speaker-0: Welcome to the wooly way of podcast specifically for dairy shepherds. is folks wanting to raise sheep for the purpose of harvesting milk. I'm your host, Rachel. speaker-1: and I'm Liv Fox. We cover all things pertaining to raising dairy sheep here via animal nutrition, housing, health care, lambing tips, cheese making, and even some butchery and fiber arts. speaker-0: After all, if you raise dairy sheep, you are going to have wool, and if your operation is successful, you'll eventually have surplus lambs to decide what to do with. speaker-1: Ethical animal husbandry is the focus here, as well as sustainable agriculture. We want to provide you with the information you need to start and continue your dairy sheep operation in the best way possible for you, your sheep, and the amazing world we live in. speaker-0: So grab a nice cup of sheet milk and let's dive in. Liv: And for sometimes our own mental health, it's okay to take a step back and be like, Okay. Leslie and Amy, they rotationally graze. This year, I will I will 100% admit I'm not rotationally grazing my ewes right now. And I'm okay with that. The Rams are there. So somebody's at least getting, you know, the the free food at the farm. But it just it was getting too challenging for me to move nets every day. I do have help. Zach is a wonderful helper. Rachel Hester: And. and Liv: The the sheep and the horses and the chickens, they are not his thing. but he has embraced that it is my thing. And by the time, you know, he came along in my life, I'd already been in the dairy sheep world for two years. so he's never complained. He goes if he's home, he goes out and he helps do chores every day. And he does it be you know, because he knows. Rachel Hester: And. Okay. Liv: I appreciate it and he does it out of love. So kind of like you mentioned, you you you don't pret you never watched football before, but you do it because that's what Terry likes. Zach likes to watch dirt bikes. So I know nothing about dirt bikes, right? He has a dirt bike. th that's what he likes to do. He has a friend that lives pretty close and we get along great with them. So every once in a while, like we'll go over to their house too and watch the dirt bike races. Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: I do it purely out of love. Is there something else that I could do or rather be doing? Absolutely. But I'm the same thing for him. Like this summer when it's gonna be blazing hot and when I gotta go out and milk and he does all the watering chores, he's probably gonna be questioning his life decisions too. You know what I mean? But when you Rachel Hester: Yeah. Right. Liv: do it because your your partner or the other person in your life, that's what you know feeds. their soul, it seems like it's easy to do to say this is what they like. They do what I like and are supportive. So I can support them in this way. Rachel Hester: Yeah. Well, and I think it's. Leslie Grace Farm: And before you know it, you're gonna know everything about dirt bikes, okay? You're gonna know everything about dirt bikes because you're there. And you'll be so surprised Liv: I know. Leslie Grace Farm: at you know yourself and how you've transformed because it's out of love. Liv: Mm-hmm. Yes. I mean, he Rachel Hester: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Liv: already knows things about dairy sheep. And we have been mostly to so far it's been like Amish communities. And when they discover who I am, when we get in the truck and Leafy goes, You're kind of a big deal in the dairy sheep world, aren't you? I'm like, yes. Like, it's a very niche pocket of people, but yes. Leslie Grace Farm: yeah. You are you are a rock star. Amy Rappuhn: ECHEW Rachel Hester: Yes, yes, very nice. I remember the first time we were, it was actually local. It was funny. And up to that point, was like, why are you wasting time on social media? That is such a teeny bopper thing to do. I and not that he was being nasty about it, but he just didn't Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: get it. And we were waiting for our table at a restaurant and this person comes up and they were like, are you on YouTube? And y'all have to understand, like me and YouTube, like we are not BFFs. Like if someone's going to find me, I would have thought it would have been on Instagram. And I was like, yeah. And they're like, we just love your content and they just walked away. And I just look at kind of like, yeah, that's right. Not wasting time, bite me. Okay. And he's just like, okay, okay. Liv: Yeah. Rachel Hester: I think you hear a lot in homesteading of like, it's so hard. It's so hard. It's so hard. I don't think homesteading is easier or harder when it comes to the maturity principles. Cause I mean like what we're all describing with the relationships things, you know, my cousin married a guy, his thing was hiking. Like, On their wedding registry