Donna and Maddie in Donna's house, at one point there's the shot from across from the other room and you see the couch and you see them. And I every time we're in that that area and we see that angle, ⁓ I'm always there's I always think about the part where Bob is comes out and he's over the cat like Yeah, and I just feel it even though that hasn't happened yet, right? It hasn't happened yet.

speaker-0: Creeping. No.

speaker-1: It feels yeah, and it's like you feel the ⁓ it's like the evil is just like ever present and just it's and I and I mean I guess the first time you watch the show you wouldn't think that, but like as a thing that you keep coming back to, you just know that it's just it just is there. Which I kinda it's one of the benefits of watching it. Re watching it.

speaker-0: Yeah. Hundred times. Yeah. I mean, and also in the similar vein, like when Maddie is walking out and you see Leland's reaction, the first time you see it, it's sort of like you you think of like a father scared, like could it happen again or just delusional? But then once you know and and seeing fire walk with me, he he acts a lot of the same way, right? You know meetup to Laura's murder. Like when he sees her, that sort of like it's like that. the insanity, you know, and and you know, it really gave me kind of chills seeing it because it just reminded me of like when he sees her sneak out and firewalk with me and he's he he he then you know follows and murders her, right?

speaker-1: Yeah, the when I see him sitting there I can imagine on like on the one hand you can imagine a father in the the grief that he's in after losing his daughter and he can't sleep at night and he's just sitting in a dark room with his thoughts and his memories and then he notices Maddie leaving. But then there's the other side that I'm like, is that is that Bob? sitting there and like he's in he's in a bob state and and watches her go and it's and then is he is it do we f find out that he's the one that is the creepy POV at the end?

speaker-0: We never do, but like

speaker-1: Well there's something that that there's something where I think in season two Jacoby comments on how he smells like burnt motor oil or something like that when he was

speaker-0: That's the smell of Bob. So it must have been him. You're right.

speaker-1: Yeah. I th I they never explicitly say it, but I think that that's but it but again, if that's who that was and they see Maddie dressed up like Laura. I mean that's the last P that's the last like thing that we're seeing in this episode. That's like kind of a crazy bit to thing for them to to be seeing.

speaker-0: You know what I mean? But also like that's why I'm like it just feels ill advised to play dress up as the murdered girl. I get it. But like it's like, you know, she is just if she wasn't already a target, right? Certainly walking i in in and breathing like she's Laura is gonna make her one.

speaker-1: Yeah.

speaker-0: What yeah, at night alone. Alone. You know, one of the spoilers for me is that I really noticed that it's like the juxtaposition of when you see how kind Coop was with Audrey, it makes also the conduct of like Mr. C i in the postseason two world and in the return so much more jarring when you know that you know he ultimately goes to the I see you and rapes her. You know what I mean? When she's in a clean And it's like you see how gentle he was and letting her down easy and how much he cared for her. And then when you see his doppelgang or what he does to to her, sort of it's the same with Diane, when Diane tells the story about with Mr. C and how, you know, the guy really is, you know, the the inverse of co

speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah, that's the that's the like that sad thing. Cooper's Cooper going like or at least ⁓ an a that aspect, the double game.

speaker-0: Yeah. When you think of the way he hurt people that Cooper loved, which which Mr. C did. You know, he burned all of his bridges and hurt anyone he could, right? But that's part of the arc. I mean

speaker-1: Yeah. It's dark. Dark. Yeah. What so okay, another spoilerish thing is with Ed and Nadine, when when Ed comes home to Nadine while she's watching Invitation to Love, this is one of the things where I never really noticed it before. Nadine is on the couch and as he's walking up to her, she's looking at her wrists. And while I was watching I I was and I was thinking hindsight, is that her thinking about suicide? Because she's gonna

speaker-0: Killing this.

speaker-1: attempt to commit suicide overdose on pills in the next episode.

speaker-0: Next episode. I'm gonna rewatch that. I didn't notice that.

speaker-1: Well, I I I looked at the script and it's it explicitly says it says she's she checks she that she she's looking at this isn't the script that she's looking at suicide scars on her wrists as as if imagining another attempt. And it kinda it kinda the dialogue the dialogue between Ed and her kinda goes in like he clearly

speaker-0: Yeah. You got things for me.

speaker-1: f he is a w they don't explicitly say it, but it's he it's he's aware that she's tried in the past and he's and that she's in a place of like feeling like there's nothing worth living for kind of a thing.

speaker-0: He's seeing the signs and maybe trying to

speaker-1: But in the show it's interesting, it like they it's just this little thing where she you and if your first time you're watching it, I mean sh y she's looking at her she's like looking like right here on both on both of her and then he and then Ed's there and he can see her looking at them. But ⁓ I never noticed that.

speaker-0: I've never noticed that. But I guess, you know, it is it's setting the table.

speaker-1: Yeah. Let's see. Thank Yeah, that's all my spoiler stuff that I had.

speaker-0: My only other one, and I sort of said it in the beginning, but it's like when you see I was really struck by because I'm watching The Return, right? And I just finished it, right? While we're re-watching this, and I'm just so struck by when Shelly's talking to Hank and you just see that it's like it's Norma and Shelly and then the granddaughter role of like her daughter. And it's like they all just live the same pattern for whatever reason they end up with. You know, and it's happens again in the return where it's like they they're all just kind of ending up with bums and thankfully Norma doesn't in the end. But th it's sad to see 'cause I'm like, they're gonna spend the next thirty years living out this pattern, you know, of of these women, these these bright, beautiful women that just choose the wrong men.

speaker-1: That's like the what Truman's saying, how that he doesn't think people can change. It's like that's a version of it where it's it's not the people necessarily being bad themselves, but the making the getting stuck in these

speaker-0: Jane. Patterns and runs. Yeah. Well, on that note, another on that uplifting note. Join us all next week as we as we close out season one in a in a very high stakes, exciting episode. Until then, we'll talk to you guys next week.

speaker-1: Everyone, thanks for listening.

speaker-0: Thanks for coming.