1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:04,240 Welcome to episode number 337 of the mindful 2 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:07,680 marketing podcast. In the month of December every year, I bring 3 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:11,519 you guest appearances on other podcasts, both as a way 4 00:00:11,519 --> 00:00:15,315 to share what I'm doing out in the world at wide, 5 00:00:15,615 --> 00:00:19,215 but also to give myself a little break and, walk the talk that I 6 00:00:19,215 --> 00:00:22,814 preach so much here on this very podcast. And today, I'm excited to 7 00:00:22,814 --> 00:00:26,175 highlight my guest appearance on the Consistency Corner 8 00:00:26,175 --> 00:00:29,730 podcast. Ruthie and I sat down to talk about social media 9 00:00:29,730 --> 00:00:33,330 algorithms. If you've ever felt like they've left you scratching your 10 00:00:33,330 --> 00:00:37,010 head, this episode is for you. Ruthie and I dive into the world of 11 00:00:37,010 --> 00:00:40,690 algorithms breaking down how they work and how you can make them 12 00:00:40,690 --> 00:00:44,335 work for you. We talk about why understanding the algorithm is 13 00:00:44,335 --> 00:00:48,175 essential for optimizing your content so that you reach all people. We talk about 14 00:00:48,175 --> 00:00:51,695 how to tailor your content to the different platforms which can get you better 15 00:00:51,695 --> 00:00:55,454 results. I talk about the benefits of outsourcing social media. I'm a huge 16 00:00:55,454 --> 00:00:58,550 fan of this, but I also wanna help you decide if it's the right move 17 00:00:58,550 --> 00:01:02,330 for you and your business. We talk about why genuine 18 00:01:02,630 --> 00:01:06,390 social, like engaging and building relationships, is a game changer for 19 00:01:06,390 --> 00:01:10,230 visibility. And I share with you the role of clear brand values and 20 00:01:10,230 --> 00:01:14,045 personal development in your social media success. So if you're 21 00:01:14,045 --> 00:01:17,664 ready to approach social media with a more intentional strategy, 22 00:01:18,204 --> 00:01:22,045 this episode of the consistency corner podcast is for you. 23 00:01:22,045 --> 00:01:23,024 Let's dive in. 24 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:35,160 Alright. Welcome back to another episode of the Consistency Corner 25 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:38,595 podcast. I'm really pumped today for our conversation with 26 00:01:38,595 --> 00:01:42,435 Andréa Jones, who I actually heard as a guest speaker in 27 00:01:42,435 --> 00:01:45,975 a virtual summit. And I was taking a walk and I was listening to her 28 00:01:46,115 --> 00:01:49,795 speak about, mister Al, who we're gonna we're gonna talk 29 00:01:49,795 --> 00:01:53,420 about today and you're gonna get to know. And I was like, yes, this 30 00:01:53,420 --> 00:01:56,640 is conversations that more people need to be having, 31 00:01:56,860 --> 00:02:00,700 particularly those of us in the marketing space and in the social media 32 00:02:00,700 --> 00:02:04,380 space to let people know about because we all 33 00:02:04,380 --> 00:02:08,095 can scroll. And we can all see the tips and tricks and hacks 34 00:02:08,475 --> 00:02:12,075 and people talking about beating the algorithm or 35 00:02:12,075 --> 00:02:15,595 figuring out the algorithm, but, like, what does that actually mean? Well, we're here to 36 00:02:15,595 --> 00:02:18,970 talk about that and Andréa is gonna spill the beans on that. She's a social 37 00:02:18,970 --> 00:02:22,730 media strategist who helps brands with bold personalities, bold opinions, 38 00:02:22,730 --> 00:02:26,410 and bold ideas make bold moves towards elevating their thought 39 00:02:26,410 --> 00:02:30,010 leadership and growing their business using the power of social media. So I'm 40 00:02:30,010 --> 00:02:33,450 excited to get in. Andréa, welcome to the show. Thank you for being here 41 00:02:33,450 --> 00:02:37,125 today. Yes. Thank you so much for having me. I love talking about Mr. 42 00:02:37,125 --> 00:02:40,825 Al. So I'm excited to dive in. Yes. Before we get into 43 00:02:41,205 --> 00:02:44,885 our conversation on Mr. Al, can you share a little bit about your business journey 44 00:02:44,885 --> 00:02:48,569 and how you got into being a social media strategist? Yeah. 45 00:02:48,569 --> 00:02:52,330 So I'm like an OG Internet user. I started my first 46 00:02:52,330 --> 00:02:56,170 blog in 2024, which makes this year 20 years, which 47 00:02:56,170 --> 00:02:59,870 is just wild. You said 2024. Oh, 2004. 48 00:03:01,224 --> 00:03:04,825 Blame the pregnancy brain. There you go. There you go. Okay. The 49 00:03:04,825 --> 00:03:08,665 2004. Wow. That is OG. OG. Yeah. This was back 50 00:03:08,665 --> 00:03:11,885 when it was not cool. I started my YouTube channel in 2007, 51 00:03:13,810 --> 00:03:17,410 And my friends were like, you're doing what? You're posting videos online? That's 52 00:03:17,410 --> 00:03:21,170 weird. Right? But I met my husband online. 53 00:03:21,170 --> 00:03:24,150 So it's part of the story is we created a video together, 54 00:03:25,010 --> 00:03:28,834 then we kept talking and fell in love. And then I 55 00:03:28,834 --> 00:03:32,614 moved from Atlanta, Georgia to Toronto, Canada. 56 00:03:33,635 --> 00:03:36,855 The tundra, the frozen. Yeah. Did you move during the winter? 57 00:03:37,715 --> 00:03:41,530 Yeah, I moved on March 1st. And I was shocked that there 58 00:03:41,530 --> 00:03:44,330 was snow in the ground and it that was one of the years where the 59 00:03:44,330 --> 00:03:47,550 snow stayed until, like, end of April. And I was like, what have I done? 60 00:03:48,330 --> 00:03:52,090 I must really left you. No. Yes. 10 years later, still 61 00:03:52,090 --> 00:03:55,530 here. I live in Niagara Falls now, but that move really launched my 62 00:03:55,530 --> 00:03:59,025 business. So prior to that, I work in hospitality. I was put on, like, the 63 00:03:59,025 --> 00:04:02,805 social media teams at the time, but this was 2011. 64 00:04:03,345 --> 00:04:07,105 So it wasn't really like, we had Facebook and Twitter and that's about 65 00:04:07,105 --> 00:04:10,650 it. Brands weren't even on Instagram yet at that point. And 66 00:04:10,650 --> 00:04:13,390 so, I launched my business, 67 00:04:14,250 --> 00:04:16,990 offering social media services in 2014, 68 00:04:18,410 --> 00:04:22,250 and it grew from there. I started off freelancing doing wearing 69 00:04:22,250 --> 00:04:26,074 a Tenet hats, and now we have an agency where we offer done 70 00:04:26,074 --> 00:04:29,755 for you services, for our clients. And then I teach, 71 00:04:30,235 --> 00:04:34,074 our same material on the education side of the business in the Savvy 72 00:04:34,074 --> 00:04:37,710 Social School and online podcast. Yeah. Awesome. So you've really 73 00:04:37,710 --> 00:04:41,010 seen throughout the course of your career the changes 74 00:04:42,190 --> 00:04:45,950 in the algorithm and how at any given time, if somebody 75 00:04:45,950 --> 00:04:49,310 says, well, the algorithm likes this or the algorithm likes that, you're like, 76 00:04:49,310 --> 00:04:52,675 woah, Hold on a second. So for people who are, 77 00:04:52,675 --> 00:04:56,455 like, struggling to understand what the algorithm 78 00:04:56,515 --> 00:04:59,255 wants, let's talk about that. And does it even matter? 