WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.640 --> 00:00:04.480 Today we're breaking down some of those preconceived notions that we all have 2 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:07.555 about what marketing should be, and we're talking about 3 00:00:07.875 --> 00:00:11.474 mindful and sustainable marketing with my special guest today, 4 00:00:11.474 --> 00:00:15.155 Tameeson Smith. I'm excited to geek out about marketing with her. Let's get 5 00:00:15.155 --> 00:00:15.974 into it. 6 00:00:22.040 --> 00:00:25.845 You're listening to the Mindful Marketing Podcast. I'm Andrea Jones. 7 00:00:29.425 --> 00:00:33.120 I've recorded over 300 podcast episodes. Yeah. It's 8 00:00:33.120 --> 00:00:36.800 a lot of podcast episodes, and I've tried a lot of different virtual 9 00:00:36.800 --> 00:00:40.100 recording studios. But my favorite has been 10 00:00:40.239 --> 00:00:43.855 Riverside. Riverside makes their virtual recording studio 11 00:00:43.855 --> 00:00:47.534 look so profesh. My guests love it. Plus, I 12 00:00:47.534 --> 00:00:50.910 also low key love recording YouTube videos in here as well 13 00:00:51.070 --> 00:00:54.910 because it's so easy to use. My team also loves Riverside because 14 00:00:54.910 --> 00:00:58.050 it spits out separate audio video tracks making editing 15 00:00:58.445 --> 00:01:02.065 easy breezy, lemon squeezy. And if you want a little magic, 16 00:01:02.125 --> 00:01:05.665 they've got this tool called MagicClips, which uses 17 00:01:05.725 --> 00:01:09.310 AI to take your video and turn it into perfect social 18 00:01:09.310 --> 00:01:12.830 media sized videos. I'm talking vertical videos for TikTok and Instagram, 19 00:01:12.830 --> 00:01:16.604 Facebook Reels, all the places you can post these videos with the captions 20 00:01:16.604 --> 00:01:20.125 included, and you don't have to hunt and search for that 21 00:01:20.125 --> 00:01:23.185 perfect clip. So if you wanna try this out for yourself, 22 00:01:24.030 --> 00:01:27.150 click the link that goes with this video. Or if you're listening to the audio 23 00:01:27.150 --> 00:01:30.605 on the podcast, it's in the show notes. Okay? Click that link. 24 00:01:30.765 --> 00:01:34.445 Use the 15% off coupon code. It's Drea, d r e 25 00:01:34.445 --> 00:01:38.045 a, and try Riverside for yourself. Thank you, 26 00:01:38.045 --> 00:01:41.860 Riverside. Tomisin, 27 00:01:42.560 --> 00:01:46.240 welcome to the show. Thank you. I'm happy to be here. 28 00:01:46.240 --> 00:01:49.945 It's super nice. Yay. I'm excited to chat with you and just geek out 29 00:01:49.945 --> 00:01:53.625 about marketing. We have a lot of the same foundational beliefs and, like, what 30 00:01:53.625 --> 00:01:57.320 marketing could be and how businesses can use it. But I wanna 31 00:01:57.320 --> 00:02:00.920 go way back to your origin story. I was watching a 32 00:02:00.920 --> 00:02:04.600 YouTube video of yours right before this, and you said you started 10 years 33 00:02:04.600 --> 00:02:08.264 ago, same as me. So tell me. Yeah. We're 34 00:02:08.264 --> 00:02:11.865 OGs. How did you get into the marketing space? It's 35 00:02:11.865 --> 00:02:15.705 it's so wild, because, I mean, there is no one that 36 00:02:15.705 --> 00:02:19.130 is, smooth because, I'm I'm originally 37 00:02:19.130 --> 00:02:22.970 African. So you're either a doctor, an engineer, or 38 00:02:22.970 --> 00:02:25.870 a. Right? So I went to school for 39 00:02:26.335 --> 00:02:29.715 medical sciences, and it was so hard. I hated 40 00:02:29.935 --> 00:02:33.694 every second of it. I did everything we had to do, open 41 00:02:33.694 --> 00:02:37.280 people up. It was gory. And I just knew that, you know what? I don't 42 00:02:37.280 --> 00:02:41.120 wanna live my life like this. I am not happy. So once I was done 43 00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:44.485 with, medical school, I went to 44 00:02:44.485 --> 00:02:48.245 advertising school. I've always been fascinated by creativity. It's 45 00:02:48.245 --> 00:02:51.305 well to me how something in someone's 46 00:02:51.685 --> 00:02:55.460 brain can become pen to paper. Right? Taking something from 47 00:02:55.460 --> 00:02:59.160 your head and putting it down, learning your drawing, whether you're writing. 48 00:02:59.460 --> 00:03:02.504 So I've always been that kind of a burden. I'm like, you know what? Let 49 00:03:02.504 --> 00:03:06.345 me go and see what I can do with this. And, you 50 00:03:06.345 --> 00:03:09.625 know, that's also a lesson for someone that you don't always have to have your 51 00:03:09.625 --> 00:03:13.459 life figured out. It's okay to keep trying and experimenting up until you 52 00:03:13.459 --> 00:03:17.220 find out what you really want to do. So I went to advertising school 53 00:03:17.220 --> 00:03:20.905 for my direction, because I'm 54 00:03:20.905 --> 00:03:24.685 also, like, super into producing and directing 55 00:03:24.825 --> 00:03:28.360 movies because I just I'm I'm a I'm a mom behind. Oh, I used to 56 00:03:28.360 --> 00:03:32.120 think I'm always behind the scenes girl, but life has shown 57 00:03:32.120 --> 00:03:35.560 me otherwise. And after I was going the other 58 00:03:35.560 --> 00:03:39.105 direction, I noticed that I really gravitated towards 59 00:03:39.165 --> 00:03:42.685 graphics and social. And the cool thing about my ad 60 00:03:42.685 --> 00:03:46.500 agency was, yes, you had your core, but you were involved in 61 00:03:46.500 --> 00:03:49.240 every other thing. So I had some information about copy, 62 00:03:49.860 --> 00:03:53.560 radio jingles, billboards, the process, shooting 63 00:03:53.620 --> 00:03:57.444 ads. And I I found out that throughout all of these, I know the 64 00:03:57.444 --> 00:04:01.125 knowledge that I've gone on, social was more interesting to me, 65 00:04:01.125 --> 00:04:04.720 but I did not know how to go about it. I had 66 00:04:04.940 --> 00:04:08.780 the school certification. How do I apply for jobs? How 67 00:04:08.780 --> 00:04:12.560 do I get a job? Then I met this lady in church, 68 00:04:13.745 --> 00:04:17.505 somewhere around, like, 10 10 years ago, and I always really liked how 69 00:04:17.505 --> 00:04:21.345 she carried herself. She had, like, 3 folds. And then 10 years ago, she 70 00:04:21.345 --> 00:04:24.290 had 3 folds. Like, what do you do for what? Why do you have so 71 00:04:24.290 --> 00:04:28.050 many phones? And, you know, I just asked that. Sorry. Is 72 00:04:28.050 --> 00:04:31.090 it okay if I ask that? She said she was social media manager. I'm like, 73 00:04:31.090 --> 00:04:34.785 oh my god. I love this. People can pay 74 00:04:34.785 --> 00:04:38.305 me to manage their social, which is, you know, me 75 00:04:38.305 --> 00:04:42.050 using all the skills I have, all the skills I have done 76 00:04:42.050 --> 00:04:45.850 on, all the skills I love, and then I went into action. 