speaker-0: They describe this blockchain solution, I'm like, but what problem is this really solved? I'm I'm not seeing it. The one thing that blockchain technology technology does really well is eliminates intermediaries. But everything is transacted instantaneously on the same system.

speaker-1: Today's guest is Eric Guthrie. Eric is a blockchain attorney, author of Blockchain or Die and Blockchain or Die Harder, and the director of training for the Government Blockchain Association. In our conversation, we talk about what blockchain actually does well, the kinds of problems it can and will solve in the future, and how to tell when the technology is solving a real problem versus when it's simply a solution like a technology looking for a problem to solve. If you've heard a lot about blockchain but still aren't clear on where it creates real value, this conversation will give you a practical way to think about it. And if you get value from this conversation, be sure to subscribe and share with a friend. Now please enjoy my conversation with Eric Guthrie. Eric, thank you so much for being here.

speaker-0: Yes, I had me here, I appreciate it.

speaker-1: Absolutely. So Eric, a lot of people hear blockchain and immediately think Bitcoin, crypto, or NFTs. You've spent years looking at the technology across a lot of different interesting applications that I don't think I myself has have considered, nor other people in my world. So you've looked at applications across law, business, government, and finance. So I wanna start like underneath all of that and kind of get to the basics first. So for someone who still doesn't really understand blockchain like myself. How would you explain what it is in simple terms and what problems does blockchain as a technology actually solve?

speaker-0: So that Ian, that's a very common question that I get because a lot of folks will come to me after a book sign in my speech and I say, Eric, I just don't understand blockchain technology. And I ask them what what do you do? Are you a, you know, a doctor, a lawyer, or a nurse, engineer, a mechanic? And then I say, Well, did you understand what you do now before you learn how to do it? And then they say, Well, no. I said, Well, that's the same principle applies. It's not gonna matter just You jump into your brain, you had to understand it, research it, you had to, you know, spend time to, you know, to integrate it into, you know, your your knowledge base. Just like you would for any type of investing or anything you're doing in life. So if it's important enough for you to understand the future of money, the future of business, the future of law, the future of communications and and transferring of value, then it's important enough to understand. This is how I explain blockchain technology to anyone that asks. If you want to decide how a do a house is bought and sold, how a dollar is spent, how a checkbook works, how a padlock works, and how a cashier works, I can explain how blockchain technology works. So here we go. When you buy a house, you have to get title insurance. When you get title insurance and make sure you get a town insurance company to make sure that you're getting good, clear title. To close on the deal. So the tower insurance company looks at all the transactions from the the first seller all through the seller to buyer to the last buyer, right? And looks to see if there's no mechanic liens or any estate liens on the house. That makes sure that they can tell the attorneys and the realtors that good titles being passed and the deal can close. Right? Now take that house, put a dollar in this place. The same checks will be done on that dollar from the day it's mended to the day it's spent through all of its buyers and sellers, right? Now of course there's many more dollars on houses, so that means that there's gonna be many more transactions. That's where the checkbook comes in. You gotta have a place to store all the transactions. Now the checkbook, which money folks don't use anymore. I mean, for younger folks out there, may not ever use it, ever use a checkbook. I'm able to write three checks a year myself. The checkbook ledger. Is where you keep all your transactions. You know, who you sprout the check to, the balance before the check, the check amount, balance after the check, and the date, right? That's how we used to balance our checkbook back in the day. So now, take that checkbook. It's not your checkbook, it's everyone's checkbook in the world. Anyone can use it, anyone can download it, anyone can see it. It's a global checkbook, right? But that checkbook needs protection. That's where the padlock comes in. And the padlock has two keyholes, the public key and the private key. The public key encrypts data, the private key decrypts data. The way I describe that is like your email. You have your email username, which you give out to to make business, to to get clients, or to get personal email, right? So you want that out there, otherwise, who's gonna communicate with you? And then you have your private key, which is like your password. You don't give out your password. Like you never get out your private key. That's the keys to the kingdom. That's just one form of security on the blockchain. Now, all of these transactions are happening, but who is doing them? Well, the miner is doing them, but the miner is like the cashier in the store. So when you go to the store and you get your cart and you go in and buy your eggs, your your ham, your bread, your detergent. your paper towels, your candles, whatever you buy, it does you no good if you cannot leave the store with it. So you go to the cashier, they ring it up, they tell the amount, you tender your payment, they accept the payment, and then you walk out the store with the the goods that you purchase and then they take their draw and then they tally up and make the final tally for their shift and they submit to corporate. Right? So that's like blockchain technology with the miner. The miner processes blocks and on Bitcoin there's ten transactions per block and it gets locked up and it gets put away and it cannot be changed. Right. So in the in the quick story of the house, the dollar, the checkbook, the padlock, and the cashier, that's essentially how blockchain technology works.

