Kailey: Beauty was never designed with disable people in mind, but we're here anyways. Ashton: I'm Ashton, disabled beauty creator. Kailey: And I'm Kaylee, an occupational therapist. Ashton: And this is Accessibly Ever After, where we talk all things accessible beauty, inclusive design, and what it really means to make beauty work for real people. Kailey: Today we're joined by Lucy Edwards, who lost her sight at 17 and a year later picked up a camera to show the world how a blind girl does everything, from cooking to traveling to styling that famous red hair. It's beautiful, with her guide dog, Miss Molly, by her side. Since then, she's become BBC Radio One's first blind presenter, won two Royal Television Society Awards, written the memoir Blind Not Broken, and made this year's Time 100 Creators list. In Beauty, she was Panteen's first visually impaired ambassador, helped put scannable Navi lens codes on their bottles, and served as UK ambassador for Mattel's first blind Barbie. And this month she's launching her own accessible cosmetics brand, Etia London. Woohoo! Welcome to the podcast, Lucy. Lucy Edwards: my gosh, thank you so much for having me. And I love the way you say Etia, honestly. Whenever I talk to any Canadian or American friends, they're like, Etia, I love it. It's so slow. But thank you so much for the intro. Ashton: yeah, we're so we're so happy to have you here and your list of many mile-long accomplishments. Lucy Edwards: bless you guys. Honestly I was like my god, they've got it all. That's so cool. Yeah, thank you. And I love your podcast. I think this is gonna be such a cool chat, isn't it? Ashton: Thank you. I'm truly I I do I do think that these are lots of fun. By the end of it I always feel more energized and we love we just love chatting with chatting with our friends on here. So I think to kick us off, Lucy, would you mind giving our listeners a visual description of yourself and then we'll hop in and give one as well. Lucy Edwards: Of course, love. so I am Lucy, my pronouns are she her. I have like shoulder length now, ginger slash red hair. over the years Ashton: Yes. Lucy Edwards: it's got more bright slash duller. I would say I'm in like a bit of a phase where it looks a bit more natural actually. Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: so that's cool. And it's a tiny bit shorter and I tend to like like blow dry it with my Dyson so it's like wavy, like a blowout. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: otherwise Ashton: Beautiful. Lucy Edwards: it just looks a bit, you know, limp. And we've gotta get some volume in that queen. and Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: then I'm wearing my Etia mascara. I've got like sparkly eyeshadow on. I've just been filming some content behind the scenes for our launch in like soon, really soon, end of October. and my dress is actually sent from the new ASOS accessible line, the adaptive range. Ashton: Ooh yes. Yes, Kailey: Mm. Ashton: I've seen it. It's gorgeous. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, so it's like a wrap dress and it's burgundy. and I also Ashton: No. Lucy Edwards: have a I'm not wearing it right now, but I tried it on earlier. It's like this like cropped blazer that's like gorgeous and like I w why am I not grabbing colours out of my mind? What's going on? Brown. That's lovely, like gorgeous chocolatey brown. so yeah, that's Kailey: Ha ha ha Ashton: Mm, yes, yes, yes, yes. Love. Lucy Edwards: me. And yeah, thanks for having me. Ashton: Perfect, perfect. Kailey: Perfect, perfect. Ashton: I will jump in for myself. I am Ashton. My pronouns are she, her. Today I showed up because we do not have a video podcast. I Lucy Edwards: Hey. Ashton: am quite literally wearing a little black robe, makeup free, just skincare glowing this morning. I have like a dirt dirty blonde hair that really needs some touch up currently. on the coloring front and it is just tied up into a messy bun because it is 8 30 in the morning. and I am not yet ready for the day. But I'm wearing my black glass my black Kate Spade glasses. Nothing super fancy over here, Kaylee passing it to you. Kailey: Okay, I'm Kaylee Sheher. I am currently sitting in my basement, which sounds scary, but it's actually like carpeted and stuff, so it's fine. And I have a little longer than shoulder length reddish hair, although it's very much faded. I actually am going to the hairstylist later today to get it re upped. So I will be Ashton: Hmm. Kailey: a lot redder. thank Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Kailey: you than I am right now. Yep. I have Ashton: twins. Lucy Edwards: Good. Kailey: my skincare on right now, so I'm very glowy, but absolutely no makeup. I have blue eyes and I'm wearing this like burgundy tank top with this really cozy sweater over it. so I'm feeling Ashton: Love Kailey: very comfy and cozy Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Kailey: and ready for our discussion today. Lucy Edwards: Love it. Also love the Kate Spade glasses. Yeah, we love. Ashton: And for fall. Thank you. There, I do, I do Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: truly love them. they are my go-tos. before we dive in, I have to ask, how is Ms. Molly doing today? And is she in the room with you? Lucy Edwards: bless her. So Miss Molly has actually gone for a free run walk with her little sidekicks. Yeah, she's with my mum at the moment, Ashton: What's that for her? Lucy Edwards: bless her. but she did have a like every outfit I wear, if I go out with her, which we have done a bit of filming this morning, because it's 1 pm for me, Ashton: Yes. Lucy Edwards: she ha actually has a burgundy collar on with like a burgundy little bow tie. It's from this company called Coco Pup here in the UK, and I just Ashton: my gosh. Lucy Edwards: can't not match her to my outfits because my dress is burgundy. Ashton: I always love the coordinating. He's so cute. I I say the same Lucy Edwards: I know, it's so cute But yeah. Ashton: thing every time. I'm like, we have to have, like, we have to have a matching outfit. He is like, Lucy Edwards: You do, hun. Ashton: he's my partner, but also my so my service dog's name is Forrest. He's also a golden retriever. and he is eight years old, retiring probably next year. So that has been a bit of a feat in and of itself. Lucy Edwards: Sorry, yeah. Ashton: definitely a transition, but we always have to match, especially when we're out and about. So I feel you there. I'm sure she looks absolutely adorable. but I I definitely thank you. Lucy Edwards: Bless our yeah. I love the name forest as well. So cute. Ashton: We have we have Forest and then we have a River who is also a golden retriever, but definitely Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: just a glorified pet and the goodest boy, but also scared of his own shadow. So Lucy Edwards: Bless him. Aww. Ashton: two two very different boys, but they do love each other and are, you know, the happiest of brothers. Lucy Edwards: so cute. Kailey: So cute. I have no dog, so I have no way to contribute to this conversation, but I won the Lucy Edwards: I love it. Kailey: I do want to hear more about kind of your story because Miss Molly has become such a big part. I'd love to go back to the chapter like right before, before you ever posted a video. Who was Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Kailey: Lucy at 16? What did you love? And really what did you think your life would look like? Lucy Edwards: my gosh, not like this. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: I well I don't know. I think at sixteen we're all just so like I was definitely like I loved what I loved, but I was definitely in my own bubble. Like I had no real Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: like thought about even losing my sight to any great Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: degree, even though so at eight years old I went for a routine eye check. I already kind of knew I had my rare genetic condition, it's called inconscientipigmenti, that made me lose my eyesight. in the end, but like because not a lot of people know about the condition and on the Wikipedia it's like updated itself now, but back then like we really didn't know that it caused blindness. It was like you've Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: got a few less teeth, you've got a little bit of alopecia on the top of your head, you've got slightly ridged nails and at four years old you had this like skin condition on the back of your legs and that's how it got diagnosed. And then that went away. And we thought kind of nothing more about it. And yet as I say, routine I check age eight The lovely lady at Speck Safe was was like, Mrs. Edwards to my mum, Mrs. Edwards, you you need to rush your daughter to the hospital. And we were like, What? That just kind of started the spiral of it. But like I lost the sight of my right eye due to IP eleven. But even then, like I got away with like not using my long white cane. I, Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: you know, bumped into things at school. Like I didn't really care. Like had a little bit of death. like depth perception loss and night blindness, Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: but at school I kind of just got along with bruises and kind of didn't care. So at sixteen I would say was having a very quote unquote normal childhood. And I I f sometimes I feel a bit guilty like saying that because like my childhood very much like I got away with a lot of sighted things. Like I could still read Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: like fourteen to twenty point font. You know, as long as I was at the front of the class I was fine, and it was only when I turned like sixteen and a half-ish that like I started to get cataracts in my last remaining f you know, eye that had any vision, Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: and the world started going blurry to me. And then I remember like literally being in A-level English, and we were studying this book called Bird Song, and my god, I was terribly like worried because I literally had to have because my cataract was getting really really blurry I had like a Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: sex scene on my laptop that was like I had to zoom in on and I was like I'm at the front of the class and there's like two words per literally two Ashton: No. What are the odds? Lucy Edwards: two words per like whole Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: screen of text here and everyone can see like I don't know her boobs or whatever her breasts or whatever and I was like Time it's like 16, you just want to dig to Australia. So Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: that was kind of my reality at 16, and then I don't know, like even then, I was like, I'm not gonna go blind from this, it's fine. And then when I woke up from my cataract surgery, like late into my six sixteens, sixteenth year, I don't know. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I was so excited because finally I was like, my god, to my sister, she's like eight. 15 months younger than me. I was like, my god, Alice, I love that I can see your acne. She was like savage, but I am glad you can see it. and I turned to my mom and I was my god, I can see your wrinkles. I'm so happy. Anyway, six months later, it was all yeah. After that, like my retina detached because it didn't really work. once you mess with the front, you mess with the back. So I don't know, like Ashton: Right. Kailey: Mm. Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I Yeah, I went really low then. Sorry, that was a very whistle stop tour, but Yeah, we can dig into all of it, but yeah. Ashton: Yeah. Sure, sure, sure, sure. Did you like have any idea of what you maybe wanted to do as a career? Like what you thought kind of, you know, the trajectory might be after high school? Lucy Edwards: so I lost my sight at the start of what we say as A levels. Kailey: around Yeah. Lucy Edwards: was like sixteen to eighteen. What do you do when you're sixteen? It's like further education? Ashton: That's the end of high school for us. And then would move into like university or college after that, should you choose that route? Yes. Kailey: Around like eighteen. Yeah. Lucy Edwards: to eighteen. yeah, yeah. So yeah, this is like I I'm guessing like the end of your high school, but for us we call it six Ashton: Yes. Lucy Edwards: sixth form and it's just like two years that attacked onto the end of like the higher education. And Kailey: Okay. Okay. Lucy Edwards: first we have like GCSEs and then you you kind of do f about like ten to thirteen of those, well I did when I was and the when Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: I was sixteen. So I got through those okay Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: and then yeah we call it A level studies between seventeen and eighteen, those two years, but I had to do three instead because I lost my sight like pretty much bang in the middle of them. So all I watched all of my Kailey: Oof. Lucy Edwards: friends like go into the second year of that. And then I Ashton: That's so tough. Lucy Edwards: just stu yeah. So managed to do it though and I really wanted to be a lawyer, like Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: a solicitor here. And I Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: actually got into law school. I like I c I I refused to use Braille because I was like, I can see and I'll always be able to see Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: Mm mommy and like no, it wasn't the case. Like I caught like dictated every comma and every full stop in my English literature. And I managed to come out of that with A star B B and I got into law school, which is insane, within Ashton: Incredible. Yeah. Kailey: Love. Lucy Edwards: three years. And then but then yeah, I dropped out of law school because I was really low. I was so super low. So yeah, Ashton: Valid. I'm I'm sure. Lucy Edwards: I I did I did okay at law school, but just my heart wasn't in it, and I was like, YouTube was Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: starting, and I was like I can make something of this, you know? So Ashton: Yes. You said I have Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: I have z something else in mind. Something very different. Lucy Edwards: Yeah. I've got a dream. Ashton: yes, exactly. And it's so crazy how that that panned out. But a year later, you know, your life obviously shifted so much. And I think that beauty ended up playing a probably a very big role in finding your way through that. I would love to know what is the first beauty product you figured out how to use on your own. Maybe, you know, you had to adapt something, maybe you didn't. And how long did it take to feel confident with it post losing your site? Lucy Edwards: Mmm, mmm, yeah, so I messed with loads of beauty products before, but like, yeah, as I say, I kind of had to bin everything I kind of knew as like a sighted young teenager. Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: would say the first thing I wore and was comfortable with is like clear lip gloss because I was just so scared about doing it all. And then Ashton: Yes. Mm-hmm. Kailey: Mm. Mm. Lucy Edwards: I transitioned into trying to do my face makeup because I was like, well, if I can get the right shade, then I I'm hoping that I can apply it okay. And that's when I got obsessed with beauty blender sponges. and Ashton: Yeah yes. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: kind of then once I discovered that, I tried to match it myself with someone in like boots over here, and I think it's like Walgreens in the USA, but like, yeah, I tried to do that, and then my sister would kind of be like, Lou, you look really orange, and I'd be like, No. Ashton: Sisters are so savage sometimes. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, literally. Honestly, I love her. But like if she didn't Kailey: They're honest. Lucy Edwards: do that and I didn't cry, I wouldn't be as good as she's taught me to be. So bless her. Yeah. Ashton: Okay, so true. So true. Kailey: Mm-hmm. And kind of as you like built up that confidence, right? With like the practice and with your sister just kind of like shooting you down and then building you back up. I I imagine Lucy Edwards: Plus Ashton: Ha ha. Kailey: you ran into plenty of people who didn't understand why makeup still mattered to you. I mean, I feel like we see comments of this all over Ashton: All the time. Kailey: the internet, where Lucy Edwards: Mm. Kailey: people assume that like if you can't see, you why would you care how you look? And I would just love to know like what would you wanna say to them who have or the people who have this notion and assumption. Yeah. Ashton: Or, like, what do you say to them? Cuz I'm sure you hear this. Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Yeah. my god, so much. well beauty's always been a massive part of who I am. So I didn't just want to lose Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: it when I lost my sight. Like I'd always like it's the thing like my sister has autism and it was h it's ha always been her special interest. So like for us to be very like Kailey: Love that. Ashton: I relate. Lucy Edwards: yeah, literally, she's like she just adores it and has always loved it and Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: the amount that we have bonded over it as like being close in age, it's always just been the two of us. We don't have any other siblings. So Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: I think like for me, I got a lot of comfort in Alice always being my mirror. And you Kailey: So Lucy Edwards: know, if someone says something to me online, like inevitably it's always there. like, why would you want to do this? or la la la. My response Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: has always been quite like steadfast in that I know myself. It's a sense of self. And I think when I started to lose my eyesight grieving that loss of not being able to see myself in the mirror has has Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: like I don't know, like it's always helped me to get through the day. Like I if I woke up and thought, my God, I'm blind again. Like this is groundhog day. I hate this, I would be like, right, just push that to the back of your mind. Go and Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: do the three steps you can do with your beauty routine and it's about the way it makes you feel and I think that's what all Alice Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: has always tried to kind of make me believe because it at the end of the day, the beauty industry isn't made for people like me. Like I got shut out Kailey: Yep. Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: that day that I lost my eyesight. Every bottle, every product just started to feel the same. And Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I was so distraught about that that I just didn't feel like I had a place anymore with a Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: hobby that, you know, me and my sister had always done since we were literally twelve years old. So I think it was a fight to try and, you know, really fight for that sense of self. but Alice Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: didn't let me lose it. And I was just so lucky that you know, she'd literally audio describe hours of tutorials. So what I would say to people is like I mean, I just want to be the Alice for other people. I don't feel like many people Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: have an Alice like I did and you know, it's Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: still not really accessible to us. The B E industry still isn't accessible and I think it's about just finding like ha you know, the different things more than the visuals about how it makes you feel. It is about how it makes you feel. Yeah. Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: Sure. Yeah, it very much is. It's it's creativity, it's self-expression, it's it's all these things wrapped into one. And it was a way for you too to connect with your sister, which is obviously so important, especially with it being her her special interest. I I imagine Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: though that it was grounding to hold on to something like that. But you know, we hear that all the time online. It obviously For folks who are blind or visually impaired, but across the board for disabled people, people just do not understand Kailey: Mm. Ashton: why disabled people want to be able to, you know, dress up or do their makeup or do all these things. We're still people at the end of the day. We still want to feel like ourselves. We still want to express ourselves. And I I think it's a very silly notion to have, Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: but I I love your your answer for that. I feel like people tend to Focus on, and very understandably, you know, it is a lot to grapple with, and that's an understatement, but people tend to focus on what's hard about being disabled or what's hard about being blind. So I would love to kind of flip it around for a second and get a little silly with it. I would love to know what is an unexpected perk of being blind that nobody ever talks about. Because I'm thinking for myself as a wheelchair user, I can wear high heels, I can wear the most uncomfortable shoes. Lucy Edwards: He Ashton: And it does not matter because they will not be touching the ground. I would love to know if you found kind of a perk like that. Lucy Edwards: my god, I love that. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: That's awesome. Honestly, like the most rhinestone gorgeous heels. Yeah, absolutely. And also they never wear out. Like you could buy really expensive shoes. Yeah. my god. Ashton: Exactly, exactly. That is my other favorite thing. They're most likely not going to get dirty or scuffed. Kailey: Mm-hmm. No. Ashton: They're going to be beautiful to the end. So that's my little perk. Lucy Edwards: my god, slow. my god, I love that. Okay, I guess like all I spoke about this in an article a month or so back, but like I think it's a really this carefree thing of like not having an expectation of like having to scroll through Instagram and compare myself to everybody. Like I Ashton: Ooh I love that. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: just adore the fact that I could just wear tactile clothes. Like go and be in my own head about how the way it makes Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: me feel. And don't get me wrong, like I've grappled so much with like should I care about my sighted sister's opinion about this more than my own? Like because that's what I used to care about when I could see and la la la and then I'm like, no Ashton: Right, right. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Mm. Lucy Edwards: eff it, like I love her opinion, but really is it comfy on me? Like I'm Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: thirty now, I'm not getting any younger, like I need to love it. You know? I agree. Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: Amen. I I feel that deeply. Yeah, I think I think it's very easy, especially with the landscape that you've ended up in, the social media landscape as a whole. It is so easy to play that comparison game. So Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: not that you're not immune to it, but I definitely think it's nice that you know you're not consuming it in the same way and as maybe as often. I I think that could Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: definitely have positive effects, especially as a creator. Lucy Edwards: Agreed. Ashton: because I hear that from so many folks in this space, just that that is like the bane Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: of their existence, that it makes it incredibly ex difficult to exist in this space, and I feel that as well. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, definitely. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: It is d it does weigh heavy, especially external forces, but like, yeah, I'm with you, girl. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: Sure. Yeah. Kailey: And I I love that your perk is like really helps you almost become more yourself, right? You're like, yeah, I Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: Same. Kailey: I can take this like inward of how I'm feeling and how the makeup feels on my skin, right? And like how the skincare feels. And me for specifically like lip balm, if it feels yucky, I freak out. so like, but being able Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Fair play. Ashton: Same. Kailey: to just really, and again, in your 30s, as me and Ashton are also both in our thirties, really feels like the decade of like coming into myself, truly. Like it's Lucy Edwards: God yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I Ashton: I agree. It's so freeing. Lucy Edwards: just honestly guys, I adore it. like I was such a people pleaser in my like mid twenties and I'm like, no I like no, not anymore, no, it's my life Kailey: Mm mm. Ashton: Me too Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: I always heard this very much so that once you turn 30, you kind of shift to this, you know, very much effort mindset. and then moving into I also hear that moving into your 40s. So I really hope that there is nothing but coming into ourselves and positivity for the future. I'm very excited and I hope that I just grow more increasingly willing to just Give somebody the middle finger and move on. Kailey: so we could literally probably talk about how great our 30s are all day. But Ashton: Ha ha Kailey: I want to get into the absolutely incredible work you've done in beauty and just like really uplift that you were Panteen's first visually impaired ambassador and you helped put Navi lens codes on their bottles. Like I literally remember seeing this online as because I started my like accessible beauty stuff like six-ish years ago or something like that. But I remember Ashton: Yeah, it's horrifying. Kailey: looking for things and finding this and being like wow there's something right and so I would love to know what Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Kailey: was it like pushing that global brand or a global brand to change its actual packaging. Lucy Edwards: Literally insane. I'll kind of rewind and tell you a bit of the backstory. So like Ashton: Yes, Lucy Edwards: back in twenty nineteen I was like to be honest doing freelance journalism for the BBC but also like you know, wanting to pick up my social media a bit more and just make more contacts and thinking I really want to get into beauty and I had like a lot of contacts from journalism and I thought I'm just gonna ring Sam Latif. She didn't know who the hell I was. Sam Latif is the global accessibility lead for Procter and Gamble. and she was like yeah I think I know who you are. You interviewed my brother didn't you on on a pock on a BBC podcast. I'm like, yeah that's me yeah yeah yeah that's me. but I was like honestly My pants a little bit and thought, my god, I'm shaking. Like, why am I doing Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: this? This is so weird. Anyway, so we kind of continue talking. I was like, I really would love to just be involved in what you're doing. I think you're really cool. She's like, thanks. Like, this is you know, I just heard about her tactile symbols from interviewing her brother. Like, all of her brothers are also blind, and they're really Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: blinking cool. Like, they all do different things within the blind space. and her brother. went on celebrity master chef here like a good few years ago now. Ashton: So cool. Kailey: My gosh. Lucy Edwards: after interviewing him I said, Sam, let's keep in touch. to be honest, I was just like young and bright eyed, bushy tailed, just wanted to involve myself, you know? So sh I would go Ashton: yes. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: onto these free calls for like hours and hours and hours. I'm like What symbols for deodorant and body wash and all these different things that Sam was doing that was like not in the beauty space or hair care space at all. She was just like, What you know, seven, eight blind people on the call, like do you like these symbols? I've sent you with them out in the post. Anyway, this happened for like honestly years. And then, at the end of twenty twenty, or is it the start of twenty one, she was like, Lou, like you've been on all these calls with other people, like, just come on the call. I'm gonna Like, all my team will be on the call, but just like just pretend they're not there. Like, I'm just gonna interview you about your hair. I'm like, Kailey: Okay. Ashton: Okay. Lucy Edwards: That's that's a bit weird. That's a bit weird. She's like, I'll give you like a thirty quid gift card. I can't even remember the it was a Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: nominal amount of f whatever. And I'm just sitting there Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: in my little living room, like minding my own business on a November evening, and I'm like, Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: so yeah, like this just really gets to be like I have like this hair and la la la Anyway, just word vomiting about like my hair and this and the other. And like Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: having t apparently 20 people on the call or there, they're all silent. Anyway Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: Then randomly the year after, like in 2021 in March, she was like, Louie, you sitting down, I want to to ring you And I'm like, Yeah, I mean it's my sister's birthday, like and I thought she would be ringing me about some tactile symbol. I thought she's just a cool lady Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: and we'd like built a rapport. Like we're really good friends now, by the way. Like I love her kids, like I see her all the time. Well, yeah, it is I Ashton: Right. Sure. Are you sitting down is a little suspicious, but Kailey: No. Lucy Edwards: was like, mm, okay. She was like to the call. I didn't know her as much now. Now I'm like, Sam, you're just like amazing. But then I was like, yeah, like I I've got a GT. She's like, I'm gonna change your life. I'm like, sorry? Come again. She's like, yeah, sit down because I'm gonna make you the global face of Panther. And I'm like, c come again. so yeah Kailey: My God. Lucy Edwards: I I honestly because I didn't know her loads, I was like thank you so much, my gosh, thank you. And the call scream like literally scream Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: the house down. Ashton: Yeah, throw your phone across the room. So valid Lucy Edwards: Yeah, literally. And get pretty drunk, not gonna lie. Ashton: and real. Lucy Edwards: A whirlwind because I just dealt my manager dealt with all the contracts and stuff because I'd never done all Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: that stuff before. Like I was Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: blowing up on social media. Like the year before, I'd just had a million followers. I was kind of like, I'm just a little old girl, I kind of understand. anyway, Ashton: Incredible. Right. It happens fast. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: so yeah, that all happened, and I think to be honest, kudos to Sam because she was like, 'Lou, do you know about navigns?' and I think what made that really good is that in the contract she made sure there was a consulting element, so she was like, Lou. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: I want you to still come to these things. Like even though you're the face of our company, like you've you've been consulting for us for years now. Like I've got a lot of your Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: insights. Like, how can we make this better? Like I would go on calls to the Navilins team and be like, I think we can add this more to the packaging. And then obviously, Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: as part of the element of like me doing like a 15 hour shoot, it was insane because then the the day after I would obviously tack on like an accessibility portion to it. So to be honest, it's like it was Ashton: Right. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: Me being a model and me being the face of something, but also adding this like different element and yeah, I I still can't believe I did two adverts. Ashton: Consulting, modeling, like seems like it was a very well-rounded experience that you kind of got Lucy Edwards: Honestly! Ashton: thrown into, but obviously they chose you for a reason. I th Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: that's so funny that she was like, hey, are you sitting down? I'm gonna change your entire life. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, literally. I'm just gonna change her entire life. I was like she Kailey: Exactly. Lucy Edwards: she still laughs though. She's like, Lou, like there's this one moment because like obviously we wanna get people to understand accessibility and how these codes like truly change people's lives. Like I've been on several Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: Exactly. Lucy Edwards: calls now to the Netherlands team and I love Javier and his team. Like I'm really good friends with them. And like, you know, I I went to this like open day where Sam had like fake shelves up with like all the Netherlands codes and like Pantent all on the shelves Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: and I remember scanning Kailey: Hm. Lucy Edwards: it for the first time and I honestly looked so ugly crying and she's like Lou like I did Ashton: I Kailey: No Lucy Edwards: record that obviously because like you knew that you were being recorded but like I do put that on every one of my presentations and I'm like cheers babe Ashton: Awww Lucy Edwards: lovely Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: love that for me yeah but yeah Ashton: Your real your real reaction. I love that. Yeah. You're like, yeah, and of course I was ugly crying. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, literally. But no, on a serious note, it's honestly life changing technology and I wouldn't have necessarily known Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: about it without Sam. But I think girls together, like the fact that we were both like hitting it, she was from corporate level, I was from the face of, and both of us having that lived experience, I think honestly that's what made that partnership so special. Yeah. Ashton: It's so incredible. Yeah. Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: And now Etienne London launches this month. Starting with your visionary Lucy Edwards: I know honestly. Kailey: See. Ashton: mascara, I'm sure you're feeling all of the feelings right now. I'm sure you Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: have been overwhelmed. I can imagine how long this has been in process. And you know, you can definitely touch on that. But I would love to know kind of the moment that you knew you wanted to start. a beauty brand of your own. Lucy Edwards: my god, god. Okay. I wanna say it's since I've lost my eyesight and since like how like my video, Blind Girl Does Her Own Makeup, went viral like the first time on YouTube Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: and then obviously like doing a remake of it in twenty twenty and that got twenty million views and that kind of launched my career on TikTok. Ashton: Incredible. Lucy Edwards: but like I think ultimately I've always loved makeup and I always Have felt so frustrated with the fact that I just have no idea what's in my makeup bag. The amount of times that Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: my husband has come home and like I, you know, he's never wanted to stop me buying makeup. I mean, his bank account has, but like like I literally pave our partners. They're like, Come Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: My wife says the same, it's okay. Lucy Edwards: on, what are you doing? Yeah. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: But bless him, he still sits there and Braille's absolutely blinking everything. And I'm like, Ollie, the braille label's falling off. He's like, Okay, Lou. so yeah, it's all a bit it's all a bit cray. But like he's done that for hours and hours and hours. I can't even tell you how many hours him or my sister have labelled things. And I'm just like, This cannot Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: like I I was just like consulting for other brands and I was like, Yes, it's happening on a level, like Panton's Amazing Slay, but where's the makeup, right? And Ashton: Right. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I would try to partner with other brands and be like, you know, we can do this and all that. And then, you know, understanding how moulds work and how expensive they are, and like other people Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: having other kind of priorities, not slating them, but like, Ashton: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I just want to slay the house down, slay the boots down of like the accessibility world, and like we deserve to have a seat at the table. And I was like, one Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: Amen. Yeah. Lucy Edwards: problem, have no money, lol. so and Ashton: Ha ha ha. Lucy Edwards: didn't know how expensive it was. So Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: so I went to to be honest, I'd had like a pitch in my files probably for like I wanna say nearly ten years. From like Kailey: Wow. Lucy Edwards: and this was like me being like twenty seven, nearly turning twenty eight. Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: I was like, I literally have to do something with this, guys. I have to do something with it. was like, I just don't I don't want this makeup brand just to be like a clunky makeup I want everyone to love this. Like we are gorgeous humans and accessibility is gorgeous. So like why can't it be Ashton: Indeed, Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: both? Like what is going on? Anyway, I actually found this like grant funding And I applied, it's called the Catalyst Programme and it was people all around Europe and it culminated in like, I don't know, six rounds of me doing essays, like no probably exaggeration, but like a lot a lot of paperwork, of like these Ashton: my gosh. sure. Lucy Edwards: online forms and getting through all of that and then virtual in face interviews and then I got down I think ten of us got to Paris. Yeah, maybe fifteen, but Kailey: My gosh. Lucy Edwards: then like I was literally the first one up and I went with my co-founder and also manager Chloe like to the front of the room and there Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: was like fifteen people from like Mama Mum Mitchell, he's like a big makeup Kailey: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lucy Edwards: artist. I just I Ashton: Yes. Lucy Edwards: love him. He's the one that honestly, he is so Kailey: I own some of his stuff. Ashton: Same. Lucy Edwards: gorgeous, and