77 00:04:45.850 --> 00:04:49.610 I took every certification, and I read every book. 78 00:04:49.610 --> 00:04:52.745 I took every course because I'm a I'm a very 79 00:04:53.845 --> 00:04:57.605 DIY kind of person, a self starter. So, yes, I get, like, the 80 00:04:57.605 --> 00:05:01.400 basic school knowledge, but I'm very, very into practical 81 00:05:01.460 --> 00:05:05.139 knowledge. So I took, the method then it was Facebook 82 00:05:05.139 --> 00:05:08.794 Blueprint. Yep. I took courses on Shaw Academy. I 83 00:05:08.794 --> 00:05:12.634 took courses on Google Digital Garage, and that's what I 84 00:05:12.634 --> 00:05:16.074 tell people that I want to be social media managers now. You are not gonna 85 00:05:16.074 --> 00:05:19.700 know the skills, and you're just maybe following some gurus, and they're 86 00:05:19.700 --> 00:05:23.540 telling you what to do, which is most likely not right. You know? There's so 87 00:05:23.540 --> 00:05:27.354 many free resources that you can exhaust before 88 00:05:27.814 --> 00:05:31.115 you start paying for things. Yeah. So I took all of these free resources 89 00:05:31.735 --> 00:05:35.094 and put that knowledge together and put the certifications, wrote a 90 00:05:35.094 --> 00:05:38.840 resume, and applied to my 1st big girl job, and I got it. I 91 00:05:38.840 --> 00:05:42.440 was like, oh my god. I got this job quote and unquote by 92 00:05:42.440 --> 00:05:46.164 myself. Yes. And that's really how I got into 93 00:05:46.164 --> 00:05:49.925 social. I've been there, for a decade this 94 00:05:49.925 --> 00:05:53.650 year. I'm still loving it. Yes. I have gone from employee 95 00:05:53.710 --> 00:05:57.170 to solopreneur to business owner to agency owner, but 96 00:05:57.630 --> 00:06:01.310 I'm I'm really, really, grateful for the kind of journey that I have 97 00:06:01.310 --> 00:06:05.125 had so far. Yes. I love that. And I love that you're 98 00:06:05.365 --> 00:06:09.045 like like, first of all, you just casually are like, yeah. I went to 99 00:06:09.045 --> 00:06:12.650 med school. I'm like, what? Girl. 100 00:06:13.590 --> 00:06:17.349 Like, that's a lot of school. That's a lot of school. And I'm with you. 101 00:06:17.349 --> 00:06:21.115 I can't even watch, I'm I just started watching Chicago Med, and 102 00:06:21.115 --> 00:06:24.795 I can't even watch that. I'm like, it's too gory. Can we fast 103 00:06:24.795 --> 00:06:28.310 forward to the I it's not for me. It's not for me. But I like 104 00:06:28.310 --> 00:06:31.830 how I like your journey because there's it's so rich from the 105 00:06:31.830 --> 00:06:35.669 background. And I think that's important for, like, us to talk 106 00:06:35.669 --> 00:06:39.455 about because sometimes people, when they come into 107 00:06:39.455 --> 00:06:42.675 our world the first time, they just get the snapshot of where we are now. 108 00:06:43.455 --> 00:06:47.009 And where we are now can be easy to describe, 109 00:06:47.009 --> 00:06:50.849 but the path to get there sometimes is not easy. So I love that. I 110 00:06:50.849 --> 00:06:54.690 love that. So you're all about sustainable and mindful marketing just like 111 00:06:54.690 --> 00:06:58.055 I am. And I know for me, there was like a key moment 112 00:06:58.435 --> 00:07:02.195 or it was like, oh, I don't wanna do things the way 113 00:07:02.195 --> 00:07:06.010 that everyone else does them. I I think I have a different approach. 114 00:07:06.870 --> 00:07:10.310 And then once I had that key moment, I couldn't go back. I had to 115 00:07:10.310 --> 00:07:13.895 start infusing it into my work. And then now this is the mindful 116 00:07:13.895 --> 00:07:17.655 marketing podcast. I've rebranded it because of all this work that I've 117 00:07:17.655 --> 00:07:21.015 been doing for the past few years. So I'm wondering for you, was there a 118 00:07:21.015 --> 00:07:24.680 moment in time or a couple of moments where you're like, we can't 119 00:07:24.680 --> 00:07:28.520 do things unethically? We can't do things without being 120 00:07:28.520 --> 00:07:31.705 mindful? I I think for me, it was, 121 00:07:33.385 --> 00:07:37.210 like, late 2020 and, like, 2021, the heat 122 00:07:37.210 --> 00:07:40.990 of COVID when everybody and their grandparents became online educators, 123 00:07:41.210 --> 00:07:44.755 and everybody knew about social. And there's 124 00:07:44.755 --> 00:07:48.515 so much misinformation out there. It used to keep me up on my 125 00:07:48.595 --> 00:07:52.440 every time I say this, people like me because this is what I do. 126 00:07:52.440 --> 00:07:55.180 This is what I know. I don't want it to be misrepresented. 127 00:07:56.120 --> 00:07:59.800 And at that moment, I just decided that, you know what? I'm going to get 128 00:07:59.800 --> 00:08:02.815 online and demystify everything I can, 129 00:08:03.595 --> 00:08:07.115 break every mess breakable, call out whoever I choose to call 130 00:08:07.115 --> 00:08:10.699 out, and also teach people the right way to think about things 131 00:08:10.699 --> 00:08:14.300 because social is so noisy. Social 132 00:08:14.300 --> 00:08:17.979 is so hard. People get depressed from 133 00:08:17.979 --> 00:08:21.604 social media. So it's it's not it's a it can be a 134 00:08:21.604 --> 00:08:25.384 matter of life and death. It can be the difference between 135 00:08:25.604 --> 00:08:29.350 someone, someone's life looking a certain way and it looking like 136 00:08:29.350 --> 00:08:32.870 in a in a very good way. So I decided that I 137 00:08:32.870 --> 00:08:36.485 wanted to be that person that to a large extent would 138 00:08:36.644 --> 00:08:40.325 put that positivity back in the hearts of people while 139 00:08:40.325 --> 00:08:44.084 teaching them that, you know, it is a marathon. It's not 140 00:08:44.084 --> 00:08:47.550 a sprint. You have to think sustainably over 141 00:08:47.550 --> 00:08:51.310 virality. Because I say this all the time, I'm not building an 142 00:08:51.310 --> 00:08:54.615 agency that I want to be viral today and make a $100,000,000 143 00:08:55.155 --> 00:08:58.595 today. Nope. My goal is slowly but surely 144 00:08:58.595 --> 00:09:02.020 because even as a person, maybe because I'm I'm neurodivergent. 145 00:09:02.560 --> 00:09:06.400 When things happen too fast, it overwhelms me. And I know 146 00:09:06.400 --> 00:09:09.775 almost everybody is like that. I've gone viral on social. I 147 00:09:09.775 --> 00:09:13.235 hated it so much. So, you know, in 2020, 148 00:09:13.295 --> 00:09:16.975 2021, I just decided that I don't like the information I 149 00:09:16.975 --> 00:09:20.639 am seeing. There were a lot of people that were kinda, 150 00:09:20.639 --> 00:09:24.399 like, looking to me, in the social media space. So 151 00:09:24.399 --> 00:09:28.125 maybe people I had mentored in the past or people that were Nigerians like 152 00:09:28.125 --> 00:09:31.824 me and maybe just moved to the US. I just needed some direction, 153 00:09:31.964 --> 00:09:35.710 and I decided that I was going to be that guy for them while 154 00:09:35.850 --> 00:09:39.690 remaining true to myself. It is so important to me to be able to 155 00:09:39.690 --> 00:09:43.290 sleep at night. Mhmm. You know? For me to be able to feel 156 00:09:43.290 --> 00:09:46.985 like I did the right thing. I said the right thing. I 157 00:09:46.985 --> 00:09:50.445 led people in the right path. Because I believe that when 158 00:09:50.665 --> 00:09:53.690 God gives you an opportunity, because I'm a believer, when 159 00:09:56.170 --> 00:09:59.770 you're supposed to do it right, you know, because you if I 160 00:09:59.770 --> 00:10:03.585 count. So for me, that's where it came from. I just wanted 161 00:10:03.585 --> 00:10:07.105 to do the right thing. When I do viral or not, I really don't 162 00:10:07.105 --> 00:10:10.810 care. I don't want to, but I want you to be able 163 00:10:10.810 --> 00:10:14.430 to come back to my page, to the work that I have done, to 164 00:10:14.650 --> 00:10:18.490 the the results we have delivered for our clients 5, 6, 165 00:10:18.490 --> 00:10:22.014 7 years, from now, and it is still valid. 166 00:10:22.074 --> 00:10:25.135 It's evergreen, you know, and it's good information. 