79 00:05:00,115 --> 00:05:03,710 Yeah. And it does matter. So, you know, we we come from a time where 80 00:05:03,710 --> 00:05:07,470 things used to be in chronological order. Like, they were shown to you 81 00:05:07,470 --> 00:05:10,990 in the order reverse order that it was posted. So you 82 00:05:10,990 --> 00:05:14,590 started off with what someone just posted and then scrolled back 83 00:05:14,590 --> 00:05:18,105 down. You could keep scrolling forever until the beginning of what 84 00:05:18,105 --> 00:05:21,705 everyone posted. Right? That quickly became 85 00:05:21,705 --> 00:05:25,385 overwhelming for users because you would see maybe posts 86 00:05:25,385 --> 00:05:29,085 from the past hour or 2 depending on how many people you followed, 87 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:33,600 and you certainly weren't discovering new content. It was only based 88 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:37,440 on who you followed. So enter mister Al, the 89 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:41,220 algorithm, who is basically, AI. 90 00:05:41,280 --> 00:05:44,655 He he's a machine. He's behind the scenes. He 91 00:05:44,655 --> 00:05:47,955 has both, like, a hero complex and a villain 92 00:05:48,014 --> 00:05:51,615 complex. So on the hero side, he's trying to 93 00:05:51,615 --> 00:05:55,074 reward the right content, reward 94 00:05:55,375 --> 00:05:59,070 the right content that, the platform wants to see, which means 95 00:05:59,070 --> 00:06:02,910 we're, like, we're liking it, we're sharing it, we're commenting. And then he 96 00:06:02,910 --> 00:06:05,390 can be a little bit of a villain and a little bit of a bully 97 00:06:05,390 --> 00:06:08,590 because he goes, well, nobody like this post, so I'm not showing it to anybody 98 00:06:08,590 --> 00:06:12,270 else. Right? So he has the the dynamic, the two 99 00:06:12,270 --> 00:06:16,005 sides to him. And so as a business owner, as a 100 00:06:16,005 --> 00:06:19,845 content creator, we have to be mindful of, like, what 101 00:06:19,845 --> 00:06:23,685 he wants so that we can hopefully get on his 102 00:06:23,685 --> 00:06:27,365 hero side and not his villain side. Yeah. Because you can use 103 00:06:27,365 --> 00:06:31,180 that additional support once you figure it out. But I think it's really 104 00:06:31,180 --> 00:06:34,560 important that we figure out a way to do that 105 00:06:35,180 --> 00:06:38,860 in a way that is authentic to our brand voice and our personality. So can 106 00:06:38,860 --> 00:06:42,700 you talk a little bit about the importance of that and not just trying to 107 00:06:42,700 --> 00:06:46,205 do what everybody else is doing because it looks like it's working for 108 00:06:46,205 --> 00:06:49,645 them. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. I'll I'll give an example from one of my 109 00:06:49,645 --> 00:06:53,265 clients. So she is a life coach 110 00:06:53,565 --> 00:06:57,245 and, her most viral video has nothing to do with her 111 00:06:57,245 --> 00:07:00,910 business. She got a video that got over 2,000,000 views on 112 00:07:00,910 --> 00:07:04,130 TikTok. And at the time, we were like, yay. This is awesome. 113 00:07:04,350 --> 00:07:08,190 But it had nothing to do with her business, had no impact on 114 00:07:08,190 --> 00:07:11,949 selling her offers, on selling her, or or growing her list 115 00:07:11,949 --> 00:07:15,765 or anything like that. So when we think about what the algorithm wants. I 116 00:07:15,765 --> 00:07:19,605 mean, yes, we can post things that get a ton of views. But 117 00:07:19,605 --> 00:07:23,445 ultimately, we have our own goals about how we want to show up in 118 00:07:23,445 --> 00:07:27,205 the world. One of my personal examples as 119 00:07:27,205 --> 00:07:30,940 well is I don't really post my kids on social media. 120 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:35,740 I do one post a year at Christmas time. Y'all can see the Christmas photo. 121 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,880 And then with this new baby coming, y'all will have seen already the baby 122 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,705 photo. That's it. There's no more. I know for a fact 123 00:07:43,705 --> 00:07:47,224 those are my most highly engaged posts. Okay? Like but I'm not 124 00:07:47,224 --> 00:07:50,824 pimping out my kid to sell my stuff. So that's just, like, 125 00:07:50,824 --> 00:07:54,560 my personal boundary. So when you think about, like, there's 126 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:58,400 this balance between what the algorithm wants, like, everyone loves babies. We 127 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:01,780 love the baby pictures. I could post baby pictures every day, and 128 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:06,000 people would love them. But that's not serving me, and I don't 129 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:09,699 want to put my account display like that. So there's a balance between, 130 00:08:10,375 --> 00:08:13,975 you know, what the algorithm wants and then what my my people want. 131 00:08:13,975 --> 00:08:17,595 And typically, the post that have the most 132 00:08:17,975 --> 00:08:21,335 conversion for me don't necessarily have the highest number of 133 00:08:21,335 --> 00:08:24,890 views. They I'm looking at other metrics. 134 00:08:25,110 --> 00:08:28,890 On Instagram, for instance, I love looking at saves and shares. 135 00:08:29,350 --> 00:08:33,190 The algorithm also loves looking at saves and shares. You may get 136 00:08:33,190 --> 00:08:36,995 fewer of them than likes and comments, and saves and shares 137 00:08:36,995 --> 00:08:40,755 don't necessarily help you go viral. But those are the types 138 00:08:40,755 --> 00:08:44,595 of indicators that show the algorithm that people are interested 139 00:08:44,595 --> 00:08:48,355 in your post. And they're indicators to us as as business owners, as 140 00:08:48,355 --> 00:08:52,180 content creators that that people are actually, like, learning from 141 00:08:52,180 --> 00:08:56,020 consuming, finding our content valuable. And so, there is 142 00:08:56,020 --> 00:08:59,780 a balance to, like, giving the algorithm what it wants and also doing what 143 00:08:59,780 --> 00:09:03,315 you need to do as a business owner. Well, and understanding how social 144 00:09:03,315 --> 00:09:07,075 media works as part of your overall marketing strategy. So, like, what 145 00:09:07,075 --> 00:09:10,775 is social media's job in your marketing 146 00:09:10,835 --> 00:09:14,260 puzzle? What piece in role is it filling? Because 147 00:09:14,260 --> 00:09:17,880 it shouldn't be filling all of them. Right? Because 148 00:09:18,339 --> 00:09:22,120 we don't own it. Yes. It is so fickle. Like, 149 00:09:22,740 --> 00:09:26,500 sometimes mister Al is really nice and will, like, randomly take one of 150 00:09:26,500 --> 00:09:29,885 your posts and you'll be like, oh my gosh. This posted amazing. And then you'll 151 00:09:29,885 --> 00:09:33,645 do the exact same thing. And mister Al is like, we're we're not 152 00:09:33,645 --> 00:09:37,325 sharing sharing this one out. And so it can be very fickle. So social 153 00:09:37,325 --> 00:09:40,925 media plays, more of a role in the top of 154 00:09:40,925 --> 00:09:44,390 your marketing funnel where it can be a great 155 00:09:44,390 --> 00:09:48,070 discovery engine. Because again, mister Al can help match you to the right 156 00:09:48,070 --> 00:09:51,450 people. Mhmm. And it can be a great, like, relationship 157 00:09:51,670 --> 00:09:55,210 builder. So as you are finding new people, they're getting to know you. 158 00:09:55,385 --> 00:09:58,685 But I always say, let's move them along into something else. 159 00:09:59,464 --> 00:10:03,065 For us who have podcasts, like, we want them to listen to the podcast. We 160 00:10:03,065 --> 00:10:05,464 want or if you have an email list, we want to get them on the 161 00:10:05,464 --> 00:10:08,925 email list. You know, we wanna move them into more intimate marketing 162 00:10:09,650 --> 00:10:13,410 avenues because those are way less dedicated 163 00:10:13,410 --> 00:10:17,090 by algorithms and people have to opt in to access 164 00:10:17,090 --> 00:10:20,630 them. So they're also very dedicated to consuming those content pieces. 