with every tent and sleeping bag and backpack and hammock that I never wanted to know about because that was his thing. So, I mean, I think whenever you're with someone who you love, you're going to pick up on things you never thought you were going to pick up on. You're going to learn skills you never really wanted or thought you needed, but now all of a sudden you realize are essential. Like what kind of flashlight you would need if you were running into a burning building? Never thought I'd have that life skill, but here we are. But with Homesteading, Liv: Ha ha. Rachel Hester: I think the ante is up because if your hobby is dirt biking, well, not so much dirt biking, but with hiking, yes, there's some elements of danger, but for the most part, it's not a life or death situation all the time. With homesteading, if you don't water your dairy animals, you very quickly have a life or death situation. So it's like, can't push off things longer. you know, no offense to the gardeners in the world, but like if you don't weed your tomato plants every single day, you know, they make may make smaller tomatoes, but if you have the animal aspects of it, like there's some things where your personal preferences have to take a backseat for the good of the animals in your care. But now on flip side too, like we, have to learn how to prioritize things like if it's a heat wave and there's not been any rain or dew for three weeks, like, yeah, you better go water those tomato plants because you won't have any tomatoes. So if you have to miss the football game or you can't go have lunch with your friends because you have to water your garden, you know, you make those tough calls and. we just straight up tell people if lands are dropping, you are not allowed to stop by. We don't want to see you. If you talk to us, you'll probably get your face spit off and don't expect us to sound like good Southern Baptist Christians. There will be profanity on the property at some point. So Liv: Ha ha ha. Rachel Hester: enter at your own risk. The folks who love us do. And it's a great way to weed out the high maintenance family members who we didn't want to see in the first place. So. Liv: and hopefully they don't listen to the podcast. Amy Rappuhn: dear. Rachel Hester: None of them do, Leslie Grace Farm: Okay. Rachel Hester: don't worry. That's why I can say crap like that, because I know they're never gonna listen to this. So it's just like, I won't say their names, but looking at you, cousin. Liv: Ha how do you choose like which activities or organizations that you want to commit to in your life while having the farm and the homestead? Leslie Grace Farm: Well, for many years the organizations I was involved in were for my job. So like Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: I was on the board for our local food co op. I was on a board that made decisions about grants for nutrition. I I think Rachel Hester: Thank Leslie Grace Farm: that now that I'm shifting, that's one of the big things I want to do with my retirement is maybe one day I'll do Meals on Wheels, but right now Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: is to give back to all those organizations that Terry and I have benefited from. So all the fiber festivals, I mean we've been going to fiber festivals for 28 years and those events do not just happen. And so we're putting our kind of names out there to help with Michigan Fiber Festival. And we go to one in Alpina. Rachel Hester: Okay. Amy Rappuhn: I Leslie Grace Farm: I put said that I want to help with you guys. The organizations that I feel really are congruent with how I want to walk in the world, how I want the future to look, those are the the ones that I see putting Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: more time and energy. Terry, we just came from a felting workshop for the Michigan Hand Weavers League. It was in Marquette, which is in the Upper Peninsula, the UP, and it's beautiful. And we took a class from a felter named Dawn Edwards. She's beautiful. Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: Yeah. Leslie Grace Farm: She lives in Michigan, but she's a beautiful, wonderful teacher. And we found out that the next meeting for them, it's an annual thing where they bring in, you know, teachers and such, is going to be 30, you know, in Alma, which is very close to. My Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: yeah. Leslie Grace Farm: And so I think that shifting from nutrition I did do some things for with Michigan State, some volunteering for things with 4 H and stuff, and that was a crossover. And maybe I'll do that too. Rachel Hester: Okay. Amy Rappuhn: you Leslie Grace Farm: But I do think that, you know, as we started this conversation, the number of hours that you all spend being on the board of NATSA, the number of hours that you spend doing these podcasts and getting the word The fact that you