speaker-1: Fascinating. I love that analogy. Thank you. I can tell you've been working in this for a long time to have that ready to go and so eloquently put. Yeah. And there's a lot of different nuances that we could dive into from that story. But what do you see? Like what is the the problem, right? Like obviously the like what is the problem that blockchain technology that you think this technology is uniquely qualified to to fix, right? And obviously this is a deep rooted problem that can show up in a lot of different applications, right? But I think You know, a big word that's thrown around with blockchain technology is the fact that it's decentralized, it can't be manipulated, it can't be falsified, it can't be, you know, messed with by any outside source, because it's like the if one of those transactions, from what I understand about blockchain technology, if one of those transactions is incorrect or one of those items entered into the ledger, like it it kind of breaks the whole system. Like it just like will not continue to operate correctly. And I apologize for my ignorance about the the subject, but getting to the question, what what problem do you see that this technology is uniquely qualified to solve and fix?

speaker-0: It solves so many problems. It solves almost a number of problems across industry. I'll give you an example. One of the first big big achievements of blockchain technology was the Walmart IBM food distribution example. So Walmart did a part of IBM and did an analysis. How long will it take them to find a creative and effective mangoes that came overseas to the US and to find out you know, where the crate was and and which crate it was. And they they estimated it would take seven point seven days to find that crate. But when they did an analysis with blockchain technology, which has all of the shippers, the growers, the transportation, the storage units, the stores all in the same blockchain plat platform, it took two point two seconds. So what does that mean? That means that Walmart would dramatically increase the the finding the root cause of the problem it would decrease you know the the the illnesses and perhaps even deaths it would decrease their risk it would increase efficiencies so i mean it's a win on so many different levels right i mean that's just one example of how blockchain technology can improve society there's many others i mean so many countries where you know people live Very far from banks and rural areas, they can't get to a financial institution. They have a cell phone, they've got Wi-Fi. So with blockchain technology, cryptocurrencies, they can interface with global economies, which they couldn't do before, right? They don't have to get they might even have a birth certificate or a license or something like that, because then they're born somewhere where that's not the priority as opposed to many, you know, industrialized societies. So many of them are just unbanked or underbanked, but all they need to have is a cell phone, a Wi-Fi, and they'd be able to interface with global economies. There's some economies where, you know, banks won't let a woman use their financial system. They have to either be with a a husband, a father, a brother, a cousin, or uncle. That's at the same with putting those in blockchains. You could open up a wallet, you know, and and and fund the wallet and do whatever type of transactions you want, despite your gender, right? digital digital identity. And there there are are are now a bunch of programs in some parts of the world where, you know, people are abducted and they're put into slavery. And many years later, when they're found, they don't know where they're from, they don't know their original name. Well, scanning, you know, either fingerprints or digital retinas onto a blockchain system. you know, before that happens, stores it so in the case they are found, they can be reunited with their tribe or their community or, you know, wherever they were from, just by even though they may know who they are, the system can identify them. There are so many examples of how blockchain technology has really benefited society. All we need, and this goes to your second point, all we need are companies that create good products with good user interface, you know, good user adoption that can be actually can benefit society, right? That's where the magic happens, right? And that there's so many cryptos out there that are not legitimate cryptos or they're they're not properly put together or properly run. Those are the ones that are falling by the wayside. But the strong companies that are doing very well in terms of how they benefit society, those are the ones you bet on.