167 00:10:25.915 --> 00:10:28.894 Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And same here. There's so much, 168 00:10:30.150 --> 00:10:33.910 not just misinformation, but the advice that's given, it's like, 169 00:10:33.910 --> 00:10:37.075 yeah, it could work, but you're selling your soul for it. Like, I remember 170 00:10:42.035 --> 00:10:44.140 Five times a day? What else are you doing in your day? You're living on 171 00:10:44.140 --> 00:10:47.910 TikTok. Five times a day. What else are you doing in your day? You're living 172 00:10:47.910 --> 00:10:51.450 on TikTok. And, yeah, you could go viral. Sure. 173 00:10:52.055 --> 00:10:55.894 Going viral, first of all, doesn't guarantee that your business is that you're gonna 174 00:10:55.894 --> 00:10:59.720 get more business. K? And then the second thing is you're going 175 00:10:59.720 --> 00:11:03.240 viral at the cost of your own personal self, which I just don't 176 00:11:03.240 --> 00:11:07.000 think that's not a price I'm willing to pay. Okay? Like, I'm not willing to 177 00:11:07.000 --> 00:11:09.825 pay it. And so I think that that part of what you said, like, low 178 00:11:09.825 --> 00:11:13.505 key, we don't wanna go viral. We've seen too much. We've seen too much. 179 00:11:13.505 --> 00:11:16.385 Yes. It's part of the reason I don't put my kids on social media. I've 180 00:11:16.385 --> 00:11:19.810 seen too much. I know too much. Same. 2 181 00:11:19.810 --> 00:11:23.570 children, you would never see them anywhere. They literally have 0 182 00:11:23.570 --> 00:11:27.365 digital footprint. Yeah. We've seen we've seen 183 00:11:27.365 --> 00:11:31.144 we've seen the behind the curtain. So with all of that in mind, 184 00:11:32.140 --> 00:11:35.580 I wanna learn more about you and kind of, like, how you apply this to 185 00:11:35.580 --> 00:11:39.040 your own accounts. Because, as much as we 186 00:11:39.255 --> 00:11:42.855 as marketers say, this is what you should do, sometimes what we actually do is 187 00:11:42.855 --> 00:11:46.615 different, or even, like, the time that we make first, our own stuff 188 00:11:46.615 --> 00:11:49.640 is different. I know a lot of marketers are listening to this and they do 189 00:11:49.640 --> 00:11:52.280 it for their clients. And then when it comes to their own accounts, they're like, 190 00:11:52.280 --> 00:11:55.985 what? And one of the things I saw recently was that 191 00:11:55.985 --> 00:11:59.505 you are on YouTube. I think you posted this on threads. You said you're starting 192 00:11:59.505 --> 00:12:03.345 on YouTube. So talk to me about there's 193 00:12:03.425 --> 00:12:07.060 this is a 2 parter question. What your current favorite platform is 194 00:12:07.060 --> 00:12:10.420 and then why you decided to explore a new platform like 195 00:12:10.420 --> 00:12:13.939 YouTube? So I'll I'll start with what my favorite 196 00:12:13.939 --> 00:12:17.435 platform is. And, you know, I'm not even either that I say 197 00:12:17.435 --> 00:12:21.055 this, but it's Instagram. Instagram for me is like that 198 00:12:21.355 --> 00:12:24.960 toxic x that we've had our differences, and I love to 199 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:28.260 hate, but I find it hard to let him or her go. Right? 200 00:12:28.560 --> 00:12:32.315 Because it's just it might be because it's the 201 00:12:32.315 --> 00:12:36.154 first platform I ever managed at my first job. And I have been on 202 00:12:36.154 --> 00:12:39.960 Instagram since it was Instagram, if you know what I mean. 203 00:12:39.960 --> 00:12:43.640 Like, at that point, when I got on Instagram, I knew the contents that would 204 00:12:43.640 --> 00:12:47.435 go viral. I knew the ones that would do well. I knew the ones that, 205 00:12:47.515 --> 00:12:51.275 you know, my audience or the audience or whatever people they're managing would 206 00:12:51.275 --> 00:12:55.090 engage me. It wasn't Russian or LA like it is now. So, 207 00:12:55.650 --> 00:12:59.430 I really, really, really like, social media, Instagram 208 00:12:59.570 --> 00:13:03.085 in particular, because it has just always been deaf for me. 209 00:13:03.325 --> 00:13:07.165 Right? And I am a very visual person. By visual, I mean 210 00:13:07.165 --> 00:13:10.845 graphics, not necessarily video. Because I mentioned earlier that, you 211 00:13:10.845 --> 00:13:14.150 know, I like to be honest. I am so a part of video. I mean, 212 00:13:14.150 --> 00:13:17.750 it could've been a video. It takes it takes a lot of me, you 213 00:13:17.750 --> 00:13:21.215 know, helping myself up, you know, talking to 214 00:13:21.215 --> 00:13:24.815 myself and having conversations with, like, the inner 215 00:13:24.815 --> 00:13:28.655 told me to, you know, be good on video. Because I I don't 216 00:13:28.655 --> 00:13:32.170 even take pictures. That's how I find it is because I feel like it 217 00:13:32.170 --> 00:13:35.769 just it's just not my vibe. So I'm not big on 218 00:13:35.769 --> 00:13:39.555 video, but I'm big on graphics. Give me designs all the time. Tell 219 00:13:39.555 --> 00:13:43.394 me to make things look pretty. Tell me to so Instagram had 220 00:13:43.635 --> 00:13:47.075 has that for me. You know? I can put pictures. I can put graphics that 221 00:13:47.075 --> 00:13:50.920 people would appreciate and be like, oh, this looks really good, and it has good 222 00:13:50.920 --> 00:13:53.740 information. So I think that's majorly why, 223 00:13:54.920 --> 00:13:58.665 Instagram is still my fave, to date. YouTube, 224 00:13:58.725 --> 00:14:02.404 I am loving. Loving. Love. I'm not going to front. I 225 00:14:02.404 --> 00:14:06.030 currently have, 80 subscribers, and I love it. I am so 226 00:14:06.030 --> 00:14:09.490 happy because I feel like for me, 227 00:14:09.790 --> 00:14:13.445 getting on YouTube is not about, you know, putting myself out 228 00:14:13.445 --> 00:14:17.065 there necessarily. It's about keeping a promise I make to myself, 229 00:14:17.765 --> 00:14:21.465 which is to be to consciously share good information. 230 00:14:22.009 --> 00:14:25.770 I know that I can do that on Instagram, but how many times? 231 00:14:25.770 --> 00:14:29.130 I'm like, I have so much more to say. And then it has to be 232 00:14:29.130 --> 00:14:31.915 one minute. It has to be 37, though it has to be on the training 233 00:14:31.915 --> 00:14:35.274 module. And all those, you know, things that I'm just like, you know what? I'm 234 00:14:35.274 --> 00:14:38.970 not doing this. So I decided that with YouTube, I can have 235 00:14:38.970 --> 00:14:42.650 much more impact. My watch word this year is 236 00:14:42.650 --> 00:14:46.305 impacts over effects, impacts over 237 00:14:46.305 --> 00:14:49.825 virality. Impacts are long lasting. It 238 00:14:49.825 --> 00:14:53.265 comprises effects. Effects just come and go. You know? It's like the 239 00:14:53.730 --> 00:14:57.410 it's like a shadow. It passes, and and that's the end of it. 240 00:14:57.410 --> 00:15:01.005 But YouTube and I thought about the platform that has made that type of impact 241 00:15:05.805 --> 00:15:09.279 necessarily don't see Instagram post from 10 years ago. So I'm like, you know 242 00:15:09.279 --> 00:15:12.420 what? If I'm thinking longevity, if I'm thinking sustainability, 243 00:15:13.279 --> 00:15:16.995 especially for my personal brand, then I need to 244 00:15:16.995 --> 00:15:20.695 be on YouTube. So this is me keeping that promise to myself. 