all are starting to try to do this, your your breed up program, what you're doing with AI, am I going to do those things? Probably not. But they are good for the organization, Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: they're good for dairy, dairy sheep overall. And if I can lend in some way my time and energy, It is so fun Liv: Ha ha ha Leslie Grace Farm: to get to talk to people that can't stop talking about sheep. How that links to nutr human nutrition, I don't know, but it seemed to come up all the time. Rachel Hester: I'll explain it to you. We can do another podcast episode. I'll explain how human nutrition and sheep nutrition Liv: Ha ha ha. Rachel Hester: They're like this. Leslie Grace Farm: Right. Rachel Hester: I can free associate all day. Leslie Grace Farm: If I'm teaching future dietitians or athletic trainers or physical therapists, do they really need to know about sheep? You know, not necessarily. But they could tell, they all knew that when I retired, that was what I was going to do. I just Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: couldn't shut up about it. And so did they think it was weird and fringe? Yeah, they did. But and there are actually a few students, you know, they're no longer my students, that I'm going to bring to the farm and introduce them to fibree things. Because they started to come to class knitting. I mean, you all probably, you know, have seen this in general, but college students and kids in general, there's a lot of anxiety. And so the fiber arts are a great way for them to have an outlet. I mean, I there's research on knitting, there's initial research on spinning Rachel Hester: Thank Leslie Grace Farm: about what that does to your brain biochemistry. I mean, we don't you guys know it because you've you've felt it and having sheep and so forth. But I think introducing kids to these coping mechanisms, whether it's eating well or moving, you know, or or talking to friends or having community that's real or knitting. These are strategies that we can utilize to help these kids work through this anxiety. Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: I think that in in having that organizations that are really robust, that this is a place where they can turn. these organizations are also beacons for younger folks. So like, you know, when you sell a lamb, you're also introducing them to that organization. And those Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: organizations will not exist if we don't have volunteers that are passionate. And we've all probably seen situations where robust, passionate people Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: have gotten burn out. Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: Because you can only give up certain parts of your life for so long if you're pursuing this. And so when I look at the organizations that are important to me, I see them all kind of intertwined with fiber or dairy sheep because it's you know what Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: I think is is congruent I want to take sheep into like nursing homes, like lambs. And I think that Folks in our silos, I think that this is super important with our area is getting involved. I think that it was great to see the survey, the NADSA survey, where you were asking us about what we can do. But that's a really hard thing to do. hard to relinquish control because this is your baby, right? This Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: is you guys' baby. And so to send it out into the world for those of us to maybe pick up things, that's really courageous. But it's also necessary for your own personal health Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: never seen an organization like very young, you know, and and you're doing like presentations with veterinarians on nutrition, you have this cheese making one suit. I'm so geek. That's huge. So you know, it's it's it's brave. Liv: Ha ha ha. Leslie Grace Farm: So thank you. Thank you, because I'm excited to get in get involved. Rachel Hester: Hey guys, I just wanted to interrupt quick to give a shout out to our sponsor, the North America Dairy Sheep Association. Natsa is open to any sheep breed or crossed use for milking purposes. Natsa supports dairy shepherds and is elevating dairy standards in sheep in America. Natsa now offers a Milk Star program, has sanctioned dairy sheep shows, and is now offering a breed up program. You can become a member or get more information by going to the website www.northamericadarysheep.org or you can email the association at northamericadarysheep.com We are so thankful to Natsa for sponsoring this podcast and helping bring more resources to the dairy sheep community. Stay tuned for future podcast episodes where we talk to NADSA board members about what NADSA is trying to accomplish in America for the dairy sheep community. Leslie Grace Farm: Very excited. Liv: Well, thank you. And thank you for filling out that form. I will not lay claim to making that form. We had another board member, Tracy, made the form for us, and then I could just send it out. But yeah, it the control thing, I 100% get what you're saying, Leslie, because I do feel like Natsa is a baby to me and Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: it's hard. My concern is always is somebody gonna if they say, I'll do that, are they gonna drop the ball? Because if they are, then I might as well just do it myself. That like that's always in the back of my mind. and not that anyone has done that, but it it does it gets challenging. But at the same time, like you said, like I know for my own personal health and for my family's health and well being, other Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: people need to start getting it more involved so that way. Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: They're invested in the organization and hopefully it just continues to blossom and grow. because it has so far in, you know, the two years that we've been around, it's crazy. Like the fact, like you mentioned, we're doing quarterly webinars with you know, specialists in the industry and stuff like that. It's like if somebody would have told me three years ago this is where NASA would be at, I would be like, You're crazy. Rachel Hester: Yeah, Amy, how do you figure out what to do? Liv: But Amy, what about you? Amy Rappuhn: getting involved. I mean, it's pretty much what Leslie said. Wherever my interests lie, know, wherever I feel like my talents can be used. And if I have the time to, because I don't want to commit to something and then something else that I'm doing is going to suffer. Rachel Hester: Yeah, we Liv: Well Rachel Hester: look at it as what's absolutely necessary, like what has to be done first and knock that out of the way. And then it's okay, well, what do we want to do after that? And then if there's any room after that. which there rarely is, and it's like, okay, what can we give to someone else at this point? But I mean, you know, we're in a different life stage where, mean, Kyle's work's a very demanding off-farm job. Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: We have a toddler who's so curious and that's such a But, you know, I sometimes feel bad because I want to be more in a place like Leslie where it's like, you know, I've gone to the Kentucky Sheep and Fiber Festival for 15 years and they need a board member. I should jump on another board because I'm such a great board member for the first organization I'm on. But then it's like, Liv: You are helpful. Rachel Hester: thank you. I have my little corner Liv: Ha ha. Rachel Hester: and I don't go out of that because I can't. Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: to that point though, it's like, I know I have a unique spot with NADSA that I feel like I can fill in a unique way and I fill it in that unique way very well. The Kentucky Sheep and Fiber Festival. It's like, Liv: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: there's so many people who could fill that spot. They don't need Rachel. They just need somebody. It's finding what do I have to do right now? mean, like the animals have to eat, they have to be watered, they need milk if it's milking season, know, the humans have to eat. the mental health component is really important too. mean, like Leslie said, I have to either knit or spin daily. And if I don't, the following day, this mental static does not go away. So, you know, then you kind of make some decisions after that of, Do I want to hang out with someone so who's been asking to for a while? Do I want to volunteer with this? Do I need to get that project out of the way? Liv: It'll always be there the next day. That that to do list. It you you just find other things to keep adding to it. And I think that's important for folks to realize. Rachel Hester: Or you knock them out each time. Like I used to be the person that got all of the bathrooms in the kitchen and the mopping done in one day. And now it's like, I got one toilet scrubbed in the morning before I made my cup of tea. I'm doing good. And then tomorrow I can get the sink clean and I will have two Liv: Yeah. Rachel Hester: parts of five of my bathroom where they're clean. Leslie Grace Farm: Okay. Rachel Hester: I'm on top of the world. So that's Liv: Hmm. Rachel Hester: why you shouldn't drop in during milking season. Amy Rappuhn: Yep. Liv: I'm I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one in that very similar boat. I Amy Rappuhn: Yeah. Rachel Hester: Thank Liv: just got my bathroom cleaned last weekend. Fun fact. So, but my milk machine and everything, that that's spotless. Rachel Hester: Yeah, but the farmhouse aesthetic was not invented by farmers. Liv: All right. let's do some like fun and personal questions. would do