speaker-1: Yeah. Right. Yeah. It has to be an actual product doing something, like solving some problem in some application, right? And they have to and the every any innovation in order for mass adoption to happen, it has to, you know, be two times, three times, five times, ten times better than the existing solution in order to get people to actually move over. Right. So there's a huge hill to climb and a hurdle to cross for this technology in every single application of the technology. Same thing's happening with artificial intelligence. Blockchain is facing the same thing. Any innovation, any new technology faces this hurdle that you have to leap because getting people to make a change and migrate over into a new solution takes a lot of work because we're we're creatures of habit. Right. And getting us to change is going to take a lot. So I'm going to try and repeat back to you my understanding so far. And I would love for you to just poke any holes in in what I have. Okay. So again, my understanding is that each cryptocurrency, right, is like its own blockchain, right? There's the The Bitcoin blockchain and then there's the Ethereum blockchain and like every other cryptocurrency kind of is in its of itself its own blockchain. Is that right?

speaker-0: So not quite. So so a cryptocurrency can have its own blockchain, but let's look at Ethereum. Ethereum has the Ethereum blockchain, but there are hundreds of tokens that are housed on the Ethereum blockchain as a token, not just a cryptocurrency. So they so Ethereum and Solana and Cardano, those are the three coming of the the big global blockchain. Companies that allow you to house your token on their blockchain, they've they've made a business model of being a blockchain that can house a crypto. So you don't have to build your own blockchain, which is very expensive, very time consuming, and it's fraught with you know chasing bugs and you know making sure you're doing proper audits and making sure that the blockchain programming is functioning well. Well, they're doing it for you. I mean, Ethereum is the first one to do it. It's still the granddaddy of all, you know, blockchains that houses tokens. But there there are hundreds of tokens on Ethereum and probably, you know, a a larger number on Solana and Cardano as well. And those are the ones that are making it easier for crypto companies, cryptocurrency companies to actually create a crypto token without having to create their own blockchain.

speaker-1: Got it. So then what's the difference between the token? Like I from if I had to guess, right, my understanding would be that the token is the thing that you can exchange, right? The thing that you can exchange with another user, another individual, another organization, another entity. And then the blockchain, again, my understanding of what the blockchain is, is that it's this ledger of information that is unadulterated, right? Like you can't change this lever ledger of information, right? It is verifiable truth, factual information that is, you know, governed and monitored and verified by every node within that blockchain. All right. So the blockchain itself is like the ledger and then is the token the thing that you can exchange or what's the difference between the token and the blockchain itself?

speaker-0: So I'm gonna you're you're close. I'm gonna guess expand information and make the information, for example, transactions, like I was saying before with the dollar. Transactions are what can be housed on the blockchain. Smart contracts. The contracts that actually have the ability to conduct business can be housed on blockchains, right? Those are two of the more common ways that blockchain technology provides benefits to industry is by Housing transactions and smart contracts enables transactions to happen. So for example, like with Bitcoin, it's decentralized finance, right? It's just basically spending money here or there with Bitcoin. But and with Ethereum, I mean, it it's far more more complicated than that. Ethereum took the Bitcoin blockchain, Ethereum and Bitalic Burton was nineteen years old when he did this. So talk about being a young person making a difference, right? And it's it's made him wealthy, you know, beyond his probably his wildest dreams back then. But he he created Ethereum and there's so many transactions, you know, NFTs can go on blockchains, you know, of course tokens can go on blockchains, smart contracts can go on blockchains, and they're all started with Ethereum. And that's what houses on the blockchain. And then and and I wanna I'll make a distinction as well. Not every blockchain needs a cryptocurrency. There are plenty of block like the Walmart example, the Walmart IBM. There's no crypto involved with that. It's simply a pr enterprise business solution. So you don't need to have a cryptocurrency to be have a blockchain. But if you got a cryptocurrency, it needs a blockchain. And it can be either one you make or one you associate with like Ethereum or Cardano or Solana.

speaker-1: Yeah. Okay. Thank you for that. and thank you for your patience with me in this in this conversation here. Of course. yeah. so you before we were talking or before we press record on today's conversation, you were sharing with me that you're you're living in DC. So you're in the heart of it, right? Working with policymakers, having these conversations, working to bring this technology to the place where it can have the impact that it can have. Right. And anytime that new technologies, right Revolutions happen, right? There are forces that are going to work against it and prevent, right? There's interest, there's the existing inter there's the interest of the existing institutions that this technology is going to disrupt. So what are you seeing on the front lines, right, of working with policymakers, working in DC to bring this technology to the place where it can have the impact that it has? Like what forces are you seeing working against the adoption of this technology?