245 00:15:20.755 --> 00:15:24.515 This is me consistently deciding to post at least for 246 00:15:24.515 --> 00:15:28.190 this year. And I I I I was telling my 247 00:15:28.190 --> 00:15:31.709 friends, honestly, if I get 2 views, Andrea, I'm still going to 248 00:15:31.709 --> 00:15:35.365 because it's not about that for me at all for 249 00:15:35.365 --> 00:15:39.205 now. It's about showing myself that when I when I 250 00:15:39.205 --> 00:15:41.865 tell myself to do something, I can't. Because 251 00:15:43.520 --> 00:15:47.280 I'll I'll talk with my younger brother that the people that 252 00:15:47.280 --> 00:15:51.040 are doing well, the ones that are selling their businesses for millions or 253 00:15:51.040 --> 00:15:54.785 the ones that that have impacts, the kind of impact they're making from. 254 00:15:54.785 --> 00:15:58.625 The of this world is not because they're the most brilliant people, 255 00:15:58.625 --> 00:16:02.209 because they're the most consistent. Everybody's going to forget 256 00:16:02.209 --> 00:16:05.490 about you if you don't keep doing what you're doing, if you don't keep the 257 00:16:05.490 --> 00:16:09.165 promises you make to yourself, the promises you make to your audience. So, 258 00:16:09.165 --> 00:16:13.005 you know, my my major goal this month is not. I don't care 259 00:16:13.005 --> 00:16:16.800 if nobody watches. I don't care if, it's not doing well. 260 00:16:16.959 --> 00:16:20.500 The numbers are not 6. Actually, maybe next year we change. But 261 00:16:20.720 --> 00:16:24.420 for me, this year, it's it's it's nothing about that. So that's majorly 262 00:16:24.480 --> 00:16:28.024 why I decided to get. Many subscribers 263 00:16:28.404 --> 00:16:31.845 long, but the vibe is immaculate. I am not 264 00:16:31.845 --> 00:16:35.640 feeling pressured or feeling anxious to get 265 00:16:35.640 --> 00:16:39.400 in front of the camera and record a video because I'm just talking about what 266 00:16:39.400 --> 00:16:42.995 I already know. So, you know, that's that's where I'm at, honestly. 267 00:16:43.535 --> 00:16:47.375 Honestly, I love it. We are like kindred spirits over here. 268 00:16:47.375 --> 00:16:51.070 I feel like I always have way more to say than social media allowed. 269 00:16:51.850 --> 00:16:55.370 I feel like I'm always just, like, teasing people on social media. Listen to the 270 00:16:55.370 --> 00:16:58.430 podcast. Watch my YouTube videos. That's where the real stuff is. 271 00:16:59.685 --> 00:17:03.365 I love that. And I think that a lot more people are leaning into 272 00:17:03.365 --> 00:17:06.869 these long form content styles. We're seeing, like, 273 00:17:07.030 --> 00:17:10.790 podcasting, YouTube video blogging is having its moment. I'm here for 274 00:17:10.790 --> 00:17:14.550 it. I love it. Okay. We're gonna take a quick break. When we come back, 275 00:17:14.550 --> 00:17:18.274 I wanna talk more about all of this change and what that means when we 276 00:17:18.274 --> 00:17:21.954 get back. We are long past the good old days of 277 00:17:21.954 --> 00:17:25.669 Myspace. And despite what those Facebook ads are touting 278 00:17:25.669 --> 00:17:29.350 as the magical AI solution antithesis to social 279 00:17:29.350 --> 00:17:32.870 media, social media is not dead. It is 280 00:17:32.870 --> 00:17:36.615 simply evolving, and that's what we're exploring at the Social 281 00:17:36.615 --> 00:17:40.375 Media Day Summit. Join me and my fellow experts on 282 00:17:40.375 --> 00:17:44.215 June 30th as we dive into what's working for social media 283 00:17:44.215 --> 00:17:47.920 marketers here now and today. We're exploring 284 00:17:48.140 --> 00:17:51.820 innovative strategies and timeless tactics that you 285 00:17:51.820 --> 00:17:55.625 can use for both yourself and your clients. Grab your ticket 286 00:17:55.625 --> 00:17:57.965 today for $10 and I'll see you there. 287 00:17:59.465 --> 00:18:02.925 And we're back. So I wanna talk about change because, 288 00:18:03.900 --> 00:18:07.520 I watched a I think it was an Instagram reel of yours recently, 289 00:18:07.740 --> 00:18:11.475 I believe, because you were in the car. And you were talking about change and 290 00:18:11.475 --> 00:18:15.235 how, as business owners, we need to embrace change. Like, it's gonna 291 00:18:15.235 --> 00:18:18.970 happen anyways. And I think especially in the industry we're in 292 00:18:18.970 --> 00:18:22.809 in social media, it changes so much. So can you talk to us a little 293 00:18:22.809 --> 00:18:26.649 bit about change and what are some ways that business 294 00:18:26.649 --> 00:18:30.395 owners and marketers can think about change as a good thing and not necessarily a 295 00:18:30.395 --> 00:18:34.015 bad thing? Okay. Awesome. So first, the 296 00:18:34.075 --> 00:18:37.820 video I started recording in the car is 297 00:18:37.820 --> 00:18:41.660 because, I was trying to take the pressure out of 298 00:18:41.660 --> 00:18:45.215 video content. So it was me distracting myself 299 00:18:45.275 --> 00:18:48.955 and talking like I would to maybe my friends or, you 300 00:18:48.955 --> 00:18:52.440 know, someone's sitting at the, on the other 301 00:18:52.440 --> 00:18:55.580 side, I just talk about something I'm passionate about. So 302 00:18:56.120 --> 00:18:59.500 that goes to show that, you know, just just create 303 00:18:59.559 --> 00:19:03.265 whereby it makes you. It doesn't have to be perfect. I had so many good 304 00:19:03.265 --> 00:19:06.705 conversations in my DMs. On threads, I've 305 00:19:06.705 --> 00:19:10.340 conformed from both my car conversation 306 00:19:10.399 --> 00:19:13.679 type videos. So, you know, I just wanted to put that out there that you 307 00:19:13.679 --> 00:19:17.440 don't have to pass the camera. You don't have to have a script. Sometimes it's 308 00:19:17.440 --> 00:19:21.115 okay to just have a conversation. That being said, 309 00:19:21.575 --> 00:19:25.255 talking about change, I think one of the things that has helped 310 00:19:25.255 --> 00:19:29.100 me as a person, as a prayer, as an educator, as 311 00:19:29.100 --> 00:19:32.860 a mom, is that change will always happen. No matter what I 312 00:19:32.860 --> 00:19:36.625 do, Everything will change. Mhmm. I I literally have 313 00:19:36.625 --> 00:19:40.465 no control over change. My body will change. My there'll be 314 00:19:40.465 --> 00:19:43.950 change in my career. There'll be change in my life. There'll be 315 00:19:44.250 --> 00:19:48.090 change in my work. There'll be change on social media. So 316 00:19:48.090 --> 00:19:51.895 how best can I approach it? Number 1, you just have to work on it. 317 00:19:52.135 --> 00:19:55.815 Right? For me, whenever something changes and that was even, 318 00:19:55.815 --> 00:19:59.575 like, 2 years ago before I matured this much. Whenever there's a change 319 00:19:59.575 --> 00:20:02.970 on on social, I take a step back. I log 320 00:20:02.970 --> 00:20:06.810 out. Do think about it. Do something for for the day, and 321 00:20:06.810 --> 00:20:10.415 then come back and think about what it means for me, for my clients, and 322 00:20:10.415 --> 00:20:14.255 if I want to strategize. Now change that in every day on this 323 00:20:14.255 --> 00:20:17.940 room that I do have a mailbox, and I honestly do not care. Because 324 00:20:17.940 --> 00:20:21.620 half the time, even Instagram that 325 00:20:21.620 --> 00:20:25.300 is announcing the change don't know what it means because they started 326 00:20:25.300 --> 00:20:28.925 spreading a lot of false information. So I am at that 327 00:20:28.925 --> 00:20:32.465 point, even in client accounts that we manage, we're at that point where 328 00:20:32.605 --> 00:20:36.260 we are focusing on focusing on our strategy. Nothing is 329 00:20:36.260 --> 00:20:40.100 determined. Nothing is shifting us to the right or to the left. We 330 00:20:40.100 --> 00:20:43.735 know our focus, and that's what we're doing. So for 331 00:20:43.735 --> 00:20:47.335 me, change should not shake 332 00:20:47.335 --> 00:20:51.150 you, especially if it comes to, like, platform change. It should not 333 00:20:51.150 --> 00:20:54.670 make you rethink your entire strategy, except if you do drastic change like, 334 00:20:54.670 --> 00:20:58.505 oh, rules are leaving Instagram or councils are leaving Instagram. If 335 00:20:58.505 --> 00:21:02.025 it's minor things like, oh, now we have an adios sticker. Now you can do 336 00:21:02.025 --> 00:21:04.685 this in school. Girl, nobody cares. 