you prefer coffee or tea in how many cups a day? Leslie Grace Farm: Amy, why don't you start us up? Amy Rappuhn: Yeah, okay. So Liv: Ha ha. Amy Rappuhn: I was always a coffee drinker, but I'm really trying to limit my caffeine. So believe it or not, I actually drink chicory and I add cocoa Liv: okay. Amy Rappuhn: to that. Yeah, and actually I really enjoy it. I drank like two cups of that a day. Liv: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: How did you work through the withdrawal? Amy Rappuhn: It wasn't so bad for me. I'm going to be real honest. After drinking coffee for so long afternoons, I always have like, you know, a downtime when I was really tired. So after cutting the caffeine out and drinking the chicory, Rachel Hester: Okay. Amy Rappuhn: you don't get that anymore. And I don't get that anymore in the afternoons. My energy just, you know, yeah. Right. So Leslie Grace Farm: Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Amy Rappuhn: so that made me feel better. Rachel Hester: Okay. Amy Rappuhn: I didn't get any of those headaches or yeah, none of that from the caffeine. Leslie Grace Farm: That's fabulous. And the GI stuff, some people have, you know, like stomach pains or, things like that because of the acid production and the acid in the is it? Amy Rappuhn: Honestly, that's why I quit the caffeine. Leslie Grace Farm: Yeah, yeah. Amy Rappuhn: So, yeah. Leslie Grace Farm: Well, I used to drink a lot. Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: I mean it's kind of the culture of my workplace is is to drink a lot of coffee. I love the taste of it. So I do dark roast, I mean I'm pretty specific, like French roast, this brand, finely ground, Americano, and I just do one cup. And I don't have that slump anymore. I've you know people who've gotten off they say you have more energy if you Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: it's like hush up, you I don't want to hear it. I know it's not healthy but I just I really would love to be you, Amy. That's what I was asking. It's like because you want to drink something warm, right? But I think it's kind of nice to be able to to wean off all that stuff. Yeah. Rachel Hester: You can add chicory to the coffee grounds too. That's what they actually did in Romania. I can drink coffee in Eastern Europe all day long and I'm fine. mean jet lag probably has something to do with that too. But I learned later they cut their coffee grounds with chicory. And so, mean, if you're trying to wean off coffee, you can start adding like a little bit of chicory and just increase the chicory and decrease the coffee. And then you're not going to have that huge withdrawal like you would otherwise. And I actually kind of liked the taste combination of the two. I mean, it's, that, you know, lower note, full body bitter tastes. Leslie Grace Farm: Okay. Well you've got me convinced. Liv: do you prefer early mornings or late night productivity? Amy Rappuhn: I'm definitely a morning person, 100%. I like to go to bed early. Husband always makes fun of me, but hey, he's a night owl, so he stays up. But yeah, I like to get up before everybody gets up. The quiet, know, taking care of the animals. Everything coming awake, yeah, that's my time for sure. Leslie Grace Farm: That's my time too, but now I'm not sure if it's the caffeine talking or you know what mean? Because by three o'clock Rachel Hester: Is feeling convicted. Leslie Grace Farm: I'm just that was I mean maybe if I can get down to the chicory I can know what my bi rhythms really are. I don't get up in the middle of the night for lambing. Do you guys do that? Do you guys I know you some of you have like lamb cams, but do you get up in the middle of the night for lambing Amy Rappuhn: Mm-hmm. Liv: I don't set an alarm. If I naturally wake up, I will check my cameras. But I I do not set an alarm. Amy Rappuhn: I had a bad year this year, so yeah, I do. I will every couple hours. I have cameras, love them. I don't know why I didn't have them before. especially when it's cold outside. Rachel Hester: Yeah. Leslie Grace Farm: You will. Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: I need to make a YouTube video of Leslie Grace Farm: Yeah. Yeah. Rachel Hester: our timing setup because we did ours right outside the front. Like actually you can see the laminate setup behind us and it's right outside our front door. midnight I would walk up front door, shine a flashlight out and then I think it was 5 a.m. on the next time we checked. and then we just checked on throughout the day at that point. But Kyle's work schedule, is how things fell as far as when I went to bed and when he got home from work. and the use I had I was pretty confident about them. So, um, other, our first two or three years, lambing every two hours, we were out there and that was also the year we did twice a day milking. And by the end of that year, we were like, we're