speaker-0: Well, you know, so that that's a fantastic question. When I th when I first went my first book, Blood Shannon Die, it it the the main force was people didn't understand it. The main force was you know like politicians and legislators, they they were still trying to get their arms around it. Ten years later, that's less of an issue. I mean, there's still folks that don't understand it and it's still folks that need to have a good education. But now the issue is, first of all There's lot of scams out there. It's a lot of scams. The scams are not only related to cryptos and blockchains. There's, you know, there's there's scams for gift cards, there's scams for for stocks. There's, you know, there's there's worthless and scam stocks out there. There's pump and dump schemes. And pump and dump started with stocks and they came over to the crypto world, right? So scams are are are a big issue. And another issue is the crypto blockchain market is still very high risk. I mean, there's there's a lot of cryptos out there that fluctuate greatly in price almost daily. So you have to if you're investing in that market, you have to be knowledgeable of the fact that, you know, you're getting in a market. It's that's that's a high risk market. So it's not for everybody, right? some folks have to, you know, decide that they don't want to be involved in it because it's not their appetite for their risk investment. You know, and another big you know happened and and you mentioned AI was, you know, until AI and you know, starting with Chat G B T really came on the scene, blockchain technology was like the the darling new technology on the block. Well long AI and a lot of funding that was going to blockchains, whoop it gets it got switched to AI. And, you know, blockchain comes like, what what just happened? What happened to all the VCs and agile funders? They were They were dying for blockchain projects, but now they're they're like looking at eye. So what I've done is with my clients, and recently I I had a client that, you know, we were working together in in the twenty twenty-two time frame. During the the the bear market, the crit we call it crypto winter, you know, went down for a couple of years. So they kind of a dormant, it's come back, even though it's kinda going down again. and they said they wanted to do a new They wanted to bring back the crypto project, and I was their counsel on on that one. So I asked them, I said, Well, what are you what are you doing different than you did before? I thought I recalled correctly. They said nothing. I said, Well, if I call cor recall correctly, all you did was you had a crypto you were putting on an exchange to sell. And they were like, Yeah, that's all we're doing. It's nothing, you know, nothing to change. I said, you know, you know, 2021, 2022. You can still do that, but now it's a whole different story. Now this crypto companies making revenue, they're building products, they're they're you know actually adding value to the investors besides the price of the crypto I said you can't we can't rely on that anymore. And and and unless we figure out a way to add a revenue stream independent of crypto price, you're not gonna succeed. And you know, after some discussion back and forth, they they agree with me and then I said, you know what you should do? You should build in an AI component. And you would have thought I told them that they just made sliced bread. I mean they were so excited to bring AI to it. But that's what you have to do now. I mean any crypto and and this is all the clients I've talked to on the crypto world, any crypto now has to have AI, perhaps even quantum computing, built into their crypto to be to be relevant and to be looking towards the future than looking toward the past. So those n emergent technologies, there's no reason why they all c are brought together to create, you know, a better matchup as I say in in business parlance and you know and it make it something that was gonna really benefit society.

speaker-1: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I can I work in the AI space. I can only imagine working in the like being told, okay, not only do you have to work with this emerging new technology and find your own innovative, you know, application for this technology, but you also have to take into consideration two other emerging complicated technologies that and find a way to work with that and work into it in order to really get the attention and the funding that is required to operate a project as expensive. as a crypto or a blockchain project would be. So hats off to all of the operators in that industry and the people that you're working with and people like yourself. It is a valiant, valiant fight for sure. That has got to be tough to deal with, but you guys are going to make it happen. You're going to pull it off, right? We always find a way and figure it out. But so when you are consulting a company and when you go back to the Walmart and IBM example, How did you see that blockchain was a potential solution to the problem that they were solving? Right. So let's say there's a founder listening to this, and you know, maybe they hadn't even considered the idea of incorporating blockchain technology into the work that they do, into their organization. Like, what was the problem, I guess? Or like what like when you how do you look at a problem and and then say, like, okay, I think blockchain could be something that can help with that? Like, what kinds of problems do you see? And maybe, you know, there's a lot of young people that listen to the show, creative, hungry, ambitious people that are looking for something to pour their energy into. So maybe through your answer, they can maybe just equip themselves with this lens to kind of look for problems that maybe blockchain could step into to help solve. So like what did you see in that Walmart example that made you think that blockchain could be a part of the solution to what they were struggling with?