he was one of the guys who was just like, Lou, you can do this. And I think he was like, We need to give her the money. He was hugging me after anyway. Ashton: I love that. Lucy Edwards: and I was the third person who run some grant funding. They were only going to give the grant funding to two people and honestly standing there and I was the third person they announced. So I was like to be honest, I was smiling and clapping for everybody and thought, my God, they're two Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: really deserving winners. And then they're like, and actually we're giving a third Ashton: And I had no idea. Lucy Edwards: one. And then I honestly literally weed myself. like on the spot, you know? Visceral Kailey: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ashton: I mean s I would have too. It's okay. Yeah. Kailey: As one does. Lucy Edwards: Exactly. and I just cried and my manager was like Lou Hold it together, keep it together. But I think it just meant so much to me. I won like a hundred and twenty K, but then I was like, Ashton: Incredible. Lucy Edwards: my god, that is literally insane. But when you get to make up packaging, dear Lord, like it's literally Kailey: Yeah. Yeah. Lucy Edwards: If I wanted to truly do absolutely everything that I wanted to do, like Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: I've done it to the best of my ability for the money that I Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: had. And honestly, Queens, like we have, you know, begged and yeah, you just got you gotta do what you gotta do. You gotta hustle. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: You do. Lucy Edwards: and also me and Ollie have pumped some of like some of our money in and saved over like five, six years. Anyway, cannot believe I won that grant funding. I cannot believe that I have been in a privileged place, like save and put some stuff into it, but it is because I just wanna change packaging for disabled people. I just yeah. It's gonna be amazing. Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Yeah. Yeah. And Ashton: You had a dream. Kailey: so Lucy Edwards: you. Kailey: incredible. And also just like talking about how expensive it is, right? Do you find that it really was more expensive than someone who might be trying to launch something with just like component packaging or something that maybe wasn't as focused on accessibility? Lucy Edwards: Mm hmm. Yeah, you definitely have to think outside the box, Hun. You absolutely Kailey: Okay. Lucy Edwards: do. I mean, you know, first of all, stage one, like two and a bit years ago now, you know, you get Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: these components that are rounded, that are square, Kailey: Mm. Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: but have no tactile features on them, and there are like Kailey: Yeah, yeah. Ashton: Sure. Lucy Edwards: a certain unit price. And now I've seen all of those, I've pretty much seen every single packet. Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: I'm Lucy Edwards: That's literally on the shelves Ashton: sure. Lucy Edwards: and know how much they pay for them. So I'm like, my god, queens, we're very much hiking up the price here. anyway, Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lucy Edwards: honestly, you can't take the bromie out the girl. I'm just so like honest with stuff. But like I just think I see all of these unit cards and I'm just like, well, we can't access this. Like Ashton: Right. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: You know, and obviously I don't speak for every disabled person and I know when I launch there are gonna be different iterations of this and I'm gonna have Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: a swarm of comments like, We need this, Lucy, we need that, Lucy. I'm like, yes, please tell me. Like honestly, Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: don't mind the feedback. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: We need to have this brand for everybody, and it's not just my brand when it launches into the world. It's very much been in my head and also on survey forms. But like, there is no way that I was not making a custom mold, but as you say, like You're looking at custom injection moulds being like fifty grand plus and Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: that's just one mould before you've even made any of the packaging, before you've even attached Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: it onto a formula Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: i before an out of box, before a formula, before a fill, before shipping it, Ashton: Sure. Lucy Edwards: before all of these overheads. So you're like, my god, I just I can't spend fifty grand on just one injection mould. Ashton: Right, you're like, I am Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: one person. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, I'm literally one I'm like, MG. So like how Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: do I do this? So I went for a different type of mould. and you know, think we've got there and we've got the shape that we want in Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: the way that we have. We've had to make, you know, with everything, there's pros and cons to everything that you do. Ashton: Sure. Lucy Edwards: And eventually, Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: obviously those blue skies are gonna be me spending that fifty grand on on things Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: that need injection moulding, but that's after I've had a lot of feedback from everybody looking Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: at the brand at the moment. we made the the mould that we with a component that is kind of sold every day on the inside. It's actually a round component on the inside. Kailey: Okay. Lucy Edwards: And then on the outside, the silicon mold that we've done, we've glued it and we've attached it and we've made it have braille on it. We've made the custom Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: component look really gorgeous, but also the fact that it's silicon, it's grippy. And we did a massive survey Kailey: Mm. Ashton: Love. Lucy Edwards: of over a thousand people in my audience who have told me exactly what bottle they like to grip, exactly what they like to have. Like I honestly bless I've d given them like more than twenty questions on that survey and got Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: them to type loads Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: of stuff and they came through. Like I love my audience. And then about we've got like ten thousand people on the wait list. So I hope I've done them proud. hope Ashton: I'm I'm sure you have. Lucy Edwards: that I've done enough. Ashton: at the end of the day, and we talk about this all the time, obviously no one product can be one size fits all. No one product can meet the needs of every single disabled person out there, but it speaks to the hard work and the love that you've put into this and the passion you've put into this that you wanted to hear feedback from other folks, and that you're still open to it even after launch. You you just touched on Lucy Edwards: my god, yeah. Ashton: that. you've kind of woven accessibility into every single detail of Etia, understandably from your packaging to Braille to Navi Lens to accessible tutorials. I would love you to walk us through kind of how you tested these features. And maybe some of the feedback and things you learned from disabled consumers or your audience along the way. Lucy Edwards: Absolutely. So I called our little group the Blind Beauty Alliance. and I had several women from around the globe like talking to me about their, you know, points of view on blindness because I'm only one blind person. So I'd Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: And it's a spectrum. Lucy Edwards: been doing that even before I had Etya in my head, I was like, I wanna do these universal tactile symbols. I wanna make them globally accessible. Like that's what Sam's done with Proctor and Gamble. Like she is like, please take my symbols. Like I'm not gonna license them for money. Like we just want you to take them. If you don't know Braille, you need to, you know get along with these symbols and we want these symbols to be discreet Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: on packaging that is already existing so they look demure. And me and Sam have Ashton: Love. Lucy Edwards: been talking about she's like, Lou, you have to do these universal tactile symbols for makeup. Like you have to do it, you have to make it a thing. And I did. that was the first thing o Kailey: Awesome. Lucy Edwards: of that, of like just consulting blind people, people who love makeup Ashton: Right, so cool. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: on our symbols. And then Past that, it was about making it not roll off the table and grippable Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: for people who have limb difference or people who, Ashton: Yes. Lucy Edwards: you know, have a maybe a slight shake in their arm, or said to me, Lou, Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: like, I hate these long handles. Like, I absolutely hate the fact that these mascaras are always so massive. Ashton: Me too, girl. Lucy Edwards: so then we adjusted the size of it. after that feedback and then as I say like I put a massive pollock to my audience and surveyed them. All of the comments that I've done on the Fanders Diaries series. know, I've had so many DMs of like just chatting to people about their different experiences my audience have been super helpful. But as I say, like Ashton: I love. Lucy Edwards: I think ultimately the this packaging is inspired by the way make it makes me feel and the way I want it to make other Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: people feel and it looks like a perfume bottle. Like I wanted it to be about touch number one I was inspired by all of it. And Ashton: drinking. Lucy Edwards: just think, you know, it it's just my my wildish dreams that people care enough to like one, care about give me feedback, but also the out of box packaging. I worked really hard. with my factory because there's n like a lot of people were telling me in the comments of my videos but also in DMs that like they just couldn't get these fiddly out of box packets on traditional Ashton: Mm. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: beauty products. There's not like you know on the Amazon boxes they're like the s the the the like already perforated tear that you can like Kailey: Yep. Yeah. Ashton: Yep. Lucy Edwards: slit. We wanted that on our outer box, but we also wanted Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: to just be able to crush it. So like someone with limb difference, I'm hoping Kailey: Mm Lucy Edwards: that they just get Etia, they can literally crush it with their forearm and they Kailey: I love that. Ashton: Love. Lucy Edwards: can open it as well. So yeah, as I say, like I'm still open. This is just our first launch. Like I'm still open to Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: and I will be doing so many more surveys for people who buy Etia and love Etia. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: But yeah. Sorry, I'm rabbiting on. Ashton: No, I think that's that's Kailey: No, I Ashton: great. I think it speaks to the community that you have too, that they were, you know, that they've been so willing to to share that with you. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, absolutely. Kailey: Yeah. And I honestly hearing that you might be able to crush, I'm like, okay, so I'm on the wait list and now I need to buy multiples so that I can try it multiple ways. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: Literally, literally, to crush the fox. my god. And I want all feedback. Even if it's n even Kailey: Sounds Yeah. Lucy Edwards: if it's negative, I'm with you, girl. Like if we can change it and in any way or like my dream one day is to like have different caps, like different iterations, different things that people can put on, you know? Kailey: Yeah, yeah, yeah. my gosh. We were literally Ashton: Yes. Kailey: so we were on a podcast or we were recording a podcast with Sarah Todd Hammer the other day and she is like an a an a disability advocate and whatnot. And we literally were talking about how we'd love if brands would do like a build your own so that you can like build your so Lucy. Ashton: Mm. Lucy Edwards: Literally I hear you girl. I'm with ya. And I side note, I love Sarah Toddhammer, she's a sleigh. honestly bless her. but yeah, Kailey: All right, all right. I'm fine but Yeah, yeah. Ashton: She's so lovely. Lucy Edwards: no, that I am so with you. Like I am so an Apple girly. Their modularity of like the Kailey: Yeah. Yeah. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: the way they design things, I'm here for it, but for makeup. So like watch this space. Any feedback is like very much appreciated. And as long as Kailey: Okay. Lucy Edwards: it's said in like a constructive way, not like I hate you, Lucy, what are you doing? Kailey: yeah. Lucy Edwards: I'm in all ears Yeslay Kailey: Yeah, I will for sure be in your DMs. but okay. Hearing all that, literally I've gotten chills so many times throughout this conversation. And I Ashton: Same. Lucy Edwards: Hey Kailey: keep picturing the people who are about to hold an Etia pro and I'm getting chills again right now. I about to hold it for the very first time. And for someone who is listening who's never really been able to reach into their makeup bag and know what they're holding, like you've mentioned needing. Your husband to help or like getting how they all feel the same. What do you hope that first experience feels like? Lucy Edwards: My god, this makes me cry. Kailey: I know. Ashton: We're all gonna be crying. Lucy Edwards: my Just remember feeling so low and so dehumanized by not being able to be myself when I first lost Kailey: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Lucy Edwards: my eyesight, and just thinking, my god, like the world around me wants me to be fixed, but like I don't feel like I need fixing. Like, I'm just Lucy. This happened to me. Like overnight I lost my Ashton: Right. Lucy Edwards: sight through no fault of my own. And suddenly I just can't do anything like I used to. So I literally do everything that I do because of the little version of me still out there feeling so terrified and just wanting to feel like themselves. And I get up every single day and I think, my God, I just don't want other people to feel sick like I did. And I cannot wait for someone to open their makeup bag and just actually feel the mascara and like not have to ask anybody like that to me is like true independence that I used to have before Kailey: Mm-hmm. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: I lost my sight and just I want to eradicate that feeling from anyone who is losing their sight or anyone who is feeling inadequate or not worthy or feels like the beauty industry just hasn't represented them because why should Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: it bloody not? It's twenty twenty six. So I want them to feel okay about themselves finally. And that's what I hope S here does. Ashton: Alright, well now we are I think this is the first episode that I've like teared up during. So woo! Alright. 