okay. Dying young and being unhealthy. We don't need to see that bad. do. Yeah, this is not worth it. And, uh, the homage for just like, Liv: huh. Leslie Grace Farm: Yeah. Rachel Hester: they're there a little. stupid English, let's explain life to you. then actually in the Florida Homesteaders Conference, Joel was talking, I went and sat in one of his lectures and he called me out from the entire group. I was so mad at him because he's like, and Rachel, here's what they do in Australia. Liv: Ha ha ha. Rachel Hester: And I'm like, okay, bro, I like you, but Liv: Ha ha. Rachel Hester: shut up. But anyway, he said when he was on Australia, He was at these two different farms and he was asking them how often they did lamb checks. And they said, well, when we do lamb, when we did lambing checks throughout the night, like you're supposed to, we were all at risk of losing our marriages. And so now we just have the opinion of, we've got now granted they're dealing with hundreds of sheep. So it's not like our little tiny micro flocks of five to 15, but they were like, you drop a lamb by yourself and get it cleaned up and move on. get to stay if you need help and we find you afterwards then. tough to be you. And they said, and now all of our marriages are happy and we don't worry and we have really strong flocks because it was survival of the fittest, which I mean, I Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: don't know that I would have recommended quite that hardcore Darwinian method for landing, but it was kind of a good thing to think about. if I have to check on them every two hours and I'm completely sleep deprived and I can't enjoy milking and I can't make cheese, cause I'm so, you know, sleep deprived by the end of it. I'm not managing the shepherd portion of the sheep operation very well. anyway, we're, trying to kind of wean down on those kinds of disruptions because, you know, like this whole podcast episode is about, it's about budgeting where we spend our energy and stress levels so that we can. Liv: Mm-hmm. Rachel Hester: How's it people may go out to public who remember things like deodorant and to brush your teeth. Leslie Grace Farm: It's it's it's a tough balance, you guys, and that the reason I ask is with the Shetlands, you know, they're kind of a robust, hardy little group and Amy Rappuhn: Yeah. Leslie Grace Farm: I didn't I didn't breed I don't breed every year because I was doing mostly for my own replacement, but Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: enough years that I didn't realize how they were fitting into my lifestyle. And I'm nervous is probably a strong word, but I'm very aware of now having BFLs breeding and the high percentage East Frisian that I probably need to shift my management. And knock on wood, I've never had to go in and assist. and I certainly I get up early because to me Lambie is like Christmas. You know, it's like, my God, I can't wait to see open the packages. So naturally I'm waking up at four o'clock in the morning and if I go to bed at 11, you know. So I'm out there, but Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: More often than not, there was a there were dry lambs, either single or twins, everybody's go doing well. But now with the dairy sheep, I mean my understanding that you're going to have more multiples, you need to be, you know, able to go in there. My Oberhostley, same thing. And so not that I want to, you know. Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: Be getting up every two hours because I do think that I would not be worth anything after, you know, a week of that kind of schedule. That I need to be thinking through how my management with the Shetlands needs to be adjusted for the management with the high percentage East Frisians, just because that that they may need me more. Rachel Hester: Yeah. Okay. if you know the science of lambing for us, if it's a first time chief, If she starts getting all swollen in the, you know, where it's getting all bright pink and she's kind of off by herself, like when those signs kick in them, then, it, especially as a first timer, we'll definitely kick up the checks on that sheet. but I mean, Leslie Grace Farm: Sure, sure. Rachel Hester: you know, the old, the old veterans who I know, like this is six or seven lambing with them. I know them, they know me, you know, it's. fairly confident I'm going to walk out and there's going to be two dry lambs sprawling about. I don't check them as often, but there's a really good book out in the market that has a whole chapter on lambing and pre-lamming and what you can do for pre-lamming. And I will say like, if you do the pre-lamming prep work for the dairies, I don't hear the horror stories when the prep work is done to set them up for success, you know, despite, no matter what the breed is. Leslie Grace Farm: Well I've been using ligaments a lot, like the way do you guys do