165 00:10:21,090 --> 00:10:24,930 And so, yeah, it definitely plays a very specific role in your in your 166 00:10:24,930 --> 00:10:28,445 sales funnel. Yeah. So in terms of the algorithm 167 00:10:28,665 --> 00:10:32,265 and even not just the part that social media plays, but the different 168 00:10:32,265 --> 00:10:36,105 parts of social media. So when we think about it, like, obviously, each 169 00:10:36,105 --> 00:10:39,085 platform has its own algorithm, but each 170 00:10:39,580 --> 00:10:43,100 component within the platform has its own 171 00:10:43,100 --> 00:10:46,700 algorithm. Stories has an algorithm. Reels has an algorithm. The feed has an 172 00:10:46,700 --> 00:10:50,300 algorithm. The explore page has an algorithm. How does, 173 00:10:50,300 --> 00:10:53,360 like, somebody keep up with all of that? 174 00:10:54,655 --> 00:10:58,175 Yeah. It can be very challenging for business owners. I actually think 175 00:10:58,175 --> 00:11:01,935 Instagram is become too complicated. Like, if we think about some of 176 00:11:01,935 --> 00:11:05,695 the other platforms, like, they're way more simplified, and I think it's 177 00:11:05,695 --> 00:11:09,490 easier to actually create content there. But Instagram remains a favorite. It's one of 178 00:11:09,490 --> 00:11:13,090 my favorites as well. But each of those categories plays a 179 00:11:13,090 --> 00:11:16,850 different role. So, Instagram reels typically is 180 00:11:16,850 --> 00:11:20,550 about discovery. And you'll see this as you scroll through your feed. Instagram's 181 00:11:20,690 --> 00:11:23,565 like, how about this reel about toddlers 182 00:11:24,265 --> 00:11:27,805 eating food? And I'm like, yes, I'm watching it. Right? 183 00:11:28,345 --> 00:11:32,024 And so as a business owner, you want your reel to 184 00:11:32,024 --> 00:11:35,704 be right there in people's feeds, and that's Instagram actively matching it 185 00:11:35,704 --> 00:11:39,210 based on user behavior. So 186 00:11:39,210 --> 00:11:42,970 Reels typically are for discovery, typically. And that's like the top of 187 00:11:42,970 --> 00:11:46,570 its own funnel within Instagram. Mhmm. Your feed 188 00:11:46,570 --> 00:11:50,270 posts can straddle the line of discovery and relationship 189 00:11:50,330 --> 00:11:53,975 building. So sometimes you'll also see, like, a 190 00:11:53,975 --> 00:11:57,735 carousel or a static, image post 191 00:11:57,735 --> 00:12:01,495 in your feed. But more often than that, we're served reels from people 192 00:12:01,495 --> 00:12:04,750 we don't follow. So scroll through your feed and take a look at that. So 193 00:12:04,750 --> 00:12:08,430 think about that when you're creating your content. Reels, it's going out to people who 194 00:12:08,430 --> 00:12:11,970 don't know you. So you may wanna keep your educational 195 00:12:12,190 --> 00:12:15,709 content focused on them and not so much on you. Your 196 00:12:15,709 --> 00:12:19,515 feed post, they can be discoverable, but most often than not, 197 00:12:19,515 --> 00:12:23,355 it's people who already follow you or even people who are thinking about follow 198 00:12:23,355 --> 00:12:26,895 you and they they head over to your page. Stories is almost always 199 00:12:27,035 --> 00:12:30,830 people who already follow you. And so you can be a lot more intimate 200 00:12:30,830 --> 00:12:34,510 there. You can talk like you're talking to a friend. You can share a 201 00:12:34,510 --> 00:12:37,870 little bit more of the behind the scenes and the things that people who, you 202 00:12:37,870 --> 00:12:41,090 know, they already have relationship with you, so they're interested in it there. 203 00:12:41,550 --> 00:12:44,610 So reels, feed posts, stories, typically that's how it goes. 204 00:12:45,575 --> 00:12:48,935 All of those things can be on the discovery pay the discover pages 205 00:12:48,935 --> 00:12:52,775 in, Instagram, but most often you'll see reels 206 00:12:52,775 --> 00:12:56,615 and, static posts there. And most 207 00:12:56,615 --> 00:13:00,330 users don't go to the Discover page. They're looking 208 00:13:00,330 --> 00:13:04,090 at their feed. And, Adam Messeri, the, CEO 209 00:13:04,090 --> 00:13:07,770 of Instagram recently, released a stat that most people are actually looking 210 00:13:07,770 --> 00:13:11,450 at stories Mhmm. First. So I mean, it kinda makes sense that that 211 00:13:11,450 --> 00:13:14,265 it's at the top of the screen. So It's at the top of the screen. 212 00:13:14,265 --> 00:13:17,705 Yeah. And so we kinda wanna guide people. Like, if they found us so real 213 00:13:17,705 --> 00:13:21,545 and they're following our feed, like, maybe sometimes we wanna say, like, go 214 00:13:21,545 --> 00:13:24,825 watch the stories. Right? And, like, like, have a call to action there to drive 215 00:13:24,825 --> 00:13:28,640 them to the stories. Mhmm. But all of those have algorithms 216 00:13:28,780 --> 00:13:32,380 too. Like, stories, I there are certain people who I watch their 217 00:13:32,380 --> 00:13:36,220 stories every day, and so they're at the top. The algorithm 218 00:13:36,220 --> 00:13:39,360 is like, oh, she's watching this from every day. We're gonna put it right upfront. 219 00:13:39,495 --> 00:13:43,255 But then sometimes I see stories from people, oh, I haven't seen them in a 220 00:13:43,255 --> 00:13:47,095 while. That's the algorithm mixing it up a little bit going, okay. So she hasn't 221 00:13:47,095 --> 00:13:49,654 seen this one a while. Let's test it out and see. And if I don't 222 00:13:49,654 --> 00:13:53,350 click it, it's going back to the back of the line, and 223 00:13:53,350 --> 00:13:56,950 the algorithm is not gonna show it to me anymore. The 224 00:13:56,950 --> 00:14:00,730 thing the thing I'll say, it's, like, in this thought about the algorithm is that 225 00:14:01,590 --> 00:14:05,415 it is trying to personalize experience for every individual person. 226 00:14:05,714 --> 00:14:09,394 Mhmm. So your experience with the algorithm is gonna be different than 227 00:14:09,394 --> 00:14:13,235 someone else's, and it's all based on your behavior. So if 228 00:14:13,235 --> 00:14:16,995 you're seeing posts you don't like, you need to retrain your algorithm, 229 00:14:16,995 --> 00:14:20,450 and the same is happening for every single person as they're they're going 230 00:14:20,450 --> 00:14:23,970 through a platform like Instagram. Yeah. And I think one of the 231 00:14:23,970 --> 00:14:27,570 interesting things that you said was how each component has a different 232 00:14:27,570 --> 00:14:31,265 algorithm, and you can really think about it in terms of the funnel of 233 00:14:31,265 --> 00:14:34,945 attract, nurture and convert. And so when I know when I work with 234 00:14:34,945 --> 00:14:37,925 clients, like we talk about for your overall strategy, 235 00:14:38,545 --> 00:14:42,225 what tools or I will say what activations or platforms are you 236 00:14:42,225 --> 00:14:46,019 using to attract reels might be one of them. But we're 237 00:14:46,019 --> 00:14:49,320 not gonna say social media, we're gonna say 238 00:14:49,779 --> 00:14:53,540 specifically, the type and platform. And so let's say there's somebody who's 239 00:14:53,540 --> 00:14:56,339 there like, you know what, Instagram is