9 Lucy Edwards: Honestly. Sorry guys. Ashton: 30 in the morning. Just have a good cry to start Kailey: No no Ashton: the day. It's a good cry though, because Lucy Edwards: guys. Ashton: it is I I I can only imagine what it feels like from your perspective. And I I hear so much passion and love and Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: and I know that so much. joy and and passion and thought and all of these things have gone into this brain. I'm so excited. I'm so excited for you. I'm so excited for the many folks who you've already impacted but are going to continue to impact. but I'm I'm sure this feeling of being seen in this way connects so deeply to your own journey as you've just touched on You've said that you love being blind now, something you probably never imagined that you would say. Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: What would you tell the 17 year old I'm still back with the heavy hitting questions, what would Kailey: Ooh. Lucy Edwards: Yeah. Ashton: you tell the 17-year-old version of you who had just lost her sight? Lucy Edwards: I love that question. I constantly think about it and it's the reason that I get up, it's my why. you are not invisible, even though you feel like you are, even though you feel sick to your stomach, that you don't recognise the body that you now live in, that you don't feel like yourself, and every time you go out the front door, you feel like everyone's judging you in a different way because people are just seeing your mobility aid or your disability before they finally see you. That you are not invisible to me. Like you will never be invisible. And you should love yourself. And this is what Etia is about. Like you deserve to feel really good about yourself. And it's not always just about makeup. But for me, make up was a way that I could get up in the morning, not feel crummy, and just actually just carve out a bit of time for myself. And why the bloody hell? Just because you can't see yourself or Have a limb difference or feel like it's really hard to put on makeup. Why on earth should we be shut out? It's not okay. So you can do it and you are normal, whatever normal is. and just because, you know, this has happened to you, it doesn't mean that it's the end of your world. Ashton: And end of episode. Kailey: And period. No. Like we Lucy Edwards: Ha ha ha. Kailey: are, I think we're gonna have to put like a disclaimer at the top. Be like, by the end, you probably will cry. So get tissues. and so Ashton: Ha ha ha. Lucy Edwards: Yeah, press you guys. Kailey: our very last question before we go into kind of silly fun, haha, bring it back up at the end so we don't leave you in the middle of your work day like with such a heavy, yeah, sorry. Lucy Edwards: Bless you. It's okay. Kailey: but we're gonna end with a message for the people who really have the Power to change this industry, right? Like in one sentence, what do you want every beauty executive to hear? Lucy Edwards: yeah. think if you're listening to this and are interested in inclusive beauty, accessible beauty, you are interested full stop in beauty. It's yes, we are carving out a section of the internet to say we want accessible beauty, but really that just means universal design and it means thinking about every age, every gender, every sexual orientation, every race when you are sitting around the boardroom thinking about your budgets and understanding Is this product I'm holding not just for the average American, average British person? Like what is that anyway? Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: what is average? I don't like average. cannot, do not understand her. Just never being her. But I think we need to not be as prescriptive and understand that I mean You anyone could go disabled at any time. Like any like I lost my eyesight through no fault of my own. And I al I always say like I knew nothing about disability until I became a disabled person myself. So of course it's not your fault that you don't know anything about any of this. Like I had to blink and learn on the job, mate. But it doesn't mean that it doesn't Ashton: Right. Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: concern you just because you don't know anyone your life when fifteen percent of the global population And eight trillion dollars globally is put you know, is the spending power Kailey: Mm-hmm. Lucy Edwards: at the purple pound of, Ashton: Mm. Lucy Edwards: you know, disabled people and their families. So I could go on and on and on, but I just think like Kailey: Mm. Lucy Edwards: we just need to think about this from a human level, rather Ashton: Yeah. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: than just putting us in a box. Ashton: A very humanistic approach. And if nothing else, I say all the time, a business case, don't you want money? Like I think Lucy Edwards: Literally I'm with you. Ashton: that's a very, very reasonable way to say it. But now that we have made you cry and feel all the feelings today and ourselves too, I would love to get into a fun little rapid fire question where they're really just whatever comes to mind when I ask you these questions. I would love to get into that. Lucy Edwards: Let's do it. Ashton: Okay. Tea or coffee and bonus, how do you take it? Lucy Edwards: my god, cup of tea, I'm British. Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: milk, no sugar. Ashton: runway or red carpet? Lucy Edwards: my god, this is so hard, don't do the red carpet next week. Kailey: Ha ha. Lucy Edwards: Runway though, because Miss Molly was like the first guide doggy in Vogue. Thank you. Lip gloss. Yeah. Gotta love. Ashton: my gosh, Lipstick or lip gloss? Sparkly or matte? Lucy Edwards: Sparkle. Ashton: Sweet or savory? Lucy Edwards: set you free. Ashton: Audiobook or a podcast? Lucy Edwards: podcast just pipped. Love my investigative journalism. Ashton: Signature scent or signature hairstyle. Lucy Edwards: my god, this is really hard. would say hair, that's what I'm known for, but I just love my ood. Ashton: what's Kailey: my god. Ashton: your favorite beauty product texture to feel? Lucy Edwards: my god. Like recently, 'cause it like changes all the time, Ashton: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: but like these new cushion foundations like started when we were like twelve, thirteen, fourteen and now they've come back around and my god, that YSL cushion foundation, the packaging, my god, the application, my god, and it feels like skincare on your face. Ashton: It's so satisfying. Lucy Edwards: Same. my god. Ashton: What is your go-to comfort meal to cook? Lucy Edwards: pizza. Ashton: Would you rather wear full glam to the gym or no makeup to a red carpet? Lucy Edwards: I couldn't do that on a red carpet. Full glam to the gym. Getty images cannot have my rosacea. Kailey: Yeah. Ashton: my gosh, not getting. would you rather give up setting spray or primer? Lucy Edwards: Say spray. Ashton: Would you rather know what Miss Molly is thinking for a day or have her understand everything you say? Lucy Edwards: my god, think thinking. my god, thinking. I love that question. Kailey: Yeah. Lucy Edwards: Literally. Ashton: never buy another makeup product or never have to clean another makeup brush. Lucy Edwards: I would say never have to clean another makeup brush. God, that's laborious, yeah. Ashton: where can our listeners find you? Where can they get their hands on Etia? Lucy Edwards: Etia London dot com. It's gonna be out thirtieth of October. And yeah, can't wait to see you there. Also it's gonna be on TikTok shop. And then just find me at the Etia London. But also you can find my social media just at Lucy Edwards most places. Kailey: we will have all of her links in the show notes. Please do if you are not following Lucy, go follow Lucy because it she is just a fabulous human. And if you have not been convinced of that by this conversation, I don't know how I'm gonna help you. But If this episode felt helpful, consider subscribing, sharing it with your bestie, or leaving a review so we can keep the dream alive. We'll see you next time. Ashton: And the lights on. Thank you so much, Lucy. See you guys next time. Bye. I'm Kailey: Bye.