that? The relaxation of the ligaments in their hip? That's really served me well. Just, you know, down their back, check that little peace sign. If those are relaxed, then that really helps. I'm more nervous, you guys, about the multiples and the working through the multiples. Like I I hope I know how to feed sheep before they land. I hope so. but but the dairy animals, I'm sure the sheep will take it to another level. But I just Rachel Hester: Okay. Leslie Grace Farm: you know, in thinking about other shepherds that have worked with some of these more primitive heritage breeds for fleeces, moving to dairy, I mean, it it's kind of like this merging of the dairy goat world. Like like Amy and I were talking into we were talking about hypoglycalcemia. Rachel Hester: you Leslie Grace Farm: And I was always a hawk with it with the goats. But now it's like you've gotta shift all that kind of knowledge to your sheep. Because when you think about it at the end of the day They're asking even more of their bodies with the fleeces. And so Liv: Mm-hmm. Leslie Grace Farm: those nutritional needs are going to be, you know, just exponentially greater. I think that cameras sound like the way to go. Liv: convenient for sure. Like I can pull up my f app on my phone right now and I can see my sheep. Now, I will admit I forget about having this app on my phone all the time. and there'll be times where I'm like, yeah, I guess I c I could have checked to see if anyone was, you know, Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: hanging out in the barn or something like that. Like last. Well, probably it would be two weeks ago this Sunday. I had a surprise lamb be born. I thought we were done. And that's even Zach said, I thought we were done. And I'm like, well, the math was mathing. And then, you know, apparently we had a Houdini who bred someone without marking her with his marking harness. so I'm like, Well, technically, I guess then we're not Rachel Hester: Okay. So. Liv: done with Lamb Watch until June twenty first. We could potentially have one more. Rachel Hester: Okay. Okay. Liv: So I am thankful for those cameras, but and they do they are convenient, especially if I'm lambing in the winter time. I usually wake up like around two o'clock in the morning naturally. so I'll just look on my cameras real quick. If I don't see anything, I just I'm one of those I'm very blessed. I can just set my device down and roll over and fall right back asleep. Amy Rappuhn: Hmm. Liv: So that works well for me. versus having to like bundle up and all my car hearts and trudge out to the barn and be like, there's not even anything out here, you know, and then come back. So I I do like the cameras for sure. Rachel Hester: I forget you're in the part of world where you can't just put on sweats and a pair of boots and a hat. You just kind of skip on down the barn in December. Amy Rappuhn: Thank Liv: No, no, no, no, no, Amy Rappuhn: No. Rachel Hester: You Liv: absolutely not. Leslie Grace Farm: But you could put a jacket on in your barn boots with your nightgown on pretty well. I mean, you know. Yeah. Liv: Yes, yes. that's right now with my bottle lambs. That's 100% what I do. if you were to show up at my house at six o'clock in the morning, you would see me in my nightgown, in my ankle muck boots, and a sweatshirt over top, trudging out to the barn with the dogs to to feed the bottle lambs. And if you show up at that time of day, I I don't even have any guilt about it. That is my time. Leslie Grace Farm: Yeah. Liv: with that, we we have definitely gone over time for sure, but it has been a joy and a treat to have both you, Leslie and Amy on the podcast. So thank you for coming on. I know I would love to have you two back. this has been a a terrific conversation and I'm hoping that our listeners are going to get some. Rachel Hester: Okay. Liv: inspiration and maybe some like, I don't I don't have to do it all like aha moments. listening to this this episode. Amy Rappuhn: Well, thank you for having us. Leslie Grace Farm: Yeah, thanks for having us. speaker-0: Thanks so much for listening to the Woolly Way Podcast. speaker-1: We hope you enjoyed our episode and have gleaned at least one tip you can implement in your flock right away. If you like what you heard, please hit the subscribe button. And if you wouldn't mind, leave us a review. This helps others find our podcast so that they can enjoy learning about dairy sheep along with you. The Woolly Way podcast is a production of Whoopsy Daisy Farm and Crafty Fox Bakers. For updates and information about our show, follow us on Facebook or Instagram. speaker-0: Subscribe to our YouTube and email list and look us up at whoopsydaisyfarm.com to find both. Have a particular guest you'd like us to host or a topic you'd like us to cover? Fill out our contact form on our website or shoot us an email at whoopsydaisyfarm.gmail.com. See you next time!