just like, not my thing. I'm not over 240 00:14:56,339 --> 00:14:59,935 there. But I'm on LinkedIn. Like, now we have a whole 241 00:14:59,935 --> 00:15:03,775 nother set of components and platforms and algorithms to learn 242 00:15:03,775 --> 00:15:07,215 and understand. And I think LinkedIn is like, the 243 00:15:07,215 --> 00:15:11,055 silent, underrated partner that we all need to be, like, buddying 244 00:15:11,055 --> 00:15:14,760 up with lately. Yeah. I'm loving LinkedIn. Again, I find it's 245 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:18,600 way simpler to create content over there versus Instagram. Instagram 246 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:22,040 has gotten so complicated. I love it. I love it. It's my favorite. But if 247 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:25,675 a brand new business owner came today, I'd be like, well, let's 248 00:15:25,675 --> 00:15:29,355 start with something a little bit easier to, like, grasp. And 249 00:15:29,355 --> 00:15:33,035 LinkedIn's algorithm, I find, requires way 250 00:15:33,035 --> 00:15:36,714 less content. So sometimes you'll see posts in the feed 251 00:15:36,714 --> 00:15:40,110 for a week, 2 weeks, 3 weeks after it's been posted. 252 00:15:40,490 --> 00:15:43,610 So you don't have to post every day. You could post once a week or 253 00:15:43,610 --> 00:15:46,670 even once a month and still get really good traction on LinkedIn. 254 00:15:47,210 --> 00:15:50,750 Yeah. And LinkedIn's algorithm is very different from Instagram. 255 00:15:50,890 --> 00:15:52,830 They like text based content. 256 00:15:54,515 --> 00:15:58,035 They they wanna see thought leadership in a way 257 00:15:58,035 --> 00:16:01,635 that's consumable, by the person. There's no stories on 258 00:16:01,635 --> 00:16:05,334 LinkedIn. They tested it out. It didn't work for their their, brands. 259 00:16:06,420 --> 00:16:10,180 But the similarities in the algorithm are still there. It wants people to 260 00:16:10,180 --> 00:16:13,640 engage and all the algorithms want people to stay on their app. 261 00:16:14,500 --> 00:16:17,800 So one of the challenges right now with LinkedIn is, 262 00:16:18,455 --> 00:16:20,695 well, they just fixed it this year. There didn't used to be a link in 263 00:16:20,695 --> 00:16:24,455 the bio. So you're adding links in your post, but it's like people are leaving 264 00:16:24,455 --> 00:16:28,295 LinkedIn and then the algorithm's like, hey, every time you post people leave me. I 265 00:16:28,295 --> 00:16:32,140 don't want that. And so it would devalue your post. Whereas 266 00:16:32,140 --> 00:16:35,580 now you can say link in bio because there is a link in bio. It 267 00:16:35,580 --> 00:16:38,940 kind of tricks the algorithm a little bit because they're still on LinkedIn for a 268 00:16:38,940 --> 00:16:42,700 sec and then they can leave. And it's really focused 269 00:16:42,700 --> 00:16:46,380 on the conversation and the engagement. So the algorithm wants to 270 00:16:46,380 --> 00:16:49,575 see people engaging with your content. 271 00:16:50,274 --> 00:16:53,795 So there are a lot of similarities with between LinkedIn and Instagram, but 272 00:16:53,795 --> 00:16:57,555 LinkedIn is more business focused. Mhmm. It's slightly more 273 00:16:57,555 --> 00:17:00,600 professional. I will say there people still let loose over there. 274 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:04,760 Video is on the rise over there too. So I repurpose my reels over to 275 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:08,280 LinkedIn, and I still see some really good engagement over 276 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:11,640 there. And more people are using it on mobile than 277 00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:15,444 desktop now. So it is the underdog, but 278 00:17:15,444 --> 00:17:18,825 I think it's gonna have its time in the sun. Yeah, I think it's interesting 279 00:17:18,885 --> 00:17:22,244 too, to think about your audience. And when they pick up their 280 00:17:22,244 --> 00:17:25,544 phone, or they type in the, you know, 281 00:17:26,180 --> 00:17:28,520 into their search bar on their computer linkedin.comorinstagram.com, 282 00:17:31,540 --> 00:17:35,140 like, what is their intention? You know, oftentimes, we're picking up 283 00:17:35,140 --> 00:17:38,980 Instagram because we want to laugh. We want to see a funny meme or a 284 00:17:38,980 --> 00:17:42,395 funny reel. We wanna connect with a friend. We wanna catch up with our 285 00:17:42,395 --> 00:17:46,015 community. We're going to LinkedIn maybe more to learn 286 00:17:46,155 --> 00:17:49,835 or see what's out there or catch up on 287 00:17:49,835 --> 00:17:53,435 industry news. You know, it's so interesting to me just to even have 288 00:17:53,435 --> 00:17:56,860 conversations with people inside other 289 00:17:56,860 --> 00:17:59,760 industries of, like, how are you using this platform? 290 00:18:00,700 --> 00:18:04,000 Yeah. LinkedIn is definitely more professionally 291 00:18:04,140 --> 00:18:07,820 minded, and there's not a lot of mixture of content. Whereas on 292 00:18:07,820 --> 00:18:11,405 Instagram, I mentioned earlier that I'm getting, like, toddler eating 293 00:18:11,405 --> 00:18:14,845 videos. I don't I don't see those on LinkedIn. Right? Right. 294 00:18:14,845 --> 00:18:18,385 So it's it's very focused on business, whereas, 295 00:18:18,845 --> 00:18:22,685 Instagram and even other platforms like Facebook for me is 296 00:18:22,685 --> 00:18:26,350 a huge mix. Same with threads now for me is a huge 297 00:18:26,350 --> 00:18:30,110 mix. LinkedIn is very focused. And so I do find 298 00:18:30,110 --> 00:18:33,870 it's easier to be business minded as well in the 299 00:18:33,870 --> 00:18:37,410 room. Yeah. And the other thing too, to understand, like, I think when we're particularly 300 00:18:37,550 --> 00:18:40,905 when people are comparing maybe their social media 301 00:18:41,685 --> 00:18:45,525 content and journey to competitors or even industry 302 00:18:45,525 --> 00:18:48,905 leaders, like understanding the value 303 00:18:49,045 --> 00:18:52,550 of the time people have put in. So if you're 304 00:18:52,550 --> 00:18:56,230 starting out, like you're on chapter 1 or chapter 2 or chapter 3 of your 305 00:18:56,230 --> 00:18:59,990 business journey, and you're over here following Amy Porterfield, who's like the 306 00:18:59,990 --> 00:19:03,670 OG spin all platforms since they started, it's not the same 307 00:19:03,670 --> 00:19:07,075 because she has equity in the platform already. 308 00:19:07,075 --> 00:19:10,355 Right? Yeah. And the algorithm actually does prefer that. 309 00:19:10,914 --> 00:19:14,515 Someone asked me the other day if they should start over their Instagram from 310 00:19:14,515 --> 00:19:17,475 scratch. And even their LinkedIn, they were like, should I just delete it and start 311 00:19:17,475 --> 00:19:21,200 a new one? No. The algorithm likes that you've been here for a 312 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:25,040 long time. They don't like a bunch of new accounts every time you create 313 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,800 something new or shift or pivot. So if you can, keep your same account 314 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:32,320 because that history there does does impact the algorithm as 315 00:19:32,320 --> 00:19:35,895 well. Yeah, for sure. So when we talk about thought 316 00:19:35,895 --> 00:19:39,575 leadership, I think this is an interesting concept that 317 00:19:39,575 --> 00:19:43,415 those of us in the marketing space, like really understand, we get it, 318 00:19:43,415 --> 00:19:47,169 we see the value in thought leadership 319 00:19:47,169 --> 00:19:50,929 style content. But I know that for people outside the marketing 320 00:19:50,929 --> 00:19:54,370 space, I know sometimes some of the clients that I talk to, they're like, thought 321 00:19:54,370 --> 00:19:57,765 leadership? Like, what is that? I just need to sell my stuff. 