337 00:21:05.865 --> 00:21:09.650 We also have legit at that point, and I'm like, oh, 338 00:21:09.650 --> 00:21:13.090 must I have a new video? This is me. I don't watch his 339 00:21:13.090 --> 00:21:16.850 videos. I do not because he does absolutely nothing. Adam 340 00:21:16.850 --> 00:21:20.675 Mosseri says, don't use roofs today. Tomorrow, it says roofs are the 341 00:21:20.675 --> 00:21:24.115 best best for you to use. So right now, it's just to protect people like 342 00:21:24.115 --> 00:21:27.395 you. Right? So I'm not even going to you know, it's world does not hold 343 00:21:27.395 --> 00:21:31.220 water. So if you're a marketing, if you're a creator, 344 00:21:31.220 --> 00:21:34.820 if you're an educator, you have to be attuned to all 345 00:21:34.820 --> 00:21:38.595 these changes. You know? If it's platform changes, honestly, I would say focus 346 00:21:38.595 --> 00:21:42.375 on your strategy. But if it's changes in, like, consumer behavior, 347 00:21:42.434 --> 00:21:46.195 if it's changes in, like, industry trends, where are people gravitating to 348 00:21:46.195 --> 00:21:49.860 us? Your target audience is Gen z. You know? Are they 349 00:21:49.860 --> 00:21:53.159 more on Pinterest now? Are they more on TikTok? Do you want to, 350 00:21:53.460 --> 00:21:57.265 diversify your strategy or focus on that one platform because 351 00:21:57.265 --> 00:22:00.545 you know that's where your audience is? So, you know, you have to think of 352 00:22:00.545 --> 00:22:04.165 change in the regard of how does it affect 353 00:22:04.225 --> 00:22:07.899 my business, not how it affects my engagement. Because engagement 354 00:22:08.120 --> 00:22:11.720 does not equal business. Engagement, comments, like 355 00:22:11.720 --> 00:22:15.335 shares does not equal dollars. You have to think about your 356 00:22:15.335 --> 00:22:18.875 business holistically and the strategy you have 357 00:22:19.015 --> 00:22:22.429 for marketing. Of which social is just one part 358 00:22:22.649 --> 00:22:25.630 of your integral, entire, holistic 359 00:22:26.090 --> 00:22:29.775 marketing strategy. So, you know, think about change and 360 00:22:29.775 --> 00:22:33.135 what it means for you. And if it looks like something that is drastic, that 361 00:22:33.135 --> 00:22:36.490 is very important, like when it's gonna make reduce risk. And 362 00:22:36.490 --> 00:22:39.870 breastfeed seems as an opportunity to try experiments 363 00:22:40.250 --> 00:22:43.930 and do new things. Because for me, if you go through my 364 00:22:43.930 --> 00:22:47.415 content from 2020 to 2021, something is always 365 00:22:47.415 --> 00:22:51.015 changing. Maybe because I can't sit still. But because I 366 00:22:51.015 --> 00:22:54.530 also know that my audience is changing, I'm changing. They're 367 00:22:54.530 --> 00:22:58.210 changing the way the consumer's changing. So, you know, how can I 368 00:22:58.210 --> 00:23:02.005 find the delicate balance of giving them all the wants while still 369 00:23:02.005 --> 00:23:05.684 being true and authentic to myself? Because my essence is what 370 00:23:05.684 --> 00:23:09.365 helps me sleep at night. My my authenticity, you 371 00:23:09.365 --> 00:23:12.970 know, me sharing only good for information on me, talking about 372 00:23:12.970 --> 00:23:16.810 mindful social media. You're gonna be helping people to avoid burnout. So 373 00:23:16.810 --> 00:23:20.425 how can I still have the same message but 374 00:23:20.425 --> 00:23:24.185 deliver it in a different way? Because people are changing. So, you 375 00:23:24.185 --> 00:23:27.325 know, it's I always experiment with different content formats, 376 00:23:28.090 --> 00:23:31.930 you know, cueing the car conversations. I always experiment with, 377 00:23:31.930 --> 00:23:35.505 like, carousels. Am I using 10 pages? Am I using 5? Am I using 378 00:23:35.505 --> 00:23:39.025 a single graphic? Recently, I started experimenting with 379 00:23:39.025 --> 00:23:42.865 pictures because I hardly took pictures of myself. You know? So now I'm 380 00:23:42.865 --> 00:23:46.480 experimenting with that. So you have to think about what do I 381 00:23:46.480 --> 00:23:50.320 want to do, and then, you know, analyze how your 382 00:23:50.320 --> 00:23:54.025 audience receives it, analyze how much they enjoy it. You 383 00:23:54.025 --> 00:23:57.465 know? And this is not just in the numbers. Think of how many conversations it 384 00:23:57.465 --> 00:24:01.225 starts in the DMs. You know? Think of how many emails you get from 385 00:24:01.225 --> 00:24:05.040 that one piece of content speaking to people. And, you know, you go 386 00:24:05.040 --> 00:24:08.720 from there. If you don't embrace change, you'll most likely not 387 00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:12.055 remain relevant, especially when it comes to big changes. 388 00:24:12.755 --> 00:24:16.595 Yeah. Oh my gosh. Very, very well said. And I had to laugh about the 389 00:24:16.595 --> 00:24:19.635 Adam Mosseri piece because when I see him in my feed, I'm like, what is 390 00:24:19.635 --> 00:24:23.450 this man saying now? Because he always has something different. You're right. And it 391 00:24:23.450 --> 00:24:26.510 feels like he's contradicting himself constantly. 392 00:24:27.450 --> 00:24:30.965 And we have to say the course. I love that you say that. Be unjigable. 393 00:24:31.345 --> 00:24:35.025 Because a lot of these little, little changes, they make them and then they end 394 00:24:35.025 --> 00:24:38.770 up pulling them back. The one recently that a lot of 395 00:24:38.770 --> 00:24:42.529 people kept asking me about was, like, the Flipsta or they like the 396 00:24:42.529 --> 00:24:45.490 other Instagram that you get out. You have your main Instagram, then you have your 397 00:24:45.490 --> 00:24:49.275 secret Instagram. It was like this whole thing for, like, 2 months and then 398 00:24:49.275 --> 00:24:52.875 it was they were like, yeah, we're not doing that anymore. So okay. Good. 399 00:24:52.875 --> 00:24:56.650 Nobody changed their strategy because when they release these things, they 400 00:24:56.650 --> 00:25:00.410 take them back half the time. So Yeah. Yeah. One of the things you 401 00:25:00.410 --> 00:25:03.965 mentioned was that you're experimenting a lot. I'm curious what you 402 00:25:03.965 --> 00:25:07.645 see working really well right now, not just for you with with your 403 00:25:07.645 --> 00:25:11.025 clients. Like, what type of content is working really well right now? 404 00:25:13.920 --> 00:25:17.760 Honestly, I will say scroll stopping content. I know that's not what I mean by 405 00:25:17.760 --> 00:25:21.455 that, with basic information. You know how 406 00:25:21.455 --> 00:25:24.815 YouTube people are very you know, they want more 407 00:25:24.815 --> 00:25:28.255 information. They're in-depth. Instagram people 408 00:25:28.255 --> 00:25:31.590 are basic. They want, like, surface level. 409 00:25:31.970 --> 00:25:35.350 They want something that will that you just have to say, oh, 410 00:25:35.865 --> 00:25:39.705 Right? Don't use line breaks in your caption. You know? But 411 00:25:39.705 --> 00:25:43.225 how you deliver it is what matters. By scroll stopping, I 412 00:25:43.225 --> 00:25:46.610 mean, if you have been noticing, the videos that we're getting, like, good 413 00:25:46.610 --> 00:25:50.390 reach, you know, good engagement views 414 00:25:50.770 --> 00:25:54.455 is videos that are well edited. By well edited, I'm full 415 00:25:54.455 --> 00:25:57.675 stoping. I mean, interesting. So did you clone yourself? 