speaker-0: Well, the first thing was just in the the time frame itself to go from seven days to two point two seconds. I mean, that's that's a huge solution to a huge problem. You know, not to mention all the collateral damage that could exist. And you hit upon something that's very, very passionate for me. A lot of times I get potential clients that come to me and they describe this blockchain solution. I'm like, But what problem is this really solved? I'm I'm not seeing it. And what they do what they did was they created a blockchain solution. is such a problem. They didn't have a problem to which blockchain really saw that solution. Then the number one reason why I turn clients down is because, you know, and and I don't want to just take the money, is to say, I I don't I really don't see, you know, what real benefit this has to society, what problem it's solving, you know, what how this could benefit the industry you're in. So that's number one. You know, so in terms of what problem it solves, Blockchain technology has a number of really great facets. And one of them is to be able to bring a number of parties together in a system where communication is difficult. If you put them all in this like like with Walmart, with the supplier and the and the the grower and the shipper and the storage unit and you know, all those folks are now on one platform, rather than having to jump from platform to platform to platform to figure something out. The one thing that blockchain technology technology does really well is eliminates intermediaries. But everything is transacted instantaneously on the same system. So if you have a system that has so many people, so many processes involved that can be streamlined, that is one thing that's right for blockchain technology to solve. The other is r remittances like money g if you're doing with money overseas or you know in different countries and you continue having to you know to exchange rates and pay you know f different fees or use the Swift system, things like that, you know which is a a problem that Ripple solves, for example, the ability to to transact almost instantaneously and for a much lower price. I mean when When I when when I wrote my first book, Blockchain had died, remittances were were really kind of being brought into the the crypto world and people were sending money overseas where, you know, Western Union and other like money gram are charging, you know, seven to twelve percent. Cryptos were charging one percent. And it was instantaneous, not waiting in three or four days and you gotta go to some place to pick it up from somewhere. You can just get it on your cell phone. And you had the money, right? And then you can just use it however you needed to. Well, that's a big problem to solve. And, you know, coming from my family is from the Caribbean, my my dad with some money overseas the Caribbean and he would be paying back in the days, you know, all that money and we complain about it. I've actually written about it in my books. This solves that problem, right? Yeah. So when you have fees being charged, you know, by big corporations that are going to their overhead rather than to who you're sending the money to or coming out of your pocket where it can go in either place where it has more of a benefit to your inner circle, cryptos and blockchains solve that problem. Right. So there there's a lot of problems. You know, th th they have they have energy grids, microgrids that that are built, you know, with technology, but the storage and the value is stored in blockchain technology Ledgers. So you can actually sell, buy and sell energy using blockchain technology and tokens on the microgrids. And that's been great in a number of different countries. Even in Brooklyn, New York. You know, they have a microgrid in Brooklyn, New York. So there's a number of ways you that blockchain technology can solve so many problems. All you have to do is figure out how to do it.

speaker-1: Yeah. Right. And I think it starts with having an understanding by, you know, reading books like the ones that you have written, having conversations with people like yourself. So you have you build and develop this understanding. Yep. Blockchain or die harder. Let's go. You got another edition. Let's go. Exactly.

speaker-0: This number one. This is 2019. This has just came out in February. This is twenty twenty six. this was Amazon number one bestseller seven times, and this is already number one. It's gonna probably do a number or more in the in the coming months. But yeah, these are the two books.