322 00:19:57,925 --> 00:20:01,445 And so talk to me a little bit about like, why thought 323 00:20:01,445 --> 00:20:05,045 leadership is important, and how we can use thought leadership style 324 00:20:05,045 --> 00:20:08,025 content to help optimize social media. 325 00:20:08,565 --> 00:20:12,245 Yeah. This is a challenging one. And it really depends 326 00:20:12,245 --> 00:20:15,910 on where you are in your stage of business. And it's why sometimes I really 327 00:20:15,910 --> 00:20:19,670 emphasize if someone's coming to social media today, it's gonna take a while 328 00:20:19,670 --> 00:20:23,290 before you get clients from it. There are other marketing levers you can pull 329 00:20:23,750 --> 00:20:27,585 to get clients faster than social media. Social media is a long 330 00:20:27,585 --> 00:20:31,365 term play that can it's like investing. You put in $20 331 00:20:31,505 --> 00:20:35,045 today, and then in 10 years, you'll have $1,000 332 00:20:35,505 --> 00:20:38,400 Right? Like, there's gonna be some investment there. 333 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:42,720 And so it is a long term play, but thought leadership is really you 334 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,320 sharing your expertise online. Mhmm. And, 335 00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:50,240 a great example of this is someone who I started following recently. Her name is 336 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,745 doctor Becky. And 337 00:20:53,745 --> 00:20:57,524 she talks a lot about like re parenting yourself as your parenting 338 00:20:57,585 --> 00:21:01,424 your child. Y'all can tell what stage of life I'm in now. Right? If y'all 339 00:21:01,424 --> 00:21:05,184 have kids, go follow Doctor. Becky. Doctor. Becky get inside, read 340 00:21:05,184 --> 00:21:08,960 her book, listen to her podcast. So good. Yes. And she does 341 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,179 social media so well for thought leadership. Right? So 342 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:16,320 she's sharing her expertise in her 343 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:20,155 industry with this, kind 344 00:21:20,155 --> 00:21:23,915 of background expectation that you will buy her book and you'll join her 345 00:21:23,915 --> 00:21:27,675 paid community. Right? And she has digital products. She's not 346 00:21:27,675 --> 00:21:31,435 leading with, hi, I'm doctor Becky. Buy my book. Because 347 00:21:31,435 --> 00:21:35,010 that feels a little bit aggressive sometimes. She's leading 348 00:21:35,150 --> 00:21:38,910 with, hey, are are you having this issue with your child? Here's what it 349 00:21:38,910 --> 00:21:42,530 could mean. Right? Or, hey, here's something I observe 350 00:21:42,590 --> 00:21:46,270 with one of my clients. She'll even do examples like 351 00:21:46,270 --> 00:21:49,945 role playing, like, here's what this could sound like. 352 00:21:49,945 --> 00:21:53,785 And it helps us as a viewer recognize ourselves in that 353 00:21:53,785 --> 00:21:57,405 post and go, I'm going through that exact same thing right now. 354 00:21:58,025 --> 00:22:01,780 I thought I was the only one. I'm listening. Okay? 355 00:22:01,780 --> 00:22:04,660 And then you're in her world and you're listening to her podcast and you're buying 356 00:22:04,660 --> 00:22:08,180 her books and you're joining her community. And so the same is for you as 357 00:22:08,180 --> 00:22:11,860 as a a creator, a business owner, an expert, a thought 358 00:22:11,860 --> 00:22:15,505 leader, you're sharing your expertise in a 359 00:22:15,505 --> 00:22:19,184 way that the other person can see themselves in 360 00:22:19,184 --> 00:22:22,865 that content, get curious and go 361 00:22:22,865 --> 00:22:26,304 down the road. And I think this is a lot like building a friendship or 362 00:22:26,304 --> 00:22:29,840 any relationship, dating, whatever. Because you 363 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:33,600 could, like, meet someone and go, oh, we're best friends. And for some 364 00:22:33,679 --> 00:22:37,279 for most people, it's kinda like, that's really weird and aggressive, 365 00:22:37,279 --> 00:22:41,120 and I don't know you. But for a lot of us, how 366 00:22:41,120 --> 00:22:44,895 we caught our best friends is it happens 367 00:22:44,895 --> 00:22:48,654 slowly over time. Right? You meet someone and you're like, let's go for 368 00:22:48,654 --> 00:22:52,414 coffee, and then we're going for dinner. And now we're hanging out each other's 369 00:22:52,414 --> 00:22:56,095 house, binge watching RuPaul's Drag Race. Like, whatever it is that you 370 00:22:56,095 --> 00:22:59,930 do with your friends, that's the the evolution 371 00:23:00,070 --> 00:23:03,750 of it, and not every friend will be a best friend. Not 372 00:23:03,750 --> 00:23:07,350 every person you meet will get to that level. And so social media 373 00:23:07,350 --> 00:23:10,950 relationship building is very much the same. That leadership is very much the 374 00:23:10,950 --> 00:23:14,775 same. Some people may say surface level and they may only engage on 375 00:23:14,775 --> 00:23:18,615 your social media platforms, but we're looking for those people who 376 00:23:18,615 --> 00:23:21,575 wanna take it deeper. They wanna take it to the next level. They wanna get 377 00:23:21,575 --> 00:23:25,400 to best friend status. And the only way for them 378 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:28,680 to find you is for you to show up as an expert and help them 379 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,140 see themselves in the content that you're sharing. Yeah. 380 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,040 So, you know, you talked about, like, that finding your best friend and you're 381 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:39,475 nurturing your people on social media and those relationships. 382 00:23:40,175 --> 00:23:43,235 Let's talk about the idea of being social 383 00:23:43,695 --> 00:23:47,535 on social media and how that in and of itself can 384 00:23:47,535 --> 00:23:51,170 actually help the algorithm help you. Yes. 385 00:23:51,230 --> 00:23:53,970 The algorithm does not like a post and go situation. 386 00:23:55,230 --> 00:23:59,070 He is a little needy, mister Al, and he wants 387 00:23:59,070 --> 00:24:02,750 all of our attention all of the time. So as much 388 00:24:02,750 --> 00:24:06,135 attention as you can give him, he will reward you for that. So this is 389 00:24:06,135 --> 00:24:09,815 why, you know, some people say if you post 5 times a 390 00:24:09,815 --> 00:24:13,655 day, you know, that's a strategy that some people say. To me, 391 00:24:13,655 --> 00:24:17,335 that's exhausting. I don't have that much energy to post 5 times a 392 00:24:17,335 --> 00:24:20,810 day. However, behind that strategy 393 00:24:21,510 --> 00:24:25,190 is the amount of time you're spending in the app. Okay? 394 00:24:25,190 --> 00:24:29,030 So that time commitment would be helpful, and it's a 395 00:24:29,030 --> 00:24:32,815 consistent daily time commitment. So typically, I recommend 10 to 20 396 00:24:32,815 --> 00:24:36,495 minutes a day to start, and then you can scale up. And in those 397 00:24:36,495 --> 00:24:40,174 10 to 20 minutes a day, we're we're hanging out. 398 00:24:40,174 --> 00:24:43,855 We're finding new people. We're connecting with them. And I like to do 399 00:24:43,855 --> 00:24:45,955 this personally with referral partnerships. 