416 00:25:58.215 --> 00:26:01.970 Do you have, like, the big text behind you? Do you have some TapCox 417 00:26:01.970 --> 00:26:05.810 effects flying around? Those are the things that people are really, 418 00:26:05.810 --> 00:26:09.534 really enjoying now because, you know, how, humans like 419 00:26:09.534 --> 00:26:13.375 this, the dopamine to just, you know, hit 420 00:26:13.375 --> 00:26:17.080 them and then and then get. So, you know, for me, 421 00:26:17.080 --> 00:26:20.840 with clients, with my content, I have noticed that, scroll 422 00:26:20.840 --> 00:26:24.385 stopping slash distracted content has been really working 423 00:26:24.385 --> 00:26:27.765 well. For example, in the chat conversation video, 424 00:26:28.225 --> 00:26:31.765 I I was deliberate about not, making eye contact 425 00:26:32.020 --> 00:26:35.700 with the camera because then I don't want you to feel like I 426 00:26:35.700 --> 00:26:39.140 am talking to you. You're probably going to be much more interested when it looks 427 00:26:39.140 --> 00:26:41.482 like I'm talking to Sorens. Why? Because humans are looking nosy. They want to know 428 00:26:41.482 --> 00:26:43.615 what I'm saying. That is not to you. You know? So I it it works 429 00:26:48.399 --> 00:26:51.679 all the time. I've worked for clients that are personal brand. I have seen it 430 00:26:51.679 --> 00:26:55.299 work for me. So, you know, scroll stopping, 431 00:26:55.679 --> 00:26:59.215 storytelling type reels, videos always work 432 00:26:59.215 --> 00:27:02.595 well. That being said, I am a huge carousel 433 00:27:02.655 --> 00:27:06.310 girl. And I have and this I'm even so proud to say. Right? 434 00:27:06.310 --> 00:27:09.590 I'm never proud to say that I have gone viral for, but I've always brought 435 00:27:09.590 --> 00:27:13.325 the time go viral for carousel. Yes. Bring 436 00:27:13.325 --> 00:27:17.165 me 2,000 followers because yeah. I mean, we can't tell you. You 437 00:27:17.165 --> 00:27:20.680 can't even say, like, the numbers of followers from that particular 438 00:27:20.740 --> 00:27:24.280 currencies. And that's because I enjoy delivering 439 00:27:25.380 --> 00:27:29.125 information in, like, a digestible way, but also 440 00:27:30.065 --> 00:27:33.745 intelligent, for lack of words. So helping you to think about things the 441 00:27:33.745 --> 00:27:37.280 way you haven't thought about it. You know? I I 442 00:27:37.280 --> 00:27:40.880 have one that everybody really love, and I'll talk to you 443 00:27:40.880 --> 00:27:44.355 about consistency over frequency and how that 444 00:27:44.515 --> 00:27:48.355 you can be someone that posts once per week. Are you a consistent 445 00:27:48.355 --> 00:27:52.135 person? Because consistency does not mean I post 446 00:27:53.120 --> 00:27:56.880 5 times in a week. You know? It means I'm posting once, but I'm sticking 447 00:27:56.880 --> 00:28:00.640 to that. It literally means sticking to your shadow. You know, I was talking 448 00:28:00.640 --> 00:28:04.335 about burnout, how to avoid it, how to create, and 449 00:28:04.335 --> 00:28:07.775 people really, really loved it. So I am pro car 450 00:28:07.775 --> 00:28:11.539 sales if you make sure that it's well designed, number 1. I'm very well 451 00:28:11.539 --> 00:28:14.919 designed. It's not it's not like bells and whistles. It just needs to be visible. 452 00:28:14.980 --> 00:28:18.445 People can read it. The background is dark enough. The text 453 00:28:19.304 --> 00:28:23.145 is lights or the background is light and the text is dark. You know? And 454 00:28:23.145 --> 00:28:26.910 it's not a novel because this happens all the time. 455 00:28:26.910 --> 00:28:30.670 People overload information on their terms. And that's why, you know, you have 20 456 00:28:30.670 --> 00:28:34.184 pages just, you know, sharing information gradually, 457 00:28:34.725 --> 00:28:38.245 make it, like, easy for people to scroll. And another reason why I know them 458 00:28:38.245 --> 00:28:41.690 is they are literally the only 2 on Instagram that shows up 459 00:28:41.690 --> 00:28:45.370 twice on one person's feet. So, you know, if, for example, I see 460 00:28:45.370 --> 00:28:48.330 your person for the first time I don't engage, it shows me the second page 461 00:28:48.330 --> 00:28:51.725 a few minutes later. So, team, 462 00:28:52.345 --> 00:28:55.165 super nice, distracted slash storytelling 463 00:28:55.945 --> 00:28:59.565 slash, scroll stopper rooms, and 464 00:29:00.330 --> 00:29:04.090 good information about carousels. Mhmm. Yeah. I love that. And I 465 00:29:04.090 --> 00:29:07.555 love that you said that Instagram is basic too and YouTube is, like, 466 00:29:07.715 --> 00:29:11.555 the in-depth content. Because I do think that sometimes even with a carousel, like you 467 00:29:11.555 --> 00:29:14.915 said, we try to stuff it with so much content. I, a 100% agree with 468 00:29:14.915 --> 00:29:18.670 you. I'm, like, nodding my head. Yes. Because that's exactly what I say about consistency 469 00:29:18.730 --> 00:29:22.490 versus frequency. You can be consistent at your own frequency. I'm 470 00:29:22.490 --> 00:29:26.065 here for it. I love all of it. One of the things you mentioned too 471 00:29:26.065 --> 00:29:29.905 was about burnout. And I think there's it's it's happening 472 00:29:29.905 --> 00:29:33.530 a lot right now. People are getting burnout, especially content creators. 473 00:29:33.530 --> 00:29:36.990 I'm noticing a lot of content creators making announcements 474 00:29:37.530 --> 00:29:41.130 saying I'm pausing from Instagram. I'm taking a sabbatical. I'm 475 00:29:41.130 --> 00:29:44.955 stepping back because they did so much, too 476 00:29:44.955 --> 00:29:48.715 much to get to where they are, and it wasn't sustainable. So 477 00:29:48.715 --> 00:29:51.710 can you talk to us a little bit about what are some of these anti 478 00:29:51.710 --> 00:29:55.230 burnout strategies that you recommend so that we 479 00:29:55.230 --> 00:29:58.850 can keep going at a consistent pace at our own frequency 480 00:29:59.275 --> 00:30:01.695 without burning out? Yeah. 481 00:30:03.035 --> 00:30:06.335 First things first. I feel like I'm too 482 00:30:06.475 --> 00:30:10.290 realistic and logical for my liking. I believe 483 00:30:10.350 --> 00:30:14.190 at any point, if you're creating content on social, you will burn out. 484 00:30:14.190 --> 00:30:18.015 I mean, I am on my 500 burnout at the moment. 485 00:30:18.315 --> 00:30:22.155 Right? But how do I come back from it? And how do I make 486 00:30:22.155 --> 00:30:25.775 sure that it doesn't happen too frequently? Because it will. 487 00:30:26.120 --> 00:30:29.580 With the way social is, how distracting it is, 488 00:30:30.279 --> 00:30:34.039 you know, the shiny object syndrome, it will most 489 00:30:34.039 --> 00:30:37.885 likely come if you are a content creator. What you can do though 490 00:30:38.185 --> 00:30:41.965 is to work against it. You know? And for me, 491 00:30:42.130 --> 00:30:45.830 when I noticed that, you know, burnout is creeping in, I'm not excited 492 00:30:45.970 --> 00:30:49.735 about my content because, you know, that's what that's what burnout is. You're 493 00:30:49.735 --> 00:30:53.495 not excited anymore. You're not excited about what you're creating. Or 494 00:30:53.575 --> 00:30:56.455 and it's not like you don't have ideas, but you do. You're just like, I 495 00:30:56.455 --> 00:31:00.049 don't wanna do it. So, you know, if you're not if I'm not 496 00:31:00.049 --> 00:31:03.650 excited about what I'm creating or excited to put content out there, I I first 497 00:31:03.650 --> 00:31:07.415 take a step back. The first thing I always always do is log out 498 00:31:07.415 --> 00:31:10.855 of that account. That's the. And I have a 499 00:31:10.855 --> 00:31:14.615 Vybe's Instagram accounts. Okay. Instagram accounts, it goes for, 500 00:31:14.615 --> 00:31:17.940 like, fashion, comedy, just like 501 00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:21.600 basic things that just makes me happy. 