speaker-1: Congratulations. That's very exciting. you develop this understanding and then you maybe learn more again through this conversation. At least this is the process that I would like that I like to go through. So you understand the underlying technology and then you look at where is it being applied elsewhere. And then when you see where it's being applied and you have this understanding, then you just build up this awareness. So then when you see a problem somewhere else, you'll be able to know, like, okay, yes, I think I could build, I could apply this technology to help solve that problem. And then when you do that, then you can just say, okay, who else has a problem like this and just keep, you know, repeating that? And I think the first couple of ideas that came to my mind, obviously, the like enterprise grade supply chains. I feel like every single enterprise supply chain should be operating and run on the blockchain. Absolutely. Yeah, like no doubt about it. Like if that's not already happening, it should be happening. And then in my business, right, I think you talked about like international financial transactions. I use PayPal or WISE to pay my VAs who operate over in the Philippines. And it sounds like I should because I pay like crazy amounts in fees for for paying them and sending money over there, should be using something like Ripple or or these other technologies for my own business, right? That could be the application for for me and my company. So that's super fascinating. And I think I know that these are always super tough, but I think if you could just kind of do like broad strokes, like general assumptions or general guesses of like, okay, if we close our eyes ten years from now, Like how is the everyday consumer, everyday person going to experience the impact that blockchain and cryptocurrency technology has on the world?

speaker-0: So it it that's actually a a a great question and this is why I'd like to explain it. 10, 15 years ago, if you were told you were gonna pick up your phone, swipe right and get in a stranger's car, swipe right and sleep in a stranger's house, swipe right and go on to some date with a stranger, you would be like, Are you kidding me? That's just that's not happening. But that's everyday life, right? Technology has made it such that, you know, the world is much smaller. Right? The difference is that With cryptocurrencies, the value is inherent in the crypto. In other words, I you don't have to connect your wallet, your your your your credit card or your bank card or your your debit card or your or PayPal as a third party source. It could be in already inside the internet that you're using with your wallet. So what's gonna happen, I believe, is you're gonna see a lot more companies and it's it's already happening, especially in you know, parts of Asia like China where they have their own digital currency they've created to be able to just have it be built into systems rather than having to connect outside systems to use in. The question is, like I said before, you know, which companies are gonna do it so all you have to do is swipe right to do something or click or point or click, right? Back in the day to download a crypto or the user wallet, you had to go to MetaMask. Then you had to go somewhere else to download something another another program. You had to download two or three programs just to just to even use one crypto. Well, it's gotten a lot better now. I mean, now it's on Robin Hood, it's on Charles Schwab. It's you know, crypto is a much more mainstream in our financial system. But to be more c comprehensive about it, in companies that build it in for everyday use in what we do. Those are the ones that are gonna be successful at it, especially when it comes to AI. I mean, they have the centralized AI blockchains where you know the the the blockchain is the the the power behind the AI. The problem is AI uses so much power, so much energy to be able to just use your laptop as once one of the many, many sources of AI use that's that's free and unencumbered. It's too much energy. It'll be it will be too slow and it wouldn't compete with the likes of Chad GPT or Gemini or Claude, right? But they're out there. And you know, if someone can figure out how to scale that up to do something that's much more powerful, that will be a very powerful blockchain enterprise solution to combine that in AI. So th there's so many ways. There's so many ways that, you know, blockchain technology and with or without crypto. could benefit society in the future, to name those few. All we need is smart, good, well well structured, well financed companies, you know, even as startups, to make that happen.

speaker-1: Yeah. And doing the delicate political dance and tight walking of the tightrope to balance the different interest groups that again are gonna be fighting against this technology from disrupting their, you know, established position. Right. And one of those obviously the biggest hurdle to jump is Finance, you know, money is such an effective lever. It's really like the modern tool used to assert your power over other countries, right? Like sanctions and like these kinds of things. And if that weapon is taken away from the biggest institution on the planet, which is the government, I can feel them. I would s assume that they're gonna fight pretty hard against that from happening. So there's that big hurdle to cross and finding the way to walk that tight rope and it's gonna be fascinating. I think, you know, the best solution will always win. So just keep creating innovative solutions and you know, the best will always win. But Eric, fascinating discussion. Would love to have you back on the podcast because this isn't going anywhere, right? And the people that understand it the best and can build with it and use it, the wisest are gonna be the ones that can reap the most from it. But before we get to my final question, which is a recurring question I ask every guest, Eric, how can people how can people find you?