400 00:24:47,750 --> 00:24:51,590 So, you know, people who can send me clients, and especially in 401 00:24:51,590 --> 00:24:55,270 my kind of vertical, people who need help with social media, 402 00:24:55,270 --> 00:24:58,630 they may have trouble finding me on social media because they're not on social media. 403 00:24:58,630 --> 00:25:02,090 I have a little bit of a catch 22 situation over here. Yeah. 404 00:25:02,684 --> 00:25:06,065 So I'm connecting with other people, web designers, podcast 405 00:25:06,125 --> 00:25:09,965 hosts, brand experts, and I'm building out my network of 406 00:25:09,965 --> 00:25:13,804 people who also serve my same client. To me, these are 407 00:25:13,804 --> 00:25:17,164 my peers, my colleagues. And so it actually makes it a lot of fun for 408 00:25:17,164 --> 00:25:20,280 me to connect with them because we're talking shop. Right? 409 00:25:20,980 --> 00:25:24,820 Most of my time on social media is spent in direct messages. And 410 00:25:24,820 --> 00:25:28,360 I actually think that's very helpful for business owners 411 00:25:28,580 --> 00:25:32,100 building relationships with people because it is individual is 1 to 412 00:25:32,100 --> 00:25:35,925 1. Is it scalable? No. It's very hard to 413 00:25:35,925 --> 00:25:39,365 do. It's not scalable. I've seen a lot of people talk about 414 00:25:39,365 --> 00:25:43,145 automations and creating spreadsheets to keep track of people. 415 00:25:43,525 --> 00:25:47,125 I don't have a spreadsheet for my friends, so I don't have a spreadsheet for 416 00:25:47,125 --> 00:25:50,830 my, peers either. I just make sure I'm 417 00:25:50,830 --> 00:25:54,590 very consistently showing up. They see my content, I 418 00:25:54,590 --> 00:25:57,570 see their content, and I just have conversations with them. 419 00:25:58,669 --> 00:26:02,370 If you apply the strategy though, my my warning is 420 00:26:02,804 --> 00:26:06,164 not to be sales y. And that's kind of like the 421 00:26:06,164 --> 00:26:09,945 underlying current of a lot of the things we're talking about today is 422 00:26:10,245 --> 00:26:13,684 it it could be we've all had the messages. People come in the DMs and 423 00:26:13,684 --> 00:26:17,205 they're like, you should buy this. And you're like, I don't know you. I don't 424 00:26:17,205 --> 00:26:20,990 want this. In fact, now I have I'm having a negative interaction with you instead 425 00:26:20,990 --> 00:26:24,510 of one that could have been neutral or positive. And so there is 426 00:26:24,510 --> 00:26:27,730 this desire as business owners that comes from a really good place 427 00:26:28,110 --> 00:26:31,390 because we wanna sell our stuff and we know it can help people. We know 428 00:26:31,390 --> 00:26:35,225 it could be valuable. And we don't wanna be, 429 00:26:35,605 --> 00:26:39,284 like, too aggressive with it as well. So it's a conversation to see 430 00:26:39,284 --> 00:26:42,804 where things go. We don't wanna assume anything about 431 00:26:42,804 --> 00:26:46,590 anybody. Yeah. And I think also knowing going back 432 00:26:46,590 --> 00:26:50,350 to, like, your whole marketing strategy, and what other pieces 433 00:26:50,350 --> 00:26:54,190 and parts are you using? If you're like, oh, my gosh, I don't 434 00:26:54,190 --> 00:26:57,630 wanna DM anybody. That doesn't sound fun for me. Like, 435 00:26:57,630 --> 00:27:01,045 yuck. Okay. What else are you doing? Are you having 436 00:27:01,105 --> 00:27:04,785 coffee chats with people? Are you going to community events? Are you 437 00:27:04,785 --> 00:27:08,305 emailing people? Like, what other ways can you 438 00:27:08,305 --> 00:27:12,065 build relationships? That's just one tool that you 439 00:27:12,065 --> 00:27:15,240 could use. And when you understand how it works, great. But if you don't wanna 440 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:18,840 do it, that's okay. Let's do other things. Right? Yes. For 441 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,260 those listening, I'm doing, like, giant head dots. I 442 00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:26,440 I a 100% agree. I was talking to one of my mentees, earlier 443 00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:30,115 last week, and I kept recommending her, 444 00:27:30,115 --> 00:27:33,875 like, do these, like, private communities. And she kept resisting. And it finally 445 00:27:33,875 --> 00:27:36,675 got to the point where she was like, Andréa, I just wanna be in person. 446 00:27:36,675 --> 00:27:40,135 I was like, oh, done. Forget everything I've said before. 447 00:27:40,450 --> 00:27:44,290 That's not for you. Let's get you in person and like meeting people and 448 00:27:44,290 --> 00:27:48,130 networking. Yes. And that's one of concept. Yes. One of the things that I find 449 00:27:48,130 --> 00:27:51,970 when people really resist being consistent at something, it's because 450 00:27:51,970 --> 00:27:55,685 it's not aligned with their values or 451 00:27:55,685 --> 00:27:59,445 what they enjoy or what lights them up. And I'm not saying that, like, we 452 00:27:59,445 --> 00:28:02,825 should never try new things because you don't know what you don't know. 453 00:28:03,125 --> 00:28:06,325 But once you've tried it and you're like, this isn't for me, like, okay, let's 454 00:28:06,325 --> 00:28:10,059 adjust. Let's pick something that we can be consistent with. Because all of this 455 00:28:10,059 --> 00:28:13,899 stuff, like, you talked about, like, it being investing, it's like putting little 456 00:28:13,899 --> 00:28:17,740 drops in the bucket each time. And if we can't consistently put 457 00:28:17,740 --> 00:28:21,100 drops in the bucket, we're never gonna fill it. And so then we can spend 458 00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:24,945 our time in those drops somewhere else where we can get 459 00:28:24,945 --> 00:28:28,385 the results we're looking for. Yes. Oh, I love that bucket 460 00:28:28,385 --> 00:28:32,225 analogy. That's beautiful. Yeah. I love a good analogy. My husband is like, oh, my 461 00:28:32,225 --> 00:28:35,585 gosh, enough with your analogies. But, you know, I'm glad you 462 00:28:35,585 --> 00:28:39,250 appreciated that. I do. I love a good analogy, too. So 463 00:28:39,250 --> 00:28:43,090 I recognize one when I see one. Well, my last question for 464 00:28:43,090 --> 00:28:46,710 you is, in your opinion, when is it time to outsource 465 00:28:46,850 --> 00:28:50,515 social media? And when we say outsourcing, like, what 466 00:28:50,515 --> 00:28:54,275 does that even mean? And what does a business owner or business leader need 467 00:28:54,275 --> 00:28:58,035 to, like, consider before stepping in and saying, I'm gonna have somebody 468 00:28:58,035 --> 00:29:01,635 else do this for me? Yeah. And especially if you're the face of 469 00:29:01,635 --> 00:29:05,340 your company, your brand, your business, it can be challenging to figure 470 00:29:05,340 --> 00:29:08,799 out how do I even outsource this. There's kind of 3 different levels to this. 471 00:29:09,020 --> 00:29:11,600 The first is getting support with smaller things. 