502 00:31:21.600 --> 00:31:25.195 Cards, videos, you know, people being seen. 503 00:31:25.735 --> 00:31:29.575 Because at that point, I don't want to be an agency owner. 504 00:31:29.575 --> 00:31:31.975 I don't want to be a creator. I don't want anybody to look up to 505 00:31:31.975 --> 00:31:35.580 me. I just want to be a person person in that moment. So and and 506 00:31:35.580 --> 00:31:39.340 because social is one of the ways I decompress. Maybe in my life, I 507 00:31:39.340 --> 00:31:43.185 don't have enough time to myself to do, like, a lot of hobbies or all 508 00:31:43.185 --> 00:31:46.145 of this cool things that people are doing. So, you know, maybe it on my 509 00:31:46.145 --> 00:31:49.525 phone really helps me. So I have a Avybe Instagram 510 00:31:50.470 --> 00:31:54.250 account. Highly, highly recommend where you can just decompress, 511 00:31:54.790 --> 00:31:58.515 you know, enjoy things that you really love. Then if you have 512 00:31:58.515 --> 00:32:02.055 hobbies, if you like to read books, if you like to watch TV shows. 513 00:32:02.355 --> 00:32:06.035 But I noticed that if I don't address the burnout, as I'm watching that TV 514 00:32:06.035 --> 00:32:09.800 show, I'm seeing content ideas. Mhmm. So it doesn't really, 515 00:32:09.800 --> 00:32:13.320 really it doesn't really, really do what it needs to do. So, 516 00:32:14.055 --> 00:32:17.895 you know, in that moment of burnout, won't pay a sprint time because once you 517 00:32:17.895 --> 00:32:21.495 get back on that account or that email or 518 00:32:21.495 --> 00:32:25.120 that YouTube channel that is making you burn out, 519 00:32:25.120 --> 00:32:28.800 you will, fall into the trap of comparison. Oh my 520 00:32:28.800 --> 00:32:31.520 god. She just did this, and I was going to do it, but you did 521 00:32:31.520 --> 00:32:35.335 not. You know? So and then that would just take you deeper 522 00:32:35.335 --> 00:32:38.635 into the whole of depression. So, you know, take a step back, 523 00:32:38.775 --> 00:32:42.610 focus on what is feasible. At this point, 524 00:32:42.750 --> 00:32:46.350 what's sustainable for me? As I'm burned out, do I still wanna create? Do I 525 00:32:46.350 --> 00:32:50.184 want to reduce my post to 1, or do I want 526 00:32:50.184 --> 00:32:53.405 to do once per month? You know, just think of 527 00:32:53.945 --> 00:32:57.740 yourself as a person in that moment and not necessarily 528 00:32:57.799 --> 00:33:01.340 a creator or a marketer or someone that has to perform. 529 00:33:02.120 --> 00:33:05.674 Secondly, I am the queen of boundaries. Oh my 530 00:33:05.674 --> 00:33:08.895 god. My clients know if you text me 531 00:33:09.355 --> 00:33:13.195 past 3 PM, you would get your reply next day 532 00:33:13.195 --> 00:33:16.980 at 10. If once I'm out, I am out. I work 533 00:33:16.980 --> 00:33:20.820 in social, not in the air. And I learned this the 534 00:33:20.820 --> 00:33:24.335 hard way because there was a time I got burnt out so much. I was 535 00:33:24.335 --> 00:33:28.175 having panic attacks from my platform, Slack notification. And I'm just 536 00:33:28.175 --> 00:33:30.895 like, you know what? This is not this is not how I want to live 537 00:33:30.895 --> 00:33:34.500 my life. I have I have children. I have 538 00:33:34.960 --> 00:33:38.420 dreams. I have aspirations. Why am I allowing post 539 00:33:39.325 --> 00:33:43.165 to give me sleepless nights or someone dropping a comment? And 540 00:33:43.165 --> 00:33:46.180 I was just like, yeah. I am not doing this. So I have 541 00:33:46.740 --> 00:33:50.200 work boundaries, super solid ones. I have 542 00:33:50.500 --> 00:33:54.120 mental health boundaries. I have some people I follow on social 543 00:33:54.505 --> 00:33:58.105 that I have muted. Right? I love you, but I do want to see your 544 00:33:58.105 --> 00:34:01.840 post. And sometimes I mute them for a 545 00:34:01.840 --> 00:34:05.600 particular time. Even sometimes my friends in the industry, if I'm having 546 00:34:05.600 --> 00:34:09.285 a hard time mentally with maybe, like, life, life, and, you know, they 547 00:34:09.285 --> 00:34:12.505 are launching things. I am human. I would fall into 548 00:34:12.805 --> 00:34:15.765 comparison. So for that moment, if I see that you have a launch coming up 549 00:34:15.765 --> 00:34:19.200 and I cannot handle it, I will probably send you a message. Oh, wish you 550 00:34:19.200 --> 00:34:22.880 the best with this. I'm mute you. I'm gonna see your post. I'm gonna see 551 00:34:22.880 --> 00:34:26.555 your stories because I just cannot handle it at that 552 00:34:26.555 --> 00:34:30.255 moment. So for me, I have to set that boundary for myself, 553 00:34:30.475 --> 00:34:34.270 not necessarily for them. So think about the boundaries that 554 00:34:34.270 --> 00:34:37.710 you need to set. So what is that thing giving you anxiety? What is that 555 00:34:37.710 --> 00:34:41.375 client or that person or that account, you know, making you 556 00:34:41.614 --> 00:34:44.915 and just release them with words of. Yes. 557 00:34:45.295 --> 00:34:48.815 Release them and let them go. And every time I say that, I also 558 00:34:48.815 --> 00:34:52.199 acknowledge I acknowledge the fact 559 00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:55.800 that that might sound, is the word 560 00:34:55.800 --> 00:34:59.340 entitled? Or for example, right, a lot of these people, 561 00:34:59.640 --> 00:35:03.185 online educators that are taking sabbatical, it this 562 00:35:03.185 --> 00:35:06.945 privilege stuff. Privilege. Yeah. It's privilege. Yes. They have made 563 00:35:06.945 --> 00:35:10.770 enough money to do that. Yep. They have, you know, they have 564 00:35:10.770 --> 00:35:13.970 money spent to do that. They have cars they can sell to do that. You 565 00:35:13.970 --> 00:35:17.589 know? And you necessarily might not have that. So 566 00:35:17.945 --> 00:35:21.465 yours might look like just reducing your scope and knowing 567 00:35:21.465 --> 00:35:25.085 that, okay. This month, how much do I need to leave? I made $3,000. 568 00:35:25.830 --> 00:35:29.670 I was making 6, and it was making me anxious. So what if 569 00:35:29.670 --> 00:35:33.510 I reduce my scope, let a client go and reduce my hours to 570 00:35:33.510 --> 00:35:36.984 35? I know I would not have a lot of money, but 571 00:35:37.285 --> 00:35:41.045 your life is more important than money. Your mental health is more important than money. 