speaker-0: So number ways, you can find me on LinkedIn, Eric Lance Guthrie. you can f go to my website, ericguthery.com, blockchain or die.org. you can find me either one of those two on the website. you can shoot me an email at Eric at blockchain or die.org. Those are the best ways to find me. I have book signings that I'm doing all over. I'm speaking at the UN Blockchain Conference in September in New York, so you can go online and Find out. I'm speaking at a number of different book signs in Atlanta, Georgia, with the Atlanta blockchain company in Atlanta. And I'll be speaking at a few libraries in Long Island, New York as well. So Oceanside Libraries one of them is a look out for that on my websites. I'll be speaking in California in September as well. So th those dates will be posted on my website. So you can find me in person. You can find me online. You know, I'm I'm all over the place. I got some book signs running up in in in Charlotte, North Carolina, and in southern Florida, West Pond, Fort Lauderdale, Miami. So I'll be doing a lot of running around there. So I enjoy getting out there, many folks. So, you know, come do a book signing. Find me a line. I have a few virtual conferences I'm speaking at. So I'll I'll send all that to you, Ian, and you can share it with your community.

speaker-1: Amazing. Why you had no shortage of ways to to get in touch and you're out there doing it. That's very exciting. yes, we'll have the links to everything in the description. So go check out blockchainerdie dot com to to find everything that you need to know about Eric. We'll have dot org. My bad. Blockchainer.die dot org. link in the description. I found I you know, before this conversation I devoured a lot of your content and yeah, you do such a great job I mean you've been doing it for for a while, right? Since twenty sixteen when you released the first version of this book, but I think you Just do such a great job. Like your enthusiasm about the technology about this is infectious, and you do such a great job at teaching and explaining things. So go get connected with Eric wherever you can. but Eric, my final question for you is a recurring question that I ask every guest, and I'm interested to see where this goes. But if you had a giant billboard that everyone in the world could see for ten seconds with one message to the world, what would it say and why?

speaker-0: would say Understand and love each other. We all see all these things and these disagreements happening all over the world, but when you track it, we all want the same thing. It's just a a one to three percent difference in opinion that we're focusing on rather than the ninety-seven percent plus similarities, right? We all love our families, we all love our kids, we all, you know, be healthy and be happy. You know, but it's almost like we wanna have it at the expense of somebody else. So what sense does that make? I mean, you just you're you're creating a i i if if happiness is a is a one hundred percent, you know, a c a kind of sphere of influence, then you know, making someone unhappy gets pulls away from that, right? We can all do so many things together without strife, without you know, without conflict, if we all just focused on what we could do to be together rather than to be different. So that's what I would say.

speaker-1: Understand and love each other. Eric, thank you so much for the time.

speaker-0: Thank you, Wayne. I appreciate it.

speaker-1: Thank you for listening. My main takeaway from this conversation is that adoption depends on making the technology easy enough for people to actually use. Right. And this is something that we're seeing with blockchain and with artificial intelligence, and it's something that's it's a pattern of all technological revolutions, right? This technology comes out. It a lot of really smart people are out there saying like this is gonna change the world. But for most of us, it's difficult to really get any meaningful value from this technology. It's like doesn't really make sense. Like, how am I supposed to actually use this? and it's really unclear where this technology is gonna go and how it's really going to be used in the future. Right. But the people who are using and and developing and building the technology need to focus on finding ways to make it as dead simple, as easy as possible for the end user, right? The customers, right? The end user, just making it as easy as possible, as frictionless as possible to use this tool to perform a very specific function. And that's the way, like that's the path to to mass adoption, right? Really quick. Like a but with the internet first came out in the early nineties. It was difficult to use, really hard to get any meaningful value from the the tool. But then the internet evolved into purpose built apps and websites that made it really like entire businesses were built around like the biggest businesses that we know t some of the biggest businesses that we know today were built around the idea of making it really easy for people, the can and consumer. To perform a very specific function using the internet, right? Amazon made it dead simple for people to buy stuff on the internet. Expedia made it really easy for you to book travel on the internet, right? All of these businesses were built around the idea of making it really easy for the end user to perform a very specific function using that technology. Same thing's happening with AI, same thing's gonna continue happening with blockchain. But that was a really cool takeaway from my conversation with Eric. So if you want to get connected with Eric, you can find the links to his social media and all of his books. In the description of this episode, that includes Blockchain or Die and Blockchain or Die Harder. And finally, if you're an author or a coach and you want to make it easier for your clients to follow through on what you teach and engage with your ideas, I put a free resource in the description that will help you build more execution support into your program without taking more of your time. Thank you all for listening, and I'll see you in the next one.