472 00:29:12,700 --> 00:29:16,105 You know, having someone edit a video for you, having 473 00:29:16,105 --> 00:29:19,865 someone write, some like maybe pull some captions from 474 00:29:19,865 --> 00:29:23,544 your podcast episodes, having an assistant who can, 475 00:29:23,544 --> 00:29:27,144 like, upload posts for you or help you stay on top of the inbox. So 476 00:29:27,144 --> 00:29:30,690 those are kind of lower level tasks that you can outsource 477 00:29:30,690 --> 00:29:34,530 individually. You'll know you're ready when you can tell 478 00:29:34,530 --> 00:29:37,890 someone else what to do. K? So you typically have to do it 479 00:29:37,890 --> 00:29:41,670 first, and then you can go, okay, I have a system. Here, replicate 480 00:29:41,730 --> 00:29:45,465 this. Right? And so that's how you'll know you're ready. You'll also know you're ready 481 00:29:45,465 --> 00:29:49,225 when you have the income to be able to support it. I'm a huge fan 482 00:29:49,225 --> 00:29:53,065 of this. People outsource things too quickly sometimes and not in the 483 00:29:53,065 --> 00:29:56,664 right order. And social media, especially if you're a personal brand, can be 484 00:29:56,664 --> 00:30:00,190 challenging to outsource. Maybe initially you need a 485 00:30:00,190 --> 00:30:04,030 bookkeeper instead of a social media manager. Right? So it depends on your business 486 00:30:04,030 --> 00:30:07,870 model, and how much revenue you're bringing in. But the next level of that is 487 00:30:07,870 --> 00:30:11,710 the social media manager. Typically, this is a freelancer or it can be an 488 00:30:11,710 --> 00:30:15,424 in house person. They have more strategy behind them than an 489 00:30:15,424 --> 00:30:19,184 assistant, and they can take over some of the the 490 00:30:19,184 --> 00:30:23,024 whole pieces of social media. So they're writing captions. They're 491 00:30:23,024 --> 00:30:26,784 telling you what videos to record. They're then editing them 492 00:30:26,784 --> 00:30:30,410 and uploading them. Because it's an individual person, they 493 00:30:30,410 --> 00:30:33,630 can be really embedded into your process, into your system. 494 00:30:34,330 --> 00:30:38,090 It's a little more expensive than just an assistant. And so I 495 00:30:38,090 --> 00:30:40,890 want you to make sure that you understand the role social media plays in your 496 00:30:40,890 --> 00:30:44,565 business first. Like, you have to understand the value it's bringing your 497 00:30:44,565 --> 00:30:48,165 business. Otherwise, you'll always look at that line item and be like, I'm 498 00:30:48,165 --> 00:30:51,845 paying too much for this. Right? Yes. Oh my gosh. Like, we're gonna I'm gonna 499 00:30:51,845 --> 00:30:54,965 get on my soapbox for a second. Because you and I both know in the 500 00:30:54,965 --> 00:30:58,550 social media management world, there are people out there that are like, can I just, 501 00:30:58,550 --> 00:31:02,150 like, hire my college neighbor and pay them, like, $200 a 502 00:31:02,150 --> 00:31:05,670 month to do this for me? No. Like, this is a job that you want 503 00:31:05,670 --> 00:31:09,270 a professional to do. You wouldn't hire your college neighbor to come rewire your 504 00:31:09,270 --> 00:31:12,875 house if you needed electrical done. Like, it's the same 505 00:31:12,875 --> 00:31:15,695 level of expertise in just a different industry. 506 00:31:16,635 --> 00:31:20,475 Yes. A 100000%. Like, having someone with 507 00:31:20,475 --> 00:31:24,075 that expertise is not cheap. K? Because they're they're 508 00:31:24,075 --> 00:31:27,830 wearing a lot of hats, writing, editing, creative 509 00:31:27,970 --> 00:31:31,810 direction, planning, organizing, video editing. Like, 510 00:31:31,810 --> 00:31:35,190 there's a lot involved. Right? But that person can be integral 511 00:31:35,410 --> 00:31:39,185 to helping free up some of your time as well. And then 512 00:31:39,185 --> 00:31:42,625 I would say the 3rd level is hiring an agency or high level 513 00:31:42,625 --> 00:31:46,465 strategic support. And this one's my favorite because this is 514 00:31:46,465 --> 00:31:49,925 where I work. So I'm a 100% biased here. 515 00:31:50,510 --> 00:31:54,050 But typically, this is when you've reached a certain level of success in your business 516 00:31:54,110 --> 00:31:57,730 where you probably have a PR team. You probably have, 517 00:31:58,830 --> 00:32:02,670 you know, a full time assistant, and you're creating a lot of content. 518 00:32:02,670 --> 00:32:06,045 Your business is doing really well, and you just don't have time to 519 00:32:06,045 --> 00:32:09,725 manage someone else. So by hiring an agency, they come 520 00:32:09,725 --> 00:32:13,485 with the video editors, the graphic designers, the writers. They're 521 00:32:13,485 --> 00:32:17,289 maybe taking things up a notch. They have multiple clients, so 522 00:32:17,289 --> 00:32:20,190 they have their pulse on, you know, your specific vertical. 523 00:32:21,210 --> 00:32:25,049 And then you're not having to worry about, like, hiring and firing multiple people. 524 00:32:25,049 --> 00:32:28,845 So the challenge with one single social media manager is, if it doesn't 525 00:32:28,845 --> 00:32:32,205 work out, you're starting all over again. Yeah. With an 526 00:32:32,205 --> 00:32:36,045 agency, they have the systems in place. So you're typically just 527 00:32:36,125 --> 00:32:39,645 you have your one point of contact and then you're dealing with them. Again, it 528 00:32:39,645 --> 00:32:43,165 is pricey, so I would recommend, you know, you're at a certain level of 529 00:32:43,165 --> 00:32:46,890 business by then. You have revenue. You have a line 530 00:32:46,890 --> 00:32:50,330 item for this. You have a budget for this. You know the impact that social 531 00:32:50,330 --> 00:32:53,370 media has on your business. When you do it, you see results in your business. 532 00:32:53,370 --> 00:32:57,130 When you don't, you don't. Right. And so, yeah, those are things to think about 533 00:32:57,130 --> 00:33:00,355 as you're thinking about hiring. Yeah. And I think another thing to think about, this 534 00:33:00,355 --> 00:33:03,475 is something that I talk with clients a lot about when we're discussing the 9 535 00:33:03,475 --> 00:33:06,695 Grid strategy is personal brand 536 00:33:07,075 --> 00:33:10,835 versus your company brand. And we're gonna look at those through a 537 00:33:10,835 --> 00:33:14,320 slightly different lens. And so for some 538 00:33:14,380 --> 00:33:17,980 companies, you don't you haven't necessarily used a 539 00:33:17,980 --> 00:33:21,500 personal brand. For other companies, your personal brand has been 540 00:33:21,500 --> 00:33:25,180 growing. Now your company is growing. Now it's starting to get too 541 00:33:25,180 --> 00:33:28,365 much to manage too, but because you may have 542 00:33:28,905 --> 00:33:32,605 individual goals or things that you're doing outside 543 00:33:32,745 --> 00:33:36,345 of just the company, it's important to still have both. So 544 00:33:36,345 --> 00:33:39,865 that might be another area of, like, okay. It's time to get some level of 545 00:33:39,865 --> 00:33:43,669 support on 1 or the other Because managing 2 546 00:33:44,210 --> 00:33:47,590 in and of itself, like, becomes a full time job sometimes. 