572 00:35:41.045 --> 00:35:43.845 And when you get back up, you get back up. I can pick up the 573 00:35:43.845 --> 00:35:47.660 slack. But, you know, I just want to acknowledge that privilege is also 574 00:35:47.660 --> 00:35:51.420 very important. You know, maybe having a another a partner that works, 575 00:35:51.420 --> 00:35:55.194 having a trust fund or having money saved is good when you're 576 00:35:55.194 --> 00:35:58.974 burnt, when you're burnt out. The last thing I do 577 00:35:59.194 --> 00:36:02.875 when I feel like I am burnt out is, you 578 00:36:02.875 --> 00:36:05.799 know, self care. For me, self care looks like, 579 00:36:07.299 --> 00:36:10.660 sitting on my bed. I went to station I said, sitting on my bed, I 580 00:36:10.660 --> 00:36:14.195 wasn't with anatomy, turning off my phone, turning 581 00:36:14.195 --> 00:36:17.875 off my phone for those moments. And I I, you know, I feel like at 582 00:36:17.875 --> 00:36:21.395 the end of every week, I'm always burnt out. So from Friday, 6 PM, my 583 00:36:21.395 --> 00:36:24.880 phone is off. Except if the client has, like, an important 584 00:36:24.880 --> 00:36:28.720 launch that, you know, maybe, you know, we just have 585 00:36:28.720 --> 00:36:32.105 to be there. But I do have a social media that is super good with 586 00:36:32.105 --> 00:36:35.225 things like that, but I always try to turn up my phone. And then I 587 00:36:35.225 --> 00:36:38.985 put it back on on Saturday to talk to my family. My mom 588 00:36:38.985 --> 00:36:42.569 makes sure it's cool. Back off, then I turn it on a 589 00:36:42.569 --> 00:36:46.170 Monday. And by off, I don't necessarily mean switch off. I mean, 590 00:36:46.170 --> 00:36:49.674 like, my air movement is on. So I can reboot if I want to. I 591 00:36:49.674 --> 00:36:52.795 can play games. Oh, I love to play games on my phone because it helps 592 00:36:52.795 --> 00:36:56.380 me to compress. New notifications are coming in. And then by 593 00:36:56.380 --> 00:37:00.220 Monday, I am energized. I can, you know, do whatever it is I 594 00:37:00.220 --> 00:37:03.900 want to do. I can do the best for my clients, for myself, for 595 00:37:03.900 --> 00:37:07.215 my family. And because you know that if you're burnt out, 596 00:37:07.595 --> 00:37:11.035 you're not winning. Nobody's winning. You're not doing your best you're gonna do your best 597 00:37:11.035 --> 00:37:14.690 work. Clients are paying you, but they're not getting you. You're not 598 00:37:14.690 --> 00:37:18.470 happy. You know? It's it's just it doesn't make sense 599 00:37:18.530 --> 00:37:22.145 to work through Brenna. So yeah. Yes. 600 00:37:22.205 --> 00:37:25.805 Okay. You could be me, and I could be you. Like, everything you're saying, like, 601 00:37:25.805 --> 00:37:29.589 this is it. This is me. Like, you're you're me, basically. I mean, I 602 00:37:29.589 --> 00:37:32.869 think that's a part of working in the industry. Like, I have I have moments 603 00:37:32.869 --> 00:37:36.329 where I'm like, oh, I I was literally having panic attacks about getting emails 604 00:37:36.765 --> 00:37:38.705 because I was just too available. 605 00:37:40.285 --> 00:37:44.125 And you're right. There's this I think the biggest thing about burnout 606 00:37:44.125 --> 00:37:47.890 is not most of us are not privileged enough to take a year 607 00:37:47.890 --> 00:37:51.650 off to deal with the burnout. So before you get to 608 00:37:51.650 --> 00:37:55.315 the point where you need to take a year off, let's set 609 00:37:55.315 --> 00:37:59.075 some boundaries. Let's turn off the notifications. I will put my phone on 610 00:37:59.075 --> 00:38:02.869 do not disturb in a heartbeat. People like, Andrea, I texted you. I'll text you 611 00:38:02.869 --> 00:38:06.410 back in 2 days. Like, it's not an 612 00:38:06.470 --> 00:38:09.685 ER, like you said. Oh my god. Everything you're saying, I'm like, it's what I 613 00:38:09.685 --> 00:38:13.365 would say. It's what I would say. I loved this conversation so much, Tamisin. I 614 00:38:13.365 --> 00:38:16.825 love it. I know you have a checklist for social media managers. 615 00:38:17.285 --> 00:38:20.970 Tell us about the checklist. That 616 00:38:20.970 --> 00:38:24.430 checklist was broken from burnout, 617 00:38:24.810 --> 00:38:28.375 legit. It was broken from doing everything 618 00:38:28.595 --> 00:38:32.355 and doing nothing. You know? So I decided, and 619 00:38:32.355 --> 00:38:36.150 this was the one before I built my team, you know, 620 00:38:36.470 --> 00:38:39.990 hired people to help and support when it was just me. I 621 00:38:39.990 --> 00:38:43.770 decided that, you know, how can I best maximize my time, 622 00:38:44.345 --> 00:38:47.944 and be effective? So I wrote a checklist for things that have to do 623 00:38:47.944 --> 00:38:51.785 daily, things that have to do biweekly, and things that have to 624 00:38:51.785 --> 00:38:55.599 do monthly. And, you know, every time that I after I created it, 625 00:38:55.599 --> 00:38:59.119 I put a post on social, and I posted, like, 3 years 626 00:38:59.119 --> 00:39:02.775 ago. And it it went, you know, it went far. It got a 627 00:39:02.775 --> 00:39:05.735 lot of saves. And that's why I knew that, you know what? This would be 628 00:39:05.735 --> 00:39:09.195 a good lead magnet for my people with the social media manager, 629 00:39:10.070 --> 00:39:13.750 to help them maximize their time and to help them, work 630 00:39:13.750 --> 00:39:17.510 smarter and faster. So that's basically what it is. 631 00:39:17.510 --> 00:39:21.165 It has, like, daily task, so that looks like inbound and 632 00:39:21.165 --> 00:39:24.925 outbound and great rates if that's relevant to you, scheduling or 633 00:39:24.925 --> 00:39:28.620 putting things up if that's relevant to you. Biweekly, it has 634 00:39:28.620 --> 00:39:29.440 things like, 635 00:39:32.140 --> 00:39:35.980 creating client contents. Because on our on in in the agency, we 636 00:39:35.980 --> 00:39:39.365 do biweekly calendars. You know, we have other things like, 637 00:39:40.165 --> 00:39:43.925 getting ready for reporting, analytics, sending things off to 638 00:39:43.925 --> 00:39:47.490 clients. And we have, like, many timelines, right, that if you wanna get 639 00:39:47.490 --> 00:39:51.330 approval in a week, for example, when should you send 640 00:39:51.330 --> 00:39:54.770 out content? So, it's basically for you 641 00:39:54.770 --> 00:39:58.464 to work hard, be effective, but 642 00:39:58.464 --> 00:40:01.984 also still have a life. Mhmm. I'm a 100% here for it. If you 643 00:40:01.984 --> 00:40:04.484 wanna grab this, go to our show notes, onlinedre.com/ 644 00:40:05.799 --> 00:40:09.480 310. That's 310, and you can get the checklist. And you 645 00:40:09.480 --> 00:40:13.295 can connect to Thomason everywhere. Instagram's her fave, but 646 00:40:13.295 --> 00:40:16.575 also on YouTube. We'll put all the links. Thank you so much for being on 647 00:40:16.575 --> 00:40:20.335 the show. This is great. Thank you for having me. I had I 648 00:40:20.335 --> 00:40:23.610 had the best time. You know, it's it's always really good when you're talking to 649 00:40:23.610 --> 00:40:26.430 someone that you have, like, similar 650 00:40:27.130 --> 00:40:30.734 ethos, similar messaging, because, you know, 651 00:40:30.734 --> 00:40:34.434 the the vibe is all and my energy is all about context. 652 00:40:34.494 --> 00:40:38.160 So super happy to be here. Yay. Thank you. The vibes are vibin'. I 653 00:40:38.160 --> 00:40:41.700 love it. I love it. And thank you, dear listener, for listening to another episode. 654 00:40:42.160 --> 00:40:46.000 Next week, we're talking about Substack Marketing. So if you're curious about 655 00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:49.555 Substack and all things Substack, we have 3 amazing 656 00:40:49.555 --> 00:40:53.155 people in our roundtable to talk about how they're leveraging 657 00:40:53.155 --> 00:40:56.780 Substack. So tune in next week for that. In the meantime, make sure you give 658 00:40:56.780 --> 00:41:00.540 us a 5 star rating on Apple Podcasts, Spotify. It helps keep us in the 659 00:41:00.540 --> 00:41:04.000 top 100 marketing podcasts. That's because of you, dear listener. 660 00:41:04.380 --> 00:41:05.520 We'll be back soon. 661 00:41:12.984 --> 00:41:13.484 Bye.