547 00:33:48,049 --> 00:33:51,730 Yeah. It's too much. I don't recommend 2 accounts, like, ever. 2 brands 548 00:33:51,730 --> 00:33:55,490 ever. 1 person. And I would disagree. I because I would say there are 549 00:33:55,490 --> 00:33:58,815 times when 2 make sense if you are and this is actually like I'll just 550 00:33:58,815 --> 00:34:02,335 say this, because this is kind of my sweet spot is more you're a 551 00:34:02,335 --> 00:34:06,095 service provider, and you've grown your business to the place that like, 552 00:34:06,095 --> 00:34:09,869 you are not the only one providing the service. You've built 553 00:34:09,869 --> 00:34:13,710 a team of service providers. So now like your 554 00:34:13,710 --> 00:34:17,230 company has it's become bigger than just 555 00:34:17,230 --> 00:34:20,190 you. But maybe it's to your point, like I was saying, like, if if you're 556 00:34:20,190 --> 00:34:23,594 doing other things, you've got other goals, like you're still doing speaking 557 00:34:23,594 --> 00:34:26,975 engagements, or like, maybe you're gonna write a book, 558 00:34:27,195 --> 00:34:30,795 or maybe someday you're gonna start another company because you're like a serial 559 00:34:30,795 --> 00:34:34,475 entrepreneur. This is where we might need to, but at that 560 00:34:34,475 --> 00:34:38,119 point, your company is bringing in enough revenue 561 00:34:38,500 --> 00:34:42,179 that it makes sense to have support. Yes, 562 00:34:42,179 --> 00:34:45,780 yes. When you have the second account, you really need someone else to manage it. 563 00:34:45,780 --> 00:34:49,219 Right. And if you have the team that that person on the team can really 564 00:34:49,219 --> 00:34:52,855 help with that. Yeah, I agree with that. For a lot of service based companies 565 00:34:52,855 --> 00:34:56,315 that I've seen. What happens is they end up asking, 566 00:34:56,375 --> 00:34:59,755 like, the front desk person or the office manager 567 00:35:00,615 --> 00:35:04,315 or somebody to handle marketing. 568 00:35:04,990 --> 00:35:08,190 And, like, that person doesn't have time and they don't have the expertise, and it's 569 00:35:08,190 --> 00:35:12,030 no different than asking your college neighbor to do it. Like, if you are 570 00:35:12,030 --> 00:35:15,710 a professional level company making 7, 8 figures, 9 figures a 571 00:35:15,710 --> 00:35:19,470 year, maybe it doesn't make sense for you to have an in house marketing team, 572 00:35:19,470 --> 00:35:22,945 but that's where like an agency and a strategic partner or a fractional 573 00:35:23,005 --> 00:35:26,845 CMO or fractional director of marketing can really make sure that 574 00:35:26,845 --> 00:35:30,685 your content and your marketing plan is elevated to the level 575 00:35:30,685 --> 00:35:34,230 of service that you're providing your clients. Right? Yes. Yes. 576 00:35:34,230 --> 00:35:38,070 Because that firm press front desk person has so much happening and so 577 00:35:38,070 --> 00:35:41,750 much going on, that they can do very surface level things that 578 00:35:41,750 --> 00:35:45,110 maybe they could do. It's the same level of what they do personally on their 579 00:35:45,110 --> 00:35:48,755 account. And there's no strategy behind it. So, yeah, you can slap up 580 00:35:48,755 --> 00:35:51,235 some posts and it can be a little bit of a Band Aid, but you'll 581 00:35:51,235 --> 00:35:54,855 eventually need strategic support for that person. For sure. 582 00:35:54,995 --> 00:35:57,395 Oh, my gosh. This was such a good conversation. I think you and I could 583 00:35:57,395 --> 00:36:01,075 probably nerd out about marketing and social media all day long, but I wanna ask 584 00:36:01,075 --> 00:36:04,289 a couple fun get to know you questions before we wrap up. And, you know, 585 00:36:04,289 --> 00:36:07,970 we talk a lot about brand values here on the consistency corner. So I would 586 00:36:07,970 --> 00:36:11,010 love to hear what's one of your brand values and how did you land on 587 00:36:11,010 --> 00:36:14,789 it? Yes. So one of my favorites is positive 588 00:36:14,849 --> 00:36:18,535 communication. And it actually started from a personal, 589 00:36:19,075 --> 00:36:21,095 value. Have you ever heard of the the CliftonStrengthsFinders? 590 00:36:22,434 --> 00:36:26,115 Okay. So I took the the CliftonStrengthsFinders and 591 00:36:26,115 --> 00:36:29,335 my number 2 strength is positivity. 592 00:36:30,410 --> 00:36:33,930 And I was like, wait, what? That's a strength? Not everyone looks 593 00:36:33,930 --> 00:36:36,270 at the world with rose colored glasses? 594 00:36:37,610 --> 00:36:41,450 So, when I recognized that, I was like, oh, this is a superpower that I 595 00:36:41,450 --> 00:36:45,135 didn't even realize that I have. Like, I'm like a cheerleader 596 00:36:45,194 --> 00:36:49,035 over here for people. And so it became one of our 597 00:36:49,035 --> 00:36:52,795 company values is now when we look at how we 598 00:36:52,795 --> 00:36:56,414 can champion our clients, we're looking at it through positive communication. 599 00:36:56,795 --> 00:37:00,450 Social media can feel very negative sometimes. Marketing 600 00:37:00,450 --> 00:37:04,210 can be a negative. Building a business is freaking hard. And 601 00:37:04,210 --> 00:37:07,970 so we try to infuse, like, a positive communication in everything we 602 00:37:07,970 --> 00:37:11,810 do. So Yeah. Tactically, that's like a lot of emojis and GIFs. 603 00:37:11,810 --> 00:37:15,425 Yes. I love that. I love that. Alright. Well, 604 00:37:15,425 --> 00:37:19,105 because one of my personal values and brand values is around 605 00:37:19,105 --> 00:37:22,545 living with a growth mindset and personal development. I always love to ask our guests, 606 00:37:22,545 --> 00:37:26,385 what is a favorite personal development book or podcast that 607 00:37:26,385 --> 00:37:29,920 you would recommend? I love Mileeek's podcast. 608 00:37:30,619 --> 00:37:34,300 I taught you. She's amazing. She's a former founder 609 00:37:34,300 --> 00:37:38,059 of CrowBox and, now talks about 610 00:37:38,059 --> 00:37:41,825 more personal development topics. It's amazing. I love it. Very fun. Very 611 00:37:41,825 --> 00:37:45,424 fun. And then what is something that you are really 612 00:37:45,424 --> 00:37:48,785 consistent with? And I'll remind everybody that consistent doesn't have to mean 613 00:37:48,785 --> 00:37:52,464 constant. But what's something that you're really consistent with either in your 614 00:37:52,464 --> 00:37:56,280 business or your personal life that you're really proud of? Personal life 615 00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:59,500 is meditation. I meditate for at least 5 minutes every day. 616 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:04,460 And then business is my podcast. We're coming up on episode 300. 617 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,220 It is the most consistent content I've ever created. And I love it. Yes. 618 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,215 I love that. I love that. And I'm very impressed that you can meditate 619 00:38:12,215 --> 00:38:15,975 for 5 minutes a day with a toddler. So that's great that you've been 620 00:38:15,975 --> 00:38:19,595 able to stick to that. It has been a lesson 621 00:38:19,735 --> 00:38:23,460 in time management and taking advantage of naps. 622 00:38:23,859 --> 00:38:27,140 Yes, for sure. Oh my goodness. Well, Andréa, this was such a great conversation. Thank 623 00:38:27,140 --> 00:38:30,660 you so much for being here. If our listeners are interested in connecting with you, 624 00:38:30,660 --> 00:38:33,700 where do you hang out online? Where can they find you and learn more? Yes. 625 00:38:33,700 --> 00:38:37,395 I'm at online drea everywhere online d r e a. Insta 626 00:38:37,395 --> 00:38:40,995 is my favorite hang place right now. And then if you like podcasts, check out 627 00:38:40,995 --> 00:38:44,835 the Savvy Social Podcast. We actually just won an award. It's, the 628 00:38:44,835 --> 00:38:48,490 best, best in Canada business show. Oh my gosh. 629 00:38:48,490 --> 00:38:52,170 Congratulations. That's awesome. Wild. So check it out, 630 00:38:52,170 --> 00:38:55,930 Savvy Social Podcast. Fine. We'll link everything in the show notes. And again, thank you 631 00:38:55,930 --> 